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Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2

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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#221 » by Illmatic12 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 4:38 pm

Bartlestein update on Beal:


Beal has another decision looming this week, as the Wizards can offer Beal a three-year, $111 million contract extension on Friday. Although Bartelstein said he and Beal have remained in contact with newly appointed general manager Tommy Sheppard as well as Ted Leonsis, there is no rush to come to an agreement on the upcoming offer.

“We’ll talk to the Wizards. We’ve been talking to the Wizards. Those are things we have to figure out in terms of what’s the right thing for everyone,” Bartelstein said. “We’re not locked in on specific dates in terms of all that. There’s nothing that needs to be decided at this moment. There’s a lot for Brad to consider. Ted and the entire Wizards organization have been nothing but spectacular to us.”

“We haven’t even gone there yet,” Bartelstein continued. “There hasn’t been a decision to make as of yet. When we get there, we’ll actually start thinking about it more seriously.”
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#222 » by nate33 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 6:33 pm

Illmatic12 wrote:Bartlestein update on Beal:


Beal has another decision looming this week, as the Wizards can offer Beal a three-year, $111 million contract extension on Friday. Although Bartelstein said he and Beal have remained in contact with newly appointed general manager Tommy Sheppard as well as Ted Leonsis, there is no rush to come to an agreement on the upcoming offer.

“We’ll talk to the Wizards. We’ve been talking to the Wizards. Those are things we have to figure out in terms of what’s the right thing for everyone,” Bartelstein said. “We’re not locked in on specific dates in terms of all that. There’s nothing that needs to be decided at this moment. There’s a lot for Brad to consider. Ted and the entire Wizards organization have been nothing but spectacular to us.”

“We haven’t even gone there yet,” Bartelstein continued. “There hasn’t been a decision to make as of yet. When we get there, we’ll actually start thinking about it more seriously.”

It sure sounds to me like Beal isn't going to sign that extension.

That's what I expected all along. I'm assuming Beal is going to try and make All-NBA this season and qualify for the 35% max rather than committing to 3 more years at the 30% max. I can understand that choice. As I've said before, that doesn't mean I'd try and trade him now. I'd be a bit more open minded to trading him, but it would have to be a very impressive offer.

At the end of the next season after All-NBA awards have been given out, if Beal still hasn't signed an extension (either a 35% if he qualifies or a 30% if he doesn't), then I would start shopping him much more vigorously and I'd start lowering my asking price.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#223 » by Illmatic12 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 7:32 pm

nate33 wrote:
Illmatic12 wrote:Bartlestein update on Beal:


Beal has another decision looming this week, as the Wizards can offer Beal a three-year, $111 million contract extension on Friday. Although Bartelstein said he and Beal have remained in contact with newly appointed general manager Tommy Sheppard as well as Ted Leonsis, there is no rush to come to an agreement on the upcoming offer.

“We’ll talk to the Wizards. We’ve been talking to the Wizards. Those are things we have to figure out in terms of what’s the right thing for everyone,” Bartelstein said. “We’re not locked in on specific dates in terms of all that. There’s nothing that needs to be decided at this moment. There’s a lot for Brad to consider. Ted and the entire Wizards organization have been nothing but spectacular to us.”

“We haven’t even gone there yet,” Bartelstein continued. “There hasn’t been a decision to make as of yet. When we get there, we’ll actually start thinking about it more seriously.”

It sure sounds to me like Beal isn't going to sign that extension.

That's what I expected all along. I'm assuming Beal is going to try and make All-NBA this season and qualify for the 35% max rather than committing to 3 more years at the 30% max. I can understand that choice. As I've said before, that doesn't mean I'd try and trade him now. I'd be a bit more open minded to trading him, but it would have to be a very impressive offer.

At the end of the next season after All-NBA awards have been given out, if Beal still hasn't signed an extension (either a 35% if he qualifies or a 30% if he doesn't), then I would start shopping him much more vigorously and I'd start lowering my asking price.

I believe he will sign it , but Bartlestein will negotiate an opt-out on the final year. That way he can re-up in DC for the 10yr veteran max, or if he really wants to he can get out before he hits 30 and sign a longterm max somewhere else

But yeah he can say he wants to stay but at some point he needs to commit and put his signature on a contract or we need to move on.

