ImageImageImageImageImage

Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2

Moderators: LyricalRico, nate33, montestewart

User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 67,033
And1: 19,354
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#61 » by nate33 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:26 pm

Dat2U wrote:
truwizfan4evr wrote:
TGW wrote:
Yes. And that's why I don't care for Shepperd's "vision." This team has no identity, and the goal of this offseason seemed as though it was just to get warm bodies to fill out the rotation. Other than maybe Hachimura (who I think won't do much this season), no one he picked up is going to move the meter. As a matter of fact, the team got significantly worse defensively.

Does it matter were tanking for a top 3 pick. If we some how get a top 3 pick and they turn out to be a mega star, all will be forgiven and forgotten.


I keep saying this but there's zero benefit in being non-competitive or being so bad that your setting records for futility. That's not an ideal environment to develop talent.

Also Hachimura at the 3 is probably not realistic. Sure, the team can call him a 3/4 but if you've watched him it's clear he's not a polished perimeter player. You generally want to put players in the best position to succeed. For him, I believe that's going to be at the 4 spot.

I'm assuming Ish, Beal, Bertans and Bryant start. It'll be interesting to see if the 5th starter is Brown or Hachimura (or perhaps even Miles). Given the total lack of depth in the front court, I think it makes more sense to start Brown so that Hachimura can at least eat up some of those backup PF minutes.

I hope Bryant can play 36 minutes a night. Our backup center situation is a disaster.
DCZards
RealGM
Posts: 10,003
And1: 3,974
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Location: The Streets of DC
     

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#62 » by DCZards » Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:36 pm

nate33 wrote:I'm assuming Ish, Beal, Bertans and Bryant start. It'll be interesting to see if the 5th starter is Brown or Hachimura (or perhaps even Miles). Given the total lack of depth in the front court, I think it makes more sense to start Brown so that Hachimura can at least eat up some of those backup PF minutes.

I hope Bryant can play 36 minutes a night. Our backup center situation is a disaster.

It wouldn't surprise me to see both Hachimura and Brown in the starting lineup with Bertans coming off the bench.

I'm still hoping that the Zards sign another big, ideally a young guy and a strong rebounder. Cheick Diallo and Marquese Criss are still available, as are Kenneth Faried, Tyler Zeller and Joakim Noah, who while 34 can still rebound and would be a stopgap measure.
Ruzious
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 47,909
And1: 11,579
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#63 » by Ruzious » Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:44 pm

I still think Wagner can play, but he really needs to start showing it. Regardless, the Wiz will be a terrible rebounding team. It doesn't help that they've replaced Sato with 6' Ish and 5'9 IT.
"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams
smoothSeph
Pro Prospect
Posts: 792
And1: 526
Joined: May 15, 2019
     

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#64 » by smoothSeph » Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:56 pm

If Mahimni is staying on board make him earn some of his money. It’s a lost year anyway might as well give him 15 center minutes a game instead of overworking Bryant
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 21,958
And1: 7,874
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#65 » by payitforward » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:10 pm

queridiculo wrote:
TGW wrote:
Yes. And that's why I don't care for Shepperd's "vision." This team has no identity, and the goal of this offseason seemed as though it was just to get warm bodies to fill out the rotation. Other than maybe Hachimura (who I think won't do much this season), no one he picked up is going to move the meter. As a matter of fact, the team got significantly worse defensively.


I'm so/so on the moves Sheppard did in the draft and I like the transactions he made to replenish the Wizards 2nd rounders.

I'm also willing to give him credit for the Bertans signing, basically got a rotation player that can shoot for free.

Now where I'm really disappointed is where the Wizards are from a competitive standpoint.

I'm willing to concede that the Wizards don't have much of a chance of being competitive this year, however, to me that doesn't mean that the Wizards shouldn't at least try.

Going into the offseason Washington essentially had two positions settled, SG and C and gaping holes everywhere else.

What the Wizards needed was rebounding and defense and they had the full MLE at their disposal along with their BAE and they might still get the DPE.

Sheppard's answer, Ish Smith.

