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Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:08 pm
by payitforward
Our first preseason game is 3 weeks from today against the Houston Rockets. So... when does Training Camp begin? Anyone know?

What do we hope to learn from TC & preseason?

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:34 pm
by Wizardspride
payitforward wrote:Our first preseason game is 3 weeks from today against the Houston Rockets. So... when does Training Camp begin? Anyone know?

What do we hope to learn from TC & preseason?

Training camp starts Sept 28.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:49 pm
by SUPERBALLMAN
Wizardspride wrote:
payitforward wrote:Our first preseason game is 3 weeks from today against the Houston Rockets. So... when does Training Camp begin? Anyone know?

What do we hope to learn from TC & preseason?

Training camp starts Sept 28.



Training camp is only a week? Is that normal? Seems short, I would think it would be a couple weeks at least.

:-?

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:02 pm
by Frichuela
ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:36 pm
by nate33
Frichuela wrote:ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!

I'm really curious about how this will all turn out.

Is Westbrook an empty stats guy who doesn't help except as a floor raiser? Or is Westbrook still a legit superstar player and we will suffer when he is gone? The ESPN guys presumably assume the latter.

The OKC situation where Westbrook was swapped with Chris Paul suggests the former, but then, Chris Paul is also a very unusual player. Was the surprising win total of the OKC team "addition by subtraction" because of Westbrook's departure, or merely the addition of an all-time great point guard and winner?

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:06 pm
by Chocolate City Jordanaire
SUPERBALLMAN wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:
payitforward wrote:Our first preseason game is 3 weeks from today against the Houston Rockets. So... when does Training Camp begin? Anyone know?

What do we hope to learn from TC & preseason?

Training camp starts Sept 28.



Training camp is only a week? Is that normal? Seems short, I would think it would be a couple weeks at least.

:-?
Is Corey Kispert the same guy we saw in summer league or is he better than that?

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:08 pm
by Chocolate City Jordanaire
nate33 wrote:
Frichuela wrote:ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!

I'm really curious about how this will all turn out.

Is Westbrook an empty stats guy who doesn't help except as a floor raiser? Or is Westbrook still a legit superstar player and we will suffer when he is gone? The ESPN guys presumably assume the latter.

The OKC situation where Westbrook was swapped with Chris Paul suggests the former, but then, Chris Paul is also a very unusual player. Was the surprising win total of the OKC team "addition by subtraction" because of Westbrook's departure, or merely the addition of an all-time great point guard and winner?
He is a legit Superstar who is past his prime. However, once he got healthy he still had a very above average game.

His energy and pace will be an asset to the Lakers IF he stays healthy.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2021 11:07 pm
by payitforward
nate33 wrote:
Frichuela wrote:ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!

I'm really curious about how this will all turn out.

Is Westbrook an empty stats guy who doesn't help except as a floor raiser? Or is Westbrook still a legit superstar player and we will suffer when he is gone? The ESPN guys presumably assume the latter.

The OKC situation where Westbrook was swapped with Chris Paul suggests the former, but then, Chris Paul is also a very unusual player. Was the surprising win total of the OKC team "addition by subtraction" because of Westbrook's departure, or merely the addition of an all-time great point guard and winner?

No question we'll suffer from Westbrook being gone -- or, rather, we would suffer if we hadn't more or less re-made the roster!

7 of the players on our 15-man roster at the end of last year are gone. Plus, Mathews, who was a 2-way guy but played almost 1100 minutes, is also gone. Those guys played 8612 minutes. That is literally 1/2 our minutes from last year.

We have 7 players on the team who weren't Wizards last year (KCP, Harrell, Kuzma, Dinwiddie, Holiday, Kispert, & Todd). Plus, we get Bryant back. That's 8 different players. I would expect those guys to play more than half our minutes this year.

Plus, we only had Gafford for 1/3 of the season. He played 400 minutes. I would expect at least 1200 minutes from him this year.

