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Triple Double King Russell Westbrook Appreciation Thread.

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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#161 » by tontoz » Tue May 4, 2021 12:20 pm

I brought this up at the time of the trade but i think it is worth repeating here. When he was in Houston his scoring efficiency was going up prior to the lockdown.

In January last season he had a TS of 57.1%. In Feb 59.4%.

News out today that he was playing with a torn quad early this season which explains a lot.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#162 » by BearlyBallin » Tue May 4, 2021 8:13 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

Wizards need to make a video clip of his 24 assists.

Like when Scherzer strikes out 20 and the Nats make a clip showing each K.

Then they could end the clip with this.

Read on Twitter
?s=20
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#163 » by FAH1223 » Tue May 4, 2021 8:48 pm

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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#164 » by NatP4 » Tue May 4, 2021 9:35 pm

FAH1223 wrote:



:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#165 » by long suffrin' boulez fan » Wed May 5, 2021 12:01 am

FAH1223 wrote:


What an amazing rant!

Great call out of Brooks
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#166 » by Doug_Blew » Wed May 5, 2021 12:07 am

Glad to see that Westbrook basically won Eastern coach of the month for April.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#167 » by nate33 » Wed May 5, 2021 12:57 am

LOL. SAS just rekt Brooks.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#168 » by 9 and 20 » Wed May 5, 2021 3:02 am

Yeah the Brooks part was great. And Perkins, who played for him for a few years, didn't speak up on his behalf at all.

To be fair, this year wasn't all on Brooks - the trade right before the season of Wall, Westbook injury, Bertans' general fatbodyness at the start, Gafford only brought on at mid-season.

Still - what the heck are you doing, Brooks? How many times can you play 3-point guard lineups? How many chances did Jerome Robinson get? I don't know how he survived the start to the season. Not that long ago, we were 17-32!
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#169 » by payitforward » Wed May 5, 2021 1:45 pm

I am unable to see anything Brooks is doing that adds real value. Certainly, nothing he's done has contributed to the current mind-boggling turnaround, which is 99.99% due to Westbrook & Gafford.

OTOH, even now you can see his negatives. For example, with Troy gone, he's turned his attention to ruining Garrison Mathews.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#170 » by pcbothwel » Wed May 5, 2021 2:04 pm

payitforward wrote:I am unable to see anything Brooks is doing that adds real value. Certainly, nothing he's done has contributed to the current mind-boggling turnaround, which is 99.99% due to Westbrook & Gafford.

OTOH, even now you can see his negatives. For example, with Troy gone, he's turned his attention to ruining Garrison Mathews.


PIF...this is why I have hope for this bunch. Not because I'm some naïve optimist, but because I think Brooks is pure butthole.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#171 » by dobrojim » Wed May 5, 2021 2:16 pm

I wonder how much weight the relationship btw Russ and Brooks will be given.
Would Westbrook intervene on his behalf?
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#172 » by doclinkin » Wed May 5, 2021 2:28 pm

payitforward wrote:I am unable to see anything Brooks is doing that adds real value. Certainly, nothing he's done has contributed to the current mind-boggling turnaround, which is 99.99% due to Westbrook & Gafford.


Credit where it is due: he has found good minutes for Len and Lopez at key points. Yeah this takes minutes from Gafford but has been part of the turnaround. We can credit Tommy for that more than Brooks, but unlike Garrison these guys are not buried. The triple towers platoon has been a core part of what we are doing well: three true bigs who can play with max effort in their time with us, and being fresh can keep up with the pace of the rest of the team. Brooks may have stumbled in to it, but it is innovative league-wide and is proving a significant part of the team's success. Especially considering aside from Bertans we don't shoot all that well from outside, our turnaround has been largely on scoring in the paint and free throws. Much of that is from Westbrook force feeding the Bigs. Gafford is efficient, but all of them have benefitted.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#173 » by DCZards » Wed May 5, 2021 3:01 pm

payitforward wrote:I am unable to see anything Brooks is doing that adds real value. Certainly, nothing he's done has contributed to the current mind-boggling turnaround, which is 99.99% due to Westbrook & Gafford.

OTOH, even now you can see his negatives. For example, with Troy gone, he's turned his attention to ruining Garrison Mathews.

If we're going to blame Brooks for his mistakes--and we should--then we should also give him props for what he's done right. He's found a way to turn a three-headed monster at center (Len, Lopez, Gafford) into one of the league's most productive set of centers and he's managed to get solid contributions from a pair of diminutive backup guards (Ish & Neto).

And Brooks isn't ruining Mathews. When Garrison struggled with his shot, Brooks turned to Hutchinson who has given the Zards a spark off the bench in several games...and who may have more long-term upside than Mathews.

