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A tad premature, but let’s just pretend we win Sunday and USA feels redeemed. What if some key players don’t want to commit to another 3 years? Colangelo and USA Basketball will have to start all over building a team to win gold in London. Which makes for an interesting question: if Kobe, Lebron and Carmelo all say, “Thanks for the chance to represent. I’m done.”

What team do you put together to give America the best shot in London? This new squad will play the tournaments leading up to the Olympics, like the World Championships in 2010.

Who do you keep from this squad? Who gets cut? Let’s say any NBA player you ask will say yes if offered a slot. But keep in mind some guys will be downright old by the time 2012 rolls around (Shaq will be 40 year; Duncan and KG each 36). Here’s the roster I’d want to see:

G: Paul / Williams
G: Wade / Kevin Martin / Roy
F: Marion / Butler / Prince
F: Brand / Boozer
C: Bosh / Howard

Why?

First, the guards. I drop Kidd. Thanks for the service as elder statesman, Jason. I’d experiment with Wade, Paul and Williams to see who starts, but I like the idea of Wade moving into the role of the team’s designated scoring threat. So he starts. Losing Kobe, Lebron and Melo means a lot of offense gone. Wade has the chops to take on a big chunk of the task.

Next, we badly need someone who can act as a lights-out, zone-busting shooter. Did you see how discombobulated we got when Argentina went zone on us Friday? Redd was supposed to make people pay for that (which kicked our butts in Athens, too). But he clearly can’t handle coming off the bench and gunning with accuracy – he’s more a rhythm shooter who needs to get a volume of shots over a whole game. I can’t say I’m terribly surprised he’s 5-18 from 3 in the tourney. The stats really don’t back up the hype about him being an “elite” shooter. He was the 43rd best three point shooter (.362) among all NBA guards who took 150+ 3s last year.

It would be tempting to take someone like Daniel Gibson: a guy who is used to coming off the bench and was last year’s 2nd best 3 point shooter among all NBA guards (.440). But you want your 4th G on this team to be able to step in and fill a hole if Wade, Paul or Williams get hurt. So if you scan down the list of Gs who shoot the 3 very well, you come across a guy named Kevin Martin. He shoots the 3 very nicely (.404), and the two (.478) so he should be efficient with limited FGAs, but can clearly carry the load if asked to play starter’s minutes (23 ppg - #3 among NBA guards).

I was tempted to slot Arenas in, too. But honestly, I just don’t know if Gilbert would hew to the party line and play a defined role on Team USA. He’s used to being The Man, Captain Quirk, with a coach that lets him do whatever he pleases. He shoots his mouth off, too. (Remember the “I’m gonna drop 50 on Portland ‘cause Nate McMillan is one of the Team USA coaches who cut me” and then he put up I think it was 9 points in probably his worst night as a Wizard?). That kind of behavior might make good blog material, but on a national team it would just be a distraction and give extra motivation to opponents. I hate to say this, but if I were Colangelo, I’d steer clear of Gilbert for Team USA. He’s just not mature enough to be a trustworthy role player.

So if I want a 5th guard, I want it to be someone who will happily accept their role. Maybe you designate this 5th slot as your “guard of the future” – a young’in Colangelo doesn’t expect to use in London, but who will benefit from exposure and be ready to take over as our stud after London. I nominate Brandon Roy. He’s only needed two seasons to show himself to be among the elite SGs: he has the 6th highest PER among SGs (higher than McGrady, VC, Joe Johnson, etc.) But with his youth, he might readily accept the role. It’s a coup to be selected over other guys with more years.

Next, the centers. I have to say Bosh really played his way into my heart in these Olympics. He just seems to be wherever the ball lands, and really brought energy off the bench. Which unfortunately we needed, since Howard really turned in a sub-par performance. He’s still an amazing specimen and can change the defensive landscape just being out there. He’s likely to mature quickly over the next 4 years. So I’d keep him, but probably put the starter spot up for grabs. It wouldn’t surprise me if Bosh earned it.

