Jan Vesely Receiving Interest From Nets, 76ers, Mavericks

[keynote]

Hmm. After reading a few articles, I'm also reminded of how Vesely initially resisted the move from SF/PF to C (I'm not sure why anyone thought he could play SF at 7' with no handles and no J). If memory serves, his personal trainer made a few negative comments about how Jan was being miscast as a big. Of course, as others have said, he eventually put on enough weight and has since embraced the role in Europe.

[Dat2U]

I don't know if it was our coaching staff, or his teammates, or his opponents. It could've been the shock of life in the US, or it could've been the new feeling being a minority in a mostly Black league. But he was oozing swag in Europe; he lost all of it within this first month of his rookie season; and he regained it all the moment he returned to Europe.

It was us. It was Wittman. He fell through the cracks here.

BS... he was a lazy bum. He would have failed anywhere he went b/c he didn't care enough to put in the time and effort to improve his skillset, gain weight & get stronger or respond positively to feedback.

Overseas he's a guy that survived off being very athletic amongst a bunch of guys that weren't. I don't understand why this guy avoids being labeled as lazy when many other minority athletes who have accomplished a lot more are stuck with the tag.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Besides Vesely being drafted too high at 6th; just after starting him 15 straight games to end a season, the Wizards traded for Okafor and Ariza during that offseason. Subsequently, they (1)changed his position, (2)cut his minutes, and (3) left him on the bench under Randy Wittman. That stifled his development.

Dat2U calls the player lazy. I think Dat2U is not correct. Not this time. (He usually IS right).

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/v/veselja01.html

If you look at PER, WS/48, USG, and Per-36 Minute stats; you will his best work was when he was with Denver. (HE DID GET BETTER). 3 steals and 2 blocks per 36 is promising. His foul rate and his PISS POOR FT SHOOTING were really wretched. I think he had confidence problems and maybe some mental health related issues going on. As well, he was a rock star in Europe but a bum in the NBA. CONFIDENCE ISSUES.

The main thing I recall is Vesely was CONSISTENTLY BETTER IN NET +/- than Kevin Seraphin.

I recall posting that the Wizards should have (IMMEDIATELY AFTER ACQUIRING OKAFOR AND ARIZA) traded Jan Vesely. They didn't. You see his rookie season was okay. After the trade he fell off a cliff.

Not all his fault.

THIS WIZARDS TEAM COULD USE JAN VESELY!!!

[closg00]

honesty he could definitely be a back up 5 or 4 on the right team. hes beefed up and still can play solid D and rebound and block shots (not super well, but decent). Its really not his fault he was picked 20-25 spots too early.

Back-up C? In Europe perhaps. Have you forgotten how he withered when mixing it up with other big men and how he wouldn't post-up even shrimpy guards?


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Go look at his euro numbers and go watch him play, they dude has gotten much better, not to mention that he also put on a lot of bulk, He sits at about 250 now, and I think he was much much less back then with us. Hey plays harder and definitely has grown as a player, I would 100% love to bring him back as a redemption story!

Exactly, his Euro numbers.Jan is very confident and comfortable playing in Europe, that's his element, that's his comfort zone .

[gambitx777]

Back-up C? In Europe perhaps. Have you forgotten how he withered when mixing it up with other big men and how he wouldn't post-up even shrimpy guards?


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Go look at his euro numbers and go watch him play, they dude has gotten much better, not to mention that he also put on a lot of bulk, He sits at about 250 now, and I think he was much much less back then with us. Hey plays harder and definitely has grown as a player, I would 100% love to bring him back as a redemption story!

Exactly, his Euro numbers.Jan is very confident and comfortable playing in Europe, that's his element, that's his comfort zone .

Dude, we f u c k e d the kid up we took him probably 20 spots too high, his numbers in europe before he was drafted were pretty bad, and he was like 220 soaking wet, and he clearly just needed time to learn to play the game, he runs at 245 250 and hes still pretty lean and athletic, his euro numbers are much better than him NBA numbers and much better than his first euro numbers. We should have stashed him for 2 years and then brought him over. we did not, that was on us, he is a better ball player now hands down and there is ZERO arguments to be made about that fact. He deserves another chance, especially since we all know bigs bloom late. Incase you forgot about a certain center in miami who every one would love to have.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Sato speaks the same language. They know one another.

Too much like the Wizards to not see the opportunity to add a quality player off the bench. The guy plays hard.

