The Incredibly Offensively Challenged Brendan Haywood Thread

[mohammed10]

Following the abysmal Minnesota loss...

Bottom line - BTH is just too damned inconsistent. Remember last season when some folks on this board tried to say that not having Haywood was as big a reason for the season going off the track as Hibachi's knee? That type of talk seems rather baseless now.

Wood did a very poor job keeping Love and Jefferson off the glass despite a 3 to 4 inch height advantage. His length is nullified by his knock-kneed jumping technique and tendency to bring the ball down on EVERY gather for a paint finish.

He gets the ball slapped away way more than he should plus he's erratic from the line WHEN he gets there.

He averages 13.8 points per 48 which is lower than every other big on thie Wiz except OldBerto.

When the team is losing so many close games I think it's fair to nitpick Brenda's lack of offensive acumen. For those that will argue that offense is not his game, I agree. BTH's not scoring isn't really the problem, per se. He's not a scorer and unless he has a point-blank gimme (a couple of which he failed to convert in this game and multiple others) he shouldn't be thinking about scoring. Problem is, he does nothing else that helps the team on offense, either. He doesn't set great screens, is not a very good passer, doesn't finish well in traffic. He's a near-complete null space on the offensive end of the floor.

The time has come to trade BTH and get for him what we can...otherwise, mark me down in the nay column when it comes to re-signing him this July.

[Devilzsidewalk]

know though that if the other 4 in the starting lineup hadn't gone 25 for 64 shooting that the Wiz would've won and you'd get to praise Wood for doing what he does: holding Al Jefferson to 11 pts on 4 for 13. Not fair to ask Haywood to be what he's never been on offense, but those other 4 guys are supposed to be scorers and they didn't do their jobs. If those other 4 do their jobs then this is a W and Haywoods light shines through.

[montestewart]

Arenas missed most of 07-08 (43-39 record) and 08-09 (19-63 record), and the primary difference between the two teams was Haywood's absence in 08-09. Given the teams multiple scorers and well-documented defensive deficiencies, the absence of of its best offensive player could reasonably be seen as less critical than the loss of its most (and sometimes only) reliable defender. Not saying he was or is better than Arenas, but it was sound logic then, and I'm not changing my tune now.

As to Haywood's offense, I don't like it but it's what it's always been. Haywood might work much better with a more physical interior scorer (Boozer, Stoudemire, Landry, etc.) but his offense, until this year, didn't seem like much of an issue. Maybe it should be, and I've wanted to see that physical interior scoring element added to the Wizards. Regardless, calling Haywood out for inconsistency seems silly considering the team as a whole. For much of the game, the Wolves had two agile young bigs in there (Jefferson and Love), and that surely had something to do with his production. They shot a combined 10-26. The game wasn't lost in the pivot.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

montestewart, given Haywood's consistency what I