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The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread

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Do we have a shot at Masai?

YES, SMOKE MEANS THERE'S FIRE
4
29%
NO, WE'RE THE WIZARDS AND ITS TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE
10
71%
 
Total votes: 14

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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#61 » by likwitdesi » Wed Jun 2, 2021 2:52 pm

Masai doesn't seem serious about leaving Toronto. Ainge would bring a lot of gravitas here. They should make him the same offer they were prepared to make Masai and let him lead basketball operations for all of Monumental and give him a piece of equity if needed. I'd retain Tommy as GM.

I think the two of them would work quite well together. Ainge is the best in the league at extracting future assets out of trades and has done it time and time again. He has also done an excellent job wooing stars to Boston (KG, Ray Allen, Kyrie, Kemba and Hayward). Some have worked out and some haven't. What he is not great at is actually making those picks. I think that is where Tommy has value - as the scout, he'd be great at making the picks and finding the fringe guys.

I also believe that, with Danny on board, we have a much better chance of attracting a strong coach.
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#62 » by TGW » Wed Jun 2, 2021 3:23 pm

Hell yes, they should hire Ainge. I wouldn't make him a godfather offer like they one they have prepared for Masai, but I would hire him for GM duties. And I would fire Sheppard. He can either go back down to european scout or kick rocks.
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#63 » by Ruzious » Wed Jun 2, 2021 3:24 pm

likwitdesi wrote:Masai doesn't seem serious about leaving Toronto. Ainge would bring a lot of gravitas here. They should make him the same offer they were prepared to make Masai and let him lead basketball operations for all of Monumental and give him a piece of equity if needed. I'd retain Tommy as GM.

I think the two of them would work quite well together. Ainge is the best in the league at extracting future assets out of trades and has done it time and time again. He has also done an excellent job wooing stars to Boston (KG, Ray Allen, Kyrie, Kemba and Hayward). Some have worked out and some haven't. What he is not great at is actually making those picks. I think that is where Tommy has value - as the scout, he'd be great at making the picks and finding the fringe guys.

I also believe that, with Danny on board, we have a much better chance of attracting a strong coach.

Nah, I think the fact that Danny is stepping down says a lot. He ain't what he used to be, and his drafts have been poor - not to mention the Kyrie time there was a disaster - and now Kyrie finished their playoff series torching them in the last 2 games. I'm surprised to hear Stevens is moving up to replace him. It'll be interesting to see who he chooses to replace himself.
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#64 » by likwitdesi » Wed Jun 2, 2021 5:21 pm

Ruzious wrote:
likwitdesi wrote:Masai doesn't seem serious about leaving Toronto. Ainge would bring a lot of gravitas here. They should make him the same offer they were prepared to make Masai and let him lead basketball operations for all of Monumental and give him a piece of equity if needed. I'd retain Tommy as GM.

I think the two of them would work quite well together. Ainge is the best in the league at extracting future assets out of trades and has done it time and time again. He has also done an excellent job wooing stars to Boston (KG, Ray Allen, Kyrie, Kemba and Hayward). Some have worked out and some haven't. What he is not great at is actually making those picks. I think that is where Tommy has value - as the scout, he'd be great at making the picks and finding the fringe guys.

I also believe that, with Danny on board, we have a much better chance of attracting a strong coach.

Nah, I think the fact that Danny is stepping down says a lot. He ain't what he used to be, and his drafts have been poor - not to mention the Kyrie time there was a disaster - and now Kyrie finished their playoff series torching them in the last 2 games. I'm surprised to hear Stevens is moving up to replace him. It'll be interesting to see who he chooses to replace himself.


Even with Ainge at a % of what he used to be, look at the results. He landed them two stars, mainly through maneuvering, and the Celtics have been in the conference finals seemingly every year the past few years. I would take that in a heartbeat
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#65 » by Ruzious » Wed Jun 2, 2021 6:20 pm

likwitdesi wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
likwitdesi wrote:Masai doesn't seem serious about leaving Toronto. Ainge would bring a lot of gravitas here. They should make him the same offer they were prepared to make Masai and let him lead basketball operations for all of Monumental and give him a piece of equity if needed. I'd retain Tommy as GM.

I think the two of them would work quite well together. Ainge is the best in the league at extracting future assets out of trades and has done it time and time again. He has also done an excellent job wooing stars to Boston (KG, Ray Allen, Kyrie, Kemba and Hayward). Some have worked out and some haven't. What he is not great at is actually making those picks. I think that is where Tommy has value - as the scout, he'd be great at making the picks and finding the fringe guys.

I also believe that, with Danny on board, we have a much better chance of attracting a strong coach.

Nah, I think the fact that Danny is stepping down says a lot. He ain't what he used to be, and his drafts have been poor - not to mention the Kyrie time there was a disaster - and now Kyrie finished their playoff series torching them in the last 2 games. I'm surprised to hear Stevens is moving up to replace him. It'll be interesting to see who he chooses to replace himself.


