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2020 Draft

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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1021 » by youngWizzy » Sun Jun 21, 2020 12:24 am

AdonalFoyle4Prez wrote:Wiggins + Looney + Paschal + 2020 Top 3 1st Round Pick for Bradley Beal + 2021 Future First Round Pick (Protected)?


This makes 0 sense.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1022 » by Ruzious » Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:21 am

youngWizzy wrote:
AdonalFoyle4Prez wrote:Wiggins + Looney + Paschal + 2020 Top 3 1st Round Pick for Bradley Beal + 2021 Future First Round Pick (Protected)?


This makes 0 sense.

I think Wiggins is better than given credit for, but I totally agree - that's a really bad trade.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1023 » by Ruzious » Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:28 am

SUPERBALLMAN wrote:I think the 3 guys I have at the top of my list for our pick is 1.Okongwu 2.Jalen Smith 3.Okoro.



Okongwu yes, but he won't be there unless we get lucky in the lotto.

Stix - only if we trade down. He might slide quite a bit. Why pick him at 9 when he might slide past 20.

Okoro - just say no to wings who can't shoot. Look at him when it's time for his 2nd contract.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1024 » by AdonalFoyle4Prez » Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:28 am

youngWizzy wrote:
AdonalFoyle4Prez wrote:Wiggins + Looney + Paschal + 2020 Top 3 1st Round Pick for Bradley Beal + 2021 Future First Round Pick (Protected)?


This makes 0 sense.


Just getting feelers for reactions and opinions; We don't need or want Bradley.

But, this trade, Wizards get Wiggins (Despite his atrocious contract) who's an instant offense guy, along with Paschal AND receive Warriors' 2020 Top 3 pick (You guys could land Anthony Edwards or Wiseman) without losing their 2020 9th pick (Maybe draft a SF/PF in Patrick Williams or Okoro Isaac, if they're there?).

PG-Wall
SG-Edwards
SF-Wiggins/William or Okoro
PF-Hachimura/Paschal
C-Mahinmi/Bryant

Losing Beal will hurt, but I'd say you guys aren't in contention for a championship, anyways. However, I'd say you guys are heading in the right direction with this.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1025 » by SUPERBALLMAN » Sun Jun 21, 2020 2:32 am

Ruzious wrote:
SUPERBALLMAN wrote:I think the 3 guys I have at the top of my list for our pick is 1.Okongwu 2.Jalen Smith 3.Okoro.



Okongwu yes, but he won't be there unless we get lucky in the lotto.

Stix - only if we trade down. He might slide quite a bit. Why pick him at 9 when he might slide past 20.

Okoro - just say no to wings who can't shoot. Look at him when it's time for his 2nd contract.



You can say Stix is going to drop, but it just takes one team to like him and he will be gone. How can you not like a guy with size, length, can shoot, can run, can defend, has athleticism and intelligence, and has great work ethic?

And Okoro strikes me as a guy you tell him he needs to improve his shooting and he will improve his shooting. We have guys who can shoot, but he has what we lack which is defense, athleticism, and toughness. He has the intangibles. Ask his coaches what he brings to their team and ask them if they want him on their team!
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1026 » by payitforward » Sun Jun 21, 2020 2:46 am

Ruzious wrote:And as we know, every team goes by "the chart" and is always willing to make any trade that shows equal value. It's as easy as pushing a button.

There is no need to push any buttons, Ruz. My new, IOS-compatible Treydoun app makes that unnecessary.

Here's how it works: there's a capacitative, touch-sensitive slider, & as you move it up & down all the picks available for any position of the slider appear on your Treydoun screen.

Although Treydoun was just released -- earlier today, in fact -- 7 of the 30 NBA GMs already have been fired by teams preferring to use my device. Not only that, but the current introductory special includes a free USB microphone, enabling one to easily podcast support for this new path.

Right now, as I type this announcement, we are working with a consortium of player agents to schedule installation of sub-dermal chips that will enable real-time communication between a player's results (including pick-up games, horse contests, etc.) & Treydoun. In this way, you will always have the latest information at your tingerfips.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1027 » by payitforward » Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:08 am

gesa2 wrote:PIF you make this comparison a lot and I think it isn't a fair one. If we trade pick 9 for 17 and 30, we dont get to wait and see how all of the picks after 17 develop, we have to make a discrete pick and live with the consequences. So you have to compare a given pick at 9 with either a given pick at 17 and 30 chosen at the time not with hindsight, or you have to use average value for those picks.

I wouldn't make that particular trade, but that's not really your point.