We can’t go into the 2020-21 season without having our core franchise piece locked up.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#224 » by gambitx777 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:18 pm

It would be smart for him to sign it. Just for the sake of security . But put opt outs in so he can get the big money when he's 30. Don't get fooled by kd and Klay keeping their money after getting hurt. As good as Beal is he's not KD and kaly got that money out of loyalty from the team that he's never once thought of leaving. So secure the bag young fella.

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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#225 » by closg00 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:20 pm

Good analysis, Wizards get brutalized though
Tank 19/20, trade Brad, Top-5 pick in 2020.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#226 » by nate33 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:50 pm

closg00 wrote:Good analysis, Wizards get brutalized though

It is interesting how nobody seems to appreciate the potential of Thomas Bryant. The kid is already one of the better offensive centers in the game. His defense is below average but not awful, which is actually pretty darn good for a 21 year old with just 1500 minutes under his belt. Given the minutes he'll get this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he gets most improved player. He wouldn't even actually have to statistically improve on a per minute basis. Just the added playing time and a modest improvement on D will get him in the conversation.

The Wizards also suffer in these analyses because of the general anti-Hachimura group think prior to the draft. Many draft gurus think Hachimura should have gone in the 15-25 range not 9th. And the draft evaluation opinions are really only set by a handful of guys, whom everyone else mostly just repeats. Basically, they think Hachimura is just a guy. Maybe they're right, but I think Hachimura is a pretty sure bet to be an above average starter, and maybe a star.

So the Wizards asset base isn't just Beal. It's Beal plus two 21-year-old big men who really might be very good players for a very long time. Finally, people act like John Wall died or something. The guy is going to come back. Maybe not to 100%, but probably to 85% or better, and hopefully with a more cerebral focus on his game after two years on the sidelines. He's still going to be good, even if he is overpaid.

I totally get being down on the Wizards this year. But their asset base going forward in 2021 and beyond isn't so bad. It's much better to have a 26-year-old All-NBA caliber guy, than not to have one.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#227 » by closg00 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:26 pm

nate33 wrote:
closg00 wrote:Good analysis, Wizards get brutalized though

It is interesting how nobody seems to appreciate the potential of Thomas Bryant. The kid is already one of the better offensive centers in the game. His defense is below average but not awful, which is actually pretty darn good for a 21 year old with just 1500 minutes under his belt. Given the minutes he'll get this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he gets most improved player. He wouldn't even actually have to statistically improve on a per minute basis. Just the added playing time and a modest improvement on D will get him in the conversation.

The Wizards also suffer in these analyses because of the general anti-Hachimura group think prior to the draft. Many draft gurus think Hachimura should have gone in the 15-25 range not 9th. And the draft evaluation opinions are really only set by a handful of guys, whom everyone else mostly just repeats. Basically, they think Hachimura is just a guy. Maybe they're right, but I think Hachimura is a pretty sure bet to be an above average starter, and maybe a star.

So the Wizards asset base isn't just Beal. It's Beal plus two 21-year-old big men who really might be very good players for a very long time. Finally, people act like John Wall died or something. The guy is going to come back. Maybe not to 100%, but probably to 85% or better, and hopefully with a more cerebral focus on his game after two years on the sidelines. He's still going to be good, even if he is overpaid.

I totally get being down on the Wizards this year. But their asset base going forward in 2021 and beyond isn't so bad. It's much better to have a 26-year-old All-NBA caliber guy, than not to have one.


At-best he could have moved us up one spot, but not any further. Brown isn't considered much and we hollowed-out the roster. Fair point that he probably considers Bryant and Rui just guys.
Tank 19/20, trade Brad, Top-5 pick in 2020.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#228 » by doclinkin » Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:16 am

queridiculo wrote:


That’s not Jimmy Butler? He was killing it. Whoever it is I want that guy on my squad.

Cool to see JSteez Jordan Crawford.

But damn Thomas Bryant.... He’s gonna have a hell of a year. Good advice given to him on how to improve on setting solid picks. And yeah Trezl rocked him to the body a couple times. But you can see how his defense will start to pick up. And as soon as he masters the Pick part of that pick and pop he’s going to be a hell of a load to handle.

Was that Moritz Wagner or some other stiff. Because he was a one man highlight reel for everyone else to score on.

IT getting stuffed in layups a few times. He’s not back yet. I like his poise. Chemistry making Bryant look good. But he’s not back yet at all.

