WIZ GET MARKIEFF MORRIS...............

[DCZards]

Cool article about Morris in today's WAPO. I'm loving the way Kieff has fit in with the Zards and has become an important contributor both on and off the court.

Here's an excerpt from the column by Dan Steinberg and the link:

"But remember, when Morris was traded here last winter — a piece that might have propelled a struggling team into the playoffs — it seemed like something of a gamble. Morris was thought to be a risk, with less potential upside than the first-round pick Washington dealt to Phoenix. The best case was that he would fit in quietly and contribute to a team led by its existing core. The best case was that he would serve as a solid player in the background.

Did the best case ever consider that, in the first playoff game of his life, Morris would score 14 points during perhaps the most important seven-minute stretch of the game, as Washington turned a six-point deficit into a 10-point lead? Or that he would outperform Millsap in that postseason debut? Or that his consecutive alley-oop dunks from Wall — with Morris punishing the rim both times — would prompt some of the loudest roars from a crowd that hadn’t seen a Game 1 at home in 38 years? Or that he would transform into an elder statesman on this still-young group, someone who could help regulate its mood and mentality?"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2017/04/16/how-markieff-morris-brought-death-row-dc-and-an-edge-to-the-wizards/?utm_term=.d893ec7e085e

[tontoz]

On this season relative to other 4s Morris ranked:

46th in PER
51st in rebound rate
49th in TS% (in spite of career best 3 pt shooting)
21st in RPM, thanks to good defense. He was still a net negative on offense

Considering that this was probably his 2nd best season as a pro I think it is pretty clear why some people didn't like the trade.

[DCZards]

On this season relative to other 4s Morris ranked:

46th in PER
51st in rebound rate
49th in TS% (in spite of career best 3 pt shooting)
21st in RPM, thanks to good defense. He was still a net negative on offense

Considering that this was probably his 2nd best season as a pro I think it is pretty clear why some people didn't like the trade.

ahhh...numbers sweet numbers. Where we would be without them.

Maybe you would have preferred that the Zards have played that 13th pick in last year's draft at PF against Atlanta at the Verizon Ctr. on Saturday. Oh, that's right. We probably wouldn't have had home court advantage without Kieff's torrid play in January and February.

[tontoz]

On this season relative to other 4s Morris ranked:

46th in PER
51st in rebound rate
49th in TS% (in spite of career best 3 pt shooting)
21st in RPM, thanks to good defense. He was still a net negative on offense

Considering that this was probably his 2nd best season as a pro I think it is pretty clear why some people didn't like the trade.

ahhh...numbers sweet numbers. Where we would be without them.

Maybe you would have preferred that the Zards have played that 13th pick in last year's draft at PF against Atlanta at the Verizon Ctr. on Saturday. Oh, that's right. We probably wouldn't have had home court advantage without Kieff's torrid play in January and February.

All the games count, not just the ones where Kief played well. Overall Kief wasn't that good. On the season he shot 48.3% on 2 point shots, taking 9 per game. That is not what you want from a big man.

Given that we finished 6 games ahead of Atlanta I am certainly not convinced that we wouldn't have home court if Smith had been our starting 4 intead of Kief. Maybe we could have used some of his salary on a backup guard that could have been useful.

And it isn't just about this season. It is also about last season and the seasons going forward.

[sfam]

On this season relative to other 4s Morris ranked:

46th in PER
51st in rebound rate
49th in TS% (in spite of career best 3 pt shooting)
21st in RPM, thanks to good defense. He was still a net negative on offense

Considering that this was probably his 2nd best season as a pro I think it is pretty clear why some people didn't like the trade.

ahhh...numbers sweet numbers. Where we would be without them.

Maybe you would have preferred that the Zards have played that 13th pick in last year's draft at PF against Atlanta at the Verizon Ctr. on Saturday. Oh, that's right. We probably wouldn't have had home court advantage without Kieff's torrid play in January and February.

All the games count, not just the ones where Kief played well. Overall Kief wasn't that good. On the season he shot 48.3% on 2 point shots, taking 9 per game. That is not what you want from a big man.

Given that we finished 6 games ahead of Atlanta I am certainly not convinced that we wouldn't have home court if Smith had been our starting 4 intead of Kief. Maybe we could have used some of his salary on a backup guard that could have been useful.

And it isn't just about this season. It is also about last season and the seasons going forward.

As much as its great to see the love for Smith, I was one of the very few even arguing the dude could play the 4 at the beginning of the season.

