Wiz trade Oubre and Rivers for Ariza [DEAL FINALIZED]

[Wizardspride]

Read on Twitter

?s=19

[Kanyewest]

Ariza has not only played with John Wall, Bradley Beal, and Otto Porter in Washington but he also played with Dwight Howard and Sam Dekker in Houston. Ariza also doesn't like Austin Rivers- had a verbal incident when Rivers was on the Clippers bench last season.

Watch on YouTube

[truwizfan4evr]

Sam dekker going to be a good pick up like we did with drew gooden a few years back.

[trast66]

Read on Twitter

?s=21

That's pifs list from this board, no?

Yes, that is my post of a few days ago. I would retweet it, but... nah.

Someone comments that this doesn't include bad FA signings -- correct, my list was to document Ernie's pathetic performance in 10 years of the draft.

It also doesn't include his idiotic trades (except where they are relevant to his draft performance).

Nor does it include his eye-poppingly bad salary management. Nor his inability to hire an average coach -- & let me tell you, most coaches are average coaches.

This list is used in an article on The Ringer today. Royalties!

[Jimmy Recard]

And rivers gets bought out by Phoenix. So basically it was just Oubre for 50 games of 33 year old Ariza. Way to go Ernie

[keynote]

And rivers gets bought out by Phoenix. So basically it was just Oubre for 50 games of 33 year old Ariza. Way to go Ernie

You could also read it to indicate that Rivers had negative trade value, despite being on an expiring deal. And, that Phoenix valued Dillon Brooks on his 2nd year of his rookie deal more than Oubre's bird rights (which, for a young rebuilding team, makes sense -- even if you think Oubre is the better player).

[nate33]

And rivers gets bought out by Phoenix. So basically it was just Oubre for 50 games of 33 year old Ariza. Way to go Ernie

It was 50 games of Oubre for 50 games of Ariza. Neither would have been back next year.

[Dark Faze]

Rivers gets bought out instantly--and even big Ern thought the kid was trash. So why didn't Brooks get the memo? Was still playing him 20 minutes a night over Sato.

It's the same thing as last year. We wasted the first 12 or so games of the season running junk ass lineups.

[daSwami]

This trade is a distillation of everything awful about the Leonsis/Grunfeld era: short-sighted, young for old, designed ONLY to save Ted $$$ and, by extension (horribly), EG's job. The Wizards are clearly Ted's red-headed stepchild, and I don't even want to speculate on the truth behind EG's job security, but it clearly isn't based on his acumen. #Wizfansrevolt! #fireGrunfeldnow!

[Ruzious]

And rivers gets bought out by Phoenix. So basically it was just Oubre for 50 games of 33 year old Ariza. Way to go Ernie

It was 50 games of Oubre for 50 games of Ariza. Neither would have been back next year.

True, but I'd think that the Bird rights to Oubre are more valuable than the rights to Ariza.

[Illmatic12]

And rivers gets bought out by Phoenix. So basically it was just Oubre for 50 games of 33 year old Ariza. Way to go Ernie

It was 50 games of Oubre for 50 games of Ariza. Neither would have been back next year.

True, but I'd think that the Bird rights to Oubre are more valuable than the rights to Ariza.

You're going straight to Bird rights and skipping over the remainder of the season. Ariza provides significantly more value than Oubre over the next 50 games + playoffs. I think Phoenix sold low on Ariza tbh, other teams would've given them much more.

Lakers offered KCP + 2nd round pick for Ariza, which is clearly better than the Wizards offer. But Sarver refused to send him to the Lakers for personal reasons.

[Ruzious]

It was 50 games of Oubre for 50 games of Ariza. Neither would have been back next year.

True, but I'd think that the Bird rights to Oubre are more valuable than the rights to Ariza.

You're going straight to Bird rights and skipping over the remainder of the season. Ariza provides significantly more value than Oubre over the next 50 games + playoffs. I think Phoenix sold low on Ariza tbh, other teams would've given them much more.

Lakers offered KCP + 2nd round pick for Ariza, which is clearly better than the Wizards offer. But Sarver refused to send him to the Lakers for personal reasons.