And we really don't know what role Brooks' close, long-term relationship with Russ may have had in Westbrook's smarter, improved play in recent weeks.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#174 » by payitforward » Wed May 5, 2021 5:14 pm

pcbothwel wrote:
payitforward wrote:I am unable to see anything Brooks is doing that adds real value. Certainly, nothing he's done has contributed to the current mind-boggling turnaround, which is 99.99% due to Westbrook & Gafford.

OTOH, even now you can see his negatives. For example, with Troy gone, he's turned his attention to ruining Garrison Mathews.

PIF...this is why I have hope for this bunch. Not because I'm some naïve optimist, but because I think Brooks is pure butthole.

pcbothwei -- you've turned me around, brother! (ok... Russ & Gafford helped too! :)). Get that Springer kid or Giddey, & let's go to the races.

In fact, this team, right now, playing the way we are, I give us a solid shot against either Philly or Brooklyn in the playoffs & a solid shot against whichever of them we'd face in R2.

I guarantee you there isn't a single team out there that wants to play us right now. & it's not b/c they're worried about being out-coached by Scott Brooks! :)
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#175 » by payitforward » Wed May 5, 2021 5:17 pm

doclinkin wrote:
payitforward wrote:I am unable to see anything Brooks is doing that adds real value. Certainly, nothing he's done has contributed to the current mind-boggling turnaround, which is 99.99% due to Westbrook & Gafford.

Credit where it is due: he has found good minutes for Len and Lopez at key points. ...The triple towers platoon has been a core part of what we are doing well....

This is a fair point, doc. Granted.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#176 » by payitforward » Wed May 5, 2021 5:48 pm

DCZards wrote:
payitforward wrote:I am unable to see anything Brooks is doing that adds real value. Certainly, nothing he's done has contributed to the current mind-boggling turnaround, which is 99.99% due to Westbrook & Gafford.

OTOH, even now you can see his negatives. For example, with Troy gone, he's turned his attention to ruining Garrison Mathews.

If we're going to blame Brooks for his mistakes--and we should--then we should also give him props for what he's done right. He's found a way to turn a three-headed monster at center (Len, Lopez, Gafford) into one of the league's most productive set of centers and he's managed to get solid contributions from a pair of diminutive backup guards (Ish & Neto).

And Brooks isn't ruining Mathews. When Garrison struggled with his shot, Brooks turned to Hutchinson who has given the Zards a spark off the bench in several games...and who may have more long-term upside than Mathews.

And we really don't know what role Brooks' close, long-term relationship with Russ may have had in Westbrook's smarter, improved play in recent weeks.

First point a good one, Zards -- as I just wrote in response to doc. Last point is pure speculation.

Middle point is incorrect, sorry. Mathews hasn't "struggled with his shot;" he's been put in a position where he pretty much only gets high-degree-of-difficulty shots, the result of which is a lower % of makes. I guess you could argue that's on Russ more than the coach (Russ really never seems to look for Mathews), & as I said we are winning so it's an unimportant issue. In any case, it's not that Mathews would sit while Hutch would play instead that makes me say Brooks is "ruining" Mathews (admittedly an overly dramatic word...).

As to Hutch, you will recall that I was high on him when you were calling him a "throw-in." Which doesn't mean you were wrong, btw! It's pretty clear that I was wrong (Tommy does seem to have been targeting Gafford in the trade). But it does mean that I'm aware of Hutch & am paying attention to his production.

TBH, I don't think either he or Mathews have "long-term upside" that reaches very high -- though a guy who combined their skills sure would! Hutch is 25, & Garrison will turn 25 in October. In a good outcome, they are a couple of useful NBA journeymen.

Not a bad thing to be! :)
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#177 » by nate33 » Wed May 5, 2021 6:22 pm

Yeah, I don't think Mathews is being "ruined" in any way. He is perhaps being underutilized because Brooks never tries running plays to get him open, but Mathews will get over it. For now, Brooks seems to value Neto's versatile playmaking and on-ball defense over Mathews' catch-and-shoot ability and off-ball defense. I can't really argue with the results. As long as he isn't running any pin-downs for Mathews, it probably makes more sense to keep Neto in the game.

Ultimately, it's probably a good thing if it drives down Mathews price in the free agency market.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#178 » by wall_glizzy » Wed May 5, 2021 9:14 pm

payitforward wrote:Middle point is incorrect, sorry. Mathews hasn't "struggled with his shot;" he's been put in a position where he pretty much only gets high-degree-of-difficulty shots, the result of which is a lower % of makes.