[ozthegap]

I don't think Vesely lacked the work ethic. He lacked the confidence. The version of Vesely who plays for Fehbernace would've earned a second NBA contract with his existing skill set, just based on energy and tenacity alone. But I think the NBA was too much of a culture shock for him.

I don't know if it was our coaching staff, or his teammates, or his opponents. It could've been the shock of life in the US, or it could've been the new feeling being a minority in a mostly Black league. But he was oozing swag in Europe; he lost all of it within this first month of his rookie season; and he regained it all the moment he returned to Europe.

I'm sorry I missed all this energy & tenacity when he was in DC. When did he display this?

I think we make excuses for a guy we deem likeable. Why? I dunno. I sometimes wonder if his fair skin has something to do with it. I try never to play that card but I have a hard time remember Kwame or any other draft bust getting so much love and sympathy.

I think you remember wrong. Wiz fans gave Kwame plenty of love and chances. Every offseason for his entire stay in Washington was like maybe this year he'll break out, maybe this year, maybe this year. We don't want to trade him and watch him blow up somewhere else, he has all the potential to be the best big in the league. Etc etc

[Kanyewest]

Hands is posting about this at BF of-course. Jan would still be just an energy big in the NBA IF he has gotten over his fear of mixing it up with grown ass men and shooting the ball.

Another of hands11's greatest hits: Abe Pollin ordered Ernie to trade the 5th pick in 2009 for Miller and Foye.

...he is still saying that

Salary considerations at the time were certainly a part of the trade as well as the notion of winning now, something that may have coincided with Abe wanting to win a championship soon. IIRC, the Wizards dumped salary including Etan's trade kicker and Darius Songailia as the Wizards avoided paying the tax. What didn't make much sense though was that the Wizards traded for Oberto while trading their 2nd rounder for cash, I believe the Wizards paid more salary as a result.

[montestewart]

Another of hands11's greatest hits: Abe Pollin ordered Ernie to trade the 5th pick in 2009 for Miller and Foye.

...he is still saying that

Salary considerations at the time were certainly a part of the trade as well as the notion of winning now, something that may have coincided with Abe wanting to win a championship soon. IIRC, the Wizards dumped salary including Etan's trade kicker and Darius Songailia as the Wizards avoided paying the tax. What didn't make much sense though was that the Wizards traded for Oberto while trading their 2nd rounder for cash, I believe the Wizards paid more salary as a result.

There's no real evidence or other justification for . No one has ever quoted any conversation between Pollin and EGgo or offered any other evidence supporting the "blame it all on Abe" position. Pollin interjected himself in a number of deals (hiring and firing of MJ, resigning Arenas, etc.) and these are well established. It's no secret that he was old and probably didn't have long to live. It's not surprising that he wanted to see the team return to the playoffs before he died. Given that he was an old school owner, it's also not surprising that he wanted to dump salary.

In dumping salary, EGgo gutted his bigs rotation so severely he had to sign Oberto, and he also sold the 2nd (missing out on the good and cheap DeJuan Blair years), and ended up with a weak frontcourt only saved by Haywood's career year. In trading the #5, he got mere wing depth on expiring contracts (which looked like Minnesota's own salary dump), not any real difference makers. Polling might have wanted to trade picks to help make the playoffs and dump dead weight salaries. EGgo was unsuccessful in executing his marching orders. I look at that trade as clear evidence of why EGgo is a bad GM, no matter what Pollin wanted.

Re Vesely, I don't know enough about where he is now to comment, but he did seem a little insecure about playing in the NBA, unable to adjust himself to the NBA game once he realized the package he arrived with wouldn't cut it. I don't relish adding another player who can't score. Not calling him lazy, but he doesn't seem like the gym rat type. I guess time will tell.

[Kanyewest]

...he is still saying that

Salary considerations at the time were certainly a part of the trade as well as the notion of winning now, something that may have coincided with Abe wanting to win a championship soon. IIRC, the Wizards dumped salary including Etan's trade kicker and Darius Songailia as the Wizards avoided paying the tax. What didn't make much sense though was that the Wizards traded for Oberto while trading their 2nd rounder for cash, I believe the Wizards paid more salary as a result.

There's no real evidence or other justification for . No one has ever quoted any conversation between Pollin and EGgo or offered any other evidence supporting the "blame it all on Abe" position. Pollin interjected himself in a number of deals (hiring and firing of MJ, resigning Arenas, etc.) and these are well established. It's no secret that he was old and probably didn't have long to live. It's not surprising that he wanted to see the team return to the playoffs before he died. Given that he was an old school owner, it's also not surprising that he wanted to dump salary.

