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Last night I am watching Howard just "MAN" over the cavs when he was in the game and I started to think about "what went wrong with Kwame" I went on line and looked up basic info.
Both are listed 6'11"
Both are listed 270
Both were #1 picks
Both were from High School to pros
Both were from the South
Both were #1 prospects in thier high school classes
Both developed from year 1 to 3
Both get new coaches in year 3
Kwame gets hurt in year 3 and his carrer ends up being a bust

What I remember about Kwame was his lack luster jog down the court, his hanging his head after a mistake, his hands (he could not catch), his injury that shut him down when he started to get better.
Did Jordon and Collins Ruin him?
Did Gilbert hurt him?
At 27 years old, is it time for some team, the wizards, to give him a real shot!

Unfortunately Kwame has hands the size of an average joe and Dwight has some serious mitts. Plus, there's also qualities like heart and drive that separate the two. That being said, Kwame was seriously mishandled by MJ and Doug Collins and maybe things might have turned out better for Kwame with some competent coaching and mentoring.

Oh-no, another what happened to Kwame thread redux...let it die.

Lots of other threads on this topic.
KB has small hands.
KB cant learn the fundamentals on O and D.
KB is not very driven.

The end.

if you can't palm the ball and your 7ft tall.... then there really is no comparison. Michael Jordan's game would have been completely different if he couldn't palm the ball...very very very very big deal.
Without MJ being able to palm...no more Air jordan symbol with him flying with the ball in one hand. Rajon Rondon who is 6'1 can palm the ball...and you got a seven footer with smaller hands than even a point guard.

Goodness...ANOTHER KFB thread?

We stole Caron for him...let it go people...

IBTL

Kwame played pretty solid for the Pistons... He's one of the better backup C's in the league.

Works hard on D for sure.

Benjammin wrote:Unfortunately Kwame has hands the size of an average joe and Dwight has some serious mitts. Plus, there's also qualities like heart and drive that separate the two. That being said, Kwame was seriously mishandled by MJ and Doug Collins and maybe things might have turned out better for Kwame with some competent coaching and mentoring.

Kwame took a fork in the road a while ago and ended up in the forest.

It wasn't so much how he was handed as much as it was how that handling was a bad match for Kwame who had some emotional vulnerabilities because of his upbringing. He was a fragile kid. The tough love thing didn't work for him. It made him crack.

He had some interesting talent and actually was showing improvement for a while. At one point he actually looked pretty dame good. His first step was insane. He could get by people without a problem. But he wasn't a center. I think that messed him up some. He should have been brought up as a PF. We have messed up with Blatche the same way. Mostly in both cases because we didn't have enough centers so they were the next best thing.

There is a chance he could make a late come back but it's really up to him. He needs to rest his demons and decide he really wants it. That and stay healthy. At 27 6-11 270, he is a beast. He seems to rebound pretty well last year. 5 boards in 17 mins. He is making 4 mil a year. He is a decent value for what he brings. What I would look for from him to indicate the light is going on and he wants it would be for him to increase his FT % to something over .516. God he has been awful from the line for years now. That and increase his blocks.

You actually bring up a good point regarding Kwame. Given what he went through and who he was to start with, it would be about now that he would start to emerge if he is going to. Det is smart to have added him. It's worth the roll of the dice.

But if I remember correctly, there were questions going way back about how much Kwame really wanted it or not. The fact that he has stuck around the league this long without quitting does say something. He has a player option for 09/10. DET is his third team. If he wanted out, he w7ould have retired.

But the kid keeps getting injured, doesn't he ? He has only logged 3 70 game seasons in 7 years.

Kwame has no desire to get better.

How do you turn down the opportunity to get tutored by Kareem Abdul-Jabar?

Seriously?

Bum.

hands11 wrote:

Benjammin wrote:Unfortunately Kwame has hands the size of an average joe and Dwight has some serious mitts. Plus, there's also qualities like heart and drive that separate the two. That being said, Kwame was seriously mishandled by MJ and Doug Collins and maybe things might have turned out better for Kwame with some competent coaching and mentoring.

Kwame took a fork in the road a while ago and ended up in the forest.

It wasn't so much how he was handed as much as it was how that handling was a bad match for Kwame who had some emotional vulnerabilities because of his upbringing. He was a fragile kid. The tough love thing didn't work for him. It made him crack.

He had some interesting talent and actually was showing improvement for a while. At one point he actually looked pretty dame good. His first step was insane. He could get by people without a problem. But he wasn't a center. I think that messed him up some. He should have been brought up as a PF. We have messed up with Blatche the same way. Mostly in both cases because we didn't have enough centers so they were the next best thing.

