DCZards wrote:PIF, I get your point about how you ranked players. It’s pretty clear that you’re not suggesting that Payton was the Zards best player...or that he's a better player than Beal.
But I disagree with your conclusion that Payton's play showed that he was someone the Zards should try to keep. (I believe that’s what you’re suggesting. Correct me if I’m wrong.)
Yes, Payton was good, at times, but in limited minutes and with a limited role and responsibility—playing defense. GPII doesn’t bring enough to the table as a ballhandler, distributor or shooter to make me want to keep him....
TBH, the impulse behind my words about Payton -- aside from simply recognizing that "in limited minutes and with a limited role and responsibility" he put up very solid numbers -- was not so much about our keeping him as to recognize that he's outlined a role for himself in the NBA. He can make something out of those limits, by staying within those limits, & I hope he does.
That said, he's inconsequential to us. A little bit the way McRae was inconsequential to us -- too old for a team that's at our stage of development to care much about. In principle, you'd rather have guys near the back of the bench who are young & have development potential. Not always possible, but definitely to be desired.
DCZards wrote:...over, say, a guy like Jerome Robinson. Robinson showed me a lot more a potential and upside than Payton. While clearly not the defender that Payton is, Robinson proved, at least to me, that he’s a pretty good (and hardworking) man-to-man defender. And, unlike Payton, Robinson can actually shoot and is a threat to score. Plus Payton is 27 years old while Robinson just turned 23....
But, the 2 guys don't present an obvious choice: a decision of "on the one hand" vs. "on the other hand." Robinson is guaranteed for next year, & given how soon his 2021-22 extension decision has to be made (1st day of the coming season, I believe) I won't be surprised to see him extended before we have the chance to see whether he'll ever play well.
So far, however, there is nothing at all that indicates he can be an effective NBA player of any kind. Tho, sure, he's an adequate defender. Robinson wasn't even particularly good in college (he did score the ball efficiently his final year). OTOH, for the reason I cited above, I agree that it makes more sense to have him on the team than GP II.
DCZards wrote:Agree that Bonga played above expectations for the most part. While some here were skeptical of Bonga’s future as an NBA player (and understandably so), I was one of those who found his potential intriguing (especially given his length, handle and ability to play D)…and argued that the Zards should hang on to Bonga to see what they had. (I believe you wanted the Zards to waive Bonga and keep Jemerrio Jones. (Again, correct me if I'm wrong about that.)
I wanted us to keep Jemerrio Jones, yes -- but not to waive Bonga! By no means. I would have preferred Jones over McRae.
Of course, we got Napier for McRae, so you can argue that Jordan turned out to be pretty useful after all! If we keep Napier, that is (we'd be fools not to).
Bonga didn't just play above expectations -- especially given how low the expectations were! He played very well.