Other Pre-Season Games

[closg00]

Wow, Euro-ball is falling flat on it's face in it's first outing for the Raps. EJ's Sixers are looking good out-of-the-box, they are dominating even-though the rebounding numbers are about even.

[closg00]

DeJuan Blair, 10 rebounds in 10 minutes, 6 pts also.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

In his first preseason game, Blair had 16 points and 19 rebounds in 22 minutes. Had 8 offensive rebounds, which is astonishing even if a guy plays 40 minutes. But 8 ORBs in 20 minutes is something I'd bet even Shaq hasn't done.

From other games of 10/6 a few observations:

Chase Budinger shot 7-10. Also shot an unreal percentage in Vegas.

Greg Oden with 18 points and 9 rebounds ... that Sacto frontline is marshmallow soft. A scoring Oden will really help Portland if he comes around.

EJ's Sixers had a 36 point second quarter. Lou Williams' value in fantasy, that's going up. Igoudala, too, if the turnovers don't get problematic.

A guy a few on this site really liked back in the Shelden Williams/Pecherov/Millsap draft class, Alexander Johnson, had 18 and 6 for the Jazz tonight. Might be a spot for him if he can play C for them. Another guy I really liked in this draft, Wes Matthews, had 16 points for the Jazz. Looking at that roster, if he can score there's a spot for him at SG or SF.

A guy doc really sold me on and that a lot of you liked, James Johnson, had a full stat sheet; including 18 points and a game winner in the game between the Bulls and Jazz over in London. Deng had 18, which is good to see for him.

I am really happy the season's getting under way!

[closg00]

In his first preseason game, Blair had 16 points and 19 rebounds in 22 minutes. Had 8 offensive rebounds, which is astonishing even if a guy plays 40 minutes. But 8 ORBs in 20 minutes is something I'd bet even Shaq hasn't done.

From other games of 10/6 a few observations:

Chase Budinger shot 7-10. Also shot an unreal percentage in Vegas.

Greg Oden with 18 points and 9 rebounds ... that Sacto frontline is marshmallow soft. A scoring Oden will really help Portland if he comes around.

EJ's Sixers had a 36 point second quarter. Lou Williams' value in fantasy, that's going up. Igoudala, too, if the turnovers don't get problematic.

A guy a few on this site really liked back in the Shelden Williams/Pecherov/Millsap draft class, Alexander Johnson, had 18 and 6 for the Jazz tonight. Might be a spot for him if he can play C for them. Another guy I really liked in this draft, Wes Matthews, had 16 points for the Jazz. Looking at that roster, if he can score there's a spot for him at SG or SF.

A guy doc really sold me on and that a lot of you liked, James Johnson, had a full stat sheet; including 18 points and a game winner in the game between the Bulls and Jazz over in London. Deng had 18, which is good to see for him.

I am really happy the season's getting under way!

My pick James Johnson was money last night I didn't know that Alexander Johnson was still kicking around, looks like he had a good night and for pick # 44 Chase Budinger is looking like a steal,

[nate33]

In his first preseason game, Blair had 16 points and 19 rebounds in 22 minutes. Had 8 offensive rebounds, which is astonishing even if a guy plays 40 minutes. But 8 ORBs in 20 minutes is something I'd bet even Shaq hasn't done.

From other games of 10/6 a few observations:

Chase Budinger shot 7-10. Also shot an unreal percentage in Vegas.

Greg Oden with 18 points and 9 rebounds ... that Sacto frontline is marshmallow soft. A scoring Oden will really help Portland if he comes around.

EJ's Sixers had a 36 point second quarter. Lou Williams' value in fantasy, that's going up. Igoudala, too, if the turnovers don't get problematic.

A guy a few on this site really liked back in the Shelden Williams/Pecherov/Millsap draft class, Alexander Johnson, had 18 and 6 for the Jazz tonight. Might be a spot for him if he can play C for them. Another guy I really liked in this draft, Wes Matthews, had 16 points for the Jazz. Looking at that roster, if he can score there's a spot for him at SG or SF.

