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Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through?

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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#121 » by deneem4 » Sat Feb 27, 2016 4:34 pm

tontoz wrote:
CobraCommander wrote:
tontoz wrote:Ariza had his best years here. Ditto Webster. Sessions is playing well here. So is Gortat. And Dudley. Wall has developed fine here.

The problem isnt the "environment". The problem is an incompetent front office that does a piss poor job of evaluating and acquiring talent.


Ariza was a champion before he got here so maybe his best statistical years. Also he left of his own accord to play with a better team that didn't have a distributor to get him the ball in spots. I don't think he left for money as much as an improvement I environment. Also why would you sign to a team that drafted your replacement and was coveting another guy at your position. Webster had his best and worse years here. Sessions isn't better than Jeremy Lin and I we could have had Lin at the minimum. Gortat grew into his own here because of John and I think Dudley is thriving playing along side a pass first point. Dudley is also the beneficiary the new valuation of the 3 and of no one better to take his job - thus he is getting more minutes than he would get if he went to Boston, Clippers or Cleveland.

IMO - Wall thrived in spite of the environment. Wall came in as a point guard playing with Gil and then survived the Shaqtin' a-fool allstar years with SwaggyP, J-McGee, AndreBLahhh- I think Sam Cassell helped mentor him.

I don't see the current roster or coaching staff having the guys that can speak truth to the team.

I understand and respect your point but I respectfully see the situation differently and Yeah I'm panicking :banghead:



There are no state taxes in Texas. Plus Houston was a legit title contender with Harden and Howard already there. It was obvious why he went there. When he played with the Lakers he was only playing 24 minutes per game. Not sure why your are even bringing that up.

Webster didn't have his worst years here at all. He had two good years and then was out hurt. It doesn't matter what the environment is like when you are in a suit.

It doesnt matter if Sessions is better than Lin or anyone else. He is having one of his better seasons here so the environment obviously isn't hurting him.

The roster and coaching staff are lacking because of Grunfail. This is not a talented team. How many other teams would be starting Temple, Porter and Dudley?


Wall didn't thrived wall struggled along with everybody else...he jus had more room for error because whittman has no choice but to play him...he was allowed to play thru his mistakes and learn from them...he starting look good 1st when ariza and okafor then nene came and til him he has to be the leader...

Sessions was always a good backup pg...the environment isn't toxic any more here but the coaching staff is....

U can't compare the McGee wizards with the gortat wizards...u can't say "player x didn't succeed here in 2010 but player x is succeeding in here 2015"


Those are 2 completely different teams...still ran by incompetence....but nontheless

And almost any other Team without a sf would be starting Porter right now...he's like our 3rd best rebounder...he's not a bad player at all, he's jus not being utilized correctly because he's not a vet and the Wizards staff not sure what he can bring...

Even though it obvious
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#122 » by Ed Wood » Sat Feb 27, 2016 4:53 pm

I can't believe that I'm choosing this comedic tour de force of a thread to fulfill my serious post quota, but I'd just like to point out that characterizing the expressed desire to see turnover in the front office of the Wizards as panic demonstrates a lack of a sense of history, both of the team and of the board.

Never mind that the arguments against the effective operation of the team can be quantified, read out in the gap between the modest statistical benchmarks each new acquisition can ostensibly claim and the more barren reality revealed by any semi-serious attempt to apply more rigor and method to those numbers.

There's no panic here because panic would imply a suddenness and urgency that is so many years behind us now if it ever existed. Grunfeld has run this team poorly for a long, long time, and so, having come to realize this, we more or less constantly hope that he'll be fired and things will get better. I don't necessarily root for the team to actively fail to fascillitate that anymore because it's already happened, happened a second and third time after that, and nothing was so accomplished. So I'd happily see the team win the NBA Finals and then fire Grunfeld the next day; there's simply too much assembled evidence weighed against his competency at this point to counterbalance anything but a sustained run of excellent decisions spanning a number of years. I'd prefer not to give him that chance because I can put only so much faith in the notion of regression to the mean, but frankly he was equally obliged to make up for having been a moron for some time half a decade ago and he's spent the intervening time being **** at running a basketball team.

So I'm not panicking here, leisurely preparing to mosey back down that hill and start again with my boulder perhaps, but I am a learning animal so when I've nearly pushed it to the top and its contract is renewed for another couple of years I hardly panic.

I laugh.
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#123 » by deneem4 » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:04 pm

CobraCommander wrote:
deneem4 wrote:As much as u guys blame whittman and eg...u guys blame the players as well...
With the exception obvious choices every move with criticized with that being said...u cant keep blaming these players if bad staff keep placing them in bad environments or putting them in a position where they can't reach they're potential...



