Wall Versus........

dlts20 · Post #1 » by **dlts20** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 7:32 am

Its that time. We are back at .500 for the millionth time. Can we get over for the 1st time in Wall's career. He's the #1 overall pick/max guy. He also since the 2nd half of last year has played as good as any PG in the league not named Paul/Curry. He is a freshly crowned All Star and just lead us to a victory over the best team in the league.

However, the reason why I made this thread is because the paragraph above now comes to its head as he is about to go head to head with beast PG's every single night. I think we should keep track of every single matchup that is coming up. Has he taken his game to the level where he can atleast match but even outplay most of these guys while getting wins in the process?

Next up he plays Lillard, Parker, Irving, Thomas, Conley(if healthy), Lin, Lowry, Teague, Holiday, Irving, Oladipo, Lowry, MCW, and Conley again.

Alot of those guys people think are either better, have played just as well, give Wall problems, or outplayed him in the previous matchup. How will he do? It will probably go a long ways to see how well we do in those matchups. Game on.

1st up is Lillard. Made the All Star team in the competitive WC, made team USA cuts over Wall, started over Wall in the scrimmage over the Summer, getting more shine on Adidas than Wall, won the skills challenge in the All Star game last year after Wall failed the year before, and is now trying to steal the dunk contest shine from John. He broke out of a mini slump last game so will be confident coming in. Has helped lead his team to one of the best records in a beast Conference and will be a big factor in seeing if Wall can get us over the .500 hump. This is a huge huge huge game because I think if we win with Wall outplaying Lillard then it would boost both Wall and our team's confidence so much along with another win over a great team that we could finally make a run despite a tough sked.

dangermouse · Post #2 » by **dangermouse** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 8:20 am

Our fanbase getting stoked to crack .500+ reminds me of the end of the Will Ferrell basketball comedy "Semi-Pro" when the Flint Tropics fans start a riot because the team made it to 4th place to finish the season.

verbal8 · Post #3 » by **verbal8** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 12:11 pm

dangermouse wrote:Our fanbase getting stoked to crack .500+ reminds me of the end of the Will Ferrell basketball comedy "Semi-Pro" when the Flint Tropics fans start a riot because the team made it to 4th place to finish the season.

Hey it is a step up from chasing the "9th seed"

Post #4 » by **miller31time** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 12:13 pm

dangermouse wrote:Our fanbase getting stoked to crack .500+ reminds me of the end of the Will Ferrell basketball comedy "Semi-Pro" when the Flint Tropics fans start a riot because the team made it to 4th place to finish the season.

Abe Pollin playoff cake?

Washington Mystics attendance banners?

This fits right in. I expect an impromptu 6th seed office dance party at season' end.

Post #5 » by **montestewart** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 1:15 pm

miller31time wrote:
dangermouse wrote:Our fanbase getting stoked to crack .500+ reminds me of the end of the Will Ferrell basketball comedy "Semi-Pro" when the Flint Tropics fans start a riot because the team made it to 4th place to finish the season.

Abe Pollin playoff cake?

Washington Mystics attendance banners?

This fits right in. I expect an impromptu 6th seed office dance party at season' end.

We, are the 6th seed, my friends,
And we'll, keep on fighting, 'til the end…

Kanyewest · Post #6 » by **Kanyewest** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 2:01 pm

dlts20 wrote:Its that time. We are back at .500 for the millionth time. Can we get over for the 1st time in Wall's career. He's the #1 overall pick/max guy. He also since the 2nd half of last year has played as good as any PG in the league not named Paul/Curry. He is a freshly crowned All Star and just lead us to a victory over the best team in the league.

However, the reason why I made this thread is because the paragraph above now comes to its head as he is about to go head to head with beast PG's every single night. I think we should keep track of every single matchup that is coming up. Has he taken his game to the level where he can atleast match but even outplay most of these guys while getting wins in the process?

Next up he plays Lillard, Parker, Irving, Thomas, Conley(if healthy), Lin, Lowry, Teague, Holiday, Irving, Oladipo, Lowry, MCW, and Conley again.

Alot of those guys people think are either better, have played just as well, give Wall problems, or outplayed him in the previous matchup. How will he do? It will probably go a long ways to see how well we do in those matchups. Game on.

1st up is Lillard. Made the All Star team in the competitive WC, made team USA cuts over Wall, started over Wall in the scrimmage over the Summer, getting more shine on Adidas than Wall, won the skills challenge in the All Star game last year after Wall failed the year before, and is now trying to steal the dunk contest shine from John. He broke out of a mini slump last game so will be confident coming in. Has helped lead his team to one of the best records in a beast Conference and will be a big factor in seeing if Wall can get us over the .500 hump. This is a huge huge huge game because I think if we win with Wall outplaying Lillard then it would boost both Wall and our team's confidence so much along with another win over a great team that we could finally make a run despite a tough sked.

If we are including this season only, I also think Kyle Lowry has been up there with the elite point guards.

