ImageImageImageImageImage

Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser"

Moderators: LyricalRico, nate33, montestewart

Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 42,544
And1: 7,865
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#481 » by Ruzious » Tue Nov 24, 2020 1:56 pm

pcbothwel wrote:
Read on Twitter


Interesting

Indeed. In the old days, PF's would always be fighting for offensive rebounds and really didn't do much in transition - offensively or defensively. Now, getting back on D is the first priority for PF's - that fits well with Bertans because he's not going to get many offensive rebounds anyway, and he's already back some because he's such a great long range 3 threat - another reason why Bertans is a great fit in today's NBA. Good to hear that he's good in defensive transition.
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 15,147
And1: 4,816
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#482 » by payitforward » Tue Nov 24, 2020 4:29 pm

Good stuff.

edit: Of course, I'd be happier if Tommy had said he was "the best" rather than just "one of" the best. OTOH, apparently Biden just hired him for his transition team, so maybe he's even better than Tommy said...?
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
Wizardspride
RealGM
Posts: 13,425
And1: 7,723
Joined: Nov 05, 2004
Location: Olney, MD/Kailua/Kaneohe, HI
       

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#483 » by Wizardspride » Tue Nov 24, 2020 7:37 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=19

Read on Twitter
?s=19


Read on Twitter
?s=19

Read on Twitter
?s=19

Read on Twitter
?s=19
President Trump told two senior Russian officials in a 2017 Oval Office meeting that he was unconcerned about Moscow’s interference in the 2016 U.S. presidential election because the United States did the same in other countries
Wizardspride
RealGM
Posts: 13,425
And1: 7,723
Joined: Nov 05, 2004
Location: Olney, MD/Kailua/Kaneohe, HI
       

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#484 » by Wizardspride » Tue Nov 24, 2020 7:53 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=19
President Trump told two senior Russian officials in a 2017 Oval Office meeting that he was unconcerned about Moscow’s interference in the 2016 U.S. presidential election because the United States did the same in other countries
User avatar
tontoz
RealGM
Posts: 17,102
And1: 2,638
Joined: Apr 11, 2005

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#485 » by tontoz » Tue Nov 24, 2020 8:02 pm

I agree that we had to resign him. We have seen guys have breakout shooting seasons with Wall (Ariza, Webster, Butler etc) and Bertans is easily the best 3pt sniper i can remember in a Wizards uni.

Letting him walk due to cost concerns would have been completely deflating for Wall and Beal.
"bulky agile perimeter bone crunch pick setting draymond green" WizD
Frichuela
Junior
Posts: 363
And1: 254
Joined: Feb 25, 2015
 

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#486 » by Frichuela » Tue Nov 24, 2020 8:30 pm

tontoz wrote:I agree that we had to resign him. We have seen guys have breakout shooting seasons with Wall (Ariza, Webster, Butler etc) and Bertans is easily the best 3pt sniper i can remember in a Wizards uni.

Letting him walk due to cost concerns would have been completely deflating for Wall and Beal.


Agreed. And in the end is a $16mn per year contract for 4 years plus only $5mn guaranteed for year 5. A bit steep, but similar to Marcus Morris and cheaper than the likes of Gallo and Harris.
DCZards
General Manager
Posts: 8,060
And1: 2,412
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Location: The Streets of DC

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#487 » by DCZards » Tue Nov 24, 2020 8:55 pm

The opportunity to play with Wall was a major factor in Bertans decision to resign. These are excerpts from an article on NBC Sports Washington.

As Bertans weighed his basketball future, he was intrigued by a partnership with five-time All-Star point guard John Wall. Wall is one of the best passers of his generation and Bertans is among the best catch-and-shoot players in the game.

The two could form a symbiotic relationship on the floor. Wall will help Bertans get open shots and shoot them in rhythm, while Bertans will help Wall get more assists and add more spacing, which could be important as he returns from rehabbing a ruptured Achilles tendon.

"Having John on the court is going to make my percentages go up," Bertans said.

"His ability to get down in the lane and kick out to open shooters is something not a lot of players have," Bertans said.

