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Hey Bulls fan here, I have rarely watched John Wall but when I have he seems to have a very unpolished game. He seems mediocre from Half-Court and usually only scores from fast breaks and IMO he doesn't seem to be able to shoot jump shots very well either.

I know that he's young and I really haven't seen much of hims so that's why I'm asking you guys, do you guys think John Wall was a bad pick? Do you think it's too early to tell or do you think his teammates are the main reason he looks to be struggling?

Bad pick...??? Nope, especially looking at the alternatives...

I agree with you though, his game is very unpolished, very raw, not very good in half court, his effort is inconsistent at times, his jumper is horrid...

But his athletic ability is underrated, court-vision also, speed is phenomenal etc.

I think it's about 50/50 on his struggles; his team is the worst in the NBA, no shooters whatsoever, so the spacing is horrible; Wall doesn't really have the space to operate... This team wasn't put together with Wall in mind...

Wall is, on the other hand, fully responsible for his own growth, i.e. his jumper. He needs to understand that shooting allot of jumpers is not good enough; he needs to learn how to shoot first, then worry about consistency. He is a hard worker though, and even if he might not be a good or great jumpshooter, I think he will be at least above average eventually.

An yes, it's waaaaaay too early to write him off (as some have done around here); you might even recall Rose not looking anyway near his normal self starting his second season... Durant the same...

Could have been worse, we could have taken Evan Turner.

Im not worried. In fact i cant believe people are proclaiming him a bust. Already.

Durant SUCKED early in his second season, and benefited from a coaching change. I think the same will hopefully happen with Wall, Saunders and the Wizards.

He could do with a veteran PG as well. Actually, after our win he praised Saunders for playing Mack behind him instead of Crawford, claiming that it helped Crawford by allowing him to be a SG. I think Wall was saying he needed a pure PG behind him to take the pressure off, too. Mack is the better floor general at this point in time.

I expect Wall to make a turn around post-all star game, and get back to his rookie form, at least (probably less assists though, due to no one being able to shoot).

Victim of the lockout. I think a full offseason would have helped him instead of him gaining false confidence playing in summer leagues and street tournaments where no one plays D.

DaRealHibachi wrote:Bad pick...??? Nope, especially looking at the alternatives...

I agree with you though, his game is very unpolished, very raw, not very good in half court, his effort is inconsistent at times, his jumper is horrid...

But his athletic ability is underrated, court-vision also, speed is phenomenal etc.

I think it's about 50/50 on his struggles; his team is the worst in the NBA, no shooters whatsoever, so the spacing is horrible; Wall doesn't really have the space to operate... This team wasn't put together with Wall in mind...

Wall is, on the other hand, fully responsible for his own growth, i.e. his jumper. He needs to understand that shooting allot of jumpers is not good enough; he needs to learn how to shoot first, then worry about consistency. He is a hard worker though, and even if he might not be a good or great jumpshooter, I think he will be at least above average eventually.

An yes, it's waaaaaay too early to write him off (as some have done around here); you might even recall Rose not looking anyway near his normal self starting his second season... Durant the same...

I agree that Wall shouldn't be written off so early, he is only 21 years old and the Wizards are lucky they didn't get someone like Evan Turner or Wesley Johnson.

dangermouse wrote:Could have been worse, we could have taken Evan Turner.

Im not worried. In fact i cant believe people are proclaiming him a bust. Already.

Durant SUCKED early in his second season, and benefited from a coaching change. I think the same will hopefully happen with Wall, Saunders and the Wizards.

He could do with a veteran PG as well. Actually, after our win he praised Saunders for playing Mack behind him instead of Crawford, claiming that it helped Crawford by allowing him to be a SG. I think Wall was saying he needed a pure PG behind him to take the pressure off, too. Mack is the better floor general at this point in time.

I expect Wall to make a turn around post-all star game, and get back to his rookie form, at least (probably less assists though, due to no one being able to shoot).

