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There were so many trades last night that I had a hard time keeping up. Obviously, teams came into the 2013 Draft w/ a wide range of strategies and worked to execute them.

So... who did well? And who didn't? What teams do you think made out last night and why? And who got stomped?

Sixers for getting a top 5 protected 2014 first round pick. They also got Noel, and Michael Carter-Williams even though he can't shoot. They had a good night, it probably won't translate to wins and they might be the lowest scoring team in the league next year.

Cleveland, moreso the Karasev pick than Bennett. This is an example of a team having too many picks and not really knowing what to do with them. A prime example of having too many picks and not necessarily translating to on court success.

Wizards. Small forward of the future and three young building blocks.

Honestly, it's really hard to figure out who won the draft because it seemed like teams picked Euro guys for the sake of picking someone and not being sold on a particular player. Very weird, uneven draft.

Good: Wizards, Minnesota ( Shabazz Muhammad & Gorgui Dieng, Lorenzo Brown)

Bad to me was the Pacers who could have done alot better than Solomon Hill at that spot.

I think the Wizards are up there. I also really liked the Hawks and Thunder draft picks. It's definitely a lot easier to draft when you're an established contender like the Thunder though, because you can draft and stash so easily.

I think the Blazers were pretty successful as well. They went in with a very good starting lineup, but no bench whatsoever. Looks like they added 3 guys who might be capable bench players right away.

Kings are another team who had a great draft, IMO. They were very lucky McLemore fell to them.

Sac had the best draft with Mclemore falling to them. I love an Evans-Mclemore backcourt. I also really like Flip's trade down to get Dieng & Shabaaz. Dieng is a really good fit as a backup center who can play with Love.

In terms of worst moves:

I don't get the Bucks. I like the pick, but does that mean that they are tanking (about doing the stupid Reddick trade)? Hammond always does well with his mid 1st rounders, so we should give him the benefit of the doubt.

mhd wrote:Sac had the best draft with Mclemore falling to them. I love an Evans-Mclemore backcourt. I also really like Flip's trade down to get Dieng & Shabaaz. Dieng is a really good fit as a backup center who can play with Love.

In terms of worst moves:

I don't get the Bucks. I like the pick, but does that mean that they are tanking (about doing the stupid Reddick trade)? Hammond always does well with his mid 1st rounders, so we should give him the benefit of the doubt.

The past is past. They made some real bad choices and have to move on. I think the pick took guts and is what it is - taking the best player for the long term. They're likely not a playoff team, so tanking does make some sense, but I don't think they go in all-out tank mode.

Ruzious wrote:

mhd wrote:Sac had the best draft with Mclemore falling to them. I love an Evans-Mclemore backcourt. I also really like Flip's trade down to get Dieng & Shabaaz. Dieng is a really good fit as a backup center who can play with Love.

In terms of worst moves:

I don't get the Bucks. I like the pick, but does that mean that they are tanking (about doing the stupid Reddick trade)? Hammond always does well with his mid 1st rounders, so we should give him the benefit of the doubt.

The past is past. They made some real bad choices and have to move on. I think the pick took guts and is what it is - taking the best player for the long term. They're likely not a playoff team, so tanking does make some sense, but I don't think they go in all-out tank mode.

Well if you're going to have guts and take an 18 year-old as the BPA, then have guts with your tank. Half-assed tanking isn't gutsy tanking. Tear it down, baby! Bring me Ersan Ilyasova!

mhd wrote:Sac had the best draft with Mclemore falling to them. I love an Evans-Mclemore backcourt. I also really like Flip's trade down to get Dieng & Shabaaz. Dieng is a really good fit as a backup center who can play with Love.

I don't. Who's the point guard in the scenario? Maybe if you had a legit PG and slide Evans over to the 3 it could work, but that's not a winning backcourt IMO. The ball-handling, decision making & mental toughness are all suspect.

Dat2U wrote:

mhd wrote:Sac had the best draft with Mclemore falling to them. I love an Evans-Mclemore backcourt. I also really like Flip's trade down to get Dieng & Shabaaz. Dieng is a really good fit as a backup center who can play with Love.

I don't. Who's the point guard in the scenario? Maybe if you had a legit PG and slide Evans over to the 3 it could work, but that's not a winning backcourt IMO. The ball-handling, decision making & mental toughness are all suspect.

I predict Sacto lets Evans walk and he signs an OJ Mayo type of contract in an effort to re-establish some value -- 2 years deal with an opt-out after 1, $4M-$5M a year.

Dat2U wrote:

mhd wrote:Sac had the best draft with Mclemore falling to them. I love an Evans-Mclemore backcourt. I also really like Flip's trade down to get Dieng & Shabaaz. Dieng is a really good fit as a backup center who can play with Love.