You are absolutely right: in fact, to support, say, my suggestion last year that we trade down from #9 to #20 & #22 (assuming the team with those picks wanted to trade up), I had to list who I would take with those picks -- could be a short list or a long one. & then, of course, there'd have to be 2 names from my list who were actually available when that pick came up. Thus, last year, I said I'd take Brandon Clarke at #20 if he was there (he was) & Thybulle at #22 if he'd been there or Keldon Johnson if he hadn't been there.

You are also right that whatever pick you make -- #9, or #17 or #30, or any other pick -- you make it before you know how it will work out. Chance is a big factor. Thus, all we can do is look at history to see what results have been over time. Thus, when you look back at guys picked #9 over the last 15 years, & you see that the pick doesn't yield an especially good player even 30% of the time, you understand that you aren't taking much of a risk trading down.

The fact that there are virtually always players available later in the draft, several of them, who are better than the guy who goes #9 does tell you something valuable, however. It tells you that multiple picks increase your chances of getting a good one -- just the way multiple flips of a coin increase your chance of getting "heads" one time.

IOW, nothing is fool-proof. One way is just a bit better overall than the other.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1028 » by payitforward » Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:26 am

Endless Loop wrote:Just talking math, it is ALWAYS true that the guy taken #9 SHOULD be better than any player available after him....

This has nothing whatever to do with math, & you also say it backwards. What is true is that you should take the best player available at #9 (or at #59 for that matter!).

Endless Loop wrote:The issue is that it's difficult to know who that guy is....

Look... if you examine the past, you discover that it is IMPOSSIBLE, not difficult, "to know who that guy is."

Endless Loop wrote:The focus should just be on picking that best player....

Well, duh. That should be -- AND IS -- the focus of every Front Office of every team in the league. Do you really think they don't "focus?"

Endless Loop wrote:If this were a numbers game, then it would make sense to say, well, since I can't know who will be the best, I might as well grab a bunch of picks. That way I have more shots in the lottery. But the numbers game approach is definitely not right, because-
1. Surely it's obvious that some players are going to be less successful than others. So it's not a true lottery.
2. Getting two picks instead of one isn't very good diversification anyway.
3. If you trade back because you THINK somebody will be available later, then you're gambling on the idea that other GMs either are dumber than you or that you have better information. I don't think that's a smart gamble. ...

First two points are incorrect. Third is correct -- for absolutely any pick. I.e. it has nothing to do with trading down or not trading down.

Endless Loop wrote:In the NBA quality wins over quantity. A higher draft pick means a better chance for higher quality. I'd almost always not trade down.

Edit for clarity:

1. Since every team in every single team sport puts the same number of players on the field, court, etc. as its opponent, quality always wins over quantity. Nothing to do with basketball as opposed to any other sport.

2. No, a higher draft pick doesn't give you "a better chance for higher quality." Not after picks 1-3 in any case. Above all -- & this is the key point -- 1 "high" pick gives you less of a chance at "higher quality" than 2 lower picks. Not more of a chance but less of a chance.

Finally -- the strength of a basketball team is in its entire roster. "Quantity" comes in not in the choice of any particular player but in the fact that you need depth. & you also need trade assets.

In other words, the goal is to increase the quantity of higher quality players.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1029 » by youngWizzy » Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:55 pm

Depending on how far he falls, I think Lamine Diane (https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/lamine-diane-1.html) could be the steal of the draft. The skills are there and he is still relatively young (turning 23 in November). He was very productive but played in a weak conference. Again, the skills are there and I wouldn't mind taking a productive player with our r2 pick if he's available.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1030 » by payitforward » Mon Jun 22, 2020 12:57 pm

Ordinarily, we'd be on our 2d-3d day of discussing what we did in the draft & what other teams did as well....

Damn... what an awful year...!
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1031 » by Ruzious » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:53 pm

payitforward wrote:Ordinarily, we'd be on our 2d-3d day of discussing what we did in the draft & what other teams did as well....

Damn... what an awful year...!

Well, we can always blast the Knicks in advance. Actually, with them drafting a few picks ahead of us, them screwing up could end up pushing someone like Haliburton to us. Thank you, in advance, to the Knicks!
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1032 » by Ruzious » Mon Jun 22, 2020 3:35 pm

And Bertans sitting out the rest of the season, certainly helps the Wiz chances of not falling in the draft.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1033 » by payitforward » Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:41 am

Agreed on both counts. & if Haliburton is there, I'd be happy to snap him up. Ditto Okongwu. Otherwise... trade down if a good deal is available.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1034 » by Shoe » Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:59 pm

What are we thinking of Avdija. He's got the size and ball skills but I'm not seeing explosive athleticism. He's kind of a Bonga type wing.