In dumping salary, EGgo gutted his bigs rotation so severely he had to sign Oberto, and he also sold the 2nd (missing out on the good and cheap DeJuan Blair years), and ended up with a weak frontcourt only saved by Haywood's career year. In trading the #5, he got mere wing depth on expiring contracts (which looked like Minnesota's own salary dump), not any real difference makers. Polling might have wanted to trade picks to help make the playoffs and dump dead weight salaries. EGgo was unsuccessful in executing his marching orders. I look at that trade as clear evidence of why EGgo is a bad GM, no matter what Pollin wanted.

Re Vesely, I don't know enough about where he is now to comment, but he did seem a little insecure about playing in the NBA, unable to adjust himself to the NBA game once he realized the package he arrived with wouldn't cut it. I don't relish adding another player who can't score. Not calling him lazy, but he doesn't seem like the gym rat type. I guess time will tell.

Proof was just in the deal itself, it was a salary dump for a year where the Wizards were a luxury tax team. There wasn't going to be an autopsy of the deal because unfortunately Pollin passed away and gungate happened.

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[80sballboy]

...he is still saying that

Salary considerations at the time were certainly a part of the trade as well as the notion of winning now, something that may have coincided with Abe wanting to win a championship soon. IIRC, the Wizards dumped salary including Etan's trade kicker and Darius Songailia as the Wizards avoided paying the tax. What didn't make much sense though was that the Wizards traded for Oberto while trading their 2nd rounder for cash, I believe the Wizards paid more salary as a result.

There's no real evidence or other justification for . No one has ever quoted any conversation between Pollin and EGgo or offered any other evidence supporting the "blame it all on Abe" position. Pollin interjected himself in a number of deals (hiring and firing of MJ, resigning Arenas, etc.) and these are well established. It's no secret that he was old and probably didn't have long to live. It's not surprising that he wanted to see the team return to the playoffs before he died. Given that he was an old school owner, it's also not surprising that he wanted to dump salary.

In dumping salary, EGgo gutted his bigs rotation so severely he had to sign Oberto, and he also sold the 2nd (missing out on the good and cheap DeJuan Blair years), and ended up with a weak frontcourt only saved by Haywood's career year. In trading the #5, he got mere wing depth on expiring contracts (which looked like Minnesota's own salary dump), not any real difference makers. Polling might have wanted to trade picks to help make the playoffs and dump dead weight salaries. EGgo was unsuccessful in executing his marching orders. I look at that trade as clear evidence of why EGgo is a bad GM, no matter what Pollin wanted.

Re Vesely, I don't know enough about where he is now to comment, but he did seem a little insecure about playing in the NBA, unable to adjust himself to the NBA game once he realized the package he arrived with wouldn't cut it. I don't relish adding another player who can't score. Not calling him lazy, but he doesn't seem like the gym rat type. I guess time will tell.

I don't know if that was true (the Foye/Miller trade) but that's what I was hearing at the time because Abe was very sick and didn't want to wait for Rubio to come over so he wanted players that could help now, which obviously didn't work out.

[Tricky_Kid]

I don't think Vesely lacked the work ethic. He lacked the confidence. The version of Vesely who plays for Fehbernace would've earned a second NBA contract with his existing skill set, just based on energy and tenacity alone. But I think the NBA was too much of a culture shock for him.

I don't know if it was our coaching staff, or his teammates, or his opponents. It could've been the shock of life in the US, or it could've been the new feeling being a minority in a mostly Black league. But he was oozing swag in Europe; he lost all of it within this first month of his rookie season; and he regained it all the moment he returned to Europe.

I'm sorry I missed all this energy & tenacity when he was in DC. When did he display this?

I think we make excuses for a guy we deem likeable. Why? I dunno. I sometimes wonder if his fair skin has something to do with it. I try never to play that card but I have a hard time remember Kwame or any other draft bust getting so much love and sympathy.

Exactly!

[Kanyewest]

Salary considerations at the time were certainly a part of the trade as well as the notion of winning now, something that may have coincided with Abe wanting to win a championship soon. IIRC, the Wizards dumped salary including Etan's trade kicker and Darius Songailia as the Wizards avoided paying the tax. What didn't make much sense though was that the Wizards traded for Oberto while trading their 2nd rounder for cash, I believe the Wizards paid more salary as a result.