I have no problem with this signing in isolation and if this had been a S&T of sorts fine, to bust our MLE on a player that doesn't help the areas of need in the slightest is unforgivable.

Zero vision, zero identity for this group that was assembled.

Rondae-Hollis Jefferson went to Toronto on a minimum deal, you're telling me the Wizards couldn't have done better?

RHJ is not much of a shooter but he would have given us some much needed defense and rebounding and with him in the fold the CJ Miles trade actually would have made some sense.

I give up... really.

We came into this season with Beal, Wall, Mahinmi, Howard & Brown Jr. signed for just under $90m. That's $19m shy of the cap with 5 players -- of whom we would want/be able to play two this year. In essence, in other words, we had two players.

We re-signed Bryant. We drafted Rui Hachimura. Now we have 4 players, & we are $7m shy of the cap.

Exactly what is the way to "try" to be competitive? Re: Miles -- don't you think Tommy called every contact he has in the league, i.e. everyone, to see whether anyone wanted to take Howard off his hands? & took the best deal he could get? Of course he did! You think he needs you to tell him to do that?

Now we still have 4 players who can take the floor, but now we are $3.5m shy of the cap. Ah, but we'd bought a R2 pick & nabbed Admiral. Figure he'll cost something like $1m this year. Did you not want to do that? How about Robinson? Figure almost another $1m. Not a good idea either? Why didn't we get Paul George instead, so we could be "competitive?"

Well, those guys were cheap; that helps. Now we have 6 guys who can play, and wow we still have $1.5m in cap room.

Nothing to dislike so far, right? How about the Lakers deal -- cost us nothing & brought us 3 maybe 4 players -- including Mo Wagner whom you wanted to draft in R1 last year -- plus a R2 pick.

So, what's the problem? You didn't like the trade for Bertans? Is that it? Instead you wanted someone else, someone whose name you already knew.

Right now we have 12 guys signed to guaranteed contracts for just under $124m. Admiral & Robinson aren't signed. Lets assume them in: that's 14 guaranteed contracts (Robinson will only be partially guaranteed) & $126m. McRae, Phillip & Jones are unaccounted for as yet.

Dat, nate & I would have signed Jake Layman & simply eaten Howard's contract instead of acquiring Miles. That puts about $1m higher in salary. Would we have become "competitive" with Layman instead of Miles? We'd also have signed Noah Vonleh instead of trading for Bertans.

I prefer both those moves, obviously. But, I don't know that Layman was interested in coming here. & I don't know whether he'll continue to play better than he ever has (which is what he did last season). & I don't know whether Vonleh wanted to come here either. He signed with Minny -- as did Layman.

So... once again -- what's your beef? That we signed Ish Smith? If we hadn't signed him we could have "at least tried" to be "competitive this year?" Is that it?

How?

Not to challenge either of you, but why don't you go into our "GM for a day" thread & describe the way you'd have handled the off season? It's fantasy but it's fun. Will you be able to do a better job than Tommy Sheppard? TBH, I wonder whether any of us who tried really were better than him -- or would be in the real world where you can't make a move happen simply by writing down a description of it!
Breaking News: In a shocking development, Wizards owner Ted Leonsis has sold the NBA franchise to a consortium of participants in a discussion board devoted to the team on realgm.com. Details to follow....
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 67,033
And1: 19,354
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#66 » by nate33 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:19 pm

DCZards wrote:It wouldn't surprise me to see both Hachimura and Brown in the starting lineup with Bertans coming off the bench.

That would surprise me. First of all, Bertans is pretty good. Secondly, he has a game that is dependent on other guys setting him up, and the two best guys to do that are Ish and Beal, so it makes sense to start him. Also, his floor stretching game is ideal to create space for the Beal/Bryant or Ish/Bryant pick-and-roll.

Hachimura looks like he has the makings of a primary scorer, but he's not yet able to do it against first rate defenders. He seems perfect as the offensive focal point of the second unit.
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 67,033
And1: 19,354
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#67 » by nate33 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:29 pm

payitforward wrote:
queridiculo wrote:
TGW wrote:
Yes. And that's why I don't care for Shepperd's "vision." This team has no identity, and the goal of this offseason seemed as though it was just to get warm bodies to fill out the rotation. Other than maybe Hachimura (who I think won't do much this season), no one he picked up is going to move the meter. As a matter of fact, the team got significantly worse defensively.