Wall has shown he can play well enough against elite point guards. He did well enough against Steph Curry and the Golden State Warriors. He also brought his A game against the OKC Thunder who were without Westbrook but were considered an elite team.

Still as for getting over .500, Wall has not alwas brought it especially on the defensive end. Someone like Phil Pressey scored 20 points while shooting 70% from the field when the Celtics and the Wizards last met. Pressey hasn't scored 20 points combined in his last 5 games.

I also felt that Wall didn't bring the same kind of defensive intensity in games against the Jazz and the Clippers. Wall really didn't take advantage of the inexperience of Trey Burke. Collison especially had his way with Wall. Perhaps the lack of defensive intensity came from playing the second game of a back to back but Wall is going to continue to have to develop his mental toughness.

stevemcqueen1 · Post #7 » by **stevemcqueen1** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 3:10 pm

We beat OKC as a team. Isolating Wall's performance and comparing it against just one other player misses that point.

The games I love are the ones like that OKC one. Wall scores just 17 points, but he played dominating D and does a terrific job orchestrating the offense. Players moved around and forced OKC to defend everybody for the whole game. The ball moved around. And almost all of our key guys got involved and scored in double figures.

The most demoralizing games are the ones where Wall dominates his individual matchup and scores a ton of points and we still lose because nobody else gets involved, like that last game against Detroit, and the one in Toronto earlier in the year. We don't win by having one player carry us like some teams do. We win by being balanced and distributive.

Higga · Post #8 » by **Higga** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 3:57 pm

stevemcqueen1 wrote:We beat OKC as a team. Isolating Wall's performance and comparing it against just one other player misses that point.

The games I love are the ones like that OKC one. Wall scores just 17 points, but he played dominating D and does a terrific job orchestrating the offense. Players moved around and forced OKC to defend everybody for the whole game. The ball moved around. And almost all of our key guys got involved and scored in double figures.

The most demoralizing games are the ones where Wall dominates his individual matchup and scores a ton of points and we still lose because nobody else gets involved, like that last game against Detroit, and the one in Toronto earlier in the year. We don't win by having one player carry us like some teams do. We win by being balanced and distributive.

Good point. We had a great team effort against OKC. But Wall went into legit superstar mode in the 2nd half. To beat the good teams, you need a good team effort but you also need your star to play like a star.

I'll take Wall against any PG in the league, save maybe Chris Paul, and take my chances.

dlts20 · Post #9 » by **dlts20** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 8:35 pm

Kanyewest wrote:
dlts20 wrote:Its that time. We are back at .500 for the millionth time. Can we get over for the 1st time in Wall's career. He's the #1 overall pick/max guy. He also since the 2nd half of last year has played as good as any PG in the league not named Paul/Curry. He is a freshly crowned All Star and just lead us to a victory over the best team in the league.

However, the reason why I made this thread is because the paragraph above now comes to its head as he is about to go head to head with beast PG's every single night. I think we should keep track of every single matchup that is coming up. Has he taken his game to the level where he can atleast match but even outplay most of these guys while getting wins in the process?

Next up he plays Lillard, Parker, Irving, Thomas, Conley(if healthy), Lin, Lowry, Teague, Holiday, Irving, Oladipo, Lowry, MCW, and Conley again.

Alot of those guys people think are either better, have played just as well, give Wall problems, or outplayed him in the previous matchup. How will he do? It will probably go a long ways to see how well we do in those matchups. Game on.

1st up is Lillard. Made the All Star team in the competitive WC, made team USA cuts over Wall, started over Wall in the scrimmage over the Summer, getting more shine on Adidas than Wall, won the skills challenge in the All Star game last year after Wall failed the year before, and is now trying to steal the dunk contest shine from John. He broke out of a mini slump last game so will be confident coming in. Has helped lead his team to one of the best records in a beast Conference and will be a big factor in seeing if Wall can get us over the .500 hump. This is a huge huge huge game because I think if we win with Wall outplaying Lillard then it would boost both Wall and our team's confidence so much along with another win over a great team that we could finally make a run despite a tough sked.

If we are including this season only, I also think Kyle Lowry has been up there with the elite point guards.

Wall has shown he can play well enough against elite point guards. He did well enough against Steph Curry and the Golden State Warriors. He also brought his A game against the OKC Thunder who were without Westbrook but were considered an elite team.

Still as for getting over .500, Wall has not alwas brought it especially on the defensive end. Someone like Phil Pressey scored 20 points while shooting 70% from the field when the Celtics and the Wizards last met. Pressey hasn't scored 20 points combined in his last 5 games.

I also felt that Wall didn't bring the same kind of defensive intensity in games against the Jazz and the Clippers. Wall really didn't take advantage of the inexperience of Trey Burke. Collison especially had his way with Wall. Perhaps the lack of defensive intensity came from playing the second game of a back to back but Wall is going to continue to have to develop his mental toughness.

