The 2020 Rookie Class

[DCZards]

..Just prior to the draft, I wrote that the Zards should take Quickley with their second round pick. Looks like it would have been a good move....

Miraculous, Zards! Since he was taken in R1 with the #25 pick!

..Here’s a re-draft order put together by a writer for NBC Sports based on his observations of the first month of the season. He has Ball at #1 and Deni at 7. I said a couple of weeks ago that I thought Tyreese Maxey would turn out to be one of the steals of the 2020 draft. This writer has Maxey at 5.

https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/warriors/2020-nba-re-draft-james-wiseman-still-goes-no-2-tyrese-haliburton-no-3

Sorry, terrible article.

Not just about, not even especially about, Tyrese Maxey (whom he has at #6, btw). At least Maxey has had 1 tremendous game to fuel over the top enthusiasm (& which may be a better indication of his future than his overall level of play which hasn't been good).

But, Williams has been awful, ditto Edwards, ditto Anthony, ditto Bey, & ditto Okoro -- & he has all those guys above Devin Vassell in a redraft, when Vassell (whom you liked) has clearly stood out.

Plus, he has all of them but Okoro as worth being redrafted higher than Precious Achiuwa! That's utterly ridiculous.

Doesn't even mention Xavier Tillman of course -- yet, journalistically, that would have been a story.

This guy straight out doesn't know what he's talking about.

I don't necessarily agree with where the NBC sports writer ranks his players, but these are his opinions and observations. I'm guessing that he's looking at the long-range potential and upside of these rooks...more than at numbers or how well they've performed in the first month of the season, which is a reasonable approach, imo.

Would you draft Tillman ahead of Wiseman, Bey or Maxey simply because Xavier's numbers are better at this point in their NBA respective careers? I wouldn't...because I believe Wiseman, Bey and Maxey have a much higher ceiling than Tillman.

Of course, I could be wrong about that.

[DCZards]

Hey PIF, this is a rookie ranking that might be more to your liking. It’s a weekly one that currently has Quickley, Mason Jones and Tillman ranked 1,2 & 3.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-rookie-power-rankings-immanuel-quickley-has-big-week-for-knicks-cole-anthony-hits-game-winner-for-magic/?fbclid=IwAR1MfOtMMKEGpFIIpCCuCoST6XhxrHUNkTtwO3uqtY-IU4e8MCkuJwmlrho

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

One way to go about this draft would be to identify current NCAA players who are similar Quickley, Bane, Tillman, Jones and Tate statistically. The same attributes the rookies who are excelling now preceded from their NCAA play numbers.

Sent from my SM-T500 using RealGM mobile app

[payitforward]

22 rookies have played over 100 minutes. Actually all 22 have played at least 148 minutes.

Of those 22, VORP and BPM have Ball, Halliburton, Tillman, Vassell and Quickley in the top 5. WS/48 has them in the top 6 (with Achiuwa also sneaking in at 5th place).

If you rank those 22 rookies by WS/48, Avidja ranks 10th
If you rank them by VORP, Avdija ranks 7th
If you rank them by BPM, Avdija ranks 7th

So it looks like Sheppard has done a fair job with the 9th pick. Among top 10 picks, only Ball has done better.

The collective board wisdom is looking pretty good too. We all loved Tillman and Achiuwa. And many of us would have taken Halliburton at 9. Dat2U was pounding the table saying Ball is the only pick that would be a star, he looks to be right again.

Now... don't puff Dat2U up -- he's gonna get over-confident & do something foolish!

I think pretty much everybody here liked Haliburton & would have taken him had Deni been off the board & there was no attractive trade down available. But, Deni did drop -- & he was the right pick.

Plus, I believe Haliburton was more or less wired to Sac'to & that his agent was telling people not to take him. Of course, if someone had done so anyway, I don't know what their Plan B would have been.

I don't know, btw, how anyone could have looked at Haliburton's college numbers & NOT have liked him! It's great to see him doing so well.

But, to me at least, what's most interesting so far is the performance of a few guys taken well outside the top dozen -- Tillman & Achiuwa obviously. But Mason Jones above all.

Last night Mason Jones took himself comfortably above the 100 minute mark we've been using. Here's what he did -- in 19 minutes, he went 6-8 from the floor, including 3-4 on 3-pointers, to score 16 points. He also had 5 rebounds and 3 assists. He did have a turnover & commit 4 fouls.

Even with those blemishes, overall that's one of the best minute for minute performances of any NBA guard this season. & it was by an undrafted rookie. Wow.... Give the guy some credit.

[payitforward]

..Here’s a re-draft order put together by a writer for NBC Sports based on his observations of the first month of the season....

https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/warriors/2020-nba-re-draft-james-wiseman-still-goes-no-2-tyrese-haliburton-no-3

Sorry, terrible article. ....
This guy straight out doesn't know what he's talking about.