Morris has been pitchy, no doubt. When Morris is not engaged, his play drops off a cliff. But he was dominating in the first game of the playoffs. Like Porter, I'm far more interested in how Morris does in the next few months, than how consistent he was during the regular season. Morris gets up for big games. That's fine with me - all games are big now.

Morris is more than paying his contract back. In addition to his numbers, he has made significant contributions to the team's culture, which is ironic considering he is a supposed cancer in the locker room.

[tontoz]

Dominating? Kief took 19 shots and 3 foul shots to score 21 points. That is a TS of 51.7%. I wouldn't call that dominating.

He certainly seemed to frustrate Milsap. However Milsap scored 19 with a TS of 74% so it isn't like Kief shut him down.

[sfam]

Dominating? Kief took 19 shots and 3 foul shots to score 21 points. That is a TS of 51.7%. I wouldn't call that dominating.

He certainly seemed to frustrate Milsap. However Milsap scored 19 with a TS of 74% so it isn't like Kief shut him down.

Milsap's WWF comment told us all we need to of Morris' impact.

He seemed to get them out of the flow of their offense. Yeah, Milsap had a good line, but looked completely out of sorts, and never "led" his team in a comeback.

[Kanyewest]

Dominating? Kief took 19 shots and 3 foul shots to score 21 points. That is a TS of 51.7%. I wouldn't call that dominating.

He certainly seemed to frustrate Milsap. However Milsap scored 19 with a TS of 74% so it isn't like Kief shut him down.

Millsap only had 2 rebounds, 1 assist and 4 turnovers. Morris had 7 rebounds, 4 blocks, 2 assists, 1 steal and 2 turnovers.

Sent from my LG-D851 using RealGM mobile app

[payitforward]

On this season relative to other 4s Morris ranked:

46th in PER
51st in rebound rate
49th in TS% (in spite of career best 3 pt shooting)
21st in RPM, thanks to good defense. He was still a net negative on offense

Considering that this was probably his 2nd best season as a pro I think it is pretty clear why some people didn't like the trade.

ahhh...numbers sweet numbers. Where we would be without them.

Maybe you would have preferred that the Zards have played that 13th pick in last year's draft at PF against Atlanta at the Verizon Ctr. on Saturday. Oh, that's right. We probably wouldn't have had home court advantage without Kieff's torrid play in January and February.

Sigh... Zards.... don't know what to do with you, man....

Markieff had a good game Monday night. Moreover, he has certainly NOT been the locker room problem some people anticipated -- note that I was not among those people. In fact, he seems like a nice guy & to be liked by his teammates. For his sake, the move to the Wizards seems to have been a god-send, & I'm happy for him as a person.

But Markieff Morris is not a particularly good NBA player -- whether you like it or not, Zards. As an NBA big, he's about average in a few categories & below average in most of them.

Markieff's blocks are below average, his assists are below average, his defensive rebounding is below average, his offensive rebounding is below average, & he fouls more than average. He scores a tiny bit more than an average NBA big, but he does so at a below average EFG%. Only his steals are a bit above average for an NBA big.

It's true, & I'm glad, Markieff played well over a stretch. & what that means is that over that stretch his "numbers sweet numbers" were a good bit better than they otherwise were. But, obviously, he also played poorly over a long stretch -- otherwise where would the overall bad numbers come from.

For that reason, no, you can't conclude that he's somehow the reason we have home court advantage! For that matter, if his almost 2400 minutes had been played by a 4 who produced at NBA average levels, we might well have had 5 more wins.

Does that mean we'd have been better off Monday night w/ the #13 guy from last year's draft? Of course not! But, that's not how you judge a player acquisition, is it, based on one game? Of course not!

Overall, yeah, we'd be better off as a team going forward if we'd kept that draft pick. Just as we'd be better off if we had our draft pick this year instead of Bojan.

[payitforward]

...Morris is more than paying his contract back.

I'd say his contract might be barely acceptable as value. Not especially good.

But that's not the point. We gave a R1 pick, a lottery pick, for Markieff.

In addition to his numbers, he has made significant contributions to the team's culture, which is ironic considering he is a supposed cancer in the locker room.

The fact that it was a bad trade doesn't mean Markieff is a bad person! Any more than the fact that he's a good person means it was a good trade!

As I just wrote a minute ago, he seems a nice guy, he's well liked, & clearly the trade has been a big plus for him: he seems pretty content. & if he's a locker room leader, that's great. It would mean more if he were a better player. If rebounds came with the tough talk, for example. If he shot a higher % on 2s. Etc.

