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Official Trade Thread - Part XLI

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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#141 » by pcbothwel » Wed Jun 9, 2021 12:56 pm

payitforward wrote:What Zards said....

There's always been one & only one problem with Otto -- his body gives out.


Right... which is the only reason he would be available to us. Healthy Otto is easily worth 18-20M, but his injuries basically cut that in half.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#142 » by dckingsfan » Wed Jun 9, 2021 1:25 pm

Moved...
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#143 » by payitforward » Wed Jun 9, 2021 1:36 pm

prime1time wrote:I like Horford. He didn’t fit in Philly but he’d be a great center for us. I’d want him as a buyout candidate though. From the sound of it, next season will probably hinge on the grow the growth of Hachimura and Avidja. It’ll be interesting to see how there respective roles change.

Al Horford has had a long & outstanding NBA career. But, he is no longer the player he was. Not close & trending down in a hurry. He would be of no use to a team like ours -- not at $27m, that's for sure.

As to Rui/Deni's growth next year, I sure hope we see it. Right now what they look like to me is evidence of two wasted drafts -- drafts which if properly managed might well have made a decisive difference to the rebuilding (or "turnaround" if you don't like that term) of this team.

So, in that sense, yes, if they really take hold next season it will be an extremely positive development. But... unless we have a different coach, I don't see how Deni will get to realize his potential.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#144 » by prime1time » Wed Jun 9, 2021 5:15 pm

payitforward wrote:
prime1time wrote:I like Horford. He didn’t fit in Philly but he’d be a great center for us. I’d want him as a buyout candidate though. From the sound of it, next season will probably hinge on the grow the growth of Hachimura and Avidja. It’ll be interesting to see how there respective roles change.

Al Horford has had a long & outstanding NBA career. But, he is no longer the player he was. Not close & trending down in a hurry. He would be of no use to a team like ours -- not at $27m, that's for sure.

As to Rui/Deni's growth next year, I sure hope we see it. Right now what they look like to me is evidence of two wasted drafts -- drafts which if properly managed might well have made a decisive difference to the rebuilding (or "turnaround" if you don't like that term) of this team.

So, in that sense, yes, if they really take hold next season it will be an extremely positive development. But... unless we have a different coach, I don't see how Deni will get to realize his potential.

It’s been 2 years for a Rui and one year for Avdija. That’s way too early to conclude anything. If you drafted Julius Randle, you’d have declared him a bust. Look at him now. Avidja will be interesting next year due to the gap between what the front office says and how he’s used. At 19 that was understandable but his role should expand next year.

*at the end of the day, it comes down to 3-point shooting for the both of them. If they can both show improvement from 3, I think we’ll be in a good place.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#145 » by prime1time » Wed Jun 9, 2021 5:17 pm

What do people think about Bol Bol?
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#146 » by Ruzious » Wed Jun 9, 2021 5:32 pm

prime1time wrote:What do people think about Bol Bol?

Disappointing. I honestly thought he would have shown something by now - with reasonable health.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#147 » by pcbothwel » Wed Jun 9, 2021 5:48 pm

Ruzious wrote:
prime1time wrote:What do people think about Bol Bol?

Disappointing. I honestly thought he would have shown something by now - with reasonable health.


Agreed. I had him as top 10 on my board, but I still think he has time to be a solid player so long as you play to his strengths. We'll see I guess
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#148 » by payitforward » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:59 pm

prime1time wrote:What do people think about Bol Bol?

This being the trade thread, I assume you mean to ask what anyone thinks about acquiring him -- right?

I wouldn't give anything for Bol Bol. Of course, I doubt we'd have to give anything. So let me put it differently. I wouldn't sign him if Denver released him.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#149 » by payitforward » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:33 pm

prime1time wrote:
payitforward wrote:
prime1time wrote:...From the sound of it, next season will probably hinge on the grow the growth of Hachimura and Avidja. It’ll be interesting to see how there respective roles change.

As to Rui/Deni's growth next year, I sure hope we see it. Right now what they look like to me is evidence of two wasted drafts....

It’s been 2 years for a Rui and one year for Avdija. That’s way too early to conclude anything....

Of course. That's why I said "right now what they look like...." I wasn't concluding anything.

prime1time wrote:If you drafted Julius Randle, you’d have declared him a bust. Look at him now....

?? What makes you say that? Julius Randle was 19 when he was drafted. He missed his rookie year, then improved every year for 4-5 years.

Anyway, that's not how you judge your work in the draft. What you do is figure out if you got the maximum value you could have reasonably expected to get. If not, you try to improve your work.

2014 was a very weak draft near the top. Only 1 good player in the top 5 (Embiid: #3). The best players went way further down. The guy taken #58 had a better NBA career than the guy taken #15, & arguably the best player in the entire draft went #41.

Noah Vonleh went #9; he's out of the league. Joe Harris, Spencer Dinwiddie, Johnny O'Bryant, Jerami Grant, Glenn Robinson III, Nikola Jokic, Dwight Powell & Jordan Clarkson all went in R2.