I don't necessarily agree with where the NBC sports writer ranks his players, but these are his opinions and observations. I'm guessing that he's looking at the long-range potential and upside of these rooks...more than at numbers or how well they've performed in the first month of the season, which is a reasonable approach, imo.

Of course it is -- but that's not what he was doing -- see the article's title & the way both he and you describe it.

Would you draft Tillman ahead of Wiseman, Bey or Maxey simply because Xavier's numbers are better at this point in their NBA respective careers? I wouldn't...because I believe Wiseman, Bey and Maxey have a much higher ceiling than Tillman......

Of course not -- because you wouldn't need to do that.

But, that's a starting point not an end point & not a proof point of anything at all. Take a look at how Memphis handled this draft. You make pick-trades to get the guys you think have the most value overall.

Now... Wiseman may blow up! God knows he has potential! But, Memphis got Desmond Bane & Xavier Tillman for not much. It cost them a low R2 pick to move up in R2 for Tillman. & it cost them 2 R2 picks to move into R1 & get Bane.

[payitforward]

Bump! Anyone paying attention to this year's rookies?

[NatP4]

Haliburton&Tillman, yeah.

[Dat2U]

Haliburton&Tillman, yeah.

Would have cost us a 2021 2nd to go up and get Tillman but it would have been worth it.

[NatP4]

Haliburton&Tillman, yeah.

Would have cost us a 2021 2nd to go up and get Tillman but it would have been worth it.

Was looking at some numbers the other day. Tillman is 2nd in net rating, 3rd in defensive rating, and 4th in offensive rating for players that have played atleast 500 minutes on the Grizzlies.

[payitforward]

Haliburton&Tillman, yeah.

Man... we were NOT getting Haliburton. Teams were warned off of him by his agent, & if they had not been warned off of him, he would have gone before #9.

We didn't "miss on" Haliburton. He wasn't really available to us.

Would have cost us a 2021 2nd to go up and get Tillman but it would have been worth it.

Absolutely!

Memphis gave their #40 plus a future R2 pick. We had the #37 to give -- an advantage over them

Now, maybe Memphis gave a '21 R2 pick, which we could not do, as we don't have one. So, that was an advantage they had over us.

What it comes back to in the end is trading down vs. making our #9 pick. A trade with Boston might have worked out better than simply taking Deni.

But, I don't question the decision.

[NatP4]

Haliburton&Tillman, yeah.

Man... we were NOT getting Haliburton. Teams were warned off of him by his agent, & if they had not been warned off of him, he would have gone before #9.

We didn't "miss on" Haliburton. He wasn't really available to us.

Would have cost us a 2021 2nd to go up and get Tillman but it would have been worth it.

Absolutely!

Memphis gave their #40 plus a future R2 pick. We had the #37 to give -- an advantage over them

Now, maybe Memphis gave a '21 R2 pick, which we could not do, as we don't have one. So, that was an advantage they had over us.

What it comes back to in the end is trading down vs. making our #9 pick. A trade with Boston might have worked out better than simply taking Deni.

But, I don't question the decision.

Memphis actually traded a 2022 2nd, which we also could have done.

[DCZards]

Man... we were NOT getting Haliburton. Teams were warned off of him by his agent, & if they had not been warned off of him, he would have gone before #9.

I really doubt the validity of the claim that Haliburton was only willing to play for Sacramento.

I’ve only seen one (maybe two) articles saying that...with absolutely no one backing that claim up, other than Haliburton’s agent.

If the story was true I believe it would have more legs...and we’d be hearing from some pissed off “sources” from teams that wanted to draft Tyrese ahead of Sac.

[nate33]

Man... we were NOT getting Haliburton. Teams were warned off of him by his agent, & if they had not been warned off of him, he would have gone before #9.

I doubt the validity of the claim that Halliburton was only willing to play for Sacramento.

I’ve only seen one (maybe two) articles saying that...with absolutely no one backing that up, other than Haliburton’s agent.

If the story was true I believe it would have more legs.

Yeah. Draft him anyhow. What's he gonna do? Not sign?

[NatP4]

Man... we were NOT getting Haliburton. Teams were warned off of him by his agent, & if they had not been warned off of him, he would have gone before #9.

I doubt the validity of the claim that Halliburton was only willing to play for Sacramento.

I’ve only seen one (maybe two) articles saying that...with absolutely no one backing that up, other than Haliburton’s agent.

If the story was true I believe it would have more legs.

Yeah. Draft him anyhow. What's he gonna do? Not sign?

Hockey players actually do this from time to time. It’s really stupid

[wall_glizzy]

Man... we were NOT getting Haliburton. Teams were warned off of him by his agent, & if they had not been warned off of him, he would have gone before #9.