I hope you don't think I'm writing him as a bust, I was just wondering how Wizards fans felt about the pick, It's way too early to tell how he's going to do and I definitely agree their lucky they never got Evan Turner(I hate that guy)

The team *was* built around him. He needs to play on a team that plays good defense so they can get out on the break. Vesely, McGee, and Singleton are all good fits with him. He's not much use in the halfcourt -- doesn't seem to be able to distort the defense with a dribble drive and then make the pass to the open man. He has the athletic skills to do it but maybe because of his lack of a jumper he just can't create any space. Would help if he wasn't playing with Crawford all the time.

Wall really needs the rest of the team to play the right way. If the ball is moving and players are making cuts without the ball, that creates opportunities for Wall to attack the seams in the defense, create a distortion, and then distribute. If everyone is standing around playing hero ball, that minimizes Wall's skills.

Zonkerbl wrote:The team *was* built around him. He needs to play on a team that plays good defense so they can get out on the break. Vesely, McGee, and Singleton are all good fits with him. He's not much use in the halfcourt -- doesn't seem to be able to distort the defense with a dribble drive and then make the pass to the open man. He has the athletic skills to do it but maybe because of his lack of a jumper he just can't create any space. Would help if he wasn't playing with Crawford all the time.

Wall really needs the rest of the team to play the right way. If the ball is moving and players are making cuts without the ball, that creates opportunities for Wall to attack the seams in the defense, create a distortion, and then distribute. If everyone is standing around playing hero ball, that minimizes Wall's skills.

While I agree the team was built in the sense of fastbreak points/ speed, EG has to know that a good portion of possessions are half-court ones; we also need players that can run a PnR, PnP, shooters and cutters, and EG failed miserably in acquiring these kind of players...

a dead-eye catch and shoot 2guard will help, as NY isn't really the catch and shoot type.
maybe mason but he can't play defense

Zonkerbl wrote:The team *was* built around him. He needs to play on a team that plays good defense so they can get out on the break. Vesely, McGee, and Singleton are all good fits with him. He's not much use in the halfcourt -- doesn't seem to be able to distort the defense with a dribble drive and then make the pass to the open man. He has the athletic skills to do it but maybe because of his lack of a jumper he just can't create any space. Would help if he wasn't playing with Crawford all the time.

Wall really needs the rest of the team to play the right way. If the ball is moving and players are making cuts without the ball, that creates opportunities for Wall to attack the seams in the defense, create a distortion, and then distribute. If everyone is standing around playing hero ball, that minimizes Wall's skills.

Just know it took Derrick Rose until his 3rd year to do this with consistency, I also think the Bulls hiring Thibs being hired as head coach helped Derricks game drastically and I think the Wizards should take the same approach.

I will admit it, I'm a little worried.

EXTREMELY worried. He's a bad shooter. He's a bad ballhandler, which is even scarier. He is a liability on the court, which is alarming for a #1 pick in year 2.

If he doesn't become a good shooter, and if he doesn't develop high-level ballhandling ability, how will he score? That basically limits his ceiling to a Rondo-like player.

The good news is that Westbrook had the same problems coming in, and now he's great. And people have forgotten how great Wall is as a passer - his court vision is maybe a hair short of a guy like CP3. But he has to turn these flaws around, and fast.

Worried and wish we had a vet PG or even yet-to-be-discovered PG so we could reduce Walls minutes to the 20's-30 like Kyrie Irving. Having a vet PG would take the pressure off-of everyone.

IMO, like the rest of the Wiz players, they are more interested in making the highlight reel than to get a W. Like for instance, the dunk on J.Lucas. It was a 2 on 1 break and Lucas seems to be out of the no charging zone, but still J wall opts to take it by himself. It could easily been a charging call.

What they need is a coach that would be able to use John Wall and his teammates' talent efficiently.

And with J-Wall, the thing that amazes me is how was it that he seems to have played better last year compared to this year, considering his potential and off season "training". Anyway, I just hope he bounces back.