I'm so/so on the moves Sheppard did in the draft and I like the transactions he made to replenish the Wizards 2nd rounders.

I'm also willing to give him credit for the Bertans signing, basically got a rotation player that can shoot for free.

Now where I'm really disappointed is where the Wizards are from a competitive standpoint.

I'm willing to concede that the Wizards don't have much of a chance of being competitive this year, however, to me that doesn't mean that the Wizards shouldn't at least try.

Going into the offseason Washington essentially had two positions settled, SG and C and gaping holes everywhere else.

What the Wizards needed was rebounding and defense and they had the full MLE at their disposal along with their BAE and they might still get the DPE.

Sheppard's answer, Ish Smith.

I have no problem with this signing in isolation and if this had been a S&T of sorts fine, to bust our MLE on a player that doesn't help the areas of need in the slightest is unforgivable.

Zero vision, zero identity for this group that was assembled.

Rondae-Hollis Jefferson went to Toronto on a minimum deal, you're telling me the Wizards couldn't have done better?

RHJ is not much of a shooter but he would have given us some much needed defense and rebounding and with him in the fold the CJ Miles trade actually would have made some sense.

I give up... really.

We came into this season with Beal, Wall, Mahinmi, Howard & Brown Jr. signed for just under $90m. That's $19m shy of the cap with 5 players -- of whom we would want/be able to play two this year. In essence, in other words, we had two players.

We re-signed Bryant. We drafted Rui Hachimura. Now we have 4 players, & we are $7m shy of the cap.

Exactly what is the way to "try" to be competitive? Re: Miles -- don't you think Tommy called every contact he has in the league, i.e. everyone, to see whether anyone wanted to take Howard off his hands? & took the best deal he could get? Of course he did! You think he needs you to tell him to do that?

Now we still have 4 players who can take the floor, but now we are $3.5m shy of the cap. Ah, but we'd bought a R2 pick & nabbed Admiral. Figure he'll cost something like $1m this year. Did you not want to do that? How about Robinson? Figure almost another $1m. Not a good idea either? Why didn't we get Paul George instead, so we could be "competitive?"

Well, those guys were cheap; that helps. Now we have 6 guys who can play, and wow we still have $1.5m in cap room.

Nothing to dislike so far, right? How about the Lakers deal -- cost us nothing & brought us 3 maybe 4 players -- including Mo Wagner whom you wanted to draft in R1 last year -- plus a R2 pick.

So, what's the problem? You didn't like the trade for Bertans? Is that it? Instead you wanted someone else, someone whose name you already knew.

Right now we have 12 guys signed to guaranteed contracts for just under $124m. Admiral & Robinson aren't signed. Lets assume them in: that's 14 guaranteed contracts (Robinson will only be partially guaranteed) & $126m. McRae, Phillip & Jones are unaccounted for as yet.

Dat, nate & I would have signed Jake Layman & simply eaten Howard's contract instead of acquiring Miles. That puts about $1m higher in salary. Would we have become "competitive" with Layman instead of Miles? We'd also have signed Noah Vonleh instead of trading for Bertans.

I prefer both those moves, obviously. But, I don't know that Layman was interested in coming here. & I don't know whether he'll continue to play better than he ever has (which is what he did last season). & I don't know whether Vonleh wanted to come here either. He signed with Minny -- as did Layman.

So... once again -- what's your beef? That we signed Ish Smith? If we hadn't signed him we could have "at least tried" to be "competitive this year?" Is that it?

How?

Not to challenge either of you, but why don't you go into our "GM for a day" thread & describe the way you'd have handled the off season? It's fantasy but it's fun. Will you be able to do a better job than Tommy Sheppard? TBH, I wonder whether any of us who tried really were better than him -- or would be in the real world where you can't make a move happen simply by writing down a description of it!

I can live with the Sato for Ish transaction because of the picks. And while I'm annoyed at the Dwight for Miles trade, it's got no real long term ramifications so I can get over it.