Meh, Ariza - at 33 - is a shell of the player he was with the Wizards. And considering he was putrid in the playoffs last season, I don't see him being a help there if the Wiz succeed in their goal of being the 8th seed in the playoffs (Yeehah!). And KCP is clearly a better player at this point - as he was last season - so if the Lakers really made that offer, there must have been something besides their play as a reason.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Rivers gets bought out instantly--and even big Ern thought the kid was trash. So why didn't Brooks get the memo? Was still playing him 20 minutes a night over Sato.

It's the same thing as last year. We wasted the first 12 or so games of the season running junk ass lineups.

Don't forget season before last where a trade to rid Nicholson plus the 1st that gave the Nets Jarrett Allen; yielded junk defensive lineups and Bojan Bogdanovic. That was the first time Brooks was able to play someone besides Satoransky.



Sent from my SM-J337T using RealGM mobile app

[DCZards]

Meh, Ariza - at 33 - is a shell of the player he was with the Wizards. And considering he was putrid in the playoffs last season, I don't see him being a help there if the Wiz succeed in their goal of being the 8th seed in the playoffs (Yeehah!). And KCP is clearly a better player at this point - as he was last season - so if the Lakers really made that offer, there must have been something besides their play as a reason.

Ariza is a defensive savant who makes any team he plays on better. And, while he didn't have a great playoff, he wasn't "putrid" either. There's a reason that teams like the Lakers and Houston were trying to trade for him.

You yourself point out that the Lakers were willing to trade "clearly a better player" (KCP) for Ariza. Why? Because Magic and Co. recognize that Ariza makes the Lakers a better team in ways that KCP never will.

But I do agree that I'd prefer Oubre with "bird rights" over the 33 year old Ariza. I'm not convinced that the Zards would definitely not have been able to resign KO.

[Ruzious]

Meh, Ariza - at 33 - is a shell of the player he was with the Wizards. And considering he was putrid in the playoffs last season, I don't see him being a help there if the Wiz succeed in their goal of being the 8th seed in the playoffs (Yeehah!). And KCP is clearly a better player at this point - as he was last season - so if the Lakers really made that offer, there must have been something besides their play as a reason.

Ariza is a defensive savant who makes any team he plays on better. And, while he didn't have a great playoff, he wasn't "putrid" either. There's a reason that teams like the Lakers and Houston were trying to trade for him.

You yourself point out that the Lakers were willing to trade "clearly a better player" (KCP) for Ariza. Why? Because Magic and Co. recognize that Ariza makes the Lakers a better team in ways that KCP never will.

But I do agree that I'd prefer Oubre with "bird rights" over the 33 year old Ariza. I'm not convinced that the Zards would definitely not have been able to resign KO.

No, I didn't point that out - about the Lakers making that trade offer. I said IF they did really make that offer it wasn't because of quality of play, because KCP is a clearly better (not to mention much younger) player. Again, he's a DECLINING 33 year old - not the player he used to be. And at that age, he's likely going to deceline more and lose a step. People who have watched him this season said they noticed his defense ain't what it used to be, and he's nowhere near the player he used to be. You're describing him as the player he used to be; not the player he is.

[nate33]

And rivers gets bought out by Phoenix. So basically it was just Oubre for 50 games of 33 year old Ariza. Way to go Ernie

It was 50 games of Oubre for 50 games of Ariza. Neither would have been back next year.

True, but I'd think that the Bird rights to Oubre are more valuable than the rights to Ariza.

But not to us.

That's the issue with this deal. Oubre had no value to us other than his production over the next 50 games. But he had move value to another team with interest in signing him to his next contract. He was therefore a very easy piece to trade. Any trade would make sense to us as long as we got back a player who would be better over the next 50 games than Oubre. And any trade would make sense to Phoenix (or any other non-playoff team) because they don't care about the next 50 games so they are trading an asset with zero long term value (Ariza) for Oubre, who has some long term value. The trade is a win-win. But I think they won a lot more than we did. We should have pushed for a win-win where we won a lot more than they did.

