ImageImageImageImageImage

Rui Hachimura

Moderators: montestewart, nate33, LyricalRico

payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 12,269
And1: 3,838
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#401 » by payitforward » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:44 pm

nate33 wrote:
Kanyewest wrote:Rui Hachimura Full Highlights vs New Zealand - 35 Pts (13/17 FG, 2/2 3PT), 5 Rebs, 3 Asts, 2 Stls in 27 minutes
https://streamable.com/lq9et

Basically, he could score whenever he wanted. Total domination. And that mid range step back is going to be a shot he can get whenever he wants. I'm starting to see the Kawhi Leonard comparison (on offense).

In general, you don't want to base your game on a midrange shot, but if you can hit that shot at a 50% clip when well defended, then that's a whole different story.

He looked great against these guys despite the fact that they were all smaller, slower & less athletic than Rui -- which might have thrown him off, you know! :)

Total population of NZ: 4.8 million. I wonder how Rui would look against a team of the very best amateur basketball players of South Dakota & Idaho. Throw in North Dakota what the heck! :)
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 54,329
And1: 8,508
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#402 » by nate33 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:55 pm

payitforward wrote:
nate33 wrote:
Kanyewest wrote:Rui Hachimura Full Highlights vs New Zealand - 35 Pts (13/17 FG, 2/2 3PT), 5 Rebs, 3 Asts, 2 Stls in 27 minutes
https://streamable.com/lq9et

Basically, he could score whenever he wanted. Total domination. And that mid range step back is going to be a shot he can get whenever he wants. I'm starting to see the Kawhi Leonard comparison (on offense).

In general, you don't want to base your game on a midrange shot, but if you can hit that shot at a 50% clip when well defended, then that's a whole different story.

He looked great against these guys despite the fact that they were all smaller, slower & less athletic than Rui -- which might have thrown him off, you know! :)

No spit, Sherlock.

But dominating a bunch of New Zealanders is better than not dominating a bunch of New Zealanders. It's hard to be much more dominant than scoring 47 points per 36 minutes on an eFG% of 82%.
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 12,269
And1: 3,838
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#403 » by payitforward » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:06 pm

Ferulci wrote:People are forgetting the time where Masai were laughed at for taking Siakam, when some wanted Giannis to be a draft and stash because he only played 2nd division in Greece....

It's true, isn't it? People forget things all the time!

You, for example, are forgetting that your points about Siakam & Giannis are completely irrelevant to Rui.

Ferulci wrote:In the end, you don't draft to get good grades by ESPN or twitter scouts. You draft to get player that will contribute to winning. The higher the pick, the more you should shoot for the stars. I love Keldon Johnson but I can't see a single path to him being an all-star one day. That path exists for Hachimura.

You use the draft to add the maximum player-value to your roster. (Or do you think you draft to add less than the maximum possible player-value? Nah....)

Of course you have to have roster space for the players you take. So, if by "shoot for the stars" you mean make a single lower-likelihood but higher-ceiling prospect, then whether you do that depends on your team, no? It's not a maxim.

Tell me, btw, did you "see a single path to (Siakam) being an all-star?" Now... be real, ok! You didn't? :) So... does that make it more likely that Johnson becomes one?

Ferulci wrote:Was Rui the good choice ? We'll know in 3 years but from a decision-making standpoint, I totally agree with taking him at 9th (I wanted my Bulls to take him at 7th so...).
Best case scenario ? He's a superstar, in the tier just below Zion.
Worst case ? He is a bust and Wizards wasted a 9th pick, which isn't the end of the world. Wizards will suck and get more chances to draft players with high potential next years.

What? Best case he is above Zion. Worst case he's... I've got it -- worst case he's no better than Keldon Johnson.

Plus, best of all!, we get rewarded for wasting a 9th pick. & who could be more familiar than a Wizards fan with the incredible rewards that come to your team for making mistake after mistake after mistake after.... :)

Note: just yanking your chain -- I think Rui Hachimura has a chance to be a pretty good NBA player. That's a start.

Stick around; we'll have fun.
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 12,269
And1: 3,838
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#404 » by payitforward » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:16 pm

nate33 wrote:
payitforward wrote:
nate33 wrote:Basically, he could score whenever he wanted. Total domination. And that mid range step back is going to be a shot he can get whenever he wants. I'm starting to see the Kawhi Leonard comparison (on offense).

