RealGM

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 2:09 pm**

I got offered jamison and wilson chandler for ben gordon and joakim noah

I think chandler is slightly worse than noah for fantasy and jamison is a little better than gordon for fantasy bc he stacks at least 20 points and 8 rebounds with a few stats on high fg%..with arenas back and haywood coming back as well..will jamison be putting up good stats still?

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 2:38 pm**

His scoring will go down a bit with Arenas back. And, the bigger deal is probably that Saunders said that he'd like to lower his minutes for the regular season. Combine the two, and you might only get something like 17/7 out of him. He'll still get you a steal a three pointer a game from the PF spot though, which is nice.

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 3:02 pm**

I think MJG got it pretty close. Jamison will give you something along og the lines of 17-18 ppg, 8 or so rpg, a couple of assist, and maybe a three and a steal each game. Something to consider is his percentages from the field and three may rise a bit with less minutes played and the return of Arenas, meaning a lot more wide open shots and layups.

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 3:04 pm**

aj and wilson chan for ben and noah??? i would make that trade in a heart beat.

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:07 pm**

zaRdsAndZeRos wrote:aj and wilson chan for ben and noah??? i would make that trade in a heart beat.

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 7:00 pm**

I'd say jamison 16 and 7

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 7:04 pm**

Jamison is hard to call. He has a bad shoulder, is a year older, his minutes are going down, Miller in the starting lineup may steal some of Jamison's boards, and we have alot more weapons to score with. However, I think alot of that will be canceled out by the return of Gil who will be pushing the ball non stop and giving Jamison a ton of more easy & open shots than he had the last 2 years. IDK if MJG's numbers are right but Id venture to say that it will be somewhere around them

Posted: **Thu Oct 22, 2009 11:35 pm**

I'd stick with Gordon and Noah.

Jamison's fantasy impact is unimpressive because he doesn't score with particularly high efficiency. He'll only really help in points and rebounds. At least Gordon will give you a substantially positive boost in 3-pointers and FT% in addition to his points and assists. Does your league keep track of turnovers? If so, that makes it more of a toss up. Jamison never turns the ball over.

I like Noah over Chandler too.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 1:42 am**

AJ is going to get you 17 and 9 per night on Avg. Take that trade. His work ethic is unmatched.

True leader.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 2:30 am**

nate33 wrote:I'd stick with Gordon and Noah.

Jamison's fantasy impact is unimpressive because he doesn't score with particularly high efficiency. He'll only really help in points and rebounds. At least Gordon will give you a substantially positive boost in 3-pointers and FT% in addition to his points and assists. Does your league keep track of turnovers? If so, that makes it more of a toss up. Jamison never turns the ball over.

I like Noah over Chandler too.

I thought he had great percentages last year and I expect them to go up this year with Gil back, him passing more, and us running more

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 11:20 am**

this is so confusing..thx for your advice guys..if jamison didnt 'hurt' his sholder i was about to do the trade in a heart beat..

i always respected jamisons game and efficiency.

problem with noah is he can go off for rebounds and get a steal or two and a block or so.
gordon on a new team may get a lot of 3's and points on the board.

I'll hold off as long as I can..only thing is I don't really like wilson chandler

bset of luck to the wizards this season..I picked up arenas in the last week last year and he helped me boost up into the finals but I had to drop him in the last week:)

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 12:40 pm**

CourtsideTV, to add another wrinkle I wonder how many shots Ben Gordon can get playing with Hamilton, Villaneuva, Stuckey, Prince, and even Will Bynum? There are only so many basketballs to go around.

Gordon might not average what he did in Chicago. He and Hamilton are in the same situation Iverson and Hamilton were, splitting time at SG.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 12:47 pm**

I don't see anyway that the Pistons are not terrible this year.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 5:33 pm**

CourtsideTV wrote:I got offered jamison and wilson chandler for ben gordon and joakim noah

I think chandler is slightly worse than noah for fantasy and jamison is a little better than gordon for fantasy bc he stacks at least 20 points and 8 rebounds with a few stats on high fg%..with arenas back and haywood coming back as well..will jamison be putting up good stats still?

If Noah is Center eligible I think he is significantly more valuable than Wilson Chandler.

I think Jamison's stats will take a hit, he is injured and he helps in the easiest to get categories(pts and rebounds). Gordon gives you a lot of 3s, some assists and a decent FG% for a guard.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 6:38 pm**

dlts20 wrote:
nate33 wrote:I'd stick with Gordon and Noah.

Jamison's fantasy impact is unimpressive because he doesn't score with particularly high efficiency. He'll only really help in points and rebounds. At least Gordon will give you a substantially positive boost in 3-pointers and FT% in addition to his points and assists. Does your league keep track of turnovers? If so, that makes it more of a toss up. Jamison never turns the ball over.

I like Noah over Chandler too.

I thought he had great percentages last year and I expect them to go up this year with Gil back, him passing more, and us running more

Here are their numbers last year, only I'll project them over 35 minutes per game (which is what I think both will average).

