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Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread

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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#201 » by nate33 » Fri Sep 10, 2021 8:55 pm

dckingsfan wrote:Just one more thing... usually it is myocarditis risk associated with vaccination that is cited as the complication (and the driving factor for kids getting hospitalized after vaccines).

Well, it turns out that COVID-19 itself is much higher than with the vaccines... so, there is that.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2110475

C'mon now. Talk about disinformation. That's a study of the entire population, not just kids.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#202 » by nate33 » Fri Sep 10, 2021 9:31 pm

dckingsfan wrote:

There are several parts to vaccinating kids.

1) Overall herd immunity with the population. Kids represent a significant portion of the population. It is about getting everyone vaccinated.

No. It's about saving lives. Vaccination is a component, but not necessarily for everyone.

2) Kids get and spread Covid - this is important especially in schools. Note that a Significant number of schools have closed - because of staffing issues (not just kids getting Covid).

Kids spread Covid FAR less effectively than adults. We've known this for over a year when the studies first came out of Denmark.

3) Our pediatric healthcare system is fragile. A surge in Covid + RSV has overwhelmed some of the children's hospitals - specifically in communities where vaccination rates are low.

Fair point. I'm definitely on board with the "flatten the curve" concept. Taking steps to slow the spread a times when hospitals are overwhelmed makes total sense.

4) Myocarditis is real with the vaccine, there have been 1,047 reports total for those under 30. Let there be no doubt that more under 30s died of Covid than the reported myocarditis side effects.

Clever how you shifted it to under 30. What are the stats for under 19?

We know deaths in that cohort are less than 500 out of 80 million, or about 6 per million (with an estimated 27 million infected). And those are mostly with comorbidities. Healthy kids have a death rate around 1 per million. Also, that 1047 number is old, from an article on July 1st. We hadn't been vaccinating kids for that long at that point. That same article says that there have been 76 myocarditis cases per million kids ages 6-17.


5) Kids long haulers is real. Studies in the US had it pegged between 5-10%. A new study out of England puts the rate between 2-14%. Take the lowest number and that dwarfs myocarditis.

Definitely take the lowest number. Long-haulers are wildly overrated. If you can't smell for 5 weeks, you are considered a long-hauler. A recent study in UK shows that the long-hauler phenomenon isn't nearly as bad as initially expected. Less than 2% had symptoms after 8 weeks:
https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/long-covid-uncommon-in-children


6) Lastly, across the board, pediatricians unequivocally believe that the benefits of vaccination far, far, far outweigh any risks - I think that is a quote from the HHS chief scientific officer for the COVID-19.

Of course that's what they believe. They are following the lead of the CDC who have been consistently dismissive of any narrative that puts into question mass vaccination. They don't even acknowledge natural immunity, which 100 million Americans have. It's deception like this that has made the public more suspicious and vaccine-hesitant. It's a shame because certainly everyone older than 50 and those with comorbidities should absolutely get vaccinated.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#203 » by Dat2U » Fri Sep 10, 2021 9:43 pm

As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#204 » by nate33 » Fri Sep 10, 2021 10:57 pm

Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

If vaccines are such a no-brainer from a medical perspective, why have 30-40% of the staff of the freaking NIH not been vaccinated?
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#205 » by tontoz » Fri Sep 10, 2021 11:35 pm

With so many people working from home I bet most companies aren't even aware how many of their people are vaccinated. It was just a week ago that I sent in copies of my vax card online at work.

The only reason I did that was because we have to be vaxed just to visit the office now. Prior to that how would top mgt know?
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#206 » by DCZards » Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:18 am

nate33 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

If vaccines are such a no-brainer from a medical perspective, why have 30-40% of the staff of the freaking NIH not been vaccinated?

Maybe because a good percentage of the NIH staff are not medical people or scientists, but just regular folks who happen to work at the NIH as secretaries, cafeteria workers, maintenance employees, security, etc.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#207 » by Ruzious » Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:26 am

Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

That's probably not accurate considering this article from all the way back to June 21st had it at 83%.
https://www.dailywire.com/news/nih-inadvertently-exposes-data-on-individual-employees-vaccination-statuses-online
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#208 » by Dat2U » Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:35 am

Ruzious wrote:
Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

That's probably not accurate considering this article from all the way back to June 21st had it at 83%.
https://www.dailywire.com/news/nih-inadvertently-exposes-data-on-individual-employees-vaccination-statuses-online


The source is NIH lol. I assume they are pretty accurate with their own numbers and would have no reason to mislead their own staff. There may be more who are in the process of taking it who aren't considered fully vaxxed yet.