I'm down, but not out. Down, because I simply do not picture the Wall we've seen over the past year+ improving enough to be considered the franchise-saving superstar that we were all hoping for when we drafted him. I mean, I fully expect he's going to get better, but when I think of a few years down the road, I see more All Star than All NBA. Not out, because if I somehow bumped into someone who told me they were from the future and that Wall had indeed become a legit superstar in 2015, I wouldn't assume they were lying to me. Well, I probably would, but more about the future thing than the Wall thing.

I know that Wall watches the other top PG's. I hope Sam is sitting John down and they are reviewing tape of Nash & Rubio racking-up dimes. If they can get John to slow-down and work on adding some variety to his game, he might develop a respectable shot like Rondo.

I think Wall puts enough (too much?) pressure on himself to be great now. If the media and fans start to put the same amount of pressure on him I fear what might happen.....

Chaos Revenant wrote:EXTREMELY worried. He's a bad shooter. He's a bad ballhandler, which is even scarier. He is a liability on the court, which is alarming for a #1 pick in year 2.

If he doesn't become a good shooter, and if he doesn't develop high-level ballhandling ability, how will he score? That basically limits his ceiling to a Rondo-like player.

He doen't seem to have a Rondo ceiling. Rondo seems to have a high BBall IQ, wants to defend, and is agood ball handler.

closg00 wrote:I know that Wall watches the other top PG's. I hope Sam is sitting John down and they are reviewing tape of Nash & Rubio racking-up dimes. If they can get John to slow-down and work on adding some variety to his game, he might develop a respectable shot like Rondo.

It won't happen. The problem is John Wall's teammates. If he has teammates that are good offensively like Nash's or Rondo's I can see J-Wall averaging 10apg.

I think the problem right now with Wall is that he's forcing too much on himself. That explains his low FG% and TOs.

there is so much wrong with this guys game that it makes you wanna cry. For one, he has one of the worst handles of any starting point guard in the league. Compare Kyrie irving, chris paul, augustine,...wall handles are poor. He nearly loses the ball when he tries to slow down after sprinting.
When he is going full speed, he can't he even maintain a low dribble. A point guard has to be able to sprint but also keep the ball outside of his knees while he sprints, wall dribbles with the ball in front of his body--huge warning sign of lack of skill development. When you see wall dribble in traffic, in can't reverse direction because he dribbles with a high center of gravity and he doesn't keep the ball low. the lower you dribble the ball, the harder adn faster you have to bounce it in order for the ball to stick in your hand as you move. You have to bounce the ball harder and as a result in stick in your hand longer because it pushes your hand up. If you have good hand strength and tricep strength, you can absorb the force of the ball at let the ball hover in your palm at your knee cap as you make explosive moves and not carry the ball.
It takes years of developing that type of coordination with your dribble and wall doesn't have it. He lets the ball bounce up to his waste and it keeps him from being able to change directions quickly because the ball is in the air most of the time instead of sticking to his hands on a low power dribbles. Also wall isn't that flexible, he seem really stiff even when playing defense Bad knees or whatever but huge warning signs.
Secondly, Wall has absolutely no post moves, he has no one handed floaters from the top the of the key, he doesn't have any fadeaways, he doesn't have combination moves like stop and go, crossover, then stop and go again, his handles are weak.
He initiate contact and create offensive advantage by throwing the momentum of the defender off, just one speed.
He needs a coach that can train him to be a point guard both metally and skills development. Cassell in my mind is a shooting guard always was. Saunders has no clue as to details of a hesitation moves, looking off a defender on a pass. He basically draws up x and o's with no concepts of physical bumping inherent in plays or changing momentum on a drive.
whitman just as bad..he might be more aggressive but has all the weakness of Saunders. Sloan or bust. Bring in a coach who has coached john stockton. if sloan isn't a coach, bring him in as your secret advisor TEd. the money you pay him will pay for itself by allowing you to make best financial basketball skill decisions that no one in your organization possesses.