Spencer 'Crypto' Dinwiddie Thread (He's Amazingly Sucky BTW)

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Spencer's shot attempts, especially 2pt shots, are down from his last full season (2019-20). And, while his 3pt FG% has gone up, his 2pt FG% is down from .485 in 2019-20 to .454 this season. His scoring is also down from that season—16 pts two seasons ago to 12.2. Maybe most significantly, his per game FT attempts are down from 7 in his last full season to just under 3 this season.

Of course, some of this can be attributed to playing in a new system and next to Beal, as well as (possibly) to the fact that he's still recovering from a serious knee injury. Hopefully, we'll see improvements in chemistry with Beal and health as the season goes on.

But I'm much more concerned about Din's style of play than I am with any #s. When he attacks the basket, which is the bread-and-butter of his offensive game, imo, he gets easier shots for himself and creates more opportunities for teammates. That's the Dinwiddie I want to see because I believe that's when he's really at his best.

Right now, either because of the system he's playing in, a lack of quickness or concerns about his knee (or maybe all three), Spencer isn't nearly as aggressive on the offensive end as he has been in the past—and needs to be in order to help this team win.

I agree with every bit of this except

1. his shots are down from his last full season b/c he's playing with someone (Brad) who takes a ton of shots. Which he didn't that year. To put it another way, his shots were up in his last full season because, & only because, Kyrie only played 650 minutes. He could not have gotten 20% more shots than the previous year if Kyrie had been healthy. They wouldn't have been available. In fact, the year before, Spence took @ the same # of shots as he does this year (.7 more per 40 minutes -- on a team that took @5% more shots than we do this year -- played at a faster pace, iow).

2. the drop in FTAs seems to be common this year -- look at Brad for example.

What remains is that we'd all like to see Spence attack the glass more. All the same, he is playing extremely well. A big reason we are 13-8.

[nate33]

...As I said before, the real issue is his complete unwillingness (or inability) to penetrate. He is not bending the defense at all, which puts the entire burden on Beal.

This seems like a perfectly fair point, nate. As it did when Zards made it.

It would be better, we would be better, if he attacked the paint. If he bent the defense.

But we are 13-8. You didn't expect that, & I didn't expect it either. Moreover, whatever success we did expect was certainly based on an idea of Brad playing a whole lot better than he has played!

Our good record mostly reflects the play of Harrell, Dinwiddie, KCP & Gafford. In Dinwiddie's case, tho not attacking the paint, he is doing other things, & how good a player is -- how much he helps youy win -- depends on all the things he does. Dinwiddie's second on the team in shots taken per 40 minutes. He's shooting 37% on 3's while taking a ton of them (second only to Bertans). He's shooting a stellar FT%. He's rebounding extremely well. He's not turning the ball over.

Here's hoping he is able to -- & does -- begin attacking the paint effectively soon!

As usual, your analysis factors 1st degree order, but ignores 2nd degree impact. Spencer has efficient stats because he is relying on others (Beal) to bend the defense to get him his looks. His reticence to attack the defense is forcing Beal to have to do it all. As a result, Beal's efficiency stats are bad, but he is making things easier for his teammates. The truth is, it is still Beal (and Harrell) who are doing the real work to generate offense, even though your spreadsheet says Dinwiddie has been the better player.

We didn't hire Dinwiddie to be a passive role player. Generally speaking, the smaller you are, the more duty you have to be a defense bender. We let the tall people be the passive role players (because there are fewer tall people on the planet with the coordination and skill to be defense benders).

[bsilver]

I'm a big Dinwiddie fan and competitive, so think this post from Nov, 2016 precedes PIFs:
"Vasquez doesn't seem to be a popular choice. How about Spencer Dinwiddie from the D League. Great size for a PG at 6-6. Still young (23) and improving. Was a top prospect in college until he tore his ACL."

At the time we were struggling with Trey Burke at PG.

I don't think Dinwiddies's been playing well at all. They exceptions are the games Beal does not play. Throw those games out, and Dinwiddies stats are not impressive. There must be something psychological going on. He just has to be more aggressive.

Dinwiddies and Beal's rebounding numbers are misleading. Our front line can't get it done alone, so we have to resort to gang rebounding to make up for their shortcomings. It shouldn't be necessary for guards to get so many rebounds. They should be leaking out for possible fast breaks. Michael Westbrook was an exception since he managed to rebound and lead the fast break.