Bertans said he's "excited" to play with Wall after watching film of him in the 2017 playoffs against the Atlanta Hawks. They also shared the court briefly last year once Wall returned to practice right before the season shut down in March.

Bertans was impressed with how unselfish Wall played in scrimmages.

"To see a leader on the team do that and help the team means it's more than words," Bertans said.
nuposse04
RealGM
Posts: 11,274
And1: 2,414
Joined: Jul 20, 2004
Location: on a rock
   

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#488 » by nuposse04 » Tue Nov 24, 2020 9:38 pm

DCZards wrote:The opportunity to play with Wall was a major factor in Bertans decision to resign. These are excerpts from an article on NBC Sports Washington.

As Bertans weighed his basketball future, he was intrigued by a partnership with five-time All-Star point guard John Wall. Wall is one of the best passers of his generation and Bertans is among the best catch-and-shoot players in the game.

The two could form a symbiotic relationship on the floor. Wall will help Bertans get open shots and shoot them in rhythm, while Bertans will help Wall get more assists and add more spacing, which could be important as he returns from rehabbing a ruptured Achilles tendon.

"Having John on the court is going to make my percentages go up," Bertans said.

"His ability to get down in the lane and kick out to open shooters is something not a lot of players have," Bertans said.

Bertans said he's "excited" to play with Wall after watching film of him in the 2017 playoffs against the Atlanta Hawks. They also shared the court briefly last year once Wall returned to practice right before the season shut down in March.

Bertans was impressed with how unselfish Wall played in scrimmages.

"To see a leader on the team do that and help the team means it's more than words," Bertans said.


2017 is a long time ago and wall has significantly physically declined since then. He's in for for a rude awakening thinking he's going to be playing with the same Wall.
User avatar
pancakes3
General Manager
Posts: 8,290
And1: 1,723
Joined: Jul 27, 2003
Location: Virginia
Contact:

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#489 » by pancakes3 » Tue Nov 24, 2020 10:01 pm

wall was and still is a legit pg though. and he's got size and sufficient athleticism to make plays. he's not quick like he used to be, but since when did you need to be quick to dish dimes?
Bullets -> Wizards
nuposse04
RealGM
Posts: 11,274
And1: 2,414
Joined: Jul 20, 2004
Location: on a rock
   

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#490 » by nuposse04 » Tue Nov 24, 2020 10:11 pm

pancakes3 wrote:wall was and still is a legit pg though. and he's got size and sufficient athleticism to make plays. he's not quick like he used to be, but since when did you need to be quick to dish dimes?


He's always been a turnover prone PG, do we expect him to up his efficiency post Achilles rupture? That would be optimistic. He SHOULD be better than Ish and IT, but that isn't exactly a high bar to overcome.
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 15,147
And1: 4,816
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#491 » by payitforward » Tue Nov 24, 2020 10:16 pm

prime1time wrote:I love all the amateur GM's who know so much. Why overpay for Bertans. Trade Bertans for a first-round pick. Now we don't overpay Bertans and we have an extra first-round pick to groom. Because obviously, Beal doesn't care whether Bertans stays or goes. He's committed to us regardless.It was never a question of resigning Bertans or not resigning Bertans. It has always been of a question of going into full-fledged rebuild mode or not.

So the real question is is it better to have Bertans on a slightly overvalued contract that can always be moved barring catastrophic injury or not. Would teams have signed for Bertans for 10 million? 12 million? 14 million? But the extra 2 million is what makes the Wizards a badly run franchise. "But it's not about the money it's about the years." Oh, here's a question. Let's say Giannis extends supermax. And the Bucks are making a major push but they need more floor spacing so Giannis can create. I know crazy scenario because shooting and floor spacing are useless in this NBA, and I mean obviously, who wants a "is a defensive liability, doesn't attack the basket, can't create his own shot, can't create for others (wrong), and is a soft-ass rebounding."

Even overlooking the obvious falsehoods - Bertans can create his own shot, he can create for others and his job isn't to rebound - your post makes no sense. Bertans was one of the most sought after players in free agency. He was one of the most sought after players before the trade deadline. And for all the crying about the overpay you guys ignore the fact that Bertans is of tremendous value and will be easy to move to a team trying to win it all. I'd go a step further and say that Bertans elite shooting is good enough to push a contending team over the top. So however much we slightly overpaid him is irrelevant given the fact that he can be easily moved.