If we'd gotten him for an expiring last year, or for a R2 pick, there would be something more significant in what you write. As it is, Zards has to defend him w/ an obvious puff piece.

What next? Bojan Bogdanovic as bargain almost-MVP-candidate -- as we were reading in late February?

[payitforward]

Dominating? Kief took 19 shots and 3 foul shots to score 21 points. That is a TS of 51.7%. I wouldn't call that dominating.

He certainly seemed to frustrate Milsap. However Milsap scored 19 with a TS of 74% so it isn't like Kief shut him down.

Millsap only had 2 rebounds, 1 assist and 4 turnovers. Morris had 7 rebounds, 4 blocks, 2 assists, 1 steal and 2 turnovers.

Sent from my LG-D851 using RealGM mobile app

Markieff had a better game than Millsap. It's a fact. We won -- that's great! & it's fair to give Markieff some credit in the win. No problem, glad to do it.

But, Zards bumped this thread with a puff piece; his point was how good Kief is (not just Monday night). Sorry. No.

His point also was what a good trade Ernie made to acquire Kief. Sorry. No.

Markieff Morris is who he is as a player. His nearly 2400 minutes this year were of a piece with his season-to-season productivity in 6 NBA seasons. Not good.

That's how you judge him, & it's how you judge the trade too. Not on 1 game. Not on a rosy article.

[Mojo Amok]

I'll tell you one thing: I'm taking the over on his 2019 contract year.

[tontoz]

Dominating? Kief took 19 shots and 3 foul shots to score 21 points. That is a TS of 51.7%. I wouldn't call that dominating.

He certainly seemed to frustrate Milsap. However Milsap scored 19 with a TS of 74% so it isn't like Kief shut him down.

Millsap only had 2 rebounds, 1 assist and 4 turnovers. Morris had 7 rebounds, 4 blocks, 2 assists, 1 steal and 2 turnovers.

Sent from my LG-D851 using RealGM mobile app

I never claimed Millsap played better than Morris. But dominating? He took a lot of shots and didn't shoot well. While he did outrebound Millsap, 7 rebounds in 38 minutes isn't exactly a bragging point. Atlanta still outrebounded us overall.

I liked the way he played defensively, hence my comment about frustrating Millsap, but his offense was pretty mediocre.

[sfam]

Dominating? Kief took 19 shots and 3 foul shots to score 21 points. That is a TS of 51.7%. I wouldn't call that dominating.

He certainly seemed to frustrate Milsap. However Milsap scored 19 with a TS of 74% so it isn't like Kief shut him down.

Millsap only had 2 rebounds, 1 assist and 4 turnovers. Morris had 7 rebounds, 4 blocks, 2 assists, 1 steal and 2 turnovers.

Sent from my LG-D851 using RealGM mobile app

Markieff had a better game than Millsap. It's a fact. We won -- that's great! & it's fair to give Markieff some credit in the win. No problem, glad to do it.

But, Zards bumped this thread with a puff piece; his point was how good Kief is (not just Monday night). Sorry. No.

His point also was what a good trade Ernie made to acquire Kief. Sorry. No.

Markieff Morris is who he is as a player. His nearly 2400 minutes this year were of a piece with his season-to-season productivity in 6 NBA seasons. Not good.

That's how you judge him, & it's how you judge the trade too. Not on 1 game. Not on a rosy article.

I'm far happier with Kief at $7M/year over Horford at $28M/year. He's the starting member of the best team the Wizards have had since the 70s - he doesn't always show up but seems to in the bigger moments. I'm fine with his play right now and am excited to see him continue to rock the playoffs, which I consider to be more important than the regular season.

[nate33]

Millsap only had 2 rebounds, 1 assist and 4 turnovers. Morris had 7 rebounds, 4 blocks, 2 assists, 1 steal and 2 turnovers.

Sent from my LG-D851 using RealGM mobile app

Markieff had a better game than Millsap. It's a fact. We won -- that's great! & it's fair to give Markieff some credit in the win. No problem, glad to do it.

But, Zards bumped this thread with a puff piece; his point was how good Kief is (not just Monday night). Sorry. No.

His point also was what a good trade Ernie made to acquire Kief. Sorry. No.

Markieff Morris is who he is as a player. His nearly 2400 minutes this year were of a piece with his season-to-season productivity in 6 NBA seasons. Not good.

That's how you judge him, & it's how you judge the trade too. Not on 1 game. Not on a rosy article.