I don't think this is true. Here's some data from Garrison's shooting dashboard for 2019-20:
Image

and 2020-21:
Image

He's taking a significantly higher percentage of his shots (nearly 10% more, 19.6% -> 28.6%) without a single defender within 6 feet of him, the difference from last season mostly coming from shots that the NBA classifies as "tight" (2-4 feet) or "open" (4-6 feet). His shot profile has also shifted slightly towards being even more catch-and-shoot-based, i.e. when he receives the ball he's either shooting or passing almost immediately (eliminating 1-on-1 situations that produce higher degree of difficulty shots).

So, he's producing less favorable results than last season despite having a more favorable shot profile on the whole (and lower usage - 11.4% this year vs. 14.5% last season). That's a bit of a bummer, but only because his shooting efficiency last year was so unbelievably good - there was almost no chance that his 69.1 TS% across 227 minutes played would prove to be non-anomalous.

The good news is that he's still shooting very well - his TS% on the season is 63.8, which is outstanding, and having logged nearly 1000 minutes on the year I think it's fair to treat this level of play as a little more "real" than last year's vis a vis future expectations. So I don't think he's being "ruined," per se, but for that matter I also don't find his level of play this year particularly disappointing - he's still doing great.

Amazingly, there is a player who's been logging major minutes this year and producing at the level Garrison did last year - Joe Ingles! (As of right now, he's actually just a tick higher - 69.2% in 1657 minutes vs. Garrison's rookie mark of 69.1%). He's tailing off a little bit after an unbelievably hot March, but if he can maintain his current numbers through the end of the season, he'll land in the top 10 seasons of all time for TS%, an absolutely unreal achievement for a shooting wing. He's actually just slightly ahead of Rudy Gobert on the year, efficiency-wise :o.

(Here's the full all-time single-season TS% leaderboard, if anyone wants to peruse: https://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ts_pct_season.html).
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#179 » by tontoz » Wed May 5, 2021 9:51 pm

Doug_Blew wrote:Glad to see that Westbrook basically won Eastern coach of the month for April.


Russ should get a percentage of Brooks next contract. Not that he needs it but COM is a joke.
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Re: Russell Westbrook in DC Appreciation Thread. 

Post#180 » by payitforward » Wed May 5, 2021 10:03 pm

wall_glizzy wrote:
payitforward wrote:Middle point is incorrect, sorry. Mathews hasn't "struggled with his shot;" he's been put in a position where he pretty much only gets high-degree-of-difficulty shots, the result of which is a lower % of makes.


I don't think this is true. Here's some data from Garrison's shooting dashboard for 2019-20:
Image

and 2020-21:
Image

He's taking a significantly higher percentage of his shots (nearly 10% more, 19.6% -> 28.6%) without a single defender within 6 feet of him, the difference from last season mostly coming from shots that the NBA classifies as "tight" (2-4 feet) or "open" (4-6 feet). His shot profile has also shifted slightly towards being even more catch-and-shoot-based, i.e. when he receives the ball he's either shooting or passing almost immediately (eliminating 1-on-1 situations that produce higher degree of difficulty shots).

So, he's producing less favorable results than last season despite having a more favorable shot profile on the whole (and lower usage - 11.4% this year vs. 14.5% last season). That's a bit of a bummer, but only because his shooting efficiency last year was so unbelievably good - there was almost no chance that his 69.1 TS% across 227 minutes played would prove to be non-anomalous.

The good news is that he's still shooting very well - his TS% on the season is 63.8, which is outstanding, and having logged nearly 1000 minutes on the year I think it's fair to treat this level of play as a little more "real" than last year's vis a vis future expectations. So I don't think he's being "ruined," per se, but for that matter I also don't find his level of play this year particularly disappointing - he's still doing great.

Amazingly, there is a player who's been logging major minutes this year and producing at the level Garrison did last year - Joe Ingles! (As of right now, he's actually just a tick higher - 69.2% in 1657 minutes vs. Garrison's rookie mark of 69.1%). He's tailing off a little bit after an unbelievably hot March, but if he can maintain his current numbers through the end of the season, he'll land in the top 10 seasons of all time for TS%, an absolutely unreal achievement for a shooting wing. He's actually just slightly ahead of Rudy Gobert on the year, efficiency-wise :o.

(Here's the full all-time single-season TS% leaderboard, if anyone wants to peruse: https://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ts_pct_season.html).

Can't argue with any of it. But, the above is at an overall-season level. What happens if you run numbers in a fine-grained way -- per week let's say. What does the productivity curve look like across those points.

Still... as I say, "ruin" was much too strong a word on my part. I take it back. Moreover -- & this I did say right away -- we are winning! We don't need to worry about Garrison Mathews right now.
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