Missing out on Vonleh is my biggest gripe. He signed in Minny for just 1 year, $2M. Surely, he would have accepted a 2/$7M or 3/$12M with us. We desperately need a defensive big and we have 20 minutes a night available at backup center, plus a few extra minutes at backup PF if we decide to play Rui at SF. It seemed like a perfect fit to address an immediate need and a long term one, all at a very cheap price. Bryant and Vonleh could combine to competently play maybe 22% of the total team minutes available for only 10% of the salary cap.
DCZards
RealGM
Posts: 10,003
And1: 3,974
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Location: The Streets of DC
     

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#68 » by DCZards » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:34 pm

nate33 wrote:
DCZards wrote:It wouldn't surprise me to see both Hachimura and Brown in the starting lineup with Bertans coming off the bench.

That would surprise me. First of all, Bertans is pretty good. Secondly, he has a game that is dependent on other guys setting him up, and the two best guys to do that are Ish and Beal, so it makes sense to start him. Also, his floor stretching game is ideal to create space for the Beal/Bryant or Ish/Bryant pick-and-roll.

Hachimura looks like he has the makings of a primary scorer, but he's not yet able to do it against first rate defenders. He seems perfect as the offensive focal point of the second unit.


Valid points…especially the part about Rui being the primary scorer on the second unit.

I guess you have to weigh that benefit against the benefit of starting Rui at PF from the outset so that he can grow comfortable in that role and playing next to Bryant. The Zards future frontline is Bryant-Hamichura. So it makes some sense to begin their development as a frontcourt unit now, especially given the low expectations for the upcoming season.
Ruzious
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 47,909
And1: 11,579
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#69 » by Ruzious » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:36 pm

nate33 wrote:
DCZards wrote:It wouldn't surprise me to see both Hachimura and Brown in the starting lineup with Bertans coming off the bench.

That would surprise me. First of all, Bertans is pretty good. Secondly, he has a game that is dependent on other guys setting him up, and the two best guys to do that are Ish and Beal, so it makes sense to start him. Also, his floor stretching game is ideal to create space for the Beal/Bryant or Ish/Bryant pick-and-roll.

Hachimura looks like he has the makings of a primary scorer, but he's not yet able to do it against first rate defenders. He seems perfect as the offensive focal point of the second unit.

And I got the impression - which could be wrong - that they want to put out a starting 5 that can all hit 3's with reasonable regularity. That would give Thomas an edge over Ish, as Thomas is a lifetime 36% shooter on 3's vs Ish's 30.6%.
"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 67,033
And1: 19,354
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#70 » by nate33 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:57 pm

Ruzious wrote:
nate33 wrote:
DCZards wrote:It wouldn't surprise me to see both Hachimura and Brown in the starting lineup with Bertans coming off the bench.

That would surprise me. First of all, Bertans is pretty good. Secondly, he has a game that is dependent on other guys setting him up, and the two best guys to do that are Ish and Beal, so it makes sense to start him. Also, his floor stretching game is ideal to create space for the Beal/Bryant or Ish/Bryant pick-and-roll.

Hachimura looks like he has the makings of a primary scorer, but he's not yet able to do it against first rate defenders. He seems perfect as the offensive focal point of the second unit.

And I got the impression - which could be wrong - that they want to put out a starting 5 that can all hit 3's with reasonable regularity. That would give Thomas an edge over Ish, as Thomas is a lifetime 36% shooter on 3's vs Ish's 30.6%.

Thomas might end up starting, or he might end up 3rd in the rotation behind Justin Robinson. I have no idea what he is capable of. It really depends on whether he can regain his pre-injury form. Pre-injury IT would be a starter and an All-NBA candidate. Post injury IT hasn't even been rotation worthy in two years. It's also notable that he shot just 27% from 3P range last year and 29% the year prior.
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 21,958
And1: 7,874
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#71 » by payitforward » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:59 pm

nate33 wrote:...Missing out on Vonleh is my biggest gripe. He signed in Minny for just 1 year, $2M. Surely, he would have accepted a 2/$7M or 3/$12M with us. We desperately need a defensive big and we have 20 minutes a night available at backup center, plus a few extra minutes at backup PF if we decide to play Rui at SF. It seemed like a perfect fit to address an immediate need and a long term one, all at a very cheap price. Bryant and Vonleh could combine to competently play maybe 22% of the total team minutes available for only 10% of the salary cap.