I don't. Who's the point guard in the scenario? Maybe if you had a legit PG and slide Evans over to the 3 it could work, but that's not a winning backcourt IMO. The ball-handling, decision making & mental toughness are all suspect.

Evans is a PG. Sac moved him to SG and SF and that screwed him up. He's at his best as a PG.

The Hornets really came out on top with their win-win scenario. Having Noel fall into their laps at 9 was good... essentially drafting Jrue Holiday locked in on a reasonable contract with the 9th surpasses any preconceived notion of "value".

pancakes3 wrote:The Hornets really came out on top with their win-win scenario. Having Noel fall into their laps at 9 was good... essentially drafting Jrue Holiday locked in on a reasonable contract with the 9th surpasses any preconceived notion of "value".

I think Jrue is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. I think he's solidly in the middle of the pack as far as PGs go. I don't see a significant difference b/w Holiday & Vasquez. I hated the move from NO's point of view. It was unnecessary, why couldn't they be patient and take a long term view towards building something special instead of cashing in their chips and going for the quick fix? They aren't winning anything of significance with Holiday as their PG.

I think Noel & Davis could have been something really special together. Defensively, that's a championship caliber front line in a few short years. Had they been patient and got a perimeter player with their 2014 lottery pick, they'd have really been in an incredible position.

Great trade from Philly's standpoint. They got Noel and a 2014 pick.

Dat2U wrote:

pancakes3 wrote:The Hornets really came out on top with their win-win scenario. Having Noel fall into their laps at 9 was good... essentially drafting Jrue Holiday locked in on a reasonable contract with the 9th surpasses any preconceived notion of "value".

I think Jrue is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. I think he's solidly in the middle of the pack as far as PGs go. I don't see a significant difference b/w Holiday & Vasquez. I hated the move from NO's point of view. It was unnecessary, why couldn't they be patient and take a long term view towards building something special instead of cashing in their chips and going for the quick fix? They aren't winning anything of significance with Holiday as their PG.

I think Noel & Davis could have been something really special together. Defensively, that's a championship caliber front line in a few short years. Had they been patient and got a perimeter player with their 2014 lottery pick, they'd have really been in an incredible position.

Great trade from Philly's standpoint. They got Noel and a 2014 pick.

The Hornets... Pelicans just acquired a 23 year old All-Star PG. How is that not building for the long-term? They could have taken Noel or someone else at 6, then drafted another guy in the 6-10 range next year, or they could have the guaranteed All-Star caliber player in Holiday. That's a fantastic trade. I agree that Holiday is not in that top top tier of PGs, and there's a lot of very good PGs in this league right now. He's probably on a similar level as Ty Lawson, maybe the 12th best PG or so off the top of my head. Holiday/Gordon/Anderson/Davis is a damn good young core.

rockymac52 wrote:

Dat2U wrote:

pancakes3 wrote:The Hornets really came out on top with their win-win scenario. Having Noel fall into their laps at 9 was good... essentially drafting Jrue Holiday locked in on a reasonable contract with the 9th surpasses any preconceived notion of "value".

I think Jrue is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. I think he's solidly in the middle of the pack as far as PGs go. I don't see a significant difference b/w Holiday & Vasquez. I hated the move from NO's point of view. It was unnecessary, why couldn't they be patient and take a long term view towards building something special instead of cashing in their chips and going for the quick fix? They aren't winning anything of significance with Holiday as their PG.

I think Noel & Davis could have been something really special together. Defensively, that's a championship caliber front line in a few short years. Had they been patient and got a perimeter player with their 2014 lottery pick, they'd have really been in an incredible position.

Great trade from Philly's standpoint. They got Noel and a 2014 pick.

The Hornets... Pelicans just acquired a 23 year old All-Star PG. How is that not building for the long-term? They could have taken Noel or someone else at 6, then drafted another guy in the 6-10 range next year, or they could have the guaranteed All-Star caliber player in Holiday. That's a fantastic trade. I agree that Holiday is not in that top top tier of PGs, and there's a lot of very good PGs in this league right now. He's probably on a similar level as Ty Lawson, maybe the 12th best PG or so off the top of my head. Holiday/Gordon/Anderson/Davis is a damn good young core.

The only good things about Holliday is his relatively modest contract. If NO had legit concerns about Noel's medical issues, I would have taken Mclemore as BPA. GV is not that far off from Holliday.

I think you can only hate on the relatively choices between the 2. If someone had posted 2 hours before the draft that New Orleans can stand pat and either get Noel or Jrue out of it, you wouldn't come close to believing it.

mhd wrote:

rockymac52 wrote:

Dat2U wrote:
I think Jrue is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. I think he's solidly in the middle of the pack as far as PGs go. I don't see a significant difference b/w Holiday & Vasquez. I hated the move from NO's point of view. It was unnecessary, why couldn't they be patient and take a long term view towards building something special instead of cashing in their chips and going for the quick fix? They aren't winning anything of significance with Holiday as their PG.