What we have here is just the descent of this board into battered woman syndrome. It is time to realize that many posters on this board lack the ability to be objective when it comes to decisions this team makes. If you want to argue against resigning Bertans that's fine. But do it with logical consistency and argue why a rebuild not later but right now is the best move. Argue why removing the best example of what an NBA should be in Beal from the locker room will advance what we are trying to do. It's easy to pick apart moves in a vacuum. But the reality is that this 5 year 80 million dollar deal was inevitable the moment we decided to try to piece something together around Beal.

Lastly, how about we talk about how we got here. For all the people that want to trash our current GM for doing such a terrible job.
https://www.nba.com/wizards/wizards-acquire-davis-bertans-from-spurs-aaron-white
For the rights to Aaron White we bought Bertans in. Aaron White has never even played a game in the NBA. Where is the credit for this trade? But no, all we get is irrational arguments about how Ian Mahimi's contract is better. Maybe it's just me but can someone link to the articles of everyone trying to trade for the defensive wiz Ian Mahimi? I must have missed it. Snyder better than Leonsis. Mike Rizzo better than Tommy Sheppard. DC United better run than the Washington Wizards. Who cares? This is the Davis Bertans thread. You want to argue about the GM or the management, there's a thread for that.

Shooting deep 3's at both high volume and high accuracy is the most valuable commodity in this NBA. Bertans has it and teams will be willing to trade for it because it can be the difference between winning a championship and not winning a championship. Unless the contract is so bad that no team would be willing to trade for him, debating whether or not he is overpaid is a purely intellectual exercise and has no actual bearing on reality other than to attack management for a decision that was 100% necessary.

I'm confused here... Are you trying to say that you like the fact that we retained Davis Bertans?

(chill good buddy! :))
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
DCZards
General Manager
Posts: 8,060
And1: 2,412
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Location: The Streets of DC

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#492 » by DCZards » Tue Nov 24, 2020 11:14 pm

nuposse04 wrote:2017 is a long time ago and wall has significantly physically declined since then. He's in for for a rude awakening thinking he's going to be playing with the same Wall.

Bertans has practiced with Wall and watched him workout in preparation for his return. So I think he has a better idea than any of us as to how Wall looks physically. Judging by the 4-5 videos I've seen, JW appears to be in the best shape he's been in in many years.

On top of that, you have no idea as to what degree Wall has "physically declined."
nuposse04
RealGM
Posts: 11,274
And1: 2,414
Joined: Jul 20, 2004
Location: on a rock
   

Re: Report: Bertans resigns 5 years, 80 million 

Post#493 » by nuposse04 » Wed Nov 25, 2020 3:20 am

DCZards wrote:
nuposse04 wrote:2017 is a long time ago and wall has significantly physically declined since then. He's in for for a rude awakening thinking he's going to be playing with the same Wall.

Bertans has practiced with Wall and watched him workout in preparation for his return. So I think he has a better idea than any of us as to how Wall looks physically. Judging by the 4-5 videos I've seen, JW appears to be in the best shape he's been in in many years.

On top of that, you have no idea as to what degree Wall has "physically declined."


There is some published work on how guys do after Achilles tears. I don't expect Wall will ever be back to his 2017 self. More likely he will be as bad as he was before all this occurred, granted even when he was sucking before his injury, he was better than IT and Ish.

Videos are meaningless, especially workout highlight videos.
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 57,401
And1: 10,669
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser" 

Post#494 » by nate33 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:52 am

A bunch of guys just signed extensions today that help put Bertans' contract into perspective.