I totally agree -- I would have loved Vonleh here. But I'm not sure you're right about the economic motivation. I.e. to equal $7m in 2 years, he'll have to earn $5m next season. Anything more is gravy. & $5m isn't much of a reach if he has a 2d good season in a row.

I'm sure he & his agent talked about the issue. Maybe it's like a mini version of Jabari's situation.

But my basic point is a little different: we are just not in a position to know why Tommy didn't get Vonleh. Or Layman. Maybe agents are a little wary of the Wizards right now. Combine that with the fact that we really didn't have much $$ to work with, & that may suffice to explain some things.

To me, the question is whether the deals Tommy did make look good on their own. The Sato trade does (all the moreso if Satoransky didn't want to return to the Wizards), the Lakers trade does, buying a R2 pick does, the maneuvering to get a guy undrafted, who (it seems) would have gone in R2 if his agent hadn't discouraged teams, also does. The Bertans trade does too.

I didn't like the Hachimura pick -- but even in that case the issues behind the decision aren't altogether transparent (did Ted oppose trading down? Did he specifically want a guy with marketable characteristics given recent Wizards history? Who knows?).

To me, the single most important unacknowledged element of the Wizards situation is that we will have to pay for all the mistakes Ernie made. There's no way to slip past them. Tommy may turn out to be a mediocre executive. But we entered this off season with few resources to use. For starters, we had $60m of dead weight salary for the coming season. We were shy a significant number of draft picks for the next few years (really regrettable when your team is bad, meaning those R2 picks would be high!), etc. No need to rehearse what we all already know. He's done a lot to rectify some of these problems.
Breaking News: In a shocking development, Wizards owner Ted Leonsis has sold the NBA franchise to a consortium of participants in a discussion board devoted to the team on realgm.com. Details to follow....
queridiculo
RealGM
Posts: 17,705
And1: 9,055
Joined: Mar 29, 2005
Location: So long Wizturdz.
   

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#72 » by queridiculo » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:34 pm

payitforward, sometimes I wonder if you even bother to read peoples posts before you go of on your rants.
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 21,958
And1: 7,874
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#73 » by payitforward » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:55 pm

queridiculo wrote:payitforward, sometimes I wonder if you even bother to read peoples posts before you go of on your rants.

Sometimes, yes, I do.

But, this time I think I expressed myself too forcefully -- or, more accurately, I was really responding not just to you but to the sum of a bunch of criticisms that seem to me don't take reality into account. & I took that out on you!

You have my apologies -- I'll be more careful next time. Peace!
Breaking News: In a shocking development, Wizards owner Ted Leonsis has sold the NBA franchise to a consortium of participants in a discussion board devoted to the team on realgm.com. Details to follow....
DCZards
RealGM
Posts: 10,003
And1: 3,974
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Location: The Streets of DC
     

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#74 » by DCZards » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:56 pm

nate33 wrote:Thomas might end up starting, or he might end up 3rd in the rotation behind Justin Robinson. I have no idea what he is capable of. It really depends on whether he can regain his pre-injury form. Pre-injury IT would be a starter and an All-NBA candidate. Post injury IT hasn't even been rotation worthy in two years. It's also notable that he shot just 27% from 3P range last year and 29% the year prior.


It’s a big unknown as to how good IT will be. He had hip surgery in March 2018 and sat out most of this past season, and only played a handful of games with the Nuggets.

Now that he’s reportedly fully healthy, I expect IT’s 3pt shooting will get back closer to what it was prior to his hip injury.
User avatar
doclinkin
RealGM
Posts: 13,230
And1: 5,367
Joined: Jul 26, 2004
Location: .wizuds.

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#75 » by doclinkin » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:58 pm

Dat2U wrote:... Hachimura at the 3 is probably not realistic. Sure, the team can call him a 3/4 but if you've watched him it's clear he's not a polished perimeter player. You generally want to put players in the best position to succeed. For him, I believe that's going to be at the 4 spot.