I'm far happier with Kief at $7M/year over Horford at $28M/year. He's the starting member of the best team the Wizards have had since the 70s - he doesn't always show up but seems to in the bigger moments. I'm fine with his play right now and am excited to see him continue to rock the playoffs, which I consider to be more important than the regular season.

Agreed. While I understand the statistical argument against him, I kinda feel he's a little better than his numbers, at least on offense. For example, his lackluster FG% comes mostly on perimeter shots. Shooting .483 from 2-point range may not be that great in the abstract, but it's a bit better when you factor that he does it mostly from midrange to provide the necessary spacing for Gortat in the post and the guards to penetrate. He also takes a lot of late shot clock bail out shots, particularly when he's in with the 2nd unit.

[payitforward]

Markieff had a better game than Millsap. It's a fact. We won -- that's great! & it's fair to give Markieff some credit in the win. No problem, glad to do it.

But, Zards bumped this thread with a puff piece; his point was how good Kief is (not just Monday night). Sorry. No.

His point also was what a good trade Ernie made to acquire Kief. Sorry. No.

Markieff Morris is who he is as a player. His nearly 2400 minutes this year were of a piece with his season-to-season productivity in 6 NBA seasons. Not good.

That's how you judge him, & it's how you judge the trade too. Not on 1 game. Not on a rosy article.

I'm far happier with Kief at $7M/year over Horford at $28M/year. He's the starting member of the best team the Wizards have had since the 70s - he doesn't always show up but seems to in the bigger moments. I'm fine with his play right now and am excited to see him continue to rock the playoffs, which I consider to be more important than the regular season.

Agreed. While I understand the statistical argument against him, I kinda feel he's a little better than his numbers. For example, his lackluster FG% comes mostly on perimeter shots. Shooting .483 from 2-point range may not be that great in the abstract, but it's a bit better when you factor that he does it mostly from midrange to provide the necessary spacing for Gortat in the post and the guards to penetrate. He also takes a lot of late shot clock bail out shots, particularly when he's in with the 2nd unit.

No question -- Kief/$7m is better than Horford/$28m. This is the big problem with max contracts -- it's very easy for a player to underperform a contract of that kind. Especially when it starts in your 10th season!

As to Kief being better than his numbers, I wonder if it doesn't come down to this: we won 49 games this year! That's just too "feel good" to bother being critical of Morris.

I'm down with that. Hope he plays well tomorrow night, & we get another win. In fact, if we get the win, I doubt I'm going to much care how he plays!

[DCZards]

But that's not the point. We gave a R1 pick, a lottery pick, for Markieff.

We gave up a late lottery pick (I believe it was the 13th pick), and the chance to draft someone who MIGHT help the Zards win in 2-3 years, for a young guy on a good contract who is helping the Zards win NOW. Winning NOW is important you know. At least it is, I'm sure, to the Zards owner, coaches and FO, to Wall, Beal and their teammates, and to the 20,000 folks who were rocking the Verizon Center last Sunday.

If we'd gotten him for an expiring last year, or for a R2 pick, there would be something more significant in what you write. As it is, Zards has to defend him w/ an obvious puff piece.

I didn't write the so-called puff piece. Nor did I post it to "defend" Kieff. Morris has been solid most of the season--and certainly on Sunday--so his play does not need to be defended, imo.

But I did post the piece (and bump this thread) to get folks talking about Morris. So I've succeeded in doing what I set out to do.

[payitforward]

Yes, you have.

Next you can post about Trey Burke. You were absolutely sure he was going to be good. Then about Andrew Nicholson. You were sure he was going to be good.

In fact, every single trade the Wizards have ever made, & every single guy the team has ever signed, at least in the 5 years I've been on this forum, you've praised. All of them. No exceptions.

Then, if/when (usually "when") the guy turns out to be as bad as we all said he was, & people point that out, you've responded that those people are focused on the past instead of the future.

I guess what I mean is that as soon as you say "I was completely wrong about Trey Burke, about Nicholson, about (fill in the blank)" it'll be easier to give weight to what you say about the next trade or FA signing. That sounds harsh, but I don't mean it that way -- you're a fan, you're motivated to be positive! But if your opinion can be filled in without even having to ask you what it is, because it's always the same, then what's it mean? What's it based on?

[tontoz]

I wouldn't necessarily say that Zards praises all the moves. He does seem to always give them the benefit of the doubt though.

[nate33]

PJ Tucker is giving Giannis about 8 feet of space even though Giannis has the ball inside the key. Just no respect at all for his shot.