Even with Ainge at a % of what he used to be, look at the results. He landed them two stars, mainly through maneuvering, and the Celtics have been in the conference finals seemingly every year the past few years. I would take that in a heartbeat

I can't argue with his resume - including those 3 recent Eastern Conference Championship losses in the historically bad East. But ever since the Kyrie debacle, I've felt he lost it. Even this year, in the 3 way trade with Chicago and Washington - teams he'd usually be able to fleece, he came up with Luke Kornet and Wagner for Theis - while Washington got Gafford and Chicago got TBJ. He was great in getting extra picks in past years, but he didn't use them well. Bane was his best pick in the 2020 draft (30th), and he traded him. In 2019, he drafted Langford (14), Grant Williams (22), and Carsen Edwards (33). He traded away Terry Rozier and Aaron Baynes. He signed Jabari Parker. I'm not going to fault him for trading Hayward for nothing - he had to. The best pickup he's made the last couple years is... Evan Fournier? Gotta do better than that, imo.
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#66 » by likwitdesi » Wed Jun 2, 2021 7:26 pm

Ruzious wrote:
likwitdesi wrote:
Ruzious wrote:Nah, I think the fact that Danny is stepping down says a lot. He ain't what he used to be, and his drafts have been poor - not to mention the Kyrie time there was a disaster - and now Kyrie finished their playoff series torching them in the last 2 games. I'm surprised to hear Stevens is moving up to replace him. It'll be interesting to see who he chooses to replace himself.


Even with Ainge at a % of what he used to be, look at the results. He landed them two stars, mainly through maneuvering, and the Celtics have been in the conference finals seemingly every year the past few years. I would take that in a heartbeat

I can't argue with his resume - including those 3 recent Eastern Conference Championship losses in the historically bad East. But ever since the Kyrie debacle, I've felt he lost it. Even this year, in the 3 way trade with Chicago and Washington - teams he'd usually be able to fleece, he came up with Luke Kornet and Wagner for Theis - while Washington got Gafford and Chicago got TBJ. He was great in getting extra picks in past years, but he didn't use them well. Bane was his best pick in the 2020 draft (30th), and he traded him. In 2019, he drafted Langford (14), Grant Williams (22), and Carsen Edwards (33). He traded away Terry Rozier and Aaron Baynes. He signed Jabari Parker. I'm not going to fault him for trading Hayward for nothing - he had to. The best pickup he's made the last couple years is... Evan Fournier? Gotta do better than that, imo.


I pointed that out. He'd have to be willing to leave primary responsibility with draft pick selection to someone else (such as Tommy). Let him be the face and the person making the higher level trades.
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#67 » by Ruzious » Wed Jun 2, 2021 8:25 pm

likwitdesi wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
likwitdesi wrote:
Even with Ainge at a % of what he used to be, look at the results. He landed them two stars, mainly through maneuvering, and the Celtics have been in the conference finals seemingly every year the past few years. I would take that in a heartbeat

I can't argue with his resume - including those 3 recent Eastern Conference Championship losses in the historically bad East. But ever since the Kyrie debacle, I've felt he lost it. Even this year, in the 3 way trade with Chicago and Washington - teams he'd usually be able to fleece, he came up with Luke Kornet and Wagner for Theis - while Washington got Gafford and Chicago got TBJ. He was great in getting extra picks in past years, but he didn't use them well. Bane was his best pick in the 2020 draft (30th), and he traded him. In 2019, he drafted Langford (14), Grant Williams (22), and Carsen Edwards (33). He traded away Terry Rozier and Aaron Baynes. He signed Jabari Parker. I'm not going to fault him for trading Hayward for nothing - he had to. The best pickup he's made the last couple years is... Evan Fournier? Gotta do better than that, imo.


I pointed that out. He'd have to be willing to leave primary responsibility with draft pick selection to someone else (such as Tommy). Let him be the face and the person making the higher level trades.

Half my post was about him not making any good trades recently. And I gotta ask - Why is he leaving his job if he thinks he can still do it well? Isn't that going to affect what other NBA people think of him?
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#68 » by Kanyewest » Wed Jun 2, 2021 9:00 pm

Ruzious wrote:
likwitdesi wrote:
Ruzious wrote:Nah, I think the fact that Danny is stepping down says a lot. He ain't what he used to be, and his drafts have been poor - not to mention the Kyrie time there was a disaster - and now Kyrie finished their playoff series torching them in the last 2 games. I'm surprised to hear Stevens is moving up to replace him. It'll be interesting to see who he chooses to replace himself.