The cliche is “you are who you guard”. But given that we likely don’t guard much of anybody. What does it matter? :clown:

Offensively he fits fine next to the stretch Bigs we have. Or Bertans anyway , since Wagner seems like he may be a lost cause.
JAR69
Senior
Posts: 671
And1: 224
Joined: Jul 25, 2002
   

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#76 » by JAR69 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:43 pm

nate33 wrote:
payitforward wrote:
queridiculo wrote:
I'm so/so on the moves Sheppard did in the draft and I like the transactions he made to replenish the Wizards 2nd rounders.

I'm also willing to give him credit for the Bertans signing, basically got a rotation player that can shoot for free.

Now where I'm really disappointed is where the Wizards are from a competitive standpoint.

I'm willing to concede that the Wizards don't have much of a chance of being competitive this year, however, to me that doesn't mean that the Wizards shouldn't at least try.

Going into the offseason Washington essentially had two positions settled, SG and C and gaping holes everywhere else.

What the Wizards needed was rebounding and defense and they had the full MLE at their disposal along with their BAE and they might still get the DPE.

Sheppard's answer, Ish Smith.

I have no problem with this signing in isolation and if this had been a S&T of sorts fine, to bust our MLE on a player that doesn't help the areas of need in the slightest is unforgivable.

Zero vision, zero identity for this group that was assembled.

Rondae-Hollis Jefferson went to Toronto on a minimum deal, you're telling me the Wizards couldn't have done better?

RHJ is not much of a shooter but he would have given us some much needed defense and rebounding and with him in the fold the CJ Miles trade actually would have made some sense.

I give up... really.

We came into this season with Beal, Wall, Mahinmi, Howard & Brown Jr. signed for just under $90m. That's $19m shy of the cap with 5 players -- of whom we would want/be able to play two this year. In essence, in other words, we had two players.

We re-signed Bryant. We drafted Rui Hachimura. Now we have 4 players, & we are $7m shy of the cap.

Exactly what is the way to "try" to be competitive? Re: Miles -- don't you think Tommy called every contact he has in the league, i.e. everyone, to see whether anyone wanted to take Howard off his hands? & took the best deal he could get? Of course he did! You think he needs you to tell him to do that?

Now we still have 4 players who can take the floor, but now we are $3.5m shy of the cap. Ah, but we'd bought a R2 pick & nabbed Admiral. Figure he'll cost something like $1m this year. Did you not want to do that? How about Robinson? Figure almost another $1m. Not a good idea either? Why didn't we get Paul George instead, so we could be "competitive?"

Well, those guys were cheap; that helps. Now we have 6 guys who can play, and wow we still have $1.5m in cap room.

Nothing to dislike so far, right? How about the Lakers deal -- cost us nothing & brought us 3 maybe 4 players -- including Mo Wagner whom you wanted to draft in R1 last year -- plus a R2 pick.

So, what's the problem? You didn't like the trade for Bertans? Is that it? Instead you wanted someone else, someone whose name you already knew.

Right now we have 12 guys signed to guaranteed contracts for just under $124m. Admiral & Robinson aren't signed. Lets assume them in: that's 14 guaranteed contracts (Robinson will only be partially guaranteed) & $126m. McRae, Phillip & Jones are unaccounted for as yet.

Dat, nate & I would have signed Jake Layman & simply eaten Howard's contract instead of acquiring Miles. That puts about $1m higher in salary. Would we have become "competitive" with Layman instead of Miles? We'd also have signed Noah Vonleh instead of trading for Bertans.

I prefer both those moves, obviously. But, I don't know that Layman was interested in coming here. & I don't know whether he'll continue to play better than he ever has (which is what he did last season). & I don't know whether Vonleh wanted to come here either. He signed with Minny -- as did Layman.

So... once again -- what's your beef? That we signed Ish Smith? If we hadn't signed him we could have "at least tried" to be "competitive this year?" Is that it?

How?