I couldn't agree with you more if I wrote it myself. The reason we are panicking is because the Wiz are a bad team with players that may have potential and Wittmans rotations make no sense to anyone attempting to develop players for the future. I actually agree with the the post about Kaw-Leonard not developing in DC.


I believe
:you can have bad players and have marginal success with GREAT coaching- :o
:you can have good players and have marginal success with a BAD coach - :)
:you can have great players and have true success with a bad coach- :P
:it's hard to develop young players if they don't get good coaching and meaningful minutes...and without development of draft picks they might as well be bad draft picks. :evil:
:with good coaching and ok players you can have marginal success! :)


Now do we really feel like we have good coaching? Do we really feel like any of these players are better as a result of playing for Wittman? Do we really feel like the Wiz are maximizing their talent?

Do we feel like we are panicking or do we feel like we should be better than fighting for a 8 seed when the only true difference is the subtraction of a Old Paul Pierce from a team that if JW doesn't get hurt is playing the Cavs for the Eastern conference title?

I might be panicking because I see the Wiz getting worse before they improve. If they roll out this same roster next year...while the rest of the east gets better, we will be a lottery team for SURE!

So I'm only panicking a little bit...


I'm not panicking because we're not lacking talent...like you said were not maximizing it...but at the same time we're not lacking it...

Teams in the east aren't getting better, they're being coached better...
They're getting quality minutes from they're "oubres/porters/temples"
In a league where it's becoming pace and space...we're one of the only teams not adapting even though that's been our gameplan since wall eas drafted...
Pay your beals....or its lights out!!!
Bron, Bosh, Wade is like Mike, Hakeem, barkley...3 top 5 picks from same draft
mike, hakeem and Barkley on the same team!!!!
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#124 » by closg00 » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:46 pm

Welcome back Hands
Tank 19/20, trade Brad, Top-5 pick in 2020.
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#125 » by montestewart » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:59 pm

Ed Wood wrote:I can't believe that I'm choosing this comedic tour de force of a thread to fulfill my serious post quota, but I'd just like to point out that characterizing the expressed desire to see turnover in the front office of the Wizards as panic demonstrates a lack of a sense of history, both of the team and of the board.

Never mind that the arguments against the effective operation of the team can be quantified, read out in the gap between the modest statistical benchmarks each new acquisition can ostensibly claim and the more barren reality revealed by any semi-serious attempt to apply more rigor and method to those numbers.

There's no panic here because panic would imply a suddenness and urgency that is so many years behind us now if it ever existed. Grunfeld has run this team poorly for a long, long time, and so, having come to realize this, we more or less constantly hope that he'll be fired and things will get better. I don't necessarily root for the team to actively fail to fascillitate that anymore because it's already happened, happened a second and third time after that, and nothing was so accomplished. So I'd happily see the team win the NBA Finals and then fire Grunfeld the next day; there's simply too much assembled evidence weighed against his competency to counterbalance at this point with anything but a sustained run of excellent decisions spanning a number of years. I'd prefer not to give him that chance because I can put only so much faith in the notion of regression to the mean, but frankly he was equally obliged to make up for being a moron for some time half a decade ago and he's spent the intervening time being **** at running a basketball team.

So I'm not panicking here, leisurely preparing to mosey back down that hill and start again with my boulder perhaps, but I am a learning animal so when I've nearly pushed it to the top and its contract is renewed for another couple of years I hardly panic.

I laugh.

This is HOF or there ain't no HOF.
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Re: RE: Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#126 » by ozthegap » Sat Feb 27, 2016 6:46 pm

milellie111 wrote:Panickers lack patience. Instead of waiting for the Morris,Anderson,Hickson deals to work out, you'd rather call for the head of the GM and hope to tank. If you are at the games or watch the games, you'll notice the potential this team has and how close they are to being a contender in the East. How can you blame a GM for being active during the trade deadline and waiver wire? Makes little to no sense. Also, our own young homegrown players are still developing and will continue to develop (Porter, Oubre). Grunfeld/Tapscott have made measurable progress.