I doubt the validity of the claim that Halliburton was only willing to play for Sacramento.

I’ve only seen one (maybe two) articles saying that...with absolutely no one backing that up, other than Haliburton’s agent.

If the story was true I believe it would have more legs.

Yeah. Draft him anyhow. What's he gonna do? Not sign?

Whenever someone does this, it's a little confusing because of the phrasing "told teams not to pick [player]" - it's not just a verbal request. Among other tactics, in this case I think what it really means is Haliburton's agent being very selective about which franchises were given access to his medical records, etc. It's conceivable that there was even more info than usual that could've been kept proprietary this year on account of the reduced combine, lengthy break between the college season and the draft, etc. So there's no real threat of not signing, but rather giving teams incomplete information in hopes of dissuading them from rolling the dice.

It's still insane to me that his destination of choice was Sacramento, of all places, but it certainly seems to have worked out. I get that the top 10 in this year's draft was almost entirely clown franchises, but what's still puzzling is that San Antonio didn't make his list. There's certainly no question about the integrity of their organization, but maybe they just weren't interested what with the back-court logjam they already have.

I believe the story, for what it's worth; it was pretty reputably reported.

[Ruzious]

I doubt the validity of the claim that Halliburton was only willing to play for Sacramento.

I’ve only seen one (maybe two) articles saying that...with absolutely no one backing that up, other than Haliburton’s agent.

If the story was true I believe it would have more legs.

Yeah. Draft him anyhow. What's he gonna do? Not sign?

Hockey players actually do this from time to time. It’s really stupid

In the NBA, it's guaranteed millions that they can live the rest of their lives off of. Can you imagine someone throwing away $10 million because they wanted to play for Sacramento? Zoiks.

The lesson there is - Never believe an agent.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

22 rookies have played over 100 minutes. Actually all 22 have played at least 148 minutes.

Of those 22, VORP and BPM have Ball, Halliburton, Tillman, Vassell and Quickley in the top 5. WS/48 has them in the top 6 (with Achiuwa also sneaking in at 5th place).

If you rank those 22 rookies by WS/48, Avidja ranks 10th
If you rank them by VORP, Avdija ranks 7th
If you rank them by BPM, Avdija ranks 7th

So it looks like Sheppard has done a fair job with the 9th pick. Among top 10 picks, only Ball has done better.

The collective board wisdom is looking pretty good too. We all loved Tillman and Achiuwa. And many of us would have taken Halliburton at 9. Dat2U was pounding the table saying Ball is the only pick that would be a star, he looks to be right again.

I don’t know if you guys know but I have been a background actor in a movie or two and on a couple of TV shows that are filmed here in Hawaii.

I think there is a movie idea about the collective wisdom of a group of people who could act as general manager or president of basketball operations. The decisions made by the consensus of this particular board would be very good. Dat2U is the best IMO.

Between Dat2U, doclinkin, payitforward, nate33, Ruzious and the rest we are TERRIFIC. There’s really not many surprise picks.

My gift? In the past if you guys said I was wrong and I insisted I was right I was right. My last few years have been kind of weird but I think I still got it.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I’m starting to think I was wrong about Jalen Smith. Time will tell...

[NatP4]

This collective board wisdom(myself included) missed on Killian Hayes

[Ruzious]

22 rookies have played over 100 minutes. Actually all 22 have played at least 148 minutes.

Of those 22, VORP and BPM have Ball, Halliburton, Tillman, Vassell and Quickley in the top 5. WS/48 has them in the top 6 (with Achiuwa also sneaking in at 5th place).

If you rank those 22 rookies by WS/48, Avidja ranks 10th
If you rank them by VORP, Avdija ranks 7th
If you rank them by BPM, Avdija ranks 7th

So it looks like Sheppard has done a fair job with the 9th pick. Among top 10 picks, only Ball has done better.

The collective board wisdom is looking pretty good too. We all loved Tillman and Achiuwa. And many of us would have taken Halliburton at 9. Dat2U was pounding the table saying Ball is the only pick that would be a star, he looks to be right again.

I don’t know if you guys know but I have been a background actor in a movie or two and on a couple of TV shows that are filmed here in Hawaii.

I think there is a movie idea about the collective wisdom of a group of people who could act as general manager or president of basketball operations. The decisions made by the consensus of this particular board would be very good. Dat2U is the best IMO.

Between Dat2U, doclinkin, payitforward, nate33, Ruzious and the rest we are TERRIFIC. There’s really not many surprise picks.

My gift? In the past if you guys said I was wrong and I insisted I was right I was right. My last few years have been kind of weird but I think I still got it.

I gotta give it to Doc. It's amazing how often his picks turn out right. Dat's 2nd, imo and could be a pro at this.

I had Hayes as the best prospect in the last draft, so... eh, not looking too good right now.