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NatP4 wrote:Looking good, I expect Rui to be a good 3pt shooter and overall efficient scorer, but I know he can rebound better than he showed in his first season, and that’s what will make or break his NBA career, along with becoming a passable team defender.

I’m not sure if it’s worth nothing, but his post all star net rating went from a -10.0 to a -5.4. His defensive rating dropped from a 119.9 to a 119.9. As others have noted, he shot 37.5% from 3 after the all star break.

Rebounding is the issue still.

If the 3pt shot happens and his defensive awareness becomes average, I think we have a solid 3rd banana with him.

This may be controversial to some, but I believe he is quite complementary to Deni Avdija, so the two could be a good 3/4 combo for the future

There was a season in which Markieff Morris actually played good defense and was efficient in scoring. I think it was 2017-2018. That is what my hope is for Rui as a player. Morris was a decent threat to create offense for himself and guard guys 1on1 and switch everything defensively. He also shot the 3 at a decent clip, I think something like 36-37%. Still didn’t rebound IIRC, but he became a net positive player for us until Brooks decided he was a small ball 5 for some reason.

NatP4 wrote:Looking good, I expect Rui to be a good 3pt shooter and overall efficient scorer, but I know he can rebound better than he showed in his first season, and that’s what will make or break his NBA career, along with becoming a passable team defender.

I’m not sure if it’s worth nothing, but his post all star net rating went from a -10.0 to a -5.4. His defensive rating dropped from a 119.9 to a 119.9. As others have noted, he shot 37.5% from 3 after the all star break.

Rebounding is the issue still.

I think rebounding will always be an issue. Rebounding is instinct and prediction and effort as much as it is size and strength. Rebounding begins before the ball goes up, getting to position and boxing out, then knowing the likely trajectory of the bounce to get there before anyone. There's skill there, dirty tricks and leverage. Many of the best rebounders play the old man below the rim game, foot work and establishing position and bulldozing you out of the way. Played with a low center of gravity not above the rim, especially on defensive boards. Rui is new to the game and I get the sense he has tunnel vision on the few things he does well. The impression he gives me on rebounding is that he doesn't instinctively feel the ball belongs to him, doesn't need to fight for it, he is acting out the performance of basketball. The best rebounders do so as if it is desperate, digging out 50/50 balls and moving people out of the way to collect their ball, diving to save a ball to a teammate, rebounding out of their area. Its the way they are going to stay on court in the 'I got next' playground game. Or not get benched in college. It requires that competitive drive. Mine mine mine mine mine. Rui by contrast is late to the game, and learned by watching highlight tapes. Of Carmelo. In FIBA competition.

Similarly on court he watches to see what is going to happen, then reacts afterwards. He is big and strong, his fundamentals can improve, but rebounding may simply be one of those things he doesn't quite commit to the way the true boardsmen do. I wish he had a role model on the bench to beat up on him in practice. He doesn't seem to avoid contact, you just can't practice rebounding by yourself, it is a game skill. We will see, but I wish we had a tough smart big man coach who could challenge and teach him.

Can someone explain to me how defensive rating is calculated. People throw it around like it's actually indicative of something, but the last I read about analytics and defense is that quantifying a player's defensive impact into a stat is very hard to do.

Man... I understand he may never be more than an average rebounder and defender (I actually think he'll be a better man defender than team defender)... But as a pure scorer I see something special.
I know this is clearly 3/4 speed, but you can see the better arc on his shot in the video below from a couple days ago.

DCZards wrote:

prime1time wrote:Yup, there's actually a longer video. He won some he lost some. Pritchard is talented. I think Rui is a 4 tbh. And I'm very concerned about Rui's defense

If you’re looking for defense you ain’t gonna find it here. No one is playing D in this video.

They don't pay you to play defense on a video, Zards.

pcbothwel wrote:Man... I understand he may never be more than an average rebounder and defender (I actually think he'll be a better man defender than team defender)... But as a pure scorer I see something special.
I know this is clearly 3/4 speed, but you can see the better arc on his shot in the video below from a couple days ago.

Watch on YouTube

Bonga and Hachimura both look considerably bigger than last year. Hachimura in particular is a beast physically. I hope that translates into more rebounds.

I wrote about it in a post early on but strength is an important physical attribute. Hopefully we see Rui in the post vs smaller guards and wings more.

I hate that big guard camp. Players don't learn nothing there. Defense is completely non-existent.

TGW wrote:I hate that big guard camp. Players don't learn nothing there. Defense is completely non-existent.

How do you know that? Have you attended the camp?

TGW wrote:I hate that big guard camp. Players don't learn nothing there. Defense is completely non-existent.