If I'm not totally off on minutes, & if all our players produce at more or less their historical levels, we are a way way better team than we were last year. Something like 45 wins. Maybe more.

Of course, arithmetic only takes you so far. Let's see them do it....

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:25 pm
by doclinkin
Frichuela wrote:ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!


It's all on Coach Wes really. I could see it going either way. Chemistry-wise, I wish we had a stone cold winner on the court who could keep the team focused. The sort of player who does not get distracted. Brad has been known to pout on court, showing poor body language or fussing to the refs instead of sprinting back on defense. Spencer is vocal, but may have to grow into a leadership role and making the right read; a player shooting 30% from 3 has no business hoisting 6 of them per game. Trez is passionate but that can be distracting if not destructive if it is not focussed against the opponents. There may be a reason why he has skipped teams in a few short years, could be his locker room act grows tiresome. I can see us leading the league in bitching at the refs unless Wes' calm and serious mindset is heeded by all. Westbrook was a force here in that way, firing up a guy like Rui, highly competitive high effort. Who is the alpha wolf on this team? Interestingly Beal is the vet who has been in the league the longest. Maybe he takes that leadership role seriously. This is finally truly his team.

If all the chemistry works though, we have some interestingly complementary pieces. We have defense at key positions, shooting from any spot on the floor and any position on the roster, interior scoring, ball-handling attack to rack fouls. If our team play exceeds our raw talent then the high 40's in wins is not inconceivable. The East is stronger, yes, deeper too, few teams rely on a single star to carry them and we may be one with Beal taking shots at a high volume. But if Beal works on his own leadership game, making the pass, acting as decoy, etc, we have enough floor balance to be tough to guard. We are shallow in ball-handling and assist duties, so playmaking may have to come from schemes and teamwork at times.

It may take a while for chemistry to click and Wes to ID what works well. Line-ups, sets, plays, in bounds, end game--what works? Nobody has yet seen these guys together. They have to grow together. But we have smart experienced young veterans. In Beal, KCP and SD26 we have 9, 8, 7 years in the league, all 28 years old, our most experienced players will have the ball the most. Bertans and Neto have 5 and 6 years but overseas experience. Shoot, Deni won't be 21 til January but has been a pro since he was 16.

On average a player's prime years are 26-30. In Harrell, Kuzma, Holiday we are 27, 26, 25 years old. Players with talent and upside still untapped. Players who breakout tend to experience a bump in their 3rd year when the game starts to slow for them and they develop consistency in the abilities they've shown flashes of. Gafford and Hachimura are in this category with 2 years under their belts, but you could expect Bryant, Kuzma, and Holiday (4 years, 4 years, 3 years) each have had their growth stunted by injury / team circumstances / changing roles. Bryant was showing his breakout potential already when he went down. Kuzma has a dozen double doubles a year, a bakers dozen 30 pt games in his career, at least one 40-piece. Holiday is acknowledged as one of the better young defenders in the league, on and off the ball, has a handful of 20+ pt games or double doubles on good efficiency, posts high +/- numbers.

Growth is the key. But it takes time. If we click early, if Wes is a magician, for sure we could play better than .500 ball. For now though I think we are in discovery mode, learning who plays well with each other. What plays work. Our early games may look like a scrimmage as players are figuring each other out and trying to impress each other and the coaching staff. A bit wild, not crisp. Still these are overall smart players who seem to love the game with only a couple raw talents still figuring it out. There's a solid chance they find their rhythm and fairly swiftly the pack figures out how to hunt together, alpha wolf or no.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:28 pm
by Chocolate City Jordanaire
payitforward wrote:
nate33 wrote:
Frichuela wrote:ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!

I'm really curious about how this will all turn out.

Is Westbrook an empty stats guy who doesn't help except as a floor raiser? Or is Westbrook still a legit superstar player and we will suffer when he is gone? The ESPN guys presumably assume the latter.