A guy doc really sold me on and that a lot of you liked, James Johnson, had a full stat sheet; including 18 points and a game winner in the game between the Bulls and Jazz over in London. Deng had 18, which is good to see for him.

I am really happy the season's getting under way!

Blair's performance was damn impressive. It's worth noting that he did it against Houston's extremely small front line. It remains to be seen whether he can dominate legit NBA centers that way. That said, I'm very happy for him. I always thought he'd be a pretty effective player. The concern with him is the knee. Every GM in the league was afraid to draft him for a reason.

The Sixers routed a defensively soft Toronto team that was playing without Bosh and Turkaglu. That starting lineup they put out there was pretty lousy: Calderon, Bellineli, DeRozan, Evans and Bargnani. The only player in that group who is even an average starter is Calderon. Bargnani is a below average starter. Nobody else deserves to start at all.

I'm most surprised about Buddinger. I was down on him throughout the draft. I figured he was overrated due to "Athletic White Guy Syndrome". His game reminds me a lot of Jarvis Hayes. He can jump and he can shoot when square, but I never saw much ball handling or lateral agility. I'm not sold on him yet. We'll see how he performs after there's a scouting report out on him. Remember Hayes had a great first 10 games or so. He sucked for the rest of his career once teams figured out his tendancies.

JJ Hickson has 15 points and 5 boards in 16 minutes.
Luol Deng might be back on track. He had 18 points, 5 assists and 2 blocks in 25 minutes.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

nate, I'm really torn on what to think about Jarvis.

I wasn't buying the hype or the enthusiasm at all when he was drafted. I recall saying I thought Marquis Daniels, who wasn't drafted that same year that the Wizards selected Jarvis, was a much better player. I thought Bogans was better than Jarvis, too, which even today is debateable. (Eerie similarity in the career stats of Hayes and Bogans).

Jarvis'career PER is under 11, with 15 being average. Yet, I don't think he's necessarily a bad NBA player. I think he's better than his stats. He just can't be counted on offensively. He had his best PER season with Detroit (13--as good as what Nick's best so far) in 07-08 and his on court differentials with New Jersey were really good last season. That team was much better with Jarvis on the court.

http://www.82games.com/0809/08NJN8.HTM

I probably like Jarvis better now than I did when he was a Wizard!

nate, I will say that Chase "Birdinger" has shot it better than Jarvis did to start his career. I remember Jarvis, Jared Jeffries, and Steve Blake having IIRC an undefeated summer league team. That first summer IIRC Jarvis was good but he wasn't shooting it near 70 percent from both the field and from three like Budinger has done so far. But it IS early. I know I didn't like Budinger's teams at Arizona and that (from admittedly pretty superficial knowledge) I certainly didn't think he'd be much in the pros (but Dat did). Early on, he's way better than I thought he'd be.

[Severn Hoos]

CCJ - good call on James Johnson, that was the first thing I looked for in the box score last night. He's definitely a/the guy I was hoping they'd target in a trade-down scenario. Oh well, even if we'd finagled Minny's other pick (#18, I believe) in the trade, he'd still have been gone before we could grab him.

And a huge "Gee, who could have predicted that?" on Blair's first game. It was so obvious that he could play. I understand the hesitation about his knee, and even the financial aspect from the Wiz standpoint. And I'll even go along with the cautions that it's only preseason. But he does look like the real deal - just the kind of player that I think the Wizards so desperately need.

And I missed this from Monday's game, but did the Pistons really start Ben Wallace and Kwame Brown at the PF/C positions? Has there ever been a more offense-challenged front court in the NBA? And talk about a weird former Wizards dynamic. Wow...

[fishercob]

Ric Bucher tweeted last night about Blair "Glass eater but no rim protection and no discernible post game. Think Paul Millsap."