Sign up Earl Watson as an assistant coach. He’s one of those Eric Snow type cats who just knows the game. I always liked his defensive intensity.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#229 » by doclinkin » Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:55 am

https://youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=9KauFoiWzYQ

Jordan Crawford always looks to me like Martin Lawrence’s stunt double. Something about his posture and style never fails to make me laugh.

Nice moment at ~26:00 of PJ Tucker giving respect for how hard Thomas Bryant works and how far he’s improved.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#230 » by DCZards » Tue Jul 23, 2019 4:50 am

doclinkin wrote:https://youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=9KauFoiWzYQ

Jordan Crawford always looks to me like Martin Lawrence’s stunt double. Something about his posture and style never fails to make me laugh.

Nice moment at ~26:00 of PJ Tucker giving respect for how hard Thomas Bryant works and how far he’s improved
.


I'm sure it meant a lot to T. Bryant to get singled out for props from a hard worker and pro's pro like PJ.

Thanks for bringing that moment to our attention, doc.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#231 » by doclinkin » Tue Jul 23, 2019 5:07 am

Yeah these runs are fun to watch. TB13 was hitting like it’s easy from range.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#232 » by SUPERBALLMAN » Tue Jul 23, 2019 5:53 am

doclinkin wrote:
queridiculo wrote:


That’s not Jimmy Butler? He was killing it. Whoever it is I want that guy on my squad.

Cool to see JSteez Jordan Crawford.

But damn Thomas Bryant.... He’s gonna have a hell of a year. Good advice given to him on how to improve on setting solid picks. And yeah Trezl rocked him to the body a couple times. But you can see how his defense will start to pick up. And as soon as he masters the Pick part of that pick and pop he’s going to be a hell of a load to handle.

Was that Moritz Wagner or some other stiff. Because he was a one man highlight reel for everyone else to score on.

IT getting stuffed in layups a few times. He’s not back yet. I like his poise. Chemistry making Bryant look good. But he’s not back yet at all.

Sign up Earl Watson as an assistant coach. He’s one of those Eric Snow type cats who just knows the game. I always liked his defensive intensity.



Thanks for posting this very awesome, glad to see Steez and IT and TB !! Hands looks good, I liked him as a late 2nd rounder.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#233 » by Dat2U » Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:55 pm

nate33 wrote:
closg00 wrote:Good analysis, Wizards get brutalized though

It is interesting how nobody seems to appreciate the potential of Thomas Bryant. The kid is already one of the better offensive centers in the game. His defense is below average but not awful, which is actually pretty darn good for a 21 year old with just 1500 minutes under his belt. Given the minutes he'll get this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he gets most improved player. He wouldn't even actually have to statistically improve on a per minute basis. Just the added playing time and a modest improvement on D will get him in the conversation.

The Wizards also suffer in these analyses because of the general anti-Hachimura group think prior to the draft. Many draft gurus think Hachimura should have gone in the 15-25 range not 9th. And the draft evaluation opinions are really only set by a handful of guys, whom everyone else mostly just repeats. Basically, they think Hachimura is just a guy. Maybe they're right, but I think Hachimura is a pretty sure bet to be an above average starter, and maybe a star.

So the Wizards asset base isn't just Beal. It's Beal plus two 21-year-old big men who really might be very good players for a very long time. Finally, people act like John Wall died or something. The guy is going to come back. Maybe not to 100%, but probably to 85% or better, and hopefully with a more cerebral focus on his game after two years on the sidelines. He's still going to be good, even if he is overpaid.

I totally get being down on the Wizards this year. But their asset base going forward in 2021 and beyond isn't so bad. It's much better to have a 26-year-old All-NBA caliber guy, than not to have one.


I remain a skeptic.

I assume the raised expectations of Rui are due to the summer league performance?

None of his supposed weaknesses were likely to be exposed in that environment. He did well but the questions about him are mostly going to be about his team defense. His rotations. How quickly he recognizes stuff? Can he quickly locate a body and block out? Can he learn to track the ball and rebound outside his area?

Bryant on the other hand is poised for a breakout. Would not be surprised to see him become a double/double guy. He will cement himself as this team's 2nd best player.

The cupboard is still pretty bare tho. No one will think of Wall as an asset under this current deal, healthy or not. He wasn't going to be worth it pre-achillies. Certainly post-achillies your likely getting an inferior performance in significantly fewer minutes.