Edit: I read the link posted. They are referring to CR (Cancer Research) staff in CMB... that's just one institute/center (IC) at NIH. There's 27 ICs at NIH and the article was just reporting on one of them lol.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#209 » by Ruzious » Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:37 am

Dat2U wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

That's probably not accurate considering this article from all the way back to June 21st had it at 83%.
https://www.dailywire.com/news/nih-inadvertently-exposes-data-on-individual-employees-vaccination-statuses-online


The source is NIH lol. I assume they are pretty accurate with their own numbers and would have no reason to mislead their own staff. There may be more who are in the process of taking it who aren't considered fully vaxxed yet.

Do you have a link to that? I know a couple of people who work there. I can check it if you give us the link.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#210 » by Dat2U » Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:44 am

Ruzious wrote:
Dat2U wrote:
Ruzious wrote:That's probably not accurate considering this article from all the way back to June 21st had it at 83%.
https://www.dailywire.com/news/nih-inadvertently-exposes-data-on-individual-employees-vaccination-statuses-online


The source is NIH lol. I assume they are pretty accurate with their own numbers and would have no reason to mislead their own staff. There may be more who are in the process of taking it who aren't considered fully vaxxed yet.

Do you have a link to that? I know a couple of people who work there. I can check it if you give us the link.


It was said at a Town Hall for NIH staff yesterday. I don't think it's available publicly.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#211 » by Dat2U » Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:46 am

DCZards wrote:
nate33 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

If vaccines are such a no-brainer from a medical perspective, why have 30-40% of the staff of the freaking NIH not been vaccinated?

Maybe because a good percentage of the NIH staff are not medical people or scientists, but just regular folks who happen to work at the NIH as secretaries, cafeteria workers, maintenance employees, security, etc.


This is very true.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#212 » by nate33 » Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:06 pm

DCZards wrote:
nate33 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

If vaccines are such a no-brainer from a medical perspective, why have 30-40% of the staff of the freaking NIH not been vaccinated?

Maybe because a good percentage of the NIH staff are not medical people or scientists, but just regular folks who happen to work at the NIH as secretaries, cafeteria workers, maintenance employees, security, etc.

I'm sure that's true. But NIH certainly has a higher percentage of its staff who is knowledgeable about medical issues than the staff of an average business. Either the knowledgeable people are more vaccine-hesitant than average, or the unknowledgeable cafeteria workers and security guards are FAR more vaccine-hesitant than average (to offset the knowledgeable people). After all, 75% of the over 18 population is vaccinated.

It's probably just a small sample size issue, now that Dat2U has pointed out that it's just one office. But if it was the entire NIH, I would consider it to be a noteworthy data point.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#213 » by tontoz » Sat Sep 11, 2021 3:32 pm


Less than a month into the new school year, the U.S. is seeing a record number of children hospitalized for COVID-19. According to data from the CDC, the hospitalization rate for children under 18 is five times what it was in June, and the New York Times reports that nearly 30,000 adolescents and children were hospitalized for coronavirus in August.

But the spike in hospitalizations is especially concerning given the capacity of pediatric ICU units, which average just 12 beds per hospital. In Louisiana and Texas, some children’s hospitals are completely overwhelmed, with federal “surge teams” bringing emergency workers in to help.

While vaccines, which are playing a key role in keeping people with COVID-19 infections out of hospitals, are still not available for kids under 12, adult vaccinations seem to be minimizing the number of sick children. The ten most vaccinated states haven’t seen much change in their pediatric hospitalization rates, while the biggest increases are happening in states with low vaccination rates. Doctors in overrun ICUs are also urging all adults, vaccinated or not, to wear masks and socially distance in public, especially if they’re coming into contact with children.




https://www.thecut.com/2021/09/a-record-number-of-kids-are-being-hospitalized-for-covid.html
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#214 » by dckingsfan » Sat Sep 11, 2021 5:00 pm

nate33 wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:

There are several parts to vaccinating kids.

1) Overall herd immunity with the population. Kids represent a significant portion of the population. It is about getting everyone vaccinated.

No. It's about saving lives. Vaccination is a component, but not necessarily for everyone.