In general, you don't want to base your game on a midrange shot, but if you can hit that shot at a 50% clip when well defended, then that's a whole different story.

He looked great against these guys despite the fact that they were all smaller, slower & less athletic than Rui -- which might have thrown him off, you know! :)

No spit, Sherlock.

But dominating a bunch of New Zealanders is better than not dominating a bunch of New Zealanders. It's hard to be much more dominant than scoring 47 points per 36 minutes on an eFG% of 82%.

I should have used green font, sorry! ...that is quite an EFG% I must admit.

I like Rui -- he's long & athletic, he has a bunch of skills already, it sounds like he's very coachable. He has a shot to be quite a good player, & certainly there's no reason to limit his upside only to that.

The argument I make about managing this draft is rather like the one you make about Wall vs. "a couple of very good players." & it's fair to say that much depends on the team -- what is best for a particular team.

Enough said -- I hope the kid is great, & it's nice to see the kinds of performances that make you think he has a chance at that!
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
User avatar
Kanyewest
General Manager
Posts: 7,739
And1: 1,284
Joined: Jul 05, 2004

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#405 » by Kanyewest » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:47 pm

nate33 wrote:
payitforward wrote:
nate33 wrote:Basically, he could score whenever he wanted. Total domination. And that mid range step back is going to be a shot he can get whenever he wants. I'm starting to see the Kawhi Leonard comparison (on offense).

In general, you don't want to base your game on a midrange shot, but if you can hit that shot at a 50% clip when well defended, then that's a whole different story.

He looked great against these guys despite the fact that they were all smaller, slower & less athletic than Rui -- which might have thrown him off, you know! :)

No spit, Sherlock.

But dominating a bunch of New Zealanders is better than not dominating a bunch of New Zealanders. It's hard to be much more dominant than scoring 47 points per 36 minutes on an eFG% of 82%.


Hey he did leave points on the table- Rui was only 7-14 from the free throw line.
Jaekast
Sophomore
Posts: 141
And1: 51
Joined: Jun 26, 2015
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#406 » by Jaekast » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:45 pm

Brandon Clarke woulda had a triple double on those boys. 10/20/20/5.
Jaekast
Sophomore
Posts: 141
And1: 51
Joined: Jun 26, 2015
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#407 » by Jaekast » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:47 pm

Rui may be an allstar one day but Brandon Clarke is well....the greatest basketball player ever. We messed up.
Jaekast
Sophomore
Posts: 141
And1: 51
Joined: Jun 26, 2015
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#408 » by Jaekast » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:48 pm

Can we start a Brandon Clarke shrine inside of this Rui thread?
Jaekast
Sophomore
Posts: 141
And1: 51
Joined: Jun 26, 2015
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#409 » by Jaekast » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:49 pm

What exactly are you paying forward btw?
Jaekast
Sophomore
Posts: 141
And1: 51
Joined: Jun 26, 2015
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#410 » by Jaekast » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:49 pm

Do you attend Wizards home games? Love to pay some stuff forward.
Jaekast
Sophomore
Posts: 141
And1: 51
Joined: Jun 26, 2015
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#411 » by Jaekast » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:52 pm

What exactly are you paying forward btw?
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 12,269
And1: 3,838
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#412 » by payitforward » Tue Aug 13, 2019 9:09 pm

Wow, 6 posts in a row from Jaekast, from whom we'd only seen 129 posts in over 4 years! Keep up the good work!

You're right, Rui might be an all star one day -- I'm sure we both hope so. But, I don't think it's possible that you really mean it when you call Brandon Clarke the greatest basketball player ever.

I used to share a season ticket with a friend -- but these days I live @125 miles from the arena, which makes attending games impractical.

How about you? How many Wiz home games did you attend last year?
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
DCZards
Head Coach
Posts: 7,464
And1: 1,960
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Location: The Streets of DC

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#413 » by DCZards » Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:24 pm

This is from the online publication "Clutch Points."

Dwane Casey sees Wizards’ Rui Hachimura ‘developing his game to move out to the 3-point line’

Washington Wizards rookie forward Rui Hachimura appears primed for a big first season in the NBA — at least according to Detroit Pistons head coach Dwane Casey.

After watching Hachimura score 35 points in Japan’s exhibition game against New Zealand, Casey can’t help but express his admiration for the Wizards’ 2019 pick. The Pistons head coach heaped praised on the young Japanese star and sees his game evolving sooner rather than later.