Brown Jr is the only other asset worth mentioning and it appears he's only highly thought of amongst Wizards fans. I think most project him as a solid role player.

The Wizards are going to need a lot more than Beal, Rui, TB, TBJ & a lesser version of Wall to do anything of note.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#234 » by dckingsfan » Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:25 pm

Dat2U wrote:
nate33 wrote:
closg00 wrote:Good analysis, Wizards get brutalized though

It is interesting how nobody seems to appreciate the potential of Thomas Bryant. The kid is already one of the better offensive centers in the game. His defense is below average but not awful, which is actually pretty darn good for a 21 year old with just 1500 minutes under his belt. Given the minutes he'll get this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he gets most improved player. He wouldn't even actually have to statistically improve on a per minute basis. Just the added playing time and a modest improvement on D will get him in the conversation.

The Wizards also suffer in these analyses because of the general anti-Hachimura group think prior to the draft. Many draft gurus think Hachimura should have gone in the 15-25 range not 9th. And the draft evaluation opinions are really only set by a handful of guys, whom everyone else mostly just repeats. Basically, they think Hachimura is just a guy. Maybe they're right, but I think Hachimura is a pretty sure bet to be an above average starter, and maybe a star.

So the Wizards asset base isn't just Beal. It's Beal plus two 21-year-old big men who really might be very good players for a very long time. Finally, people act like John Wall died or something. The guy is going to come back. Maybe not to 100%, but probably to 85% or better, and hopefully with a more cerebral focus on his game after two years on the sidelines. He's still going to be good, even if he is overpaid.

I totally get being down on the Wizards this year. But their asset base going forward in 2021 and beyond isn't so bad. It's much better to have a 26-year-old All-NBA caliber guy, than not to have one.


I remain a skeptic.

I assume the raised expectations of Rui are due to the summer league performance?

None of his supposed weaknesses were likely to be exposed in that environment. He did well but the questions about him are mostly going to be about his team defense. His rotations. How quickly he recognizes stuff? Can he quickly locate a body and block out? Can he learn to track the ball and rebound outside his area?

Bryant on the other hand is poised for a breakout. Would not be surprised to see him become a double/double guy. He will cement himself as this team's 2nd best player.

The cupboard is still pretty bare tho. No one will think of Wall as an asset under this current deal, healthy or not. He wasn't going to be worth it pre-achillies. Certainly post-achillies your likely getting an inferior performance in significantly fewer minutes.

Brown Jr is the only other asset worth mentioning and it appears he's only highly thought of amongst Wizards fans. I think most project him as a solid role player.

The Wizards are going to need a lot more than Beal, Rui, TB, TBJ & a lesser version of Wall to do anything of note.

The Brown Jr "thing" is a puzzle to me. One would think that he would be very prominent in the Wizard's thinking. I am thinking he is going to be the third best player on the Wizards. I don't say this from your perspective but from the Wizard's FO and coaching staff "meh" on him.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#235 » by nate33 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:37 pm

Dat2U wrote:I remain a skeptic.

I assume the raised expectations of Rui are due to the summer league performance?

None of his supposed weaknesses were likely to be exposed in that environment. He did well but the questions about him are mostly going to be about his team defense. His rotations. How quickly he recognizes stuff? Can he quickly locate a body and block out? Can he learn to track the ball and rebound outside his area?

Bryant on the other hand is poised for a breakout. Would not be surprised to see him become a double/double guy. He will cement himself as this team's 2nd best player.

The cupboard is still pretty bare tho. No one will think of Wall as an asset under this current deal, healthy or not. He wasn't going to be worth it pre-achillies. Certainly post-achillies your likely getting an inferior performance in significantly fewer minutes.

Brown Jr is the only other asset worth mentioning and it appears he's only highly thought of amongst Wizards fans. I think most project him as a solid role player.

The Wizards are going to need a lot more than Beal, Rui, TB, TBJ & a lesser version of Wall to do anything of note.