The OKC situation where Westbrook was swapped with Chris Paul suggests the former, but then, Chris Paul is also a very unusual player. Was the surprising win total of the OKC team "addition by subtraction" because of Westbrook's departure, or merely the addition of an all-time great point guard and winner?

No question we'll suffer from Westbrook being gone -- or, rather, we would suffer if we hadn't more or less re-made the roster!

7 of the players on our 15-man roster at the end of last year are gone. Plus, Mathews, who was a 2-way guy but played almost 1100 minutes, is also gone. Those guys played 8612 minutes. That is literally 1/2 our minutes from last year.

We have 7 players on the team who weren't Wizards last year (KCP, Harrell, Kuzma, Dinwiddie, Holiday, Kispert, & Todd). Plus, we get Bryant back. That's 8 different players. I would expect those guys to play more than half our minutes this year.

Plus, we only had Gafford for 1/3 of the season. He played 400 minutes. I would expect at least 1200 minutes from him this year.

If I'm not totally off on minutes, & if all our players produce at more or less their historical levels, we are a way way better team than we were last year. Something like 45 wins. Maybe more.

Of course, arithmetic only takes you so far. Let's see them do it....

I think 43 games is a very reasonable prediction. It wouldn’t shock me if this team won 49 or 50 games. It would surprise me but it wouldn’t shock me.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:31 pm
by Chocolate City Jordanaire
doclinkin wrote:
Frichuela wrote:ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!


It's all on Coach Wes really. I could see it going either way. Chemistry-wise, I wish we had a stone cold winner on the court who could keep the team focused. The sort of player who does not get distracted. Brad has been known to pout on court, showing poor body language or fussing to the refs instead of sprinting back on defense. Spencer is vocal, but may have to grow into a leadership role and making the right read; a player shooting 30% from 3 has no business hoisting 6 of them per game. Trez is passionate but that can be distracting if not destructive if it is not focussed against the opponents. There may be a reason why he has skipped teams in a few short years, could be his locker room act grows tiresome. I can see us leading the league in bitching at the refs unless Wes' calm and serious mindset is heeded by all. Westbrook was a force here in that way, firing up a guy like Rui, highly competitive high effort. Who is the alpha wolf on this team? Interestingly Beal is the vet who has been in the league the longest. Maybe he takes that leadership role seriously. This is finally truly his team.

If all the chemistry works though, we have some interestingly complementary pieces. We have defense at key positions, shooting from any spot on the floor and any position on the roster, interior scoring, ball-handling attack to rack fouls. If our team play exceeds our raw talent then the high 40's in wins is not inconceivable. The East is stronger, yes, deeper too, few teams rely on a single star to carry them and we may be one with Beal taking shots at a high volume. But if Beal works on his own leadership game, making the pass, acting as decoy, etc, we have enough floor balance to be tough to guard. We are shallow in ball-handling and assist duties, so playmaking may have to come from schemes and teamwork at times.

It may take a while for chemistry to click and Wes to ID what works well. Line-ups, sets, plays, in bounds, end game--what works? Nobody has yet seen these guys together. They have to grow together. But we have smart experienced young veterans. In Beal, KCP and SD26 we have 9, 8, 7 years in the league, all 28 years old, our most experienced players will have the ball the most. Bertans and Neto have 5 and 6 years but overseas experience. Shoot, Deni won't be 21 til January but has been a pro since he was 16.

On average a player's prime years are 26-30. In Harrell, Kuzma, Holiday we are 27, 26, 25 years old. Players with talent and upside still untapped. Players who breakout tend to experience a bump in their 3rd year when the game starts to slow for them and they develop consistency in the abilities they've shown flashes of. Gafford and Hachimura are in this category with 2 years under their belts, but you could expect Bryant, Kuzma, and Holiday (4 years, 4 years, 3 years) each have had their growth stunted by injury / team circumstances / changing roles. Bryant was showing his breakout potential already when he went down. Kuzma has a dozen double doubles a year, a bakers dozen 30 pt games in his career, at least one 40-piece. Holiday is acknowledged as one of the better young defenders in the league, on and off the ball, has a handful of 20+ pt games or double doubles on good efficiency, posts high +/- numbers.