Not to challenge either of you, but why don't you go into our "GM for a day" thread & describe the way you'd have handled the off season? It's fantasy but it's fun. Will you be able to do a better job than Tommy Sheppard? TBH, I wonder whether any of us who tried really were better than him -- or would be in the real world where you can't make a move happen simply by writing down a description of it!

I can live with the Sato for Ish transaction because of the picks. And while I'm annoyed at the Dwight for Miles trade, it's got no real long term ramifications so I can get over it.

Missing out on Vonleh is my biggest gripe. He signed in Minny for just 1 year, $2M. Surely, he would have accepted a 2/$7M or 3/$12M with us. We desperately need a defensive big and we have 20 minutes a night available at backup center, plus a few extra minutes at backup PF if we decide to play Rui at SF. It seemed like a perfect fit to address an immediate need and a long term one, all at a very cheap price. Bryant and Vonleh could combine to competently play maybe 22% of the total team minutes available for only 10% of the salary cap.


And the IU Hoosier fans would have been doubly happy.
"It takes talent, strategy and millions of dollars to compete in the N.B.A. But regret is the league’s greatest currency." - Howard Beck
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 67,033
And1: 19,354
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#77 » by nate33 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:49 pm

payitforward wrote:I totally agree -- I would have loved Vonleh here. But I'm not sure you're right about the economic motivation. I.e. to equal $7m in 2 years, he'll have to earn $5m next season. Anything more is gravy. & $5m isn't much of a reach if he has a 2d good season in a row.

I'm aware that the purpose of his 1-year deal is the assumption that he can perform well enough to earn a big raise, but $5M is a reach. Sure, it's possible that he could earn more, but it's not likely. Not in a market when bigs are being devalued. He could just as easily disappoint and be worth only a vet minimum contract.

I'm removing all injury risk and guaranteeing him a second year at 250% of what he is willing to earn on Year 1. I think that's an extremely fair offer.
Dat2U
RealGM
Posts: 23,520
And1: 7,097
Joined: Jun 23, 2001
Location: Columbus, OH
       

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#78 » by Dat2U » Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:15 pm

doclinkin wrote:
Dat2U wrote:... Hachimura at the 3 is probably not realistic. Sure, the team can call him a 3/4 but if you've watched him it's clear he's not a polished perimeter player. You generally want to put players in the best position to succeed. For him, I believe that's going to be at the 4 spot.


The cliche is “you are who you guard”. But given that we likely don’t guard much of anybody. What does it matter? :clown:

Offensively he fits fine next to the stretch Bigs we have. Or Bertans anyway , since Wagner seems like he may be a lost cause.


Yeah there won't be much guarding and offensively he may fit but defensively on the perimeter? From what I've seen thus far, I'd be very skeptical. Now can he fit in a lineup where Bertans guards 3s? Probably as Bertans has some experience at doing that.
Dat2U
RealGM
Posts: 23,520
And1: 7,097
Joined: Jun 23, 2001
Location: Columbus, OH
       

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#79 » by Dat2U » Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:22 pm

DCZards wrote:
nate33 wrote:Thomas might end up starting, or he might end up 3rd in the rotation behind Justin Robinson. I have no idea what he is capable of. It really depends on whether he can regain his pre-injury form. Pre-injury IT would be a starter and an All-NBA candidate. Post injury IT hasn't even been rotation worthy in two years. It's also notable that he shot just 27% from 3P range last year and 29% the year prior.


It’s a big unknown as to how good IT will be. He had hip surgery in March 2018 and sat out most of this past season, and only played a handful of games with the Nuggets.

Now that he’s reportedly fully healthy, I expect IT’s 3pt shooting will get back closer to what it was prior to his hip injury.


Yeah everyone is completely clueless to what IT will do in the NBA at 30 yrs old with a bad hip and being only 5-9. :-?

Maybe he'll re-live 2016-17 all over again and carry us in the playoffs. :D
User avatar
Mojo Amok
Pro Prospect
Posts: 960
And1: 834
Joined: Jan 28, 2017
 

Re: Wizards 2019 Offseason Thread - Part 2 

Post#80 » by Mojo Amok » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:35 pm

Wrong thread...

Return to Washington Wizards