Bertans - 5 years, $16M per year - $5M buyout in final year
Jonathan Isaac - 4 years at $20M per year - he's not playing this year, so it's really $26.7M a year.
Markelle Fultz - 3 years at $16.7M per year - team option in final year
OG Anunoby - 4 years at $18M per year - player option in final year
Luke Kennard - 4 years at $16M per year - -$8M buyout in final year
Derrick White - 4 years $18.75M per year

Bertans' contract is looking better and better. I think he's a better player than Fultz, Kennard and White and he's paid less. Isaac's contract is looking really bad if he remains injury prone. OG Anunoby's deal looks real good, but that player option really hurts Toronto if he blows up.
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 15,147
And1: 4,816
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser" 

Post#495 » by payitforward » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:02 am

Yeah, sure, but he went 1-7 the other night -- guy's washed up!
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
User avatar
closg00
RealGM
Posts: 21,038
And1: 2,734
Joined: Nov 21, 2004

Re: Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser" 

Post#496 » by closg00 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:31 am

nate33 wrote:A bunch of guys just signed extensions today that help put Bertans' contract into perspective.

Bertans - 5 years, 28 $16M per year - $5M buyout in final year
Jonathan Isaac 23 - 4 years at $20M per year - he's not playing this year, so it's really $26.7M a year.
Markelle Fultz -22 3 years at $16.7M per year - team option in final year
OG Anunoby - 23 4 years at $18M per year - player option in final year
Luke Kennard -24 4 years at $16M per year - -$8M buyout in final year
Derrick White -26 4 years $18.75M per year

Bertans' contract is looking better and better. I think he's a better player than Fultz, Kennard and White and he's paid less. Isaac's contract is looking really bad if he remains injury prone. OG Anunoby's deal looks real good, but that player option really hurts Toronto if he blows up.


Fair-enough :thumbsup:
The Wizards finally get a draft steal in Deni Avdija
User avatar
tontoz
RealGM
Posts: 17,102
And1: 2,638
Joined: Apr 11, 2005

Re: Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser" 

Post#497 » by tontoz » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:50 am

I predicted a year ago that Bertans would get $15 million + per year and got some push back. That was pre covid. I really thought covid would lower his price.

It seems like teams are giving out roughly the same contracts they would have given without covid.
"bulky agile perimeter bone crunch pick setting draymond green" WizD
NatP4
General Manager
Posts: 9,448
And1: 2,838
Joined: Jul 24, 2016
         

Re: Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser" 

Post#498 » by NatP4 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:22 am

I figured he would get 18 million per and be well worth the money. Underrated defender, smart winning player.
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 57,401
And1: 10,669
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser" 

Post#499 » by nate33 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:49 pm

closg00 wrote:
nate33 wrote:A bunch of guys just signed extensions today that help put Bertans' contract into perspective.

Bertans - 5 years, 28 $16M per year - $5M buyout in final year
Jonathan Isaac 23 - 4 years at $20M per year - he's not playing this year, so it's really $26.7M a year.
Markelle Fultz -22 3 years at $16.7M per year - team option in final year
OG Anunoby - 23 4 years at $18M per year - player option in final year
Luke Kennard -24 4 years at $16M per year - -$8M buyout in final year
Derrick White -26 4 years $18.75M per year

Bertans' contract is looking better and better. I think he's a better player than Fultz, Kennard and White and he's paid less. Isaac's contract is looking really bad if he remains injury prone. OG Anunoby's deal looks real good, but that player option really hurts Toronto if he blows up.


Fair-enough :thumbsup:

I don't think the age of the players makes all that much difference. All those other guys just signed their rookie extension so they have 3 years under their belts already. They'll improve a little going forward, but not all that much. Most guys peak in their 4th or 5th season - particularly role players. Meanwhile, Bertans is young enough to remain in his plateau until perhaps his final season.

Valuewise, I'd rank those contracts as follows:
1. OG Anunoby
2. Davis Bertans
3. Derrick White
4. Luke Kennard
5. Markelle Fultz
6. Jonathan Isaac
User avatar
tontoz
RealGM
Posts: 17,102
And1: 2,638
Joined: Apr 11, 2005

Re: Davis Bertans "the Latvian Laser" 

Post#500 » by tontoz » Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:22 pm

Historically shooters age well (Ray, Reggie, Korver, Dirk, Nash....etc). Bertans' age isn't a concern to me at all.
"bulky agile perimeter bone crunch pick setting draymond green" WizD

Return to Washington Wizards