Growth is the key. But it takes time. If we click early, if Wes is a magician, for sure we could play better than .500 ball. For now though I think we are in discovery mode, learning who plays well with each other. What plays work. Our early games may look like a scrimmage as players are figuring each other out and trying to impress each other and the coaching staff. A bit wild, not crisp. Still these are overall smart players who seem to love the game with only a couple raw talents still figuring it out. There's a solid chance they find their rhythm and fairly swiftly the pack figures out how to hunt together.


It truly is on Coach Wesley Junior.

If he can get teammates to be both accountable and professional and supportive to the point they make each other better; then this team is going to synergistically produce in the win column.

If he is myopic like the previous coach and if he plays favorites or if he just does not recognize boundaries strengths weaknesses and how to motivate, then this team might only win 20 something games. Worst case scenario would be a backbiting group of guys in it for themselves who do not respect the neophyte coach. Nepotism could be part of how he got the job.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Mon Sep 20, 2021 6:50 pm
by FAH1223
SUPERBALLMAN wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:
payitforward wrote:Our first preseason game is 3 weeks from today against the Houston Rockets. So... when does Training Camp begin? Anyone know?

What do we hope to learn from TC & preseason?

Training camp starts Sept 28.



Training camp is only a week? Is that normal? Seems short, I would think it would be a couple weeks at least.

:-?


Pretty normal. A week to 10 days.

Preseason is sort of lumped into it as you have the expanded roster during part of that time...

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:19 pm
by FAH1223
Nice to see a bunch of guys already in town


Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 1:41 am
by doclinkin
FAH1223 wrote:Nice to see a bunch of guys already in town



Wish we had video. A Wiz-cam feed to watch the scrimmages and see chemistry develop.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:04 pm
by doclinkin
This year's Garrison Mathews: Jordan Schakel joins us on an exhibit 10 contract.


Watch on YouTube



Watch on YouTube


He was on the Summer League champion squad. Played well. The battle in training camp is for the last 2-way spot to make the team. Given how shallow we are at off-guard I guess he figured this was the best bet to make a team.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:10 pm
by doclinkin
Also joining are:

Jay Huff:


Watch on YouTube


Jaime Echenique:


Watch on YouTube


Jordan Goodwin:


Watch on YouTube

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:07 pm
by Dat2U
doclinkin wrote:
Frichuela wrote:ESPN just predicted that our 2020-21 season will be 36-46, 11th seed...missing the playin tournament.

I am certainly a homer, and probably I'm drinking too much kool aid ;-), but I would think IF Dinwiddie comes back close to his form in the 2019-20 season, we should hit 41 wins at the minimum. We have so much more depth than last year...and Scotty is gone!!!


It's all on Coach Wes really. I could see it going either way. Chemistry-wise, I wish we had a stone cold winner on the court who could keep the team focused. The sort of player who does not get distracted. Brad has been known to pout on court, showing poor body language or fussing to the refs instead of sprinting back on defense. Spencer is vocal, but may have to grow into a leadership role and making the right read; a player shooting 30% from 3 has no business hoisting 6 of them per game. Trez is passionate but that can be distracting if not destructive if it is not focussed against the opponents. There may be a reason why he has skipped teams in a few short years, could be his locker room act grows tiresome. I can see us leading the league in bitching at the refs unless Wes' calm and serious mindset is heeded by all. Westbrook was a force here in that way, firing up a guy like Rui, highly competitive high effort. Who is the alpha wolf on this team? Interestingly Beal is the vet who has been in the league the longest. Maybe he takes that leadership role seriously. This is finally truly his team.