Even if you are right. Even if Hachimura never really pans out to be a plus player and is more like a Jabari Parker empty stats guy; and even if Troy Brown pans out to be merely a Justice Winslow/Evan Turner tier ball handling forward with a suspect shot, the team still has a pretty decent path forward. They still have an All-NBA 26 year old SG. They still have a rapidly improving Thomas Bryant who might be a top 10 center as soon as this year, at age 22. They'll have $15-20M in cap room next summer with Mahinmi, Miles and Bertans coming off the books. They'll have a high lotto pick. And John Wall, albeit a negative asset, will at least be much less negative asset next year once he is actually on the floor again. He'll move up to the Gordon Hayward/Kevin Love/Harrison Barnes tier of guys: a useful player, just paid more than he is worth.

So the Wizards will have two young foundation pieces in Beal and Bryant - a stronger two-man foundation than many other rebuilding teams like Atlanta, Detroit, Miami, Cleveland, New York and Chicago. They'll have an overpaid but useful Wall. $15M in cap room. And Hachimura and Brown are certainly bound to be useful rotation players, if not above-average ones. I don't see how that puts them as a bottom 3 franchise for future potential. I think they're in better shape than Cleveland, Charlotte, Miami, Detroit and New York at a bare minimum. You can make a case that they're future is rosier than Minnesota, Orlando and Toronto as well.

Too many people are overstating the negative affects of Wall's contract. Massive cap room isn't really needed during a rebuild. It's useful to have some cap room to buy a few late 1st rounders here and there, but that's really the only thing that they're missing out on. And the way things are shaping up, his contract isn't going to hurt the Wizards ability to retain key guys. The only year where that massive cap hit can really hurt is Wall's final contract year because they will have to pay Bryant (and possibly Troy Brown) big raises. If things are going well on the court, I think Ted will take the luxtax hit for one year.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#236 » by DCZards » Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:24 pm

dckingsfan wrote:The Brown Jr "thing" is a puzzle to me. One would think that he would be very prominent in the Wizard's thinking. I am thinking he is going to be the third best player on the Wizards. I don't say this from your perspective but from the Wizard's FO and coaching staff "meh" on him.


I don't think the Zards FO and coaching staff have been "meh" on Troy. Not sure where you're getting that from.

Sure there's more talk about Rui but that's mainly because he's the latest flavor and a lottery pick. I expect Hachimura to be the Zards third best player by the middle of next season...which isn't saying a lot given the dearth of proven talent on the roster.

From quotes I've read the Zards FO & staff really like Brown's versatility and high bball IQ. Of course, he does need to improve as a shooter. If he does that, I think Troy will be similar to Nic Batum.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#237 » by Dat2U » Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:25 pm

nate33 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:I remain a skeptic.

I assume the raised expectations of Rui are due to the summer league performance?

None of his supposed weaknesses were likely to be exposed in that environment. He did well but the questions about him are mostly going to be about his team defense. His rotations. How quickly he recognizes stuff? Can he quickly locate a body and block out? Can he learn to track the ball and rebound outside his area?

Bryant on the other hand is poised for a breakout. Would not be surprised to see him become a double/double guy. He will cement himself as this team's 2nd best player.

The cupboard is still pretty bare tho. No one will think of Wall as an asset under this current deal, healthy or not. He wasn't going to be worth it pre-achillies. Certainly post-achillies your likely getting an inferior performance in significantly fewer minutes.

Brown Jr is the only other asset worth mentioning and it appears he's only highly thought of amongst Wizards fans. I think most project him as a solid role player.

The Wizards are going to need a lot more than Beal, Rui, TB, TBJ & a lesser version of Wall to do anything of note.

Even if you are right. Even if Hachimura never really pans out to be a plus player and is more like a Jabari Parker empty stats guy; and even if Troy Brown pans out to be merely a Justice Winslow/Evan Turner tier ball handling forward with a suspect shot, the team still has a pretty decent path forward. They still have an All-NBA 26 year old SG. They still have a rapidly improving Thomas Bryant who might be a top 10 center as soon as this year, at age 22. They'll have $15-20M in cap room next summer with Mahinmi, Miles and Bertans coming off the books. They'll have a high lotto pick. And John Wall, albeit a negative asset, will at least be much less negative asset next year once he is actually on the floor again. He'll move up to the Gordon Hayward/Kevin Love/Harrison Barnes tier of guys: a useful player, just paid more than he is worth.

So the Wizards will have two young foundation pieces in Beal and Bryant - a stronger two-man foundation than many other rebuilding teams like Atlanta, Detroit, Miami, Cleveland, New York and Chicago. They'll have an overpaid but useful Wall. $15M in cap room. And Hachimura and Brown are certainly bound to be useful rotation players, if not above-average ones. I don't see how that puts them as a bottom 3 franchise for future potential. I think they're in better shape than Cleveland, Charlotte, Miami, Detroit and New York at a bare minimum. You can make a case that they're future is rosier than Minnesota, Orlando and Toronto as well.