Even with Ainge at a % of what he used to be, look at the results. He landed them two stars, mainly through maneuvering, and the Celtics have been in the conference finals seemingly every year the past few years. I would take that in a heartbeat

I can't argue with his resume - including those 3 recent Eastern Conference Championship losses in the historically bad East. But ever since the Kyrie debacle, I've felt he lost it. Even this year, in the 3 way trade with Chicago and Washington - teams he'd usually be able to fleece, he came up with Luke Kornet and Wagner for Theis - while Washington got Gafford and Chicago got TBJ. He was great in getting extra picks in past years, but he didn't use them well. Bane was his best pick in the 2020 draft (30th), and he traded him. In 2019, he drafted Langford (14), Grant Williams (22), and Carsen Edwards (33). He traded away Terry Rozier and Aaron Baynes. He signed Jabari Parker. I'm not going to fault him for trading Hayward for nothing - he had to. The best pickup he's made the last couple years is... Evan Fournier? Gotta do better than that, imo.


There were rumors Indiana was willing to trade Myles Turner for Hayward in a sign and trade but Ainge didn't want to and then Charlotte signed him.


As for Theis, the Celtics traded him purely for a salary dump to add Fournier but yeah they would have been better off somehow getting Gafford or even Troy Brown Jr.
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#69 » by Illuminaire » Wed Jun 2, 2021 9:16 pm

Ainge is a great example of how difficult it is to rate a GM. But I will go ahead and try anyways!

Coach Selection: Excellent. Doc Rivers is a solidly above average player-manager and overall coach. Stevens was an absolute coup.

Trades: Excellent for content. It's possible Ainge has lost his fastball, but he started out throwing 101mph heat. Even if he's settled for a gentler approach - or other GMs are guarded against him - he's still at least average. Solid but mixed results for timing. He tends to know when to go all-in, but he's not always successful at doing so. He usually knows when to cut bait, but a few recent situations turned on him faster than he could maneuver.

I would say that a good deal of his mistakes here come from GMing with aggression. He wants to create championship caliber rosters, and he takes risks to get there. Some of those risks fail. But he's been right at the top of the league in this category overall. The man traded a COACH for a first rounder, for heaven's sake.

Free Agents: Average results. He landed Ray Allen and Gordon Hayward. The first proved to be a key component on a title team. The latter never lived up to his billing due to a tragically timed injury before the Hayward era could even start. He had several big whiffs over 17 years, but the sad truth is that almost no one outside of Riley, the LA teams, or Brooklyn has managed to get a true superstar in free agency.

In terms of low end free agents he's about average. I don't see him getting many amazing bargain basement deals. I also don't see a ton of overpays.

Roster Construction: Solid but mixed results. When I look at his teams, they're usually fine... but he doesn't always correct known issues from year to year. A proper analysis for this area would take hours, but at a glance he's slightly above average. A number of his recent teams faltered hard, but it's tough to assess them because injuries and flat earthers were prominently involved.

Drafts/Scouting: Very good. This rating may draw some arguments, and that's completely fair. I think, though, that he's actually been quite good in the draft considering his usual draft position. The vast, vast majority of Danny's picks have been in the mid to late first round. That's a crap shoot. A significant number of those never work out for anyone. That said... his batting average is impressive.

I counted right around 26 first round picks, not including traded picks. Of those, all but four were 14 or higher. He nailed his only early picks. Brown and Tatum stand out among their peers drafted around them. Overall, I rate things as follow...
Home runs - 4 (Getting a star in the early draft, or a quality starter further in)
Hits - 8 (Getting a solid rotation player or average starter outside the top 10)
Eh? - 5 (20 minute a night players who aren't quite scrubs, but never become starters)
Miss - 7 (Never weres and never will bes)


So yeah. I think Ainge is an upgrade over 80-90% of GMs in the league. If the Wizards can get him, they should. Immediately. What are you doing? Get him on the phone right now.
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Re: The Masai Ujiri Watch Thread 

Post#70 » by Ruzious » Wed Jun 2, 2021 9:17 pm

Kanyewest wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
likwitdesi wrote:
Even with Ainge at a % of what he used to be, look at the results. He landed them two stars, mainly through maneuvering, and the Celtics have been in the conference finals seemingly every year the past few years. I would take that in a heartbeat

I can't argue with his resume - including those 3 recent Eastern Conference Championship losses in the historically bad East. But ever since the Kyrie debacle, I've felt he lost it. Even this year, in the 3 way trade with Chicago and Washington - teams he'd usually be able to fleece, he came up with Luke Kornet and Wagner for Theis - while Washington got Gafford and Chicago got TBJ. He was great in getting extra picks in past years, but he didn't use them well. Bane was his best pick in the 2020 draft (30th), and he traded him. In 2019, he drafted Langford (14), Grant Williams (22), and Carsen Edwards (33). He traded away Terry Rozier and Aaron Baynes. He signed Jabari Parker. I'm not going to fault him for trading Hayward for nothing - he had to. The best pickup he's made the last couple years is... Evan Fournier? Gotta do better than that, imo.


There were rumors Indiana was willing to trade Myles Turner for Hayward in a sign and trade but Ainge didn't want to and then Charlotte signed him.


As for Theis, the Celtics traded him purely for a salary dump to add Fournier but yeah they would have been better off somehow getting Gafford or even Troy Brown Jr.

And they kept Kornet - who's making more than Gafford.
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