“I think he’s going to be a heck of a player, the NBA is a physical game, a tough game. He’s got a great body for the NBA,” Casey, who is currently overseas in Japan to coach at a clinic, recently told Kyodo News.

“I see Rui…developing his game to move out to the 3-point line. Because that’s where the NBA is. Great kid, great work ethic.”

Hachimura was selected by the Wizards with the ninth overall pick in the 2019 NBA Draft out of Gonzaga. Rui spent three seasons with the Bulldogs, putting up 12.1 points and 4.4 rebounds per game. In his third year, he showed tremendous growth on his way to averaging 19.7 points, 6.5 rebounds and 1.5 assists 37 contests (all starts).

The Wizards are not expected to contend for the title in the 2019-20 season, so Hachimura will have enough time and opportunity to further develop his game as Washington builds for the future.

https://clutchpoints.com/wizards-news-dwane-casey-sees-rui-hachimura-developing-game-to-move-out-to-the-3-point-line
prime1time
Rookie
Posts: 1,136
And1: 646
Joined: Nov 02, 2016
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#414 » by prime1time » Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:50 pm

A little worse for Rui today, 6/15 for 19 points. But 2/3 from 3. Going back to his last 3 games. That's 2/3 from 3 today, 2/3 from 3 last game and 2 makes from 3 his last game of summer league, but I can't remember how many attempts. Granted that the Fiba 3-point line is closer in than the NBA 3-point line, it's still good that he's making them. Tbh, Rui's in a lose lose situation. If he plays well, he's playing against bod competition, but if he plays bad then he's a reach at 9.

You can dismiss the 13/17 all you want, but the truth is that Rui doesn't even have a good pg to set him up. He had to generate all of those points by himself. That is to say, that you give him a great pg/player that can set him up and that 35 point game, turns into a 45 point game. Then add in the fact that he was mysteriously 7/14 from the ft line (he was 5/6 today) and he had foul trouble and you can start to fully see just how dominate he was.

Also he is in tremendous shape. I'm going to post video from his Fiba games last year, from Gonzaga and then from the game Monday.



You look at him and he looks like a 3, with the ability to guard 4's. Also, you can't talk about the competition until you're blue in the face. Skills translate. The jumper he makes off the pin down starting at 52 seconds, the hard one dribble pull-up at 57 seconds. The pick-and-pop at 2:35. The form on his 3-point shot at 2:40 looks great. looks great

You can start to see how a Thomas, Beal, Rui, Bertans, Bryant lineup will look. Especially with Rui being a screener and Thomas and Beal manipulating the screen. It is going to be very hard for teams to stop. Rui's going to get open pick-and-pop 3's, mid-range jumpers and he's going to get switches onto smaller defenders, rim-runs etc. Given what we've seen, I simply don't see how opposing teams are going to stop him. Especially given the fact that in that lineup, we have 3-point shooting at every position.

Look at these 3 consecutive plays starting at 4:36

And he's still so raw. 3 years from now when his ball-handling is better and he's had 3 years to work on his 3-point shot, there's no telling how good he might be offensively. None of those clips even showed his low-post game which he also has.

So let's break it all down. Rui was considered by many to be a borderline NBA player. A 6th or 7th man at best.
Athleticism / Frame Overview: Not a great athlete vertically or laterally, but he’s solid. Fast in transition / when he gets a head of steam. Where he’s really able to thrive is using his strength – does a great job using his strength + length to his advantage.

Mentality Overview: Aggressive, physical, and a shoot first mindset. Does not have the best feel. Not someone who does the dirty work on either end.

Role: Score first PF. As he expands his range out to 3, his efficiency should stay around/average league average given his FTr and physicality around the rim, but he’s not someone who should be expected to create plays for others.

Outcome: Medium / Realistic Outcome: 6th/7th man scorer, poor defense. Even though he has made strides over the last two seasons (a solid jump this past season as the season progressed), I still think he has a ways to go on defense. With that in mind, I think given how important back-end defense is (and versatility), I don’t think his offensive scoring ability will be able to make up for his lack of defensive feel…especially when his offense is predicated on shooting jumpers and him being a ball stopper.