[nate33]

I'm not convinced that the Zards would definitely not have been able to resign KO.

It's math.

As long as Wall, Beal, Porter and Mahinmi were on the roster this summer, Oubre was not going to be resigned. And even if Mahinmi was stretched, there still wasn't room for Oubre. Maybe if we sacrificed a 1st to dump Mahinmi, it could have worked out. But I'd much rather have a 1st round pick than Oubre at whatever the cost of his next contract.

[DCZards]

No, I didn't point that out - about the Lakers making that trade offer. I said IF they did really make that offer it wasn't because of quality of play, because KCP is a clearly better (not to mention much younger) player. Again, he's a DECLINING 33 year old - not the player he used to be. And at that age, he's likely going to deceline more and lose a step. People who have watched him this season said they noticed his defense ain't what it used to be, and he's nowhere near the player he used to be. You're describing him as the player he used to be; not the player he is.

I'm not sure who you're talking about when you say that "people who watched him this season..." (which, btw, has been all of 2 months), but I find it hard to believe that Ariza's defensive skills have fallen off all that much from earlier this year when he was one of the top wing defenders in the association.

Trevor may not be as good a defender as he was in his 20s, but he's still a damn good defender even at 33...primarily because he has always relied more on smarts and guile than athleticism.

[Ruzious]

No, I didn't point that out - about the Lakers making that trade offer. I said IF they did really make that offer it wasn't because of quality of play, because KCP is a clearly better (not to mention much younger) player. Again, he's a DECLINING 33 year old - not the player he used to be. And at that age, he's likely going to deceline more and lose a step. People who have watched him this season said they noticed his defense ain't what it used to be, and he's nowhere near the player he used to be. You're describing him as the player he used to be; not the player he is.

I'm not sure who you're talking about when you say that "people who watched him this season..." (which, btw, has been all of 2 months), but I find it hard to believe that Ariza's defensive skills have fallen off all that much from earlier this year when he was one of the top wing defenders in the association.

Trevor may not be as good a defender as he was in his 20s, but he's still damn good defender at 33...primarily because he has always relied more on smarts and guile than athleticism.

What I meant by that is peoples who's opinions I respect... and who have actually watched him have pointed out that it's obvious that his defense has deteriorated. And I find it funny when people say... Well, player such and such has always relied on things other than athleticism to be a good player - as if that means if he loses a step, it shouldn't affect him. It should be obvious that any player - no matter how smart or savant-like... will decline as a defender when he loses a step.

[Kanyewest]

No, I didn't point that out - about the Lakers making that trade offer. I said IF they did really make that offer it wasn't because of quality of play, because KCP is a clearly better (not to mention much younger) player. Again, he's a DECLINING 33 year old - not the player he used to be. And at that age, he's likely going to deceline more and lose a step. People who have watched him this season said they noticed his defense ain't what it used to be, and he's nowhere near the player he used to be. You're describing him as the player he used to be; not the player he is.

I'm not sure who you're talking about when you say that "people who watched him this season..." (which, btw, has been all of 2 months), but I find it hard to believe that Ariza's defensive skills have fallen off all that much from earlier this year when he was one of the top wing defenders in the association.

Trevor may not be as good a defender as he was in his 20s, but he's still damn good defender at 33...primarily because he has always relied more on smarts and guile than athleticism.

What I meant by that is peoples who's opinions I respect... and who have actually watched him have pointed out that it's obvious that his defense has deteriorated. And I find it funny when people say... Well, player such and such has always relied on things other than athleticism to be a good player - as if that means if he loses a step, it shouldn't affect him. It should be obvious that any player - no matter how smart or savant-like... will decline as a defender when he loses a step.

I'm not really sure if Ariza's defense has taken a significant hit at least in the 2018 NBA Playoffs. He was their best perimeter defender that really limited the Warriors offense that only averaged 107 points per game. With the departure of Ariza and Mbah a Moute, the Rockets went from a top 10 defense to one of the worst in the NBA.

But yeah he's getting older, this move obviously has it risks.