What is working out? Them playing well enough for us to get the eighth seed and getting swept in the first round by the Cavs only to lose our pick? Morris, Anderson, Hickson are probably decent with some upside, no doubt. But they are never going to get us close to contention. We are angry because eg has done what he has always done throughout his career. He turned us into a mediocre team and then continuously promises us a tomorrow that never arrives.
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#127 » by deneem4 » Sat Feb 27, 2016 11:07 pm

Toronto is in 2....7th place is tied for 8th right now....
If we can get 7th we can make it to the ecf pretty easily
Pay your beals....or its lights out!!!
Bron, Bosh, Wade is like Mike, Hakeem, barkley...3 top 5 picks from same draft
mike, hakeem and Barkley on the same team!!!!
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#128 » by LyricalRico » Sun Feb 28, 2016 12:05 am

deneem4 wrote:Toronto is in 2....7th place is tied for 8th right now....
If we can get 7th we can make it to the ecf pretty easily


Take that "panickers"! :D

Talking ECF is definitely premature, but I like our chances to advance if we can get up to 7th. It's definitely not over yet!
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#129 » by milellie111 » Sun Feb 28, 2016 8:01 pm

Everything is not always as bad as it seems. Considering we can beat the top team in the East with this deep roster. Sometimes all that's needed is time to gel.
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#130 » by montestewart » Sun Feb 28, 2016 8:57 pm

milellie111 wrote:Everything is not always as bad as it seems. Considering we can beat the top team in the East with this deep roster. Sometimes all that's needed is time to gel.

It's not always darkest just before the dawn. It's actually darkest in the middle of the night. Don't be fooled by that fleshlight. (Had to work gel in there somehow.)

43-39, 6th seed is our championship! Go Wiz!
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#131 » by closg00 » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:08 pm

montestewart wrote:
milellie111 wrote:Everything is not always as bad as it seems. Considering we can beat the top team in the East with this deep roster. Sometimes all that's needed is time to gel.

It's not always darkest just before the dawn. It's actually darkest in the middle of the night. Don't be fooled by that fleshlight. (Had to work gel in there somehow.)

43-39, 6th seed is our championship! Go Wiz!


Ah-yes, the incredibly low-bar that Grunfeld apologist set for the rest of as a reason why we should shut-up and be happy with being EC bottom-feeders.
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#132 » by deneem4 » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:13 pm

closg00 wrote:
montestewart wrote:
milellie111 wrote:Everything is not always as bad as it seems. Considering we can beat the top team in the East with this deep roster. Sometimes all that's needed is time to gel.

It's not always darkest just before the dawn. It's actually darkest in the middle of the night. Don't be fooled by that fleshlight. (Had to work gel in there somehow.)

43-39, 6th seed is our championship! Go Wiz!


Ah-yes, the incredibly low-bar that Grunfeld apologist set for the rest of as a reason why we should shut-up and be happy with being EC bottom-feeders.


7th seed should be our goal...avoid Cleveland and Boston...
1st rd vs raptors...
hopefully hornets finish strong for home(considering they have the all star game next year)2nd rd vs them
Ecf vs Cleveland or hopefully Boston eliminates them for revenge

Cleveland is the only team that's almost guaranteed to reach the 2nd rd...
Pay your beals....or its lights out!!!
Bron, Bosh, Wade is like Mike, Hakeem, barkley...3 top 5 picks from same draft
mike, hakeem and Barkley on the same team!!!!
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#133 » by J-Ves » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:30 pm

^ I would rather face the Cavs in the first round. I rate the Wiz chances of beating the Cavs, Celts, and Raps in a series as about equal(about 15-20%), but only beating the Cavs moves the perception of the Wiz nationally in a big way.


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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#134 » by deneem4 » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:45 pm

J-Ves wrote:^ I would rather face the Cavs in the first round. I rate the Wiz chances of beating the Cavs, Celts, and Raps in a series as about equal(about 15-20%), but only beating the Cavs moves the perception of the Wiz nationally in a big way.


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No way, we can take the raps...when the game slow down they have no answer for gortat or nene...now we have Morris too...biyombo was a good pickup but he's young...and scola is old..

Toronto hosted the asg and drake will be at every game again...il take tht buzz vs a 1st rd cavs matchup
Pay your beals....or its lights out!!!
Bron, Bosh, Wade is like Mike, Hakeem, barkley...3 top 5 picks from same draft
mike, hakeem and Barkley on the same team!!!!
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#135 » by TheSecretWeapon » Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:05 am

montestewart wrote:
Ed Wood wrote:I can't believe that I'm choosing this comedic tour de force of a thread to fulfill my serious post quota, but I'd just like to point out that characterizing the expressed desire to see turnover in the front office of the Wizards as panic demonstrates a lack of a sense of history, both of the team and of the board.

Never mind that the arguments against the effective operation of the team can be quantified, read out in the gap between the modest statistical benchmarks each new acquisition can ostensibly claim and the more barren reality revealed by any semi-serious attempt to apply more rigor and method to those numbers.