The Lakers took Randle #7. Too bad they didn't have a crystal ball, huh? They could have traded that pick & come away with 4 other players - a better result than Randle. (Of course they could also have picked Vonleh! :) )
prime1time wrote:Rui & Deni... at the end of the day, it comes down to 3-point shooting for the both of them. If they can both show improvement from 3, I think we’ll be in a good place.

It'll take more than that, & I hope we get it -- but, of course, improving their 3pt shooting is needed too.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#150 » by Rafael122 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:24 pm

prime1time wrote:What do people think about Bol Bol?


He is who I thought he would be. He's a gimmick. I see it a bunch on Wizards Twitter, folks constantly bring him up b/c we drafted Admiral instead of him, never mind that Terrance Mann, THT and Roby were all taken after those guys and have carved up a nice career so far.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#151 » by payitforward » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:07 pm

Moving this to trade thread for comment....
Rand McNally wrote:
pcbothwel wrote:
nate33 wrote:I think GSW should trade Wiseman and one of their picks for Myles Turner (not sure if it will cost the #6 or just the #14). The addition of Turner and Klay to their current roster should make them formidable. Turner is the perfect center for them because he is a rim protector who can offset Draymond's inability to shoot. Turner's lackluster rebounding will be offset by Draymond's good rebounding from the PF position. I think the Warriors with Turner could make one more title run if Klay is 90% of his former self.


Lol, Great Minds... that was the exact trade I had in mind. To be exact, I was thinking of a Wiggins/Wiseman/7 for Turner/Levert/Justin Holiday/13

GSW gets Turner (You nailed the reasoning), Levert as 2nd ball handler, and Holiday as the 3& D Wiggins replacement.
They then have 13 & 14 to add a PG and Wing (Giddey & Wagner).

Curry / Giddey
Levert / Poole
Klay / Holiday
Draymond / Wagner
Turner / Looney

That is a dangerous, High IQ team that moves the ball and plays defense


I think there's an opportunity here for the Wizards to make the deal better for both teams.

I dont think Indiana will take Wiggins. Their ethos is just not to have max players unless they are superstars, which Wiggins is....not. They want to be as competitive as possible but always need to control costs. Obviously Wiseman is super attractive to them because of his upside and that he's cost controlled for so long.

Turner is great for GSW for reasons stated by others but they still have a depth problem. So, the Wizards should insert themselves by taking Wiggins and a pick package (either the Minn pick OR the GSW pick and 2 seconds) for Bertans, Bryant and Hutchinston.It would look like this:

GSW In: Turner, Bertans, Justin Holiday
GSW Out: Wiggins, Wiseman, aforementioned pick package

Indy In: Wiseman, Bryant (exp), Hutch
Indy out: Turner, J. Holiday

DC In: Wiggins, GSW pick package
DC out: Bertans, Bryant, Hutch

GSW's Why: Get back 3 rotation players who are all great fits. Bertans can be on the court with 2-3 excellent defenders at all times and 1-2 all-time great shooters who create a ton of gravity and open shots for him; he'd be deadly. Holiday is a needed tough veteran swing defender who can knock down shots. They get way more productivity for the money.

Indy's Why: Bryant is expiring and a nice bridge to Wise the Prize. Teams like Indy don't get shots at talents like Wiseman very often. Plus, it creates more prized financial flexibility for them.

DC's why: Better fit now while stocking up assets for the future. While Wiggins isn't remotely worth his contract, the timing of it lines with Westbrook's and clarifies the Wizards window for whatever it is they are doing. And while Wiggins isn't good, he's not terrible and a better fit with Rui and Deni than Bertans. The financial burden here is worth it due to the ability to build for the future with the pick(s) while also creating a more balanced roster in the short term.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#152 » by payitforward » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:19 pm

The above is an improved version of:

nate33 wrote:
mhd wrote:...Wiz trade Bertans+Bryant (expiring)+Hutchison (expiring) for Wiggins+#34+#35...

...I think we could extract their first round pick in the transaction (their own 2021 pick, not the Minny pick).

...because (if I understand it correctly) it gets us 3 picks.

Otherwise, it's simply a restatement of this proposal.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#153 » by Ruzious » Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:16 pm

One player that i'd move a lot to get - that some people probably haven't caught onto how good he's becoming - is Miles Bridges - Charlotte's SF. I think he's gonna be a supastar. Charlotte - with MJ - has never been good with building a team, so I'd see if something could be worked out. They don't have a center with any experience signed, so Bryant would probably be part of the trade, and since they didn't use Vernon Carey at all last season, he can come to us, and they re-up with Biyumbo to back up Bryant. The rest of the trade, I don't know - but would probably include Avdija and a pick.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#154 » by wall_glizzy » Sat Jun 12, 2021 1:52 am

Ruzious wrote:One player that i'd move a lot to get - that some people probably haven't caught onto how good he's becoming - is Miles Bridges - Charlotte's SF. I think he's gonna be a supastar. Charlotte - with MJ - has never been good with building a team, so I'd see if something could be worked out. They don't have a center with any experience signed, so Bryant would probably be part of the trade, and since they didn't use Vernon Carey at all last season, he can come to us, and they re-up with Biyumbo to back up Bryant. The rest of the trade, I don't know - but would probably include Avdija and a pick.