Too many people are overstating the negative affects of Wall's contract. Massive cap room isn't really needed during a rebuild. It's useful to have some cap room to buy a few late 1st rounders here and there, but that's really the only thing that they're missing out on. And the way things are shaping up, his contract isn't going to hurt the Wizards ability to retain key guys. The only year where that massive cap hit can really hurt is Wall's final contract year because they will have to pay Bryant (and possibly Troy Brown) big raises. If things are going well on the court, I think Ted will take the luxtax hit for one year.


I'll give you Charlotte & Detroit.

I couldn't give you the rest.

I don't know how you've talked yourself into this rosy outlook but I assume that opinion may change season when reality hits and the games are played.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#238 » by gambitx777 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 4:12 pm

I agree, it's not as doom and gloom as one might think. Also I'm interested to see what the front office does with gather assets. Bertins is going to have interest at the dead line because he's an affordable one year 3 point sniper. Teams are gonna want him for the play offs and are going to be willing to pay a premium for shooting to bolster a run. Ian could be used to take a buyer's remorse contract for the right price. Doubt cj miles has much value but ya never know.
nate33 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:I remain a skeptic.

I assume the raised expectations of Rui are due to the summer league performance?

None of his supposed weaknesses were likely to be exposed in that environment. He did well but the questions about him are mostly going to be about his team defense. His rotations. How quickly he recognizes stuff? Can he quickly locate a body and block out? Can he learn to track the ball and rebound outside his area?

Bryant on the other hand is poised for a breakout. Would not be surprised to see him become a double/double guy. He will cement himself as this team's 2nd best player.

The cupboard is still pretty bare tho. No one will think of Wall as an asset under this current deal, healthy or not. He wasn't going to be worth it pre-achillies. Certainly post-achillies your likely getting an inferior performance in significantly fewer minutes.

Brown Jr is the only other asset worth mentioning and it appears he's only highly thought of amongst Wizards fans. I think most project him as a solid role player.

The Wizards are going to need a lot more than Beal, Rui, TB, TBJ & a lesser version of Wall to do anything of note.

Even if you are right. Even if Hachimura never really pans out to be a plus player and is more like a Jabari Parker empty stats guy; and even if Troy Brown pans out to be merely a Justice Winslow/Evan Turner tier ball handling forward with a suspect shot, the team still has a pretty decent path forward. They still have an All-NBA 26 year old SG. They still have a rapidly improving Thomas Bryant who might be a top 10 center as soon as this year, at age 22. They'll have $15-20M in cap room next summer with Mahinmi, Miles and Bertans coming off the books. They'll have a high lotto pick. And John Wall, albeit a negative asset, will at least be much less negative asset next year once he is actually on the floor again. He'll move up to the Gordon Hayward/Kevin Love/Harrison Barnes tier of guys: a useful player, just paid more than he is worth.

So the Wizards will have two young foundation pieces in Beal and Bryant - a stronger two-man foundation than many other rebuilding teams like Atlanta, Detroit, Miami, Cleveland, New York and Chicago. They'll have an overpaid but useful Wall. $15M in cap room. And Hachimura and Brown are certainly bound to be useful rotation players, if not above-average ones. I don't see how that puts them as a bottom 3 franchise for future potential. I think they're in better shape than Cleveland, Charlotte, Miami, Detroit and New York at a bare minimum. You can make a case that they're future is rosier than Minnesota, Orlando and Toronto as well.

Too many people are overstating the negative affects of Wall's contract. Massive cap room isn't really needed during a rebuild. It's useful to have some cap room to buy a few late 1st rounders here and there, but that's really the only thing that they're missing out on. And the way things are shaping up, his contract isn't going to hurt the Wizards ability to retain key guys. The only year where that massive cap hit can really hurt is Wall's final contract year because they will have to pay Bryant (and possibly Troy Brown) big raises. If things are going well on the court, I think Ted will take the luxtax hit for one year.