The point is well taken that Blair can play. I also just think it's important to acknowledge that his game is limited and that he's a serious health risk.

I'm not making an argument here, just asking honest questions? Would you want him taking Blatche and McGee's minutes. If you give him Oberto roster spot, that's either more time at C, or less time on the floor for Dray, which I don't think is such a good thing.

It would certainly seem that we can use a moose on the boards; but frankly I'd think rather trade Jamison and a kid for an upgrade at PF than I would further screw with Blatche/McGee by having Blair in the mix.

I dunno.

[miller31time]

Even if we couldn't find a place on the roster for Blair, he's still a trade asset and certainly better than "cash".

[yungal07]

Ric Bucher tweeted last night about Blair "Glass eater but no rim protection and no discernible post game. Think Paul Millsap."

The point is well taken that Blair can play. I also just think it's important to acknowledge that his game is limited and that he's a serious health risk.

I'm not making an argument here, just asking honest questions? Would you want him taking Blatche and McGee's minutes. If you give him Oberto roster spot, that's either more time at C, or less time on the floor for Dray, which I don't think is such a good thing.

It would certainly seem that we can use a moose on the boards; but frankly I'd think rather trade Jamison and a kid for an upgrade at PF than I would further screw with Blatche/McGee by having Blair in the mix.

I dunno.

At this point, I'll take a player of Blair's skillset over Blatche. I am not a fan of Blatche at all. I do not like his soft, perimeter-oriented game. We need some beef. I can stand JMac because although he's frai in stature, he tries to attack the rim and dunk everything, unlike Blatche who wants to finesse everything into the basket.

I still think Grunfeld did the right thing in passing up Blair because of obvious reasons, but we still need some muscle up front. Right now, I'd trade Blatche for Carl Landry. Blatche is more talented, but Landry is a banger.

[nate33]

We've debated this over and over again. I'll take a long, skilled, athletic big man over a "banger" any day. Sure, it's nice to have a skilled banger like Duncan or Howard, but those guys are few and far between. If you're not lucky enough to have one, the best you can do is have one defensive center (like Perkins, Bynum, Ben Wallace, Oden or Nene) and play him alongside a long, skilled, athletic forward (Garnett, Gasol, R.Wallace, Aldridge, KMart).

We already have the defensive center in Haywood who is roughly similar to Bynum/Perkins/Wallace. Blatche is the type of guy who can fill the role of Garnett/Gasol/Rasheed/Aldridge. His style of game isn't really the problem. it's his lack of consistency.

I'm not saying Blatche is the missing link. It may be that Blatche just isn't good enough overall. I'm just saying that if you exchange Blatche for a brawnier, less skilled player of roughly equal overall talent, the end result won't be any better. You'd just be complaining about different issues. The Varajeo/Ben Wallace tandem couldn't win Cleveland a title despite having Lebron and a pretty talented backcourt.

[LyricalRico]

We've debated this over and over again. I'll take a long, skilled, athletic big man over a "banger" any day. Sure, it's nice to have a skilled banger like Duncan or Howard, but those guys are few and far between. If you're not lucky enough to have one, the best you can do is have one defensive center (like Perkins, Bynum, Ben Wallace, Oden or Nene) and play him alongside a long, skilled, athletic forward (Garnett, Gasol, R.Wallace, Aldridge, KMart).

We already have the defensive center in Haywood who is roughly similar to Bynum/Perkins/Wallace. Blatche is the type of guy who can fill the role of Garnett/Gasol/Rasheed/Aldridge. His style of game isn't really the problem. it's his lack of consistency (and perhaps a lack of overall talent, we shall see).

Agreed. If Jamison was 5 years younger and 2 inches taller we wouldn't have any problems. That's what we need to be looking for IMO, not miniature PFs who only star in preseason.