I think they're aiming a little higher as far as a center to replace the dusty Zeller / Biyombo rotation goes - they're definitely gonna make runs at Richaun Holmes (in FA), Myles Turner (via trade), John Collins and Jarrett Allen (via restricted FA). They had PJ Washington playing the small ball 5 now and again last year too! But yeah, I like Bridges as well - he'd be a great pickup for us if we could somehow land him. Can't imagine his value is too far off of, say, Rui's though - he wouldn't come too cheaply. Charlotte's gotta like how their future looks, provided they can find any type of warm body at the 5 to run it back with.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#155 » by payitforward » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:04 am

I like Miles Bridges for sure, but... that seems like a whole lot to give for him. Bryant, Avdija & a pick for Bridges & Carey?

Now, if he's going to become a superstar... sure! But, that's quite a jump -- even tho he's been quite good, to be sure. Had a good rookie year, backed up a fair amount his second year, but came back even better this year.

Love to have him.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#156 » by payitforward » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:13 am

wall_glizzy wrote:
Ruzious wrote:One player that i'd move a lot to get - that some people probably haven't caught onto how good he's becoming - is Miles Bridges - Charlotte's SF. ....

... I like Bridges as well - he'd be a great pickup for us if we could somehow land him. Can't imagine his value is too far off of, say, Rui's though....

Rui won't be traded, b/c he has too much marketing value.

From a pure basketball perspective, it would be a no-brainer to take Bridges straight up for him. They are the same age, but Bridges has established himself & has been a substantially better player than Rui.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#157 » by wall_glizzy » Sat Jun 12, 2021 4:13 am

payitforward wrote:
wall_glizzy wrote:
Ruzious wrote:One player that i'd move a lot to get - that some people probably haven't caught onto how good he's becoming - is Miles Bridges - Charlotte's SF. ....

... I like Bridges as well - he'd be a great pickup for us if we could somehow land him. Can't imagine his value is too far off of, say, Rui's though....

Rui won't be traded, b/c he has too much marketing value.

From a pure basketball perspective, it would be a no-brainer to take Bridges straight up for him. They are the same age, but Bridges has established himself & has been a substantially better player than Rui.


Definitely not swapping Rui for him, I just meant that I thought it would take more than Bryant. Not sure how I completely missed that last sentence about including Avdija and a pick - that's definitely way too much!
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#158 » by Ruzious » Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:55 am

wall_glizzy wrote:
payitforward wrote:
wall_glizzy wrote:... I like Bridges as well - he'd be a great pickup for us if we could somehow land him. Can't imagine his value is too far off of, say, Rui's though....

Rui won't be traded, b/c he has too much marketing value.

From a pure basketball perspective, it would be a no-brainer to take Bridges straight up for him. They are the same age, but Bridges has established himself & has been a substantially better player than Rui.


Definitely not swapping Rui for him, I just meant that I thought it would take more than Bryant. Not sure how I completely missed that last sentence about including Avdija and a pick - that's definitely way too much!

I doubt it's enough. I love Bryant, but he's an expiring contract coming off a major injury, and Deni's coming off a terrible rookie year. If Bridges is going to be a star, he's worth including the 15th pick, and we have a huge need for a 3. The last 20 games of the season, he averaged over 20 points a game on 64% TS% - making 43.5% of 3's on a high volume. Gotta look at how a young player is trending to tell if he's likely gonna take that next step. He is. Also, getting Carey at least helps fill the backup center position need. He did well in the G League as a 19/20 year old.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#159 » by Dat2U » Sat Jun 12, 2021 11:22 am

payitforward wrote:
prime1time wrote:What do people think about Bol Bol?

This being the trade thread, I assume you mean to ask what anyone thinks about acquiring him -- right?

I wouldn't give anything for Bol Bol. Of course, I doubt we'd have to give anything. So let me put it differently. I wouldn't sign him if Denver released him.


I wouldn't give up anything for him but I'd definitely sign him to a minimum deal or on a two-way deal. Guys with that height & skill are non-existant so he needs a longer look. He's never had any reliable minutes so I'm hard pressed to say he's doomed to be a scrub. I'd want him in my program and see him up close before writing him off.
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Re: Official Trade Thread - Part XLI 

Post#160 » by payitforward » Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:56 pm

Dat2U wrote:
payitforward wrote:
prime1time wrote:What do people think about Bol Bol?

This being the trade thread, I assume you mean to ask what anyone thinks about acquiring him -- right?

I wouldn't give anything for Bol Bol. Of course, I doubt we'd have to give anything. So let me put it differently. I wouldn't sign him if Denver released him.

I wouldn't give up anything for him but I'd definitely sign him to a minimum deal or on a two-way deal. Guys with that height & skill are non-existant so he needs a longer look. He's never had any reliable minutes so I'm hard pressed to say he's doomed to be a scrub. I'd want him in my program and see him up close before writing him off.

Well... sure! Why not? Something of an overstatement on my part!
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