[payitforward]

...As I said before, the real issue is his complete unwillingness (or inability) to penetrate. He is not bending the defense at all, which puts the entire burden on Beal.

This seems like a perfectly fair point, nate. As it did when Zards made it.

It would be better, we would be better, if he attacked the paint. If he bent the defense.

But we are 13-8. You didn't expect that, & I didn't expect it either. Moreover, whatever success we did expect was certainly based on an idea of Brad playing a whole lot better than he has played!

Our good record mostly reflects the play of Harrell, Dinwiddie, KCP & Gafford. In Dinwiddie's case, tho not attacking the paint, he is doing other things, & how good a player is -- how much he helps youy win -- depends on all the things he does. Dinwiddie's second on the team in shots taken per 40 minutes. He's shooting 37% on 3's while taking a ton of them (second only to Bertans). He's shooting a stellar FT%. He's rebounding extremely well. He's not turning the ball over.

Here's hoping he is able to -- & does -- begin attacking the paint effectively soon!

As usual, your analysis factors 1st degree order, but ignores 2nd degree impact. Spencer has efficient stats because he is relying on others (Beal) to bend the defense to get him his looks. His reticence to attack the defense is forcing Beal to have to do it all. As a result, Beal's efficiency stats are bad, but he is making things easier for his teammates. The truth is, it is still Beal (and Harrell) who are doing the real work to generate offense, even though your spreadsheet says Dinwiddie has been the better player.

We didn't hire Dinwiddie to be a passive role player. Generally speaking, the smaller you are, the more duty you have to be a defense bender. We let the tall people be the passive role players (because there are fewer tall people on the planet with the coordination and skill to be defense benders).

Perfectly sensible analysis -- tho your first para only addresses issues of his shooting. But, honestly, I think I've agreed often enough by now that he isn't attacking & that we all wish he were. I don't think it's useful to widen a divide when it leads to you claim, or seem to be claiming, that Dinwiddie is the cause of Beal's poor efficiency!

[payitforward]

I'm a big Dinwiddie fan and competitive, so think this post from Nov, 2016 precedes PIFs:
"Vasquez doesn't seem to be a popular choice. How about Spencer Dinwiddie from the D League. Great size for a PG at 6-6. Still young (23) and improving. Was a top prospect in college until he tore his ACL."...

I'm sure it does precede me -- in fact... who knows? I might have gotten interested in him based on your post. Or maybe Zards responded to you, & I got interested based on both your posts!

[FAH1223]

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[DCZards]

I read the post game comments by both Din and Wes Jr and they are a little concerning. Spencer seems to have a “we’re still figuring things out” attitude while coach clearly wants him to step it up now, especially early in games.

That first video of Din on the bench and calling him “disengaged” is very misleading. Based on that video, Trez is disengaged as well.

[NatP4]

This is what the board wanted. We have a PF chucking up 13 shots a game at a 53% TS.

It’s an offense where everyone gets the ball and tries to create their own shot instead of letting someone initiate offense through the pick and roll, break down the defense, and create open shots for others.

[Wizardspride]

My biggest gripe with Spencer is his inability (or lack of will) to push the ball.

His teammates are sprinting down the court and here comes Spencer methodically walking...

[nate33]

This is what the board wanted. We have a PF chucking up 13 shots a game at a 53% TS.

It’s an offense where everyone gets the ball and tries to create their own shot instead of letting someone initiate offense through the pick and roll, break down the defense, and create open shots for others.

Kuzma is shooting 11 shots a game, not 13. And the team ranks 12th in assists this year, compared to 20th last year. Overall, the team ranks 19th in offense. Last year, they were 18th. And this despite Beal and Bertans being dreadful.

I still don't really get your hatred of Kuzma. He was a bit overzealous early in the season trying to "lead" this team with his "championship experience"; but after a shot-happy start, he has settled down to play fairly good basketball. In the last 15 games, he is taking just 10.1 shots a game with a TS% of .569 and a .378 3P%. He is also averaging 3.5 assists and 8.0 rebounds (in 31 minutes a game).

[payitforward]

I read the post game comments by both Din and Wes Jr and they are a little concerning. Spencer seems to have a “we’re still figuring things out” attitude while coach clearly wants him to step it up now, especially early in games.

That first video of Din on the bench and calling him “disengaged” is very misleading. Based on that video, Trez is disengaged as well.

If we were 9-14, I might be worried. But, we're 14-9. We didn't win those games by accident.