There is a chance he could make a late come back but it's really up to him. He needs to rest his demons and decide he really wants it. That and stay healthy. At 27 6-11 270, he is a beast. He seems to rebound pretty well last year. 5 boards in 17 mins. He is making 4 mil a year. He is a decent value for what he brings. What I would look for from him to indicate the light is going on and he wants it would be for him to increase his FT % to something over .516. God he has been awful from the line for years now. That and increase his blocks.

You actually bring up a good point regarding Kwame. Given what he went through and who he was to start with, it would be about now that he would start to emerge if he is going to. Det is smart to have added him. It's worth the roll of the dice.

But if I remember correctly, there were questions going way back about how much Kwame really wanted it or not. The fact that he has stuck around the league this long without quitting does say something. He has a player option for 09/10. DET is his third team. If he wanted out, he w7ould have retired.

But the kid keeps getting injured, doesn't he ? He has only logged 3 70 game seasons in 7 years.

We didn't mess up with blatche. Blatche has a poor one leg vertical but the effort and basket iq is there. He has also improved agility and is our best bigman that can defend out in space. His skill set compliments haywood well...except he just doesn't get high off the ground when jumping off one leg which hurts him. Kwame small hands make him hopelessly poor with the basketball. Having small hands and being a bruiser in the paint is like trying having no quickness and speed in your legs like AD but trying to blow by people aka allen iverson or gilbert... Just doesn't work.

Kwame could palm a basketball -- I saw him do it in the Wizards locker room. (Well, technically, I asked him if he could do it, and he responded by doing it.) His hands are on the small side for a 7-footer, which is NOT the same thing as having hands the size of an average person. I'm 6-2 with good-sized hands, and Kwame's hand is bigger than mine. The issue with Kwame was not the size of his hands, but his use of them.

KFB

Million dollar body

Ten cent head

Never seen Kwame palm the ball with his hand on top of the ball...and i highly doubt we will ever find footage with kwame moving the ball around palming it one hand with hand on top of the ball and gripping and moving it. The boy just doesn't have the hands that a seven footer suppose to have...especially for number one overall draft pick and the scouts didn't make a big deal of it...in scouting reports. So maybe he can do it in private...but never in game and fumbles passes worse than the old haywood.

Well its a crap shoot...Howard is exactly what Kwame was supposed to be...but then again you could say that about a ton of people. Okafore was the safe #1 pick but Orlando took a risk and it paid off. It was between Kwame, Cuury and chandler...Chandler turned out the best but still not 1 pick worthy.

Physically Howard has it all..size, speed hops, length, hands.

Kwame had size and speed but bad hands and aligator arms. Plus hes a knucklehead crybaby.
Even with bad hands and aligator arms he could have been good if he dedicated himself. If i was coaching him id tell him to do nothing on offense but develop a jumper because hell never have an inside game. Hes ok on D....the big question is between him, Olawakandi and Joe Smith whos the bigger no.1 bust?

omegatronic3 wrote:Kwame had size and speed but bad hands and aligator arms. Plus hes a knucklehead crybaby.
Even with bad hands and aligator arms he could have been good if he dedicated himself. If i was coaching him id tell him to do nothing on offense but develop a jumper because hell never have an inside game. Hes ok on D....the big question is between him, Olawakandi and Joe Smith whos the bigger no.1 bust?

I think Olowakandi has to be the biggest No 1 bust of the three. Not only is he the least productive, but they also missed out on more players who come close to justifying a number 1 pick.

Unless he turns his career around, Kwame Brown is a worse bust than Joe Smith. He has been far less productive and did nothing for the team that drafted him. Joe Smith had some promising seasons for Golden State and has had solid(if underwhelming) production over his career.

Both drafts were pretty weak(with the exception of Kevin Garnett in 1995, who was a project at that point). If you re-did either lottery selection they both would be 5th or 6th. The 1995 draft top picks are a lot of great college players who were pro disappointments.

http://www.nba.com/history/draft_top13.html

Kwame was a very good high school player, but Tyson Chandler and Eddy Curry were actually liked more by a lot of scouts. It wasn't until the workouts that Kwame really elevated his stock, but he was never the concensus, best player in his class. He measured out at 6'10 in socks at the combine and 6'11.5 in shoes, but only with a 7'1 wingspan and 9'0 standing reach. His lane agility and 3/4 court sprint were respectable, but nothing out of this word.

Howard, on the other hand, was the #1 prospect in his class and was agreed upon universally by his peers. Keep in mind that this was also one of the strongest high school classes ever. He measured a full inch shorter than Kwame at the combine (although both have grown since then) at 6'9, and 6'10 in shoes, but with a 7'4.5 inch wingspan and a ridiculous 9'3.5 standing reach. He also timed out exceptionally well in the lane agility and 3/4 court sprint and had a better vertical than Kwame as well. He also has huge hands which allow him to catch the ball much easier than Kwame.

There's a lot of reasons Howard has worked out better than Kwame. He has an infinitely better mentality, is much more dedicated, etc., but Howard is also the superior specimen physically.