I flirted with Chandler as a third, defensive-oriented C. One thing that stood out to me this Olympics was how Greece, Lithuania, Australia, Argentina all have 4 or 5 guys 6’9 and taller who they ran at us in waves. You might think we need another C. But with the departure of Melo and Lebron, we’ll be adding some traditional PF beef at the forward spot.

The forwards. This is where the biggest changes are going to come. Lebron and Melo brought a rare combination of PF size (Lebron is 260 lbs!!!), with SF quicks. They are just as nightmare for opponents. We can’t replicate that.

But if we start Brand and Marion, other countries are going to have their hands full. Brand is a 6’9 bruiser who can also hit the spot up J. Marion is a 6’8 freak who’s most terrifying when he’s the 3rd or 4th option flying in for alleyoops or filling a lane on the break. While Brand will probably be our #2 offensive option after Wade, Marion will be our our best defender, taking the other squad’s best SG or F and shutting him down.

Slot in Boozer as Brand’s backup. That’s a no brainer. I also take Caron Butler. Someone’s going to scream “What about Pierce?!?!” Dude will be 35 by London. Time to start grooming the next generation, and right now Butler is legitimately one of the best SFs, old or young. Along with Deron, Kevin Martin and Bosh, Butler completes a high power foursome that we’ll probably sub into the game halfway through the 1st quarter. They’ll get serious minutes. I round out the Fs with Tayshaun Prince, because I think his length is a real asset to have as a defensive sub.

What do you think?

I like your point guards, shooting guards, and centers. I don't like your forwards at all. Butler and Prince are fine, but I don't think Marion and Brand will be that good 4 years from now, and I don't think Boozer's game is well-suited for international play.

To tell you the truth, it's pretty hard to put together a list now because there are bunch of young guys who might pan out to be studs in 4 years. If Josh Smith or Gerald Wallace ever develop jumpers, they could be considered. Maybe a guy LaMarcus Aldridge continues to improve. There's also Beasley and Oden. Maybe even our very own Blatche could one day be in the mix.

Kevin Durant for Marion. Marion's time will be done by then and Kevin Durant will be a dynamic player.

Oden/Bynum for Boozer, shifting Bosh to PF, Dwight/Oden/Bynum to center. Boozer's game does not translate very well in the international game. I would assume Oden or Bynum would have developed into a top center by that time.

Amare for Brand. Amare can be the guy off the bench who provides a guy to run and gun with the 2nd unit and be the finisher. Despite his defensive shortcomings, he's a monster offensively and he still should be.

Prince should be out for another SF. This could possibly be Josh Smith/Iggy, depending on who develops a jumper, or another player that develops.

My lineup:
G: Paul / Williams
G: Wade / Roy / Kevin Martin
F: Durant / Butler / Iggy
F: Bosh / Amare
C: Howard / Oden

This team will have very versatile wing players (Roy/Butler/Iggy/Wade are all gifted non-PG passers) an anchor defensively in Oden and perimeter threats (Durant/K-Mart and Deron/Paul/Butler) to an extent.

Although it's possible Brandon Roy could be good enough to start at SF by that time.

Note: I'm sure I've missed somebody.

Come on, you know we got a thread for TEAM USA Basketball. IBTL. Yes IBTL-PP(Post Pad)

(Wiz99 wrote) Which makes for an interesting question: if Kobe, Lebron and Carmelo all say, “Thanks for the chance to represent. I’m done.”

This is the problem and the mind set with the younger generation. It's all about me-me-me.

It's sad when people don't want to represent their country. I wonder what all the people who have died would say about this.

I thought this was about the wizards and was about to chime in about how we do need defenders. Then i realized it wasnt so now i don't care

Halcyon wrote:Kevin Durant for Marion. Marion's time will be done by then and Kevin Durant will be a dynamic player.