Plus, it's true that we are "a new team trying to figure it out." We can't change that, & there's no reason to ignore it either.

We started the season 5-1. Since then we are 9-8. That seems a more accurate representation of where we are as a team.

That said, there is no doubt that Spencer has fallen off. He's coming back from a serious injury, so maybe we should give him some more time...?

[NatP4]

This is what the board wanted. We have a PF chucking up 13 shots a game at a 53% TS.

It’s an offense where everyone gets the ball and tries to create their own shot instead of letting someone initiate offense through the pick and roll, break down the defense, and create open shots for others.

Kuzma is shooting 11 shots a game, not 13. And the team ranks 12th in assists this year, compared to 20th last year. Overall, the team ranks 19th in offense. Last year, they were 18th. And this despite Beal and Bertans being dreadful.

I still don't really get your hatred of Kuzma. He was a bit overzealous early in the season trying to "lead" this team with his "championship experience"; but after a shot-happy start, he has settled down to play fairly good basketball. In the last 15 games, he is taking just 10.1 shots a game with a TS% of .569 and a .378 3P%. He is also averaging 3.5 assists and 8.0 rebounds (in 31 minutes a game).

I’m not sure what you are getting at. He’s shot the ball a little bit better recently, to bring his averages up to pretty bad instead of horrendous. The wizards offense is significantly worse with Kuzma on the court vs when he sits. All of this is obvious stuff. There’s no reason to play the guy. Kispert and Avdija are far better options.

[Kanyewest]

This is what the board wanted. We have a PF chucking up 13 shots a game at a 53% TS.

It’s an offense where everyone gets the ball and tries to create their own shot instead of letting someone initiate offense through the pick and roll, break down the defense, and create open shots for others.

Although Kuzma's TS percentage looks better given the context that the TS% for the nba is down, as of 3 weeks ago the TS% of the league stood at 54.8 %, and last year it was at 57.2%. And someone like Beal is only has a 51% TS given the new rules.

Also everyone being involved in the offense may contribute to everyone being more engaged defensively which is why this team is playing winning basketball at the moment.

[payitforward]

This is what the board wanted. We have a PF chucking up 13 shots a game at a 53% TS.

It’s an offense where everyone gets the ball and tries to create their own shot instead of letting someone initiate offense through the pick and roll, break down the defense, and create open shots for others.

Kuzma is shooting 11 shots a game, not 13. And the team ranks 12th in assists this year, compared to 20th last year. Overall, the team ranks 19th in offense. Last year, they were 18th. And this despite Beal and Bertans being dreadful.

I still don't really get your hatred of Kuzma. He was a bit overzealous early in the season trying to "lead" this team with his "championship experience"; but after a shot-happy start, he has settled down to play fairly good basketball. In the last 15 games, he is taking just 10.1 shots a game with a TS% of .569 and a .378 3P%. He is also averaging 3.5 assists and 8.0 rebounds (in 31 minutes a game).

Kuzma is taking an average number of shots/FTAs per 40 minutes for a PF, maybe just a little less. On the season, both his efg% & his TS% are below average -- the latter a bit more below average, b/c he was shooting FTs so badly for a while. His TS% rising over the last 15 games is very good news.

He's way above average as a defensive rebounder but somewhat below average on the offensive side -- in all, he is still quite a good rebounder.

Actually, the numbers that hold his effectiveness down are that he gets few steals while turning the ball over too much.

[FAH1223]

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[DCZards]

Nate's numbers showing Kuzma's improved play over the last 15 games makes it evident that (most nights) he's helping the Zards win games.

I look forward to Deni getting more and more playing time. He just continues to get better. Thrilled to see Deni's improved ability to take defenders off the dribble and his improving 3 ball shooting.

At least to this point, Kispert hasn't shown that he deserves any more minutes than what he's currently getting. But he's a rookie (and he's not shooting the 3 particularly well) so no real surprise there.

[FAH1223]

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[Wizardspride]

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[tontoz]

To me the Beal/Spencer thing is the biggest problem for the offense. Beal is doing too much ball handling which he isnt good at, hence the spike in turnovers. Spencer is way too passive when Beal is on the floor. When Beal has been out (granted small sample) Spencer has been good.

Wes needs to get this straightened out.

Kuzma has been fine for the most part. For whatever reason he struggles in the first quarter with his shooting but other than that i can't complain too much.