Page 23 of 24

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:26 pm
by dckingsfan
payitforward wrote:Shamet went #26.

Oh, & the Hawks didn't have the #27 pick.

Otherwise you've nailed it! :)

Doesn't matter really... I was thinking our #15 to the Sixers for their #s 26 & 38. Or to the Hawks for their #s30 & 34 -- which could have brought Spellman/Robinson.

hehehe - guess I wasn't even close :D

I guess my point is - you would have to be pretty gifted to know to trade down for those two players. Doable, but not by the previous GM whose name shall be repeated.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Fri Jul 5, 2019 7:51 pm
by nate33
Reposting from the Summer League thread:

queridiculo wrote:Easy to forget, Troy Brown Jr. hasn't even turned 20 yet.

Agreed.

People want to write Brown off as just a role player because he didn't do all that much in his rookie season. Remember that the Wizards ALWAYS bring along their new draft picks slowly (well, ever since Beal, at least). Porter didn't play his rookie year. Oubre didn't play his rookie year.

Indeed, in the limited minutes available, Brown significantly outplayed the first seasons of both Oubre and Porter, despite being a year younger and playing without Wall to take off some of the defensive pressure. And he played the most minutes:

Image

Brown might be the best of the trio.

Things really started to click with Porter midway through his second season and he was exceptional by his third year. If Brown follows the same path, we have another building block.

Looking deep into Brown's numbers, there really is a lot to like. The 19-year-old had almost a 3:1 A/TO ratio! Look at his foul rate compared to Oubre and Porter. And he rebounds as well as Oubre and Porter (both of whom are exceptional rebounders at the SF position). All the high bball IQ indicators are there. If his shot comes around, the young man is going to be good.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Fri Jul 5, 2019 8:19 pm
by Illuminaire
nate33 wrote:If his shot comes around, the young man is going to be good.


That's the big IF. I wish him the best, and hope he works hard to improve. The low FT% is a bad sign, but Porter managed to significantly improve both his FT% and long range shooting between years one and three. If Troy shows a similar trajectory, he would become an outstanding combo guard/wing.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Sat Jul 6, 2019 12:33 am
by nate33
Illuminaire wrote:
nate33 wrote:If his shot comes around, the young man is going to be good.


That's the big IF. I wish him the best, and hope he works hard to improve. The low FT% is a bad sign, but Porter managed to significantly improve both his FT% and long range shooting between years one and three. If Troy shows a similar trajectory, he would become an outstanding combo guard/wing.

I don't think it's that big of an if. His shot isn't broken. He's not like MKG or Tony Allen or something. He may never be a lethal 3-point shooter like Porter, but I'm pretty confident he'll get his 3P% up to the 34-37% range - enough that teams will have to guard him out there.

He actually showed some pretty significant improvement throughout the season last year. Over the first five months of the season, he was 5/19 from 3-point range in 227 total minutes. That's 26% on 4.0 attempts per 48 minutes. In March and April, he made 17/50 from 3-point range in 504 total minutes. That's 34% on 4.8 attempts per 48 minutes. Increasing his attempts and percentages throughout the season is a good sign.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Sat Jul 6, 2019 6:25 pm
by dckingsfan
nate33 wrote:
Illuminaire wrote:
nate33 wrote:If his shot comes around, the young man is going to be good.


That's the big IF. I wish him the best, and hope he works hard to improve. The low FT% is a bad sign, but Porter managed to significantly improve both his FT% and long range shooting between years one and three. If Troy shows a similar trajectory, he would become an outstanding combo guard/wing.

I don't think it's that big of an if. His shot isn't broken. He's not like MKG or Tony Allen or something. He may never be a lethal 3-point shooter like Porter, but I'm pretty confident he'll get his 3P% up to the 34-37% range - enough that teams will have to guard him out there.

He actually showed some pretty significant improvement throughout the season last year. Over the first five months of the season, he was 5/19 from 3-point range in 227 total minutes. That's 26% on 4.0 attempts per 48 minutes. In March and April, he made 17/50 from 3-point range in 504 total minutes. That's 34% on 4.8 attempts per 48 minutes. Increasing his attempts and percentages throughout the season is a good sign.

And just going by this - I think a .370 should be expected.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Sun Jul 7, 2019 1:09 am
by Illuminaire
He only shot 29% from the college three, with a sample size of 110 shots.

Why should the last 50 shots of his first NBA season be considered more significant than his first 19? What if he'd missed two shots more during that last 50... would you instead be arguing that the first 19 were more important, since the percentage was higher?

He could certainly improve. It would be great if he did. I'm sure he's doing everything he can to make that happen. But this is a hope - nothing more. His past performance provides only the slightest indication that improvement is happening.