[Severn Hoos]

We've debated this over and over again. I'll take a long, skilled, athletic big man over a "banger" any day. Sure, it's nice to have a skilled banger like Duncan or Howard, but those guys are few and far between. If you're not lucky enough to have one, the best you can do is have one defensive center (like Perkins, Bynum, Ben Wallace, Oden or Nene) and play him alongside a long, skilled, athletic forward (Garnett, Gasol, R.Wallace, Aldridge, KMart).

We already have the defensive center in Haywood who is roughly similar to Bynum/Perkins/Wallace. Blatche is the type of guy who can fill the role of Garnett/Gasol/Rasheed/Aldridge. His style of game isn't really the problem. it's his lack of consistency (and perhaps a lack of overall talent, we shall see).

Agreed. If Jamison was 5 years younger and 2 inches taller we wouldn't have any problems. That's what we need to be looking for IMO, not miniature PFs who only star in preseason.

So all we need to do is trade Jamison for Rashard Lewis, and problem solved!

Actually, I'm a big fan of situational players - especially situational players who know and embrace their role willingly. The Backup PG who runs the offense and pesters the opposing PG for 15 minutes a night. The offensively challenged SG/SF who hounds the best perimeter player on the other team to knock him off his game. The dead-eye 3-point shooter who comes in to hit open looks and otherwise stay out of the way. And the undersized bruiser who grabs boards and uses his girth and skill to score inside when the taller, skilled (read: "finesse") guys just can't get it done, or their outside shot isn't falling.

Prior to this season, the only guy we had in any of those roles was McGuire, and he was forced into the starting lineup. These aren't the type of guys who should be starting or playing huge minutes. But they sure are nice to have on the bench when things aren't going your way.

[montestewart]

^^
So combine Jamison's developed skills with Blatches size, youth, and potential? I'd still want someone that went to the rim and rebounded more aggressively and used his size to create and block out space better than either of those two. Pass on KMart and even Rasheed now, but who wouldn't want the others? Unfortunately, they're almost as scarce as Duncan and Howard.

I think the comments about Blair and, elsewhere, Landry and similar, were partially tied to the small price to pay to get some rebounding and toughness, and if it crowded the roster, allow for a later trade. I'll be happy if Blatche develops into a surer scorer, defender and, especially, a more productive rebounder, but a reliable additional big wouldn't have hurt. Maybe Blair just had the best game he'll ever play (barring injuries, I doubt it), but Landry has shown he can play.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Personally, I'll take the guy who kicks ass. Blair kicks ass.

Is he an elite, athlete and rebounder like Rodman? No. But does he really go after every loose ball with the same intensity as Rodman? Yeah, I think so.

Is Blair able to protect the rim defensively? No. Yet, he's IMO kind of like the latter career Wes Unseld. Floorbound but not a defensive liability at all.

Is Blair a situational player and one-trick pony? Yeah, maybe. But he's got that one trick down better than anybody else his age that I've seen. Actually, he and Kevin Love are prodigious rebounders. So, I'd mention Love being the better young player because he's like Blair as a rebounder but has some serious skills on offense, too. I think Blair's rebounding is so good you have to find a place for him.

Blair to me is a physical, ass kicking dude. If his knees hold up, which I rather doubt, but if they do; he's going to be a great, great player.

Would I take him over Blatche and McGee? He's better than either one of them, but they don't come with no knee cartilege. (sp?). They can play C on a team with Jamison at PF. They can rebound and block shots. Blatche has some basketball skills and Javale is a freakish young kid. Hmmm...

I'd probably take Blair and McGee and leave Blatche and Oberto totally off my team for simplicity sake. My gut tells me Blair's a better fit at PF next to Haywood than even Jamison, but that's an ABSURD LEAP based on Jamison being a consistently good, energetic, hard working, well-rounded despite his rep on defense player. (Sorry, I know I needed a hyphen in there somewhere).

Yeah, if I could GM I'd have Blair coming off the bench on a pretty regular basis. So, for my team, with the knowledge I have a shotblocker like Haywood and a freak athlete like McGee on the roster I'd roll with Blair over Blatche and Oberto. He'd be behind Jamison, provided he can play 15-20 minutes a game without getting hurt. Life's a risk.