I think Noel & Davis could have been something really special together. Defensively, that's a championship caliber front line in a few short years. Had they been patient and got a perimeter player with their 2014 lottery pick, they'd have really been in an incredible position.

Great trade from Philly's standpoint. They got Noel and a 2014 pick.

The Hornets... Pelicans just acquired a 23 year old All-Star PG. How is that not building for the long-term? They could have taken Noel or someone else at 6, then drafted another guy in the 6-10 range next year, or they could have the guaranteed All-Star caliber player in Holiday. That's a fantastic trade. I agree that Holiday is not in that top top tier of PGs, and there's a lot of very good PGs in this league right now. He's probably on a similar level as Ty Lawson, maybe the 12th best PG or so off the top of my head. Holiday/Gordon/Anderson/Davis is a damn good young core.

The only good things about Holliday is his relatively modest contract. If NO had legit concerns about Noel's medical issues, I would have taken Mclemore as BPA. GV is not that far off from Holliday.

Greivis Vasquez IS much worse than Jrue Holiday. Come on man, you can't be serious with that.

No team had an amazing draft, but the Pelicans really plucked up with that Jrue trade. I'm in the camp that Jrue is barely above average and barely above Grevis. That' would make Philly the winner but... they pick ANOTHER guard who can't shoot - in MCW. He's another Turner. They should have picked Larkin - I don't care how short he is.

I haven't reviewed the draft closely, but I liked what Utah did. They NEEDED Burke trade up to get him. And they got a real good value in Gobert. He might not make it, but it's good risk.

Ruzious wrote:No team had an amazing draft, but the Pelicans really plucked up with that Jrue trade. I'm in the camp that Jrue is barely above average and barely above Grevis. That' would make Philly the winner but... they pick ANOTHER guard who can't shoot - in MCW. He's another Turner. They should have picked Larkin - I don't care how short he is.

I haven't reviewed the draft closely, but I liked what Utah did. They NEEDED Burke trade up to get him. And they got a real good value in Gobert. He might not make it, but it's good risk.

I didn't like the MCW pick at all. I think Philly should have taken Shabaaz or Adams.

pancakes3 wrote:I think you can only hate on the relatively choices between the 2. If someone had posted 2 hours before the draft that New Orleans can stand pat and either get Noel or Jrue out of it, you wouldn't come close to believing it.

If you had posted that NO was giving up it's 2013 1st AND 2014 pick to get Jrue Holiday, then you would have believed it. You are leaving out a pretty important part of the deal.

rockymac52 wrote:

Dat2U wrote:

pancakes3 wrote:The Hornets really came out on top with their win-win scenario. Having Noel fall into their laps at 9 was good... essentially drafting Jrue Holiday locked in on a reasonable contract with the 9th surpasses any preconceived notion of "value".

I think Jrue is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. I think he's solidly in the middle of the pack as far as PGs go. I don't see a significant difference b/w Holiday & Vasquez. I hated the move from NO's point of view. It was unnecessary, why couldn't they be patient and take a long term view towards building something special instead of cashing in their chips and going for the quick fix? They aren't winning anything of significance with Holiday as their PG.

I think Noel & Davis could have been something really special together. Defensively, that's a championship caliber front line in a few short years. Had they been patient and got a perimeter player with their 2014 lottery pick, they'd have really been in an incredible position.

Great trade from Philly's standpoint. They got Noel and a 2014 pick.

The Hornets... Pelicans just acquired a 23 year old All-Star PG. How is that not building for the long-term? They could have taken Noel or someone else at 6, then drafted another guy in the 6-10 range next year, or they could have the guaranteed All-Star caliber player in Holiday. That's a fantastic trade. I agree that Holiday is not in that top top tier of PGs, and there's a lot of very good PGs in this league right now. He's probably on a similar level as Ty Lawson, maybe the 12th best PG or so off the top of my head. Holiday/Gordon/Anderson/Davis is a damn good young core.

Anthony Mason, Tyrone Hill & Vin Baker have all been all-stars. Loul Deng was an all-star the last two years, arguably the two worst of his career. It means very little, especially considering Holiday's play tanked the 2nd half of the year when he was one of the WORST starting PGs in the league.

It wasn't a fantastic trade. They gave up a potential starting C who would have been an incredible compliment to Anthony Davis and they gave up a valuable 2014 draft pick. IMO it was shortsighted as hell. IMO. They should have let the Davis/Noel pairing grow together and shopped Gordon's deal for pennies on the dollar so they could get out of that horrible mistake from last year. Collect another high lottery pick in '14 and you might have been looking at an OKC style rebuild where they could have become an elite team in a very short period of time.