There's no real evidence or other justification for . No one has ever quoted any conversation between Pollin and EGgo or offered any other evidence supporting the "blame it all on Abe" position. Pollin interjected himself in a number of deals (hiring and firing of MJ, resigning Arenas, etc.) and these are well established. It's no secret that he was old and probably didn't have long to live. It's not surprising that he wanted to see the team return to the playoffs before he died. Given that he was an old school owner, it's also not surprising that he wanted to dump salary.

In dumping salary, EGgo gutted his bigs rotation so severely he had to sign Oberto, and he also sold the 2nd (missing out on the good and cheap DeJuan Blair years), and ended up with a weak frontcourt only saved by Haywood's career year. In trading the #5, he got mere wing depth on expiring contracts (which looked like Minnesota's own salary dump), not any real difference makers. Polling might have wanted to trade picks to help make the playoffs and dump dead weight salaries. EGgo was unsuccessful in executing his marching orders. I look at that trade as clear evidence of why EGgo is a bad GM, no matter what Pollin wanted.

Re Vesely, I don't know enough about where he is now to comment, but he did seem a little insecure about playing in the NBA, unable to adjust himself to the NBA game once he realized the package he arrived with wouldn't cut it. I don't relish adding another player who can't score. Not calling him lazy, but he doesn't seem like the gym rat type. I guess time will tell.

I don't know if that was true (the Foye/Miller trade) but that's what I was hearing at the time because Abe was very sick and didn't want to wait for Rubio to come over so he wanted players that could help now, which obviously didn't work out.

True, drafting Rubio could have been a compromise given that the Wizards would not need to pay the luxury tax. However, I also recall that Rubio and his agent didn't want to play for Washington.

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[Tricky_Kid]

honesty he could definitely be a back up 5 or 4 on the right team. hes beefed up and still can play solid D and rebound and block shots (not super well, but decent). Its really not his fault he was picked 20-25 spots too early.

Back-up C? In Europe perhaps. Have you forgotten how he withered when mixing it up with other big men and how he wouldn't post-up even shrimpy guards?


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Go look at his euro numbers and go watch him play, they dude has gotten much better, not to mention that he also put on a lot of bulk, He sits at about 250 now, and I think he was much much less back then with us. Hey plays harder and definitely has grown as a player, I would 100% love to bring him back as a redemption story!

I wish Maynor is playing and with Javaale that would be better redemption story. At least McGee is playing on NBA lvl not Euro lvl. Sato - Euroleaguer - was a non factor in NBA in first season.
I am rooting for every our players but wonder if Sato will play badly next season too Will some of You guys admit he suxx or all excuses about coaching stuff, culture shock will show up ?

[gambitx777]

Back-up C? In Europe perhaps. Have you forgotten how he withered when mixing it up with other big men and how he wouldn't post-up even shrimpy guards?


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Go look at his euro numbers and go watch him play, they dude has gotten much better, not to mention that he also put on a lot of bulk, He sits at about 250 now, and I think he was much much less back then with us. Hey plays harder and definitely has grown as a player, I would 100% love to bring him back as a redemption story!

I wish Maynor is playing and with Javaale that would be better redemption story. At least McGee is playing on NBA lvl not Euro lvl. Sato - Euroleaguer - was a non factor in NBA in first season.
I am rooting for every our players but wonder if Sato will play badly next season too Will some of You guys admit he suxx or all excuses about coaching stuff, culture shock will show up ?

You're just tossing names around, Maynor is never getting another chance. McGee got his second chance with GS and hes probably gona play somewhere next year. Tomas is a rookie, and no matter how long you stash him he needs time to adjust to the NBA game and rules, its a legit thing not a excuse. Jan, was taken 6th over all when he had the numers to be 26-35. because he was young and athletic, that is why he needed stashed, and that is why he deserves a shot the dude was still learning the game, needed to bulk up and was no ready at all. its been a few years and hes gotten a lot better, I see 0 reason why we should not sign him and see how he does in camp.

[Ruzious]

I think he will probably be as productive as Yi.

Yi's the perfect comp, and - if anything - Yi was a better talent than Jan.

Tis the ying and yang of Yi and Yan. Yes?

[montestewart]

Salary considerations at the time were certainly a part of the trade as well as the notion of winning now, something that may have coincided with Abe wanting to win a championship soon. IIRC, the Wizards dumped salary including Etan's trade kicker and Darius Songailia as the Wizards avoided paying the tax. What didn't make much sense though was that the Wizards traded for Oberto while trading their 2nd rounder for cash, I believe the Wizards paid more salary as a result.