Possession of the ball is a big thing. Blair will give you that.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

We've debated this over and over again. I'll take a long, skilled, athletic big man over a "banger" any day. Sure, it's nice to have a skilled banger like Duncan or Howard, but those guys are few and far between. If you're not lucky enough to have one, the best you can do is have one defensive center (like Perkins, Bynum, Ben Wallace, Oden or Nene) and play him alongside a long, skilled, athletic forward (Garnett, Gasol, R.Wallace, Aldridge, KMart).

We already have the defensive center in Haywood who is roughly similar to Bynum/Perkins/Wallace. Blatche is the type of guy who can fill the role of Garnett/Gasol/Rasheed/Aldridge. His style of game isn't really the problem. it's his lack of consistency.

I'm not saying Blatche is the missing link. It may be that Blatche just isn't good enough overall. I'm just saying that if you exchange Blatche for a brawnier, less skilled player of roughly equal overall talent, the end result won't be any better. You'd just be complaining about different issues. The Varajeo/Ben Wallace tandem couldn't win Cleveland a title despite having Lebron and a pretty talented backcourt.

The Blatche/Aldridge comparison is a good one, nate. Their stats are really not that different at this point in their careers IMO. So, I might mess up big time selling Blatche short. I think Andray's going to get better for at least the next 2-3 seasons. He's a better than average player IMO.

[fishercob]

Personally, I'll take the guy who kicks ass. Blair kicks ass.

Is he an elite, athlete and rebounder like Rodman? No. But does he really go after every loose ball with the same intensity as Rodman? Yeah, I think so.

Is Blair able to protect the rim defensively? No. Yet, he's IMO kind of like the latter career Wes Unseld. Floorbound but not a defensive liability at all.

Is Blair a situational player and one-trick pony? Yeah, maybe. But he's got that one trick down better than anybody else his age that I've seen. Actually, he and Kevin Love are prodigious rebounders. So, I'd mention Love being the better young player because he's like Blair as a rebounder but has some serious skills on offense, too. I think Blair's rebounding is so good you have to find a place for him.

Blair to me is a physical, ass kicking dude. If his knees hold up, which I rather doubt, but if they do; he's going to be a great, great player.

Would I take him over Blatche and McGee? He's better than either one of them, but they don't come with no knee cartilege. (sp?). They can play C on a team with Jamison at PF. They can rebound and block shots. Blatche has some basketball skills and Javale is a freakish young kid. Hmmm...

I'd probably take Blair and McGee and leave Blatche and Oberto totally off my team for simplicity sake. My gut tells me Blair's a better fit at PF next to Haywood than even Jamison, but that's an ABSURD LEAP based on Jamison being a consistently good, energetic, hard working, well-rounded despite his rep on defense player. (Sorry, I know I needed a hyphen in there somewhere).

Yeah, if I could GM I'd have Blair coming off the bench on a pretty regular basis. So, for my team, with the knowledge I have a shotblocker like Haywood and a freak athlete like McGee on the roster I'd roll with Blair over Blatche and Oberto. He'd be behind Jamison, provided he can play 15-20 minutes a game without getting hurt. Life's a risk.

Possession of the ball is a big thing. Blair will give you that.

Excellent post, CCJ.

[closg00]

The Raptors vs Sixers re-match is neck-and-neck, but Bosh is dnp.

[nate33]

Darius Songaila posted an on/off differential of -30 in just 15 minutes of action.

Shaun Livingston played 26 minutes and put up decent numbers (10 points, 5-7 shooting, 3 assists but 4 turnovers).

[montestewart]

Darius Songaila posted an on/off differential of -30 in just 15 minutes of action.

I saw that too, and thought it was too easy to kick him when he's down, but his team only lost by six points! I hope he can pull something out next game.