So there are couple things off the bat that are wrong. His offense isn't only predicated on shooting jumpers. He can score in the low post, score on lobs and take defenders off the dribble. Athletically, he's shown to be a very good athlete. Like I said in my original post, he clearly bulked up in college to play the 4/5. Looking at the Rui who played vs. New Zealand, if he uses his 7'2 wingspan correctly, he'll be able to guard 1-4 at least and all but the biggest/skilled 5's (Embiid/Jokic).

The paradox of Rui is precisely this, that while being skilled he's also raw. Now for fans who's basketball perspective is dominated by American basketball, the above statement is contradictory. But like I mentioned in earlier posts, with Rui we have to always keep in mind that he grew up playing basketball in Japan. A country where the best basketball players, are the one's with the most skill. So when Rui started playing basketball at 11 or 12, immediately the coach started to teach him skills. But Rui's feel for the game is still developing. Now what does this mean? Well, it means that despite having basketball skills, Rui still has a long way to go.
Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 38,276
And1: 5,405
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#415 » by Ruzious » Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:15 pm

Like everyone else, he has room to improve, but calling him raw is wrong, imo - particularly after 3 seasons at Gonzaga - one of the top 5 programs in the nation during that time.
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
prime1time
Rookie
Posts: 1,136
And1: 646
Joined: Nov 02, 2016
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#416 » by prime1time » Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:22 pm

Ruzious wrote:Like everyone else, he has room to improve, but calling him raw is wrong, imo - particularly after 3 seasons at Gonzaga - one of the top 5 programs in the nation during that time.

I stand by the raw comment. He started playing basketball late and every teams he's been on, he's only been asked to do one thing. Score. Is he skilled? Yes. But in terms of feel for the game, it's way below someone of his skill level. This is why he had a assist/turnover ratio of less than 1 and why numerous times in college he would miss the pass to the open defender.

But, perhaps the deeper question is what do you mean when you use the word raw? When I say raw, I'm talking about feel for the game. What do you mean?
Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 38,276
And1: 5,405
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#417 » by Ruzious » Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:28 pm

prime1time wrote:
Ruzious wrote:Like everyone else, he has room to improve, but calling him raw is wrong, imo - particularly after 3 seasons at Gonzaga - one of the top 5 programs in the nation during that time.

I stand by the raw comment. He started playing basketball late and every teams he's been on, he's only been asked to do one thing. Score. Is he skilled? Yes. But in terms of feel for the game, it's way below someone of his skill level. This is why he had a assist/turnover ratio of less than 1 and why numerous times in college he would miss the pass to the open defender.

But, perhaps the deeper question is what do you mean when you use the word raw? When I say raw, I'm talking about feel for the game. What do you mean?

Good question. To me, it would be that he's a tiny shell of what he's going to be - and he's somewhat new to the basics of the game at the level he's going to compete at.
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 12,269
And1: 3,838
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#418 » by payitforward » Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:42 pm

I think of "raw" as being used to describe someone who's gifted physically but whose skills are undeveloped. The former fits Rui, but he has skills.

He's an unusual case, so no surprise there's no single word to apply. The big thing to look for presumably is how quickly he develops in the areas where he is less experienced than most guys his age. Tommy has already said that he picks things up quickly, & his college coach spoke well of him too (which must indicate "coachability"). so there's reason to be optimistic about his development.
Remember -- if you don't like the post above: blame Doc not me.
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 54,329
And1: 8,508
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#419 » by nate33 » Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:59 pm

Rui is an odd combination of being both polished and inexperienced. He definitely has skills, but his grasp of team concepts - rebounding, off-ball movement, team defense, situational awareness, court vision - seem to be behind his aptitude in individual skills.

In many ways, he's actually a bit like Jabari Parker. I think it's possible that he will be an offensive force in the NBA almost immediately, but the application of that offensive skill successfully within a team concept may be lacking.

The big difference between Hachimura and Parker is that Hachimura is universally acknowledged to be a hard and intelligent worker who is truly driven to get better. Parker had a reputation (deserved or not) of not caring too much about defense and being unwilling or unable to do the things that lead to team success.
WallToWall
Rookie
Posts: 1,144
And1: 221
Joined: May 20, 2010
         

Re: Rui Hachimura 

Post#420 » by WallToWall » Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:45 am

Jaekast wrote:Can we start a Brandon Clarke shrine inside of this Rui thread?

ok, ok, you can stop with the man crush. Maybe this is the way to his heart, but I assure you, he isnt reading your posts here. Try somewhere else.

Return to Washington Wizards