There's no real evidence or other justification for . No one has ever quoted any conversation between Pollin and EGgo or offered any other evidence supporting the "blame it all on Abe" position. Pollin interjected himself in a number of deals (hiring and firing of MJ, resigning Arenas, etc.) and these are well established. It's no secret that he was old and probably didn't have long to live. It's not surprising that he wanted to see the team return to the playoffs before he died. Given that he was an old school owner, it's also not surprising that he wanted to dump salary.

In dumping salary, EGgo gutted his bigs rotation so severely he had to sign Oberto, and he also sold the 2nd (missing out on the good and cheap DeJuan Blair years), and ended up with a weak frontcourt only saved by Haywood's career year. In trading the #5, he got mere wing depth on expiring contracts (which looked like Minnesota's own salary dump), not any real difference makers. Polling might have wanted to trade picks to help make the playoffs and dump dead weight salaries. EGgo was unsuccessful in executing his marching orders. I look at that trade as clear evidence of why EGgo is a bad GM, no matter what Pollin wanted.

Re Vesely, I don't know enough about where he is now to comment, but he did seem a little insecure about playing in the NBA, unable to adjust himself to the NBA game once he realized the package he arrived with wouldn't cut it. I don't relish adding another player who can't score. Not calling him lazy, but he doesn't seem like the gym rat type. I guess time will tell.

Proof was just in the deal itself, it was a salary dump for a year where the Wizards were a luxury tax team. There wasn't going to be an autopsy of the deal because unfortunately Pollin passed away and gungate happened.

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By proof, what I mean is that people condemn Pollin as if they can quote him saying "trade the #5 pick for Miller and Foye," and no one can.

On it's face, it's a bad deal, even in a win now situation, the "salary dump" was essentially a wash salary-wise for that season (about $13.4 million in and out) while requiring the signing of another big (Oberto @ $2 million, though it did get them out of Songaila's $4.8 million the following season) and the remainder of the remaking of the team, including passing on Blair and signing Oberto, underscored how much all that offseason "activity" was really a lot of nothing (other than saving $2.8 million over two seasons), with the team's hopes that year resting on Arenas, Jamison, Butler, and Haywood, in much the same way all of last year's "activity"(preseason and trade deadline) was really a lot of nothing, with the team's hopes resting on Wall, Beal, Porter, and Gortat.

Trading a #5 pick for a total of $2.8 million in savings a year later seems like a pretty bad deal to me. So did Pollin say "win now" or "save now"? The two versions seem to be at odds. Maybe he said both, but no one really knows what he said, and given EGgo's history, I'm not inclined to give him a complete pass on it.

[Tricky_Kid]

Go look at his euro numbers and go watch him play, they dude has gotten much better, not to mention that he also put on a lot of bulk, He sits at about 250 now, and I think he was much much less back then with us. Hey plays harder and definitely has grown as a player, I would 100% love to bring him back as a redemption story!

I wish Maynor is playing and with Javaale that would be better redemption story. At least McGee is playing on NBA lvl not Euro lvl. Sato - Euroleaguer - was a non factor in NBA in first season.
I am rooting for every our players but wonder if Sato will play badly next season too Will some of You guys admit he suxx or all excuses about coaching stuff, culture shock will show up ?

You're just tossing names around, Maynor is never getting another chance. McGee got his second chance with GS and hes probably gona play somewhere next year. Tomas is a rookie, and no matter how long you stash him he needs time to adjust to the NBA game and rules, its a legit thing not a excuse. Jan, was taken 6th over all when he had the numers to be 26-35. because he was young and athletic, that is why he needed stashed, and that is why he deserves a shot the dude was still learning the game, needed to bulk up and was no ready at all. its been a few years and hes gotten a lot better, I see 0 reason why we should not sign him and see how he does in camp.

I wrote Maynor because he sucked like Vesely. It was sarcastic - if You want to give Vesely second chance why not try again with Javaale? At least he is in NBA not putting up euro stats. Of course You can say he wasn't ready when he played with Wizards or it was coaching stuff fault...
And finally... Vesely white czech player Sato - the same. I see a pathern here lol

Cheers

[Kanyewest]

There's no real evidence or other justification for . No one has ever quoted any conversation between Pollin and EGgo or offered any other evidence supporting the "blame it all on Abe" position. Pollin interjected himself in a number of deals (hiring and firing of MJ, resigning Arenas, etc.) and these are well established. It's no secret that he was old and probably didn't have long to live. It's not surprising that he wanted to see the team return to the playoffs before he died. Given that he was an old school owner, it's also not surprising that he wanted to dump salary.