No one plays defense in any pickup games. Trying to prevent injuries. They just use it to work on new offenses moves/skills.

DCZards wrote:

TGW wrote:I hate that big guard camp. Players don't learn nothing there. Defense is completely non-existent.

How do you know that? Have you attended the camp?

I've seen the videos. It's just unstructured pickup games mixed with some basic drillwork. Everyone is just standing around playing one on one. It's not constructive IMO.

I'd rather see Rui at a big man's camp. Not this...this is a waste of time.

Agreed on Big Man camp. That is where his skills are most deficient. Apparently Rick Mahorn runs a program. That'd be a good model to learn from.

TGW wrote:

DCZards wrote:

TGW wrote:I hate that big guard camp. Players don't learn nothing there. Defense is completely non-existent.

How do you know that? Have you attended the camp?

I've seen the videos. It's just unstructured pickup games mixed with some basic drillwork. Everyone is just standing around playing one on one. It's not constructive IMO.

I'd rather see Rui at a big man's camp. Not this...this is a waste of time.

You know as well as I do that a few short videos don't tell the whole story.

Personally, I think Rui learning some of the skills stressed at the Big Guard Camp, such as ball handling and outside shooting, is a good thing.

Shooting and ballhandling are things you can work on in an empty gym by yourself. One of my older cousins played for Coach Wooten back in the G, and the least he expected out of his guys when they came back to school from summer break was a jumpshot and handles.

Do these for 2 hours a day and you'll have crispy handles...no need for a "big guard" camp:

Rui should just invest in one of these:

Larry Hughes invested in that shooting machine and his shooting got way better after the fact.

The only thing I see being reinforced in those pickups are the bad contested midrange shots that Rui took his rookie season.

;t=552s&ab_channel=HoopDistrict
At 20:40 answering Glenn Consor's question, Rui says that he is now 240. He carries it well. I’m going to hold off final judgment for when we see him switch on to smaller guards. But 240 pounds of muscle will help finish through contact and bang in the low post.

Btw, Rui was a popular pick in RealGM outside of this forum. Even though he was a high pick, a lot of posters picked him to be the steal of the 2019 draft. viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1873398

Ruzious wrote:Btw, Rui was a popular pick in RealGM outside of this forum. Even though he was a high pick, a lot of posters picked him to be the steal of the 2019 draft. viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1873398

Interesting stuff. Some good posts by Illmatic in there. I’m curious how posters like PIF would evaluate Rui if he was a 3 instead of a 4. How does he stack up against other 3s? His rebounding would become a strength. If we had him on the wing guarding perimeter players instead of a big man role in which he has to be a better help defender and contest shots at the rim.

I have questions about Rui as a prospect but I have always believed he would develop into a lights out scorer once the 3 ball progresses. Last year per36 he put up 16-7-2 on .535, which would be a solid rookie season for a wing player. I don’t think he would have any issues sliding his feet and defending wings.

Adding Deni as a core piece and starter could also make this irrelevant. They are pretty interchangeable at the 3/4 positions. Deni projects to be a solid rebounder as a 3, maybe average to below average as a 4.

Ruzious wrote:Btw, Rui was a popular pick in RealGM outside of this forum. Even though he was a high pick, a lot of posters picked him to be the steal of the 2019 draft. viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1873398

I think the biggest issue analytics folks have on this guy is that they see his age, where he's at stats wise and they call him a bust. Rui just started playing basketball yesterday (not really). He didn't go the AAU route, didn't play at a Blue Blood college so all the metrics you look for aren't there.

I look at that 2019 draft, and where would Rui go in a re-draft? 4th? 5th? He's at least a top 5 pick if you re-did it.

Like people have already said the form looks better. But it’s time to move conversations about his three-point shooting ability. Coach Brooks talked about during his press conference but Rui has to attack teams inside instead of settling for jumpers. If you look through this thread I already talked about his low post skills. He has them. He has the footwork, he just needs to use it. In a league that switches everything, Rui’s strength is a major advantage and he needs to use it to get easy buckets. With a 3-point shot and an increasing proclivity to make teams pay in the low post instead of settling for midrange jumpers, Rui should see a rise in productivity. All in all, I’m happy with the growth we’ve seen. It’s easy to pick apart young players and their flaws which is why conversations about young players need to be centered around growth and improvement. Should we ignore their flaws? No. But they should be put in proper context. The most important thing about a young player isn’t how good he is in the present but rather how good he can become in the future. Too often posters in this forum are blinded by the present and come to conclusions about players solely based on how good they are at that moment. Coming into the league I felt that Rui has a chance to be a very good player and nothing I’ve seen has since then has dissuaded me from that notion.