So yes. It's a big IF.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Sun Jul 7, 2019 5:46 pm
by FAH1223
He’s developing

Looked good last night in first SL game

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Mon Jul 8, 2019 6:08 pm
by trast66
nate33 wrote:Reposting from the Summer League thread:

queridiculo wrote:Easy to forget, Troy Brown Jr. hasn't even turned 20 yet.

Agreed.

People want to write Brown off as just a role player because he didn't do all that much in his rookie season. Remember that the Wizards ALWAYS bring along their new draft picks slowly (well, ever since Beal, at least). Porter didn't play his rookie year. Oubre didn't play his rookie year.

Indeed, in the limited minutes available, Brown significantly outplayed the first seasons of both Oubre and Porter, despite being a year younger and playing without Wall to take off some of the defensive pressure. And he played the most minutes:

Image

Brown might be the best of the trio.

Things really started to click with Porter midway through his second season and he was exceptional by his third year. If Brown follows the same path, we have another building block.

Looking deep into Brown's numbers, there really is a lot to like. The 19-year-old had almost a 3:1 A/TO ratio! Look at his foul rate compared to Oubre and Porter. And he rebounds as well as Oubre and Porter (both of whom are exceptional rebounders at the SF position). All the high bball IQ indicators are there. If his shot comes around, the young man is going to be good.


Will be interesting to see if red shirt rookie year for Rui this year, Tommy might look at that practice differently than Ernie.

I think Troy’s stroke is fine, he’s just has a very slow release. He can probably hit open 3 pointers all day in practice but not off the bounce or anyone within 4 feet. Seems like he enjoys playing basketball ball so I’m hopeful he will get to be serviceable in this area over the next 2 seasons.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Mon Jul 8, 2019 6:14 pm
by nate33
trast66 wrote:Will be interesting to see if red shirt rookie year for Rui this year, Tommy might look at that practice differently than Ernie.

I think Troy’s stroke is fine, he’s just has a very slow release. He can probably hit open 3 pointers all day in practice but not off the bounce or anyone within 4 feet. Seems like he enjoys playing basketball ball so I’m hopeful he will get to be serviceable in this area over the next 2 seasons.

Given the lack of power forwards on the roster, I'm thinking that the Wizards will definitely play Hachimura his rookie year.

They redshirted Brown, Oubre and Porter because they were trying to make the playoffs, but they didn't redshirt Beal or Wall. I'd say this year will be more like Beal or Wall's rookie year.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Mon Jul 8, 2019 7:49 pm
by payitforward
Porter was injured his rookie year....

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:06 am
by closg00
Probably a little unfair, both Mo and Troy are on the list.

Watch on YouTube

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:03 pm
by FAH1223
Read on Twitter

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 6:45 pm
by CntOutSmrtCrazy
closg00 wrote:Probably a little unfair, both Mo and Troy are on the list.


I dunno, the Troy analysis was meh. Who here is really down about picking him at 15 with revisionist history/contextual evaluation aside? Draft evaluations after one year hold very little weight when we are talking about where he was selected. Though I get it, you have to put content up.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 6:55 pm
by nate33
CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:
closg00 wrote:Probably a little unfair, both Mo and Troy are on the list.


I dunno, the Troy analysis was meh. Who here is really down about picking him at 15 with revisionist history/contextual evaluation aside? Draft evaluations after one year hold very little weight when we are talking about where he was selected. Though I get it, you have to put content up.

Agreed. Mitchell Robinson is the only guy picked lower than Brown ewho either is or projects to be clearly better than Brown. A couple of lower picks had arguably better seasons (Shamet, Huerter, Holiday), but after factoring their age (2.5 years older, 1 year older, and 3 years older respectively), I'm still feeling pretty good about the Brown pick.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 11:28 pm
by payitforward
Brown has a shot to be a good player. That doesn't mean he was a good pick at #15.

A draft pick is an asset. When you get the most possible benefit from using that asset, you have done well in the draft. This is separate from the question whether someone is a good player.

For clarity: in 2011, the Cavs had the #4 pick in the draft. They chose Tristan Thompson. He has had a really good NBA career so far. Thompson is an excellent player.

OTOH, it seems quite likely that Cleveland could have traded that #4 pick to SA for their #15 & #29 picks in the same draft. Kawhi Leonard went #15. Jimmy Butler went #30 (hence could have been taken @#29). Had Cleveland made that move, we could say they had gotten the most possible benefit from having the #4 pick.

That doesn't change the fact that Tristan Thompson has been a terrific player. But it does reflect on the pick of Tristan Thompson.