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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1035 » by payitforward » Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:34 am

Hey younwizzy -- have you seen this? https://therookiewire.usatoday.com/lists/2020-nba-mock-draft-all-60-picks-latest-intel-prospects/

Scroll down to pick #24 -- you're famous!!
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1036 » by youngWizzy » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:08 am

payitforward wrote:Hey younwizzy -- have you seen this? https://therookiewire.usatoday.com/lists/2020-nba-mock-draft-all-60-picks-latest-intel-prospects/

Scroll down to pick #24 -- you're famous!!


I did :lol: and it made my day when I saw it! Also from the same author (https://hoopshype.com/2020/06/04/cole-anthony-coby-white-north-carolina-tar-heels-nba-mock-draft/)

If you have TheAthletic subscription I got featured here (https://theathletic.com/1835049/2020/06/09/draft-profiles-6-wings-the-raptors-could-select-with-the-no-28-pick/) and a few other articles by Blake Murphy who covers the Raptors for TheAthletic!!

Also I was featured here on an article by Kyle Boone (https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-draft-pro-comparisons-for-every-lottery-prospect-in-this-years-class/) which was awesome!

I'd say I'm honored but I got a lot of work to do but we'll see where this takes me!
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1037 » by Jimmy Recard » Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:29 am

Ruzious wrote:
payitforward wrote:Ordinarily, we'd be on our 2d-3d day of discussing what we did in the draft & what other teams did as well....

Damn... what an awful year...!

Well, we can always blast the Knicks in advance. Actually, with them drafting a few picks ahead of us, them screwing up could end up pushing someone like Haliburton to us. Thank you, in advance, to the Knicks!

Knicks gonna Knick but I just don’t see Haliburton or Okongwu falling past the first 8 picks. I wonder if any team ahead of us would bite on a pick swap + Thomas Bryant. I would do it to get Okongwu in a heartbeat.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1038 » by payitforward » Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:49 am

Jimmy Recard wrote:...I just don’t see Haliburton or Okongwu falling past the first 8 picks. I wonder if any team ahead of us would bite on a pick swap + Thomas Bryant. I would do it to get Okongwu in a heartbeat.

You'd be willing to swap the #9 plus Bryant for... what pick?

I keep being amazed at the way people undervalue Thomas Bryant. What was the last guy picked #9 in the draft who has played as well as Bryant?

Rui? No, sorry, not exactly -- or even close! Kevin Knox? Jakob Poeltl? Dennis Smith? Frank Kaminsky? Noah Vonleh? Trey Burke?

You have to go back to Kemba Walker in 2011, Gordon Hayward the year before that, & DeRozan in '09.

Don't get me wrong: I like Okongwu; Haliburton too....
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1039 » by Ruzious » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:38 pm

youngWizzy wrote:
payitforward wrote:Hey younwizzy -- have you seen this? https://therookiewire.usatoday.com/lists/2020-nba-mock-draft-all-60-picks-latest-intel-prospects/

Scroll down to pick #24 -- you're famous!!


I did :lol: and it made my day when I saw it! Also from the same author (https://hoopshype.com/2020/06/04/cole-anthony-coby-white-north-carolina-tar-heels-nba-mock-draft/)

If you have TheAthletic subscription I got featured here (https://theathletic.com/1835049/2020/06/09/draft-profiles-6-wings-the-raptors-could-select-with-the-no-28-pick/) and a few other articles by Blake Murphy who covers the Raptors for TheAthletic!!

Also I was featured here on an article by Kyle Boone (https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-draft-pro-comparisons-for-every-lottery-prospect-in-this-years-class/) which was awesome!

I'd say I'm honored but I got a lot of work to do but we'll see where this takes me!

Wow, way to go. Keep doing your stuff and making those network connections.
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Re: 2020 Draft 

Post#1040 » by Ruzious » Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:34 pm

Draft trade question for Pif or anyone else (or I could shorten it to just say draft trade question... nah), If the Bucks offer the Indiana pick (18 or 19?) and their 1st rounders for both 2021 and 2023 (realizing they're going to be late 1sts unless Giannis leaves), do you do it?

My thinking for the Bucks is - they do this if Haliburton's there. He's a perfect fit for them because he's a low usage phenom. He's basically a young George Hill, and Hill's fit in there wonderfully, but he's old. And a move like that is probably something Giannis would approve of - making him more likely to stay - which is THE key to their franchise. Also, they can buy 2nd round picks - probably less than 10 spots down from what would have been their 1st rounders. And having Hali on a rookie contract helps them in avoiding the lux tax.

But what about the Wiz? They already have Wall and Beal and Ish and Napier and Jerome Robinson and Mathews - not to mention Troy Brown possibly moving to guard at some point. We gots guards.
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