You know, I thought of that. But then I considered this: Team USA's problem has never been a lack of dynamic scorers. It's a deficit of dude's who fill the other roles. I have been VERY impressed by Kobe's willingness to cede leadership of the team to Lebron and instead be a defensive stopper. We'll still need a guy in that mold. I'd rather have a guy like Marion to shut down the next generation of Manu Ginoblis than Durant who's main (only?) skill is scoring.

Halcyon wrote:Oden/Bynum for Boozer, shifting Bosh to PF, Dwight/Oden/Bynum to center. Boozer's game does not translate very well in the international game. I would assume Oden or Bynum would have developed into a top center by that time.

True, but the NBA center is not always a good international center. You have to be very mobile, willing to follow those international bigs out to the 3 point line where they hang out, able to defend the pick and roll very, very well, but still get into position to board and block. I'm just not sure Bynum or Oden are like that. They seem more traditional back to the basket, inside 10 feet of the rim sorts.

Halcyon wrote:Amare for Brand. Amare can be the guy off the bench who provides a guy to run and gun with the 2nd unit and be the finisher. Despite his defensive shortcomings, he's a monster offensively and he still should be.

I REALLY don't like Amare's game for the international stage. Zones will just shut him down completely. He has no J and is worthless from more than 8 feet from the basket. You pointed out his defensive weakness. If we're going with a C who can't shoot, I'd rather have Oden or Bynum who ARE good on both ends.

Kind of surprised no one's argued for Gilbert...

Wiz99 wrote:I REALLY don't like Amare's game for the international stage. Zones will just shut him down completely. He has no J and is worthless from more than 8 feet from the basket. You pointed out his defensive weakness. If we're going with a C who can't shoot, I'd rather have Oden or Bynum who ARE good on both ends.

Amare has one of the best jumpers in the league for a big man. He ranks 12th in the league in 2-point jumpshot field goal percentage. The only big men who rank higher are Nowitzki and Garnett.

I think Stoudemire would be terrific in the international setting.

Hmmm... Maybe its too much watching Amare flushing down dunks that skewed my impression. I stand corrected.

So, if Lebron, Kobe and Melo opt out of another 3 year campaign, can we all agree this would be a good roster for the USA to win gold in London? I still like Marion for his ability to be our defensive stopped on the other team's best player (the Kobe role on the current squad).

G: Paul / Williams
G: Wade / Kevin Martin / Roy
F: Marion / Butler / Durant or Prince or Iggy
F: Bosh / Amare
C: Howard / Oden

Pretty good mix. Elite PGs to take care of the ball and pester the hell out of the other team, got it (Paul, Williams). Scoring punch, check (Wade, Kevin Martin, Butler). A defender to shut down the other team's best man, check (Marion). Mobile bigs who can shoot a J, defend the iron on D, fill a lane on the break and get put backs on O, check (Bosh, Amare, Howard, Oden).

Still no one who wants to argue against me and say Gil should be included?

Okay, here goes.

I replace Roy with Gil, and have 2012 Arenas be 2008 Wade. Gil would immediately be the second best scorer, and with him being asked to focus on defense (which he actually did in tryouts), he can provide that spark off the bench that Wade provdes now on both ends of the court. The preexisting chemistry with Butler helps as well.

Because of his range, you could also give them a little of the Hibachi in small doses, in order to free up the defense, make people think twice about packing the zone in, and allow the slashers to roam.

I love Marion, but I'd rather have Iggy; Iggy's younger, probably about the same defensively (not the same in rebounding, I think a better passer and ballhandler). I'd try Durant at PF but that's it.

Shouldn't this thread be merged with the USA Basketball/Olympic thread we already have?

Where a good mod when you need one?

This team made all the right moves on paper, but in reality, talent won the games during these olympics. It wasn't chemistry, or the right mix of players. All of the "strategies" implemented by team USA were made with good intentions, but really had a minimal impact compared to the leap in talent of this team versus the 2004 team or even the 2006 world team.