If all the chemistry works though, we have some interestingly complementary pieces. We have defense at key positions, shooting from any spot on the floor and any position on the roster, interior scoring, ball-handling attack to rack fouls. If our team play exceeds our raw talent then the high 40's in wins is not inconceivable. The East is stronger, yes, deeper too, few teams rely on a single star to carry them and we may be one with Beal taking shots at a high volume. But if Beal works on his own leadership game, making the pass, acting as decoy, etc, we have enough floor balance to be tough to guard. We are shallow in ball-handling and assist duties, so playmaking may have to come from schemes and teamwork at times.

It may take a while for chemistry to click and Wes to ID what works well. Line-ups, sets, plays, in bounds, end game--what works? Nobody has yet seen these guys together. They have to grow together. But we have smart experienced young veterans. In Beal, KCP and SD26 we have 9, 8, 7 years in the league, all 28 years old, our most experienced players will have the ball the most. Bertans and Neto have 5 and 6 years but overseas experience. Shoot, Deni won't be 21 til January but has been a pro since he was 16.


On average a player's prime years are 26-30. In Harrell, Kuzma, Holiday we are 27, 26, 25 years old. Players with talent and upside still untapped. Players who breakout tend to experience a bump in their 3rd year when the game starts to slow for them and they develop consistency in the abilities they've shown flashes of. Gafford and Hachimura are in this category with 2 years under their belts, but you could expect Bryant, Kuzma, and Holiday (4 years, 4 years, 3 years) each have had their growth stunted by injury / team circumstances / changing roles. Bryant was showing his breakout potential already when he went down. Kuzma has a dozen double doubles a year, a bakers dozen 30 pt games in his career, at least one 40-piece. Holiday is acknowledged as one of the better young defenders in the league, on and off the ball, has a handful of 20+ pt games or double doubles on good efficiency, posts high +/- numbers.

Growth is the key. But it takes time. If we click early, if Wes is a magician, for sure we could play better than .500 ball. For now though I think we are in discovery mode, learning who plays well with each other. What plays work. Our early games may look like a scrimmage as players are figuring each other out and trying to impress each other and the coaching staff. A bit wild, not crisp. Still these are overall smart players who seem to love the game with only a couple raw talents still figuring it out. There's a solid chance they find their rhythm and fairly swiftly the pack figures out how to hunt together, alpha wolf or no.


Yeah Russ was an alpha with a non-stop motor. Wall was a moody alpha who showed up when he wanted to lol. Dinwiddie is a nice player and interesting guy but not an alpha. Wiz are certainly deeper and have a higher floor than last year but the ceiling feels lower atm. After the Gafford move, a healthy Russ & Brad felt like a team that was beginning to gell although they were simply outclassed by a 76ers team due to significant lineup & coaching issues.

We've hopefully addressed some of lineup concerns & coaching issues, but there is roster imbalance as we've got 6 PFs imo and also simply lack top level talent beyond Beal. 38-42 wins is where I'm at. East is deeper this year (only Orlando & Detroit look like their obviously tanking). We are definitely capable of making a run to get to the play-in tournament but I'm really optimistic beyond that.

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:50 pm
by payitforward
doclinkin wrote:This year's Garrison Mathews: Jordan Schakel joins us on an exhibit 10 contract.





He was on the Summer League champion squad. Played well. The battle in training camp is for the last 2-way spot to make the team. Given how shallow we are at off-guard I guess he figured this was the best bet to make a team.

Schakel was someone's "sneak pick" in the draft thread -- but, who...?

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:53 pm
by payitforward
bubba hotep wrote:https://hoopshype.com/lists/jordan-schakel-nba-draft-interview-sleepers-san-diego-state-sdsu/

You know how you sometimes get attached to a fringe guy in the draft? Schakel is my guy for that this year.

time for bubba to check back in!!

Re: Training Camp & Preseason

Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:23 pm
by payitforward
Schakel played for GSW in Summer League. I'm kind of surprised they didn't sign him as a 2 way player.