In dumping salary, EGgo gutted his bigs rotation so severely he had to sign Oberto, and he also sold the 2nd (missing out on the good and cheap DeJuan Blair years), and ended up with a weak frontcourt only saved by Haywood's career year. In trading the #5, he got mere wing depth on expiring contracts (which looked like Minnesota's own salary dump), not any real difference makers. Polling might have wanted to trade picks to help make the playoffs and dump dead weight salaries. EGgo was unsuccessful in executing his marching orders. I look at that trade as clear evidence of why EGgo is a bad GM, no matter what Pollin wanted.

Re Vesely, I don't know enough about where he is now to comment, but he did seem a little insecure about playing in the NBA, unable to adjust himself to the NBA game once he realized the package he arrived with wouldn't cut it. I don't relish adding another player who can't score. Not calling him lazy, but he doesn't seem like the gym rat type. I guess time will tell.

Proof was just in the deal itself, it was a salary dump for a year where the Wizards were a luxury tax team. There wasn't going to be an autopsy of the deal because unfortunately Pollin passed away and gungate happened.

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By proof, what I mean is that people condemn Pollin as if they can quote him saying "trade the #5 pick for Miller and Foye," and no one can.

On it's face, it's a bad deal, even in a win now situation, the "salary dump" was essentially a wash salary-wise for that season (about $13.4 million in and out) while requiring the signing of another big (Oberto @ $2 million, though it did get them out of Songaila's $4.8 million the following season) and the remainder of the remaking of the team, including passing on Blair and signing Oberto, underscored how much all that offseason "activity" was really a lot of nothing (other than saving $2.8 million over two seasons), with the team's hopes that year resting on Arenas, Jamison, Butler, and Haywood, in much the same way all of last year's "activity"(preseason and trade deadline) was really a lot of nothing, with the team's hopes resting on Wall, Beal, Porter, and Gortat.

Trading a #5 pick for a total of $2.8 million in savings a year later seems like a pretty bad deal to me. So did Pollin say "win now" or "save now"? The two versions seem to be at odds. Maybe he said both, but no one really knows what he said, and given EGgo's history, I'm not inclined to give him a complete pass on it.

I just read an article from Michael Lee that Abe thought the Wizards were "dark horse contenders for the final". Dude believed in Arenas like a lot of us did back then. I agree the trade was really REALLY bad.

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[montestewart]

Proof was just in the deal itself, it was a salary dump for a year where the Wizards were a luxury tax team. There wasn't going to be an autopsy of the deal because unfortunately Pollin passed away and gungate happened.

Sent from my LG-D851 using RealGM mobile app

By proof, what I mean is that people condemn Pollin as if they can quote him saying "trade the #5 pick for Miller and Foye," and no one can.

On it's face, it's a bad deal, even in a win now situation, the "salary dump" was essentially a wash salary-wise for that season (about $13.4 million in and out) while requiring the signing of another big (Oberto @ $2 million, though it did get them out of Songaila's $4.8 million the following season) and the remainder of the remaking of the team, including passing on Blair and signing Oberto, underscored how much all that offseason "activity" was really a lot of nothing (other than saving $2.8 million over two seasons), with the team's hopes that year resting on Arenas, Jamison, Butler, and Haywood, in much the same way all of last year's "activity"(preseason and trade deadline) was really a lot of nothing, with the team's hopes resting on Wall, Beal, Porter, and Gortat.

Trading a #5 pick for a total of $2.8 million in savings a year later seems like a pretty bad deal to me. So did Pollin say "win now" or "save now"? The two versions seem to be at odds. Maybe he said both, but no one really knows what he said, and given EGgo's history, I'm not inclined to give him a complete pass on it.

I just read an article from Michael Lee that Abe thought the Wizards were "dark horse contenders for the final". Dude believed in Arenas like a lot of us did back then. I agree the trade was really REALLY bad.

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I remember reading an article about Pollin talking to his management team before the 98-99 season, revealing his high expectations for the coming season, in light of the fact that the team had "two all stars," those two being Juwan Howard and Mitch Richmond. Pollin definitely had rose colored glasses at times.