Examples of the conventional wisdom not making an impact?
-Michael Redd, our designated zone buster was relegated to garbage minutes and shot 5/18 from the FIBA 3 point line. 5 threes in 8 games.
-Kobe, our defensive specialist, also took it upon himself to be the offensive specialist as well. He led the team with 90 shots, with lebron checking in 2nd with 74, and wade 3rd with 58 shots. To crunch some numbers, Kobe shot 50% more shots than wade; he also took 21% more shots than James in less minutes.
-Oh yeah, he also took the most 3's. 45 three pointers, which was double lebron's attempts at #2. Our defensive specialist and our PF took 40% of our 3 point attempts.
-Jason Kidd, the calming veteran presence had an ass/to ratio of 1.3 when oop-crazy, borderline reckless Chris Paul had an A/TO ratio of 3.5
-Chris Bosh was considered too slight to bang with the likes of Baby Shaq, Marc Gasol, and Yao Ming shot 79.3% from the field. he missed only 6 times in 8 games. The big bruiser Boozer flexed his muscles at 6 minutes a game.
-Carmello Anthony, the alleged best player on the team was the only player to play meaningful minutes and shoot under 0.500. He also led the team in fouls, which correlates him to not playing very good defense. He also mustered up 3 assists in 8 games. One assist for every 45 minutes 20 seconds he was on the court.

Bonus stat: Lebron shot 59% , wade 65.5%, and Kobe 45.6% from the field. lebron shot 50%, wade, 61.8%, and kobe 44.4% from the FT line. But then again, it is easier to dunk a ball in traffic than make a freebie.

The redeem team in my eyes proved nothing except that the US has the most stellar athletes on God's green earth. Stats aside, after catching a few replays on NBC.com, I was very impressed by the play of Australia and Argentina. They use picks, cuts, and find the open man effectively. When the US sets picks, it's lazy. When they cut, it's lazy but covered up by the fact that the ball is lobbed 6 inches higher than the defender can jump. When the dribble penetration is used, it's not to find the open man, but because the ball-carrier has run out of room to move or picked up their dribble. A pass out of desperation rather than opportunity.

The US almost never passes up an open shot for an even more open shot. An open shot at the top of the key isn't a free pass to shoot, and yet most people feel like an open shot is a gimme-shot. Maybe in practice after taking 300 prior shots, the muscle memory can take over, but during a game, a 3 is a cointoss at best. Maybe for booby gibson it's a little better than a cointoss, but not by much.

So, you can play armchar colangelo and draft your perfect team, but the US is winning on talent mostly and the second you sacrifice talent like Marion for 'Melo, bron for brand, or kobe for kmart lite, the playing field will be equalized again, and more likely than not, you'll find the US in london fighting for bronze.

pancakes3 wrote:So, you can play armchar colangelo and draft your perfect team, but the US is winning on talent mostly and the second you sacrifice talent like Marion for 'Melo, bron for brand, or kobe for kmart lite, the playing field will be equalized again, and more likely than not, you'll find the US in london fighting for bronze.

Cakes, you even read the opening post? The question was what team do you put together for the 2010 World Championships and Olympics if Lebron, Kobe and Melo decide not to commit to another 3 years
Now that we've won the gold, it's very plausible. They've done their duty, and for guys who play 100 games a year already, a bit of time in the summer is all the time they get to recuperate.

So, without them, what's the best squad? I sure hope what you predict isn't a foregone conclusion.

I already posted this in the other thread, but I hope that Howard is not on our future squad.

I don't know why Redd never sniffed time during these games, he really could have sealed the victory much sooner for us in today's game.

closg00 wrote:I don't know why Redd never sniffed time during these games, he really could have sealed the victory much sooner for us in today's game.

You mean except for him going 5-18 from 3 land in this tourney, and failing utterly at his designated role of zone buster? He gets all this hype as one of the best perimeter shooters in the NBA, but his 3 pt % is 43rd best among all NBA guards.

Whoever's on the next team, we need someone who can step off the bench and drill 3s.