There's no panic here because panic would imply a suddenness and urgency that is so many years behind us now if it ever existed. Grunfeld has run this team poorly for a long, long time, and so, having come to realize this, we more or less constantly hope that he'll be fired and things will get better. I don't necessarily root for the team to actively fail to fascillitate that anymore because it's already happened, happened a second and third time after that, and nothing was so accomplished. So I'd happily see the team win the NBA Finals and then fire Grunfeld the next day; there's simply too much assembled evidence weighed against his competency to counterbalance at this point with anything but a sustained run of excellent decisions spanning a number of years. I'd prefer not to give him that chance because I can put only so much faith in the notion of regression to the mean, but frankly he was equally obliged to make up for being a moron for some time half a decade ago and he's spent the intervening time being **** at running a basketball team.

So I'm not panicking here, leisurely preparing to mosey back down that hill and start again with my boulder perhaps, but I am a learning animal so when I've nearly pushed it to the top and its contract is renewed for another couple of years I hardly panic.

I laugh.

This is HOF or there ain't no HOF.

Seconded.

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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#136 » by gambitx777 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 4:42 am

You know, let's say we make the play offs, and we make it to the finals in the east. It's possible, the east is pretty weak, and if we come on strong late.... ? who knows, ? But hell can we please get Dudley and Temple out of the starting line up! Like beal still plays a few more minutes than temple, just start him, start giving Anderson more minutes and limit temple a bit and get Morris into the starting line up!
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#137 » by dckingsfan » Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:00 pm

probability of making the playoffs 42% up from 37% according to fivethiryeight.com
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#138 » by milellie111 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 6:31 pm

gambitx777 wrote:You know, let's say we make the play offs, and we make it to the finals in the east. It's possible, the east is pretty weak, and if we come on strong late.... ? who knows, ? But hell can we please get Dudley and Temple out of the starting line up! Like beal still plays a few more minutes than temple, just start him, start giving Anderson more minutes and limit temple a bit and get Morris into the starting line up!


Of course it's possible. Better yet, it's a strong possibility. This team has shown that it can beat some quality opponents. Panicking is exactly what some are doing when you have 24 games left in the season with 2 new quality acquisitions and only 2 games out of the current playoff standings.
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#139 » by montestewart » Mon Feb 29, 2016 6:43 pm

Ed Wood wrote:I can't believe that I'm choosing this comedic tour de force of a thread to fulfill my serious post quota, but I'd just like to point out that characterizing the expressed desire to see turnover in the front office of the Wizards as panic demonstrates a lack of a sense of history, both of the team and of the board.

Never mind that the arguments against the effective operation of the team can be quantified, read out in the gap between the modest statistical benchmarks each new acquisition can ostensibly claim and the more barren reality revealed by any semi-serious attempt to apply more rigor and method to those numbers.

There's no panic here because panic would imply a suddenness and urgency that is so many years behind us now if it ever existed. Grunfeld has run this team poorly for a long, long time, and so, having come to realize this, we more or less constantly hope that he'll be fired and things will get better. I don't necessarily root for the team to actively fail to fascillitate that anymore because it's already happened, happened a second and third time after that, and nothing was so accomplished. So I'd happily see the team win the NBA Finals and then fire Grunfeld the next day; there's simply too much assembled evidence weighed against his competency at this point to counterbalance anything but a sustained run of excellent decisions spanning a number of years. I'd prefer not to give him that chance because I can put only so much faith in the notion of regression to the mean, but frankly he was equally obliged to make up for having been a moron for some time half a decade ago and he's spent the intervening time being **** at running a basketball team.

So I'm not panicking here, leisurely preparing to mosey back down that hill and start again with my boulder perhaps, but I am a learning animal so when I've nearly pushed it to the top and its contract is renewed for another couple of years I hardly panic.

I laugh.


milellie111 wrote:Panicking is exactly what some are doing when you have 24 games left in the season with 2 new quality acquisitions and only 2 games out of the current playoff standings.


Res ipsa loquitur, but kid, I gotta hand it to you, you got guts. Or something.
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Re: Have You Panickers Actually Thought This Through? 

Post#140 » by nuposse04 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 6:53 pm

milellie111 wrote:
gambitx777 wrote:You know, let's say we make the play offs, and we make it to the finals in the east. It's possible, the east is pretty weak, and if we come on strong late.... ? who knows, ? But hell can we please get Dudley and Temple out of the starting line up! Like beal still plays a few more minutes than temple, just start him, start giving Anderson more minutes and limit temple a bit and get Morris into the starting line up!


Of course it's possible. Better yet, it's a strong possibility. This team has shown that it can beat some quality opponents. Panicking is exactly what some are doing when you have 24 games left in the season with 2 new quality acquisitions and only 2 games out of the current playoff standings.


So getting a 7-8 spot on the a weaker then thought eastern conference impresses you?

I want the team to be in the playoffs for the younger players' sake but this team still has much to show in the consistency/improvement department. :/

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