2) Kids get and spread Covid - this is important especially in schools. Note that a Significant number of schools have closed - because of staffing issues (not just kids getting Covid).

Kids spread Covid FAR less effectively than adults. We've known this for over a year when the studies first came out of Denmark.

3) Our pediatric healthcare system is fragile. A surge in Covid + RSV has overwhelmed some of the children's hospitals - specifically in communities where vaccination rates are low.

Fair point. I'm definitely on board with the "flatten the curve" concept. Taking steps to slow the spread a times when hospitals are overwhelmed makes total sense.

4) Myocarditis is real with the vaccine, there have been 1,047 reports total for those under 30. Let there be no doubt that more under 30s died of Covid than the reported myocarditis side effects.

Clever how you shifted it to under 30. What are the stats for under 19?

We know deaths in that cohort are less than 500 out of 80 million, or about 6 per million (with an estimated 27 million infected). And those are mostly with comorbidities. Healthy kids have a death rate around 1 per million. Also, that 1047 number is old, from an article on July 1st. We hadn't been vaccinating kids for that long at that point. That same article says that there have been 76 myocarditis cases per million kids ages 6-17.


5) Kids long haulers is real. Studies in the US had it pegged between 5-10%. A new study out of England puts the rate between 2-14%. Take the lowest number and that dwarfs myocarditis.

Definitely take the lowest number. Long-haulers are wildly overrated. If you can't smell for 5 weeks, you are considered a long-hauler. A recent study in UK shows that the long-hauler phenomenon isn't nearly as bad as initially expected. Less than 2% had symptoms after 8 weeks:
https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/long-covid-uncommon-in-children


6) Lastly, across the board, pediatricians unequivocally believe that the benefits of vaccination far, far, far outweigh any risks - I think that is a quote from the HHS chief scientific officer for the COVID-19.

Of course that's what they believe. They are following the lead of the CDC who have been consistently dismissive of any narrative that puts into question mass vaccination. They don't even acknowledge natural immunity, which 100 million Americans have. It's deception like this that has made the public more suspicious and vaccine-hesitant. It's a shame because certainly everyone older than 50 and those with comorbidities should absolutely get vaccinated.

1) Of course it is - herd immunity allows us to save lives, open up the economy faster and reduce long haulers - in adults and children.

2) It turns out that kids spread Covid just as efficiently as adults especially with Delta because the viral loads are so much larger. Some say that they are actually more effective at spreading Covid now. Remember, with a vaccine you can still spread Covid but for a much shorter time span essentially dropping the R value.

4) I shifted to under 30 because those are the statistics that are reported. We also know that nearly all of the myocarditis events self resolve without hospitalization for those under 18. The point? Kids getting vaccines aren't dying of the vaccine and it allows us to get to herd immunity. And the risk of developing myocarditis was significantly higher for those youngsters who have contracted Covid-19 compared to those who have been vaccinated.

5) Let's take the lowest number - 2% is huge compared to vaccine issues. Even 1% drives us to the "get the damn vaccine".

6) No, pediatricians in general aren't blindly following the CDC. There is no, trust me you can't trust your pediatrician - that is nonsense and that is the real deception. We have folks saying, trust me, you can't trust your doctor - take this Ivermectin - stupid and deceptive.

And let's get to natural immunity - it really hasn't helped much in this latest surge, especially for kids. You want to know what the cat's ass is? Infection + vaccination. Everyone over 12 should get vaccinated for the good of the kids, the pediatric healthcare system and the entire community.

One thing - we shouldn't mandate them until they are approved.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#215 » by dckingsfan » Sat Sep 11, 2021 5:04 pm

nate33 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

If vaccines are such a no-brainer from a medical perspective, why have 30-40% of the staff of the freaking NIH not been vaccinated?

What is the percentage of doctors that are vaccinated. Super high - like over 99%. Nurses are headed the same way.

So, let's define "staff" at the NIH please. I know zero of the PhDs there that aren't vaccinated. The problem with NIH and vaccinations is it is all "self reported".

And as long as we are fact checking:
https://www.factcheck.org/2021/05/scicheck-posts-distort-testimony-of-federal-health-officials-on-employee-vaccinations/
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#216 » by dckingsfan » Sat Sep 11, 2021 5:11 pm

nate33 wrote:
DCZards wrote:
nate33 wrote:If vaccines are such a no-brainer from a medical perspective, why have 30-40% of the staff of the freaking NIH not been vaccinated?