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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#239 » by dckingsfan » Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:18 pm

DCZards wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:The Brown Jr "thing" is a puzzle to me. One would think that he would be very prominent in the Wizard's thinking. I am thinking he is going to be the third best player on the Wizards. I don't say this from your perspective but from the Wizard's FO and coaching staff "meh" on him.


I don't think the Zards FO and coaching staff have been "meh" on Troy. Not sure where you're getting that from.

Sure there's more talk about Rui but that's mainly because he's the latest flavor and a lottery pick. I expect Hachimura to be the Zards third best player by the middle of next season...which isn't saying a lot given the dearth of proven talent on the roster.

From quotes I've read the Zards FO & staff really like Brown's versatility and high bball IQ. Of course, he does need to improve as a shooter. If he does that, I think Troy will be similar to Nic Batum.

Quote's like, "solid"... It gives me the feeling that they really don't know what to do with him. My 1/2 cent.
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Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#240 » by payitforward » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:45 pm

Dat2U wrote:
nate33 wrote:It is interesting how nobody seems to appreciate the potential of Thomas Bryant. The kid is already one of the better offensive centers in the game. His defense is below average but not awful, which is actually pretty darn good for a 21 year old with just 1500 minutes under his belt. Given the minutes he'll get this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he gets most improved player. He wouldn't even actually have to statistically improve on a per minute basis. Just the added playing time and a modest improvement on D will get him in the conversation.

The Wizards also suffer in these analyses because of the general anti-Hachimura group think prior to the draft. Many draft gurus think Hachimura should have gone in the 15-25 range not 9th. And the draft evaluation opinions are really only set by a handful of guys, whom everyone else mostly just repeats. Basically, they think Hachimura is just a guy. Maybe they're right, but I think Hachimura is a pretty sure bet to be an above average starter, and maybe a star.

So the Wizards asset base isn't just Beal. It's Beal plus two 21-year-old big men who really might be very good players for a very long time. Finally, people act like John Wall died or something. The guy is going to come back. Maybe not to 100%, but probably to 85% or better, and hopefully with a more cerebral focus on his game after two years on the sidelines. He's still going to be good, even if he is overpaid.

I totally get being down on the Wizards this year. But their asset base going forward in 2021 and beyond isn't so bad. It's much better to have a 26-year-old All-NBA caliber guy, than not to have one.

I remain a skeptic.

I assume the raised expectations of Rui are due to the summer league performance?

None of his supposed weaknesses were likely to be exposed in that environment. He did well but the questions about him are mostly going to be about his team defense. His rotations. How quickly he recognizes stuff? Can he quickly locate a body and block out? Can he learn to track the ball and rebound outside his area?

Bryant on the other hand is poised for a breakout. Would not be surprised to see him become a double/double guy. He will cement himself as this team's 2nd best player.

The cupboard is still pretty bare tho. No one will think of Wall as an asset under this current deal, healthy or not. He wasn't going to be worth it pre-achillies. Certainly post-achillies your likely getting an inferior performance in significantly fewer minutes.

Brown Jr is the only other asset worth mentioning and it appears he's only highly thought of amongst Wizards fans. I think most project him as a solid role player.

The Wizards are going to need a lot more than Beal, Rui, TB, TBJ & a lesser version of Wall to do anything of note.

"A solid role player" is a valuable asset. But, of course we'll need more than those 4 guys.

There's a lot of time between now & TC, though... whatever Tommy does we aren't going to be any good this season. All the same, longer-term it's fair to be optimistic just based on Ernie being gone! I don't think we're going to be putting bandaids on bandaids under Tommy.

I'm more worried about Ted's "Why can't it be fast?" attitude than anything else. It can't be fast for the obvious reason that we don't have the assets to get a whole lot better quickly. Moreover, it's reasonable to worry that Ted's strategy might be based on the idea of getting "back" to being good. We were never good. From 1/3 of the way through the 2014-15 season through the end of the 2017-18 season we were under .500 with the exception of a single terrific run of about 25 games part way through 2016-17.

Aside from Brad, & not including John, all the guys we have back from last year played less than 3100 minutes total. 2226 came from Bryant & Brown. The other guys, Mahinmi & McRae, are irrelevant.

We should expect twice the minutes from Bryant/Brown this year. If we keep Brad to @ 2800 minutes, that will leave us needing @ 12,500 minutes from other players. Overall, the level of play from those guys is not likely to be anywhere near NBA average. It'll be a trick to get to 30 wins.
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.

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