Code: Select all

Player           PTS  REB  AST  3PM  STL  BLK   TO  FG%  FT%  FTA
jamison,antawn  20.6  8.2  1.7  1.3  1.1  0.3  1.4 .468 .754  5.2
gordon,ben      19.5  3.3  3.2  2.0  0.8  0.3  2.3 .456 .865  4.4

Points, Blocks and FG% are a wash. Jamison doubles Gordon on the boards. Gordon almost doubles Jamison from the arc. Gordon has a small advantage in assists which is partially offset by Jamison's small advantage in steals. That makes them about equal over 7 categories. The big difference is that Gordon will drag up his team's FT% while Jamison will not. If you then factor that Jamison is likely to decline a wee bit while Gordon might improve a touch, then I think the edge goes to Gordon.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 6:41 pm**

^^ Jamison advantage in rebounds is much more significant than Gordon's advantage in assists. I think they are about even. And given that there are less quality bigs than quality guards, I would have Jamison's value higher than Gordon, provided that he is healthy.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:08 pm**

Kanyewest wrote:^^ Jamison advantage in rebounds is much more significant than Gordon's advantage in assists. I think they are about even. And given that there are less quality bigs than quality guards, I would have Jamison's value higher than Gordon, provided that he is healthy.

The average NBA fantasy player makes about 0.8 three pointers a game. Jamison is just slightly above average. Ben Gordon is two standard deviations above average. It's Gordon's advantage in 3 pointers, not his assists, that offsets Jamison's advantage in rebounds.

When you look at fantasy stats, it's not about aggregate difference in numbers, it's the deviation above the mean. Consider the following two hypothetical players:

Player A: 16 points, 14 rebounds, 10 assists, 0.7 steals, 0.5 blocks, 0.5 threes.
Player B: 16 points, 6 rebounds, 5 assists, 2.5 steals, 2 blocks, 2.5 threes.

In real life, we'd all prefer Player A. In fantasy basketball, Player B is the better player. Those differences in steals, blocks and threes may not look that big, but they are.

Posted: **Fri Oct 23, 2009 8:51 pm**

^^ In fantasy, I would rather have Jamison (if he was healthy anyways) because it's harder to find quality big men. It would be like how Santonio Holmes is a better receiver than Antonio Gates, but Gates is more valuable because he plays tight end.

If we're simply arguing for a flex position, then you would have to take Gordon. However, the depth of guards is usually deeper than it is for power forwards. Antawn Jamison when healthy is a top 10 fantasy power forward. Ben Gordon may barely be in the top 15.

At the end of the day, Gordon averages 1.8 more apg. 6% better from 3 point range, while Jamison averaged 5.4 rpg. However, if Jamison was healthy, I would expect Jamison's shooting numbers to go up with Arenas healthy, as well his rebounding numbers with the return of Brendan Haywood.

Posted: **Sat Oct 24, 2009 2:25 am**

nate33 wrote:
dlts20 wrote:
nate33 wrote:I'd stick with Gordon and Noah.

Jamison's fantasy impact is unimpressive because he doesn't score with particularly high efficiency. He'll only really help in points and rebounds. At least Gordon will give you a substantially positive boost in 3-pointers and FT% in addition to his points and assists. Does your league keep track of turnovers? If so, that makes it more of a toss up. Jamison never turns the ball over.

I like Noah over Chandler too.

I thought he had great percentages last year and I expect them to go up this year with Gil back, him passing more, and us running more

Here are their numbers last year, only I'll project them over 35 minutes per game (which is what I think both will average).
Code: Select all
Player PTS REB AST 3PM STL BLK TO FG% FT% FTA jamison,antawn 20.6 8.2 1.7 1.3 1.1 0.3 1.4 .468 .754 5.2 gordon,ben 19.5 3.3 3.2 2.0 0.8 0.3 2.3 .456 .865 4.4

Points, Blocks and FG% are a wash. Jamison doubles Gordon on the boards. Gordon almost doubles Jamison from the arc. Gordon has a small advantage in assists which is partially offset by Jamison's small advantage in steals. That makes them about equal over 7 categories. The big difference is that Gordon will drag up his team's FT% while Jamison will not. If you then factor that Jamison is likely to decline a wee bit while Gordon might improve a touch, then I think the edge goes to Gordon.

wow that is amazing..thanks for the heads up:)

I think I'll just keep the trade open and watch the stats they put up until the other person cancels the trade:) Noah went off in rebounds which is why im worried about giving him up:) If noah gets 9 points 15 rebounds..i think its as effective as jamison...and ben gordon will be a little better than chandler. thx everyone for the help..plus jamison out 4-6 weeks which means I will be handicapped for a while..i'd rather keep my healthy squad then take a gamble...jamisons injury godforbid can turn into a wade or jameer nelsoN:(

Posted: **Sat Oct 24, 2009 2:26 am**

Kanyewest wrote:^^ In fantasy, I would rather have Jamison (if he was healthy anyways) because it's harder to find quality big men. It would be like how Santonio Holmes is a better receiver than Antonio Gates, but Gates is more valuable because he plays tight end.

If we're simply arguing for a flex position, then you would have to take Gordon. However, the depth of guards is usually deeper than it is for power forwards. Antawn Jamison when healthy is a top 10 fantasy power forward. Ben Gordon may barely be in the top 15.

At the end of the day, Gordon averages 1.8 more apg. 6% better from 3 point range, while Jamison averaged 5.4 rpg. However, if Jamison was healthy, I would expect Jamison's shooting numbers to go up with Arenas healthy, as well his rebounding numbers with the return of Brendan Haywood.

you are right but so is naet..player b would be better bc he gets 3's, steals and blocks..you can get rebounsd and points from other guys...

for bigs..i already have amare, z, and pau gasol

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