Maybe because a good percentage of the NIH staff are not medical people or scientists, but just regular folks who happen to work at the NIH as secretaries, cafeteria workers, maintenance employees, security, etc.

I'm sure that's true. But NIH certainly has a higher percentage of its staff who is knowledgeable about medical issues than the staff of an average business. Either the knowledgeable people are more vaccine-hesitant than average, or the unknowledgeable cafeteria workers and security guards are FAR more vaccine-hesitant than average (to offset the knowledgeable people). After all, 75% of the over 18 population is vaccinated.

It's probably just a small sample size issue, now that Dat2U has pointed out that it's just one office. But if it was the entire NIH, I would consider it to be a noteworthy data point.

Wow, a janitor at NIH would be more knowledgeable? I was talking to a phlebotomist - he said he overheard other phlebotomist's giving advice on vaccinations. Really? This is ridiculous.

Doctors and PhD vaccinations rates are ridiculously high. Like nearing 100% except for those that can't take vaccines.

So who is saying that vaccines are amazing, efficacious and safe. The talking heads saying, trust me, you can't trust them.

Well, trust me, you can't trust those talking heads that we told by the NIH janitors that this might not be safe.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#217 » by Dat2U » Sat Sep 11, 2021 6:01 pm

dckingsfan wrote:
nate33 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:As of 9/9/21, NIH advised approx. 60-70% of NIH staff was vaxxed. Collins & Fauci advised its now mandatory for all staff (fed & contractor) today in a Town Hall. We'll see a decent amount of openings become available.

If vaccines are such a no-brainer from a medical perspective, why have 30-40% of the staff of the freaking NIH not been vaccinated?

What is the percentage of doctors that are vaccinated. Super high - like over 99%. Nurses are headed the same way.

So, let's define "staff" at the NIH please. I know zero of the PhDs there that aren't vaccinated. The problem with NIH and vaccinations is it is all "self reported".

And as long as we are fact checking:
https://www.factcheck.org/2021/05/scicheck-posts-distort-testimony-of-federal-health-officials-on-employee-vaccinations/


NIH has a tracking system, they can tell if you took the shot - if it's through one of their locations or scheduled through your insurer. People only need to self-report if it's outside of one of those methods.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#218 » by Dat2U » Sat Sep 11, 2021 6:05 pm

nate33 wrote:
It's probably just a small sample size issue, now that Dat2U has pointed out that it's just one office. But if it was the entire NIH, I would consider it to be a noteworthy data point.


To clarify, the 60-70% as of 9/9 as referring to all of NIH. And no the remaining 30% of those folks aren't all janitors lol.

The article Ruz pointed to was indicating the results for just one specific branch.
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#219 » by tontoz » Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:03 pm

Apparently the moderna vaccine is more effective. J&j vaccine lagging and apparently out of favor. I saw in another article only 14 million have gotten the J&J vaccine.

.


A second study showed that the Moderna coronavirus vaccine was more effective in preventing hospitalizations than its counterparts from Pfizer-BioNTech and Johnson & Johnson. That assessment was based on the largest U.S. study to date of the real-world effectiveness of all three vaccines, involving about 32,000 patients seen in hospitals, emergency departments and urgent-care clinics across nine states from June through early August.

While the three vaccines were collectively 86 percent effective in preventing hospitalization, protection was significantly higher among Moderna vaccine recipients (95 percent) than among those who got Pfizer-BioNTech (80 percent) or Johnson & Johnson (60 percent). That finding echoes a smaller study by the Mayo Clinic Health System in August, not yet peer-reviewed, which showed the Moderna vaccine to be more effective than Pfizer-BioNTech at preventing infections during the delta wave.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/09/10/moderna-most-effective-covid-vaccine-studies/
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Re: Wizards Board COVID-19 Thread 

Post#220 » by Ruzious » Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:24 pm

Dat2U wrote:
nate33 wrote:
It's probably just a small sample size issue, now that Dat2U has pointed out that it's just one office. But if it was the entire NIH, I would consider it to be a noteworthy data point.


To clarify, the 60-70% as of 9/9 as referring to all of NIH. And no the remaining 30% of those folks aren't all janitors lol.

The article Ruz pointed to was indicating the results for just one specific branch.

There's probably ZERO scientists there that have not been vaccinated.
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