A player is one thing; a pick is another & very different thing.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:55 am
by Mojo Amok
Sheppard went on to paint a very reasonable picture: Beal continues to grow as an All-NBA-level player, and while waiting for Wall to get back, the Wizards develop their younger players like Thomas Bryant, who they just signed to a three-year deal, Troy Brown, who Sheppard says Washington has "huge expectations for," and this year's No. 9 overall selection Rui Hachimura, who can hopefully use the increased opportunity available in Wall's absence to expedite his growth.


https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/wizards-gm-reiterates-commitment-to-keeping-bradley-beal-but-at-what-point-will-the-risk-outweigh-the-reward/

That was buried in the article about Beal.

Doesn't mean a huge amount from within a happy talk spitball session, but it does augur a bit for the front office pushing Brown to get substantive minutes this year. He might have a 'plays through mistakes' hall pass and Brooks' job security is likely that little incremental bit higher if Brown is progressing.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:20 am
by Illmatic12
Mojo Amok wrote:
Sheppard went on to paint a very reasonable picture: Beal continues to grow as an All-NBA-level player, and while waiting for Wall to get back, the Wizards develop their younger players like Thomas Bryant, who they just signed to a three-year deal, Troy Brown, who Sheppard says Washington has "huge expectations for," and this year's No. 9 overall selection Rui Hachimura, who can hopefully use the increased opportunity available in Wall's absence to expedite his growth.


https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/wizards-gm-reiterates-commitment-to-keeping-bradley-beal-but-at-what-point-will-the-risk-outweigh-the-reward/

That was buried in the article about Beal.

Doesn't mean a huge amount from within a happy talk spitball session, but it does augur a bit for the front office pushing Brown to get substantive minutes this year. He might have a 'plays through mistakes' hall pass and Brooks' job security is likely that little incremental bit higher if Brown is progressing.

Sheppard is a big fan of TB Jr, said he wanted him to play more last year and will make sure he does so this season.

Troy needs to be prepared for all the minutes he can handle. The way the roster is lined up , they badly need him to cover at least 30mpg at the wings. His development will swing our season more than anyone else on the team.

Personally I’m optimistic - Troy already displayed a complete floor game and didn’t really look out of place in the minutes he played last season.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:03 am
by payitforward
Troy Brown had an excellent rookie season -- he was an above average NBA player at 18 years of age. Of course he needs to play more -- he needs to play 2000+ minutes.

Of course that doesn't mean he was a good draft pick at #15, since these are completely separate questions. No matter how much one tries to pretend they are the same.

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:39 pm
by nate33
payitforward wrote:Troy Brown had an excellent rookie season -- he was an above average NBA player at 18 years of age. Of course he needs to play more -- he needs to play 2000+ minutes.

Of course that doesn't mean he was a good draft pick at #15, since these are completely separate questions. No matter how much one tries to pretend they are the same.

I think he was a good draft pick. How many guys later than him would you rather have, after factoring age?

Re: The Troy Brown Thread

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:15 pm
by dckingsfan
Illmatic12 wrote:
Mojo Amok wrote:
Sheppard went on to paint a very reasonable picture: Beal continues to grow as an All-NBA-level player, and while waiting for Wall to get back, the Wizards develop their younger players like Thomas Bryant, who they just signed to a three-year deal, Troy Brown, who Sheppard says Washington has "huge expectations for," and this year's No. 9 overall selection Rui Hachimura, who can hopefully use the increased opportunity available in Wall's absence to expedite his growth.


https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/wizards-gm-reiterates-commitment-to-keeping-bradley-beal-but-at-what-point-will-the-risk-outweigh-the-reward/

That was buried in the article about Beal.

Doesn't mean a huge amount from within a happy talk spitball session, but it does augur a bit for the front office pushing Brown to get substantive minutes this year. He might have a 'plays through mistakes' hall pass and Brooks' job security is likely that little incremental bit higher if Brown is progressing.

Sheppard is a big fan of TB Jr, said he wanted him to play more last year and will make sure he does so this season.

Troy needs to be prepared for all the minutes he can handle. The way the roster is lined up , they badly need him to cover at least 30mpg at the wings. His development will swing our season more than anyone else on the team.

Personally I’m optimistic - Troy already displayed a complete floor game and didn’t really look out of place in the minutes he played last season.

I think Troy needs to play guard more than SF (but I could definitely be off here).

Cosign on his and Bryant's development swinging the season. I really see no reason that those two don't progress in a big way.

One thing I find this interesting. How does Sheppard make sure he plays more? I don't believe our current coach knows how to position him to succeed - but I have no real evidence to back my belief other than he didn't get much time at guard during the summer league.