I disagree. I think its mostly about respecting the other guy. If he respects you then he steps his D up. I think he did great on Curry, was great on a hot Jackson, and was great on Collinson in the 2nd half. Everything Collinson did was in the 1st

dlts20 · Post #10 » by **dlts20** » Mon Feb 3, 2014 8:39 pm

stevemcqueen1 wrote:We beat OKC as a team. Isolating Wall's performance and comparing it against just one other player misses that point.

The games I love are the ones like that OKC one. Wall scores just 17 points, but he played dominating D and does a terrific job orchestrating the offense. Players moved around and forced OKC to defend everybody for the whole game. The ball moved around. And almost all of our key guys got involved and scored in double figures.

The most demoralizing games are the ones where Wall dominates his individual matchup and scores a ton of points and we still lose because nobody else gets involved, like that last game against Detroit, and the one in Toronto earlier in the year. We don't win by having one player carry us like some teams do. We win by being balanced and distributive.

I disagree. No one is saying he has to be a stat monster or score 35. Its still about the eye test and watching the games. He doesnt have to have the better numbers but I would like to see him have the better impact, whether it be predominantly by playing great D or controling the game also.

Still, I think you are missing the point. We still 90% of the time will go as Wall goes. Furthermore, he is still the #1 pick and a Max guy so we should expect him to outplay guys. Thats what superstars are called to do. Wining is always going to be the most important but 9 times out of 10 they will coincide with your star's play anyways. Its time for him to show why he is the man. Even the guys on the team say if Wall plays great then its ususally a trickle down effect. He's the main engine, especially since most of them struggle to get there own shot and he's at the top of the defense

dlts20 · Post #11 » by **dlts20** » Tue Feb 4, 2014 2:40 am

Definitely atleast held his own and I think Wall outplayed him. He controlled the game more and Lillard only went off when Wall was either on the bench or not guarding him. Good battle though. The weird thing is that I was watching the game and I was saying that it felt a lil separate. Its like the 2 star PG's and they both are doing things but it never felt like it was against eachother. Batum was guarding Wall and alot of times Beal would get switched on Lillard or Dame just wouldnt score on Wall.

Next game is the big one. SA embarrassed us last time and that system eats us up. Should be a fun matchup against Parker. Still, Wall keeps playing like this then we will win alot of games. Now just got to get Beal back hot

Hypnotizer · Post #12 » by **Hypnotizer** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:42 am

[tweet]https://twitter.com/FOXSportsLive/status/458467037430288384[/tweet]

dlts20 · Post #13 » by **dlts20** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 1:08 pm

I dont like it. West Coast Gary thats what he is and he's still salty that Wall didnt come see him the last 2 summers. I just saw 2 list yesterday that think Wall is a top 3 PG. I dont care what anyone says, if you want to have 4 of those guys then fine but there is no way in hell that Lillard is better than Wall. No way.

Also, lets be real. How much do you think GP has seen Wall play compared to those guys? They are all WC teams and they all get National TV games compared to a EC team who didnt get 1 national game. I bet he didnt see Wall in any games this year

deneem4 · Post #14 » by **deneem4** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 5:12 pm

Wall vs himself....He's the only thing stopping him...He can get to the basket so easy off the dribble, finishing is a v problem but this is playoff basketball...This is the bulls they're contesting everything 3/5 fouls will get called if wall attaxks...only difference between wall and Lillard is fear...Lillard is fearless, and a better shooter, but he came to the nba on a playoff ready team....wall didn't, wall has no allstar 2nd option...but the facts still remain he must be the most important person on the floor at all times

Kanyewest · Post #15 » by **Kanyewest** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 5:26 pm

Gary Payton on John Wall

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2013/2/15 ... on-wizards

dangermouse · Post #16 » by **dangermouse** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 10:45 pm

That is strange that he picked Lillard over Wall for 5th best PG, only because he has shown Wall so much love in the past. A lot of people would agree with that list though. I think he deserves the nod for 5th spot over Lillard, but its pretty close.

TGW · Post #17 » by **TGW** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 10:51 pm

Lilliard is the most overrated "point guard" in the NBA, if you want to call him that. He doesn't run a team well IMO, and he looks for his shot first. He seems like one of those point guards that players don't want to play with because he shoots too damn much.

At least, that's what I see when I watch a Blazers game.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #18 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:37 pm

Hypnotizer wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/FOXSportsLive/status/458467037430288384[/tweet]

And after them, Kyrie Irving, Kyle Lowry, and it's close between Wall and Mike Conley.

I'm tempted to add Ty Lawson in the mix, too.

Hypnotizer · Post #19 » by **Hypnotizer** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:43 pm

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
And after them, Kyrie Irving, Kyle Lowry, and it's close between Wall and Mike Conley.

I'm tempted to add Ty Lawson in the mix, too.

Don't forget about Isaiah Thomas.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #20 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:47 pm

Honestly, Isaiah Thomas and Phil Pressey are underrated PGs. If they weren't short they'd be up there. Guys like Kemba Walker, DJ Augustin, and of course Thomas and Pressey are all effective in their own ways.

I give Wall the nod because he can impact games at either end when he's locked in. Head-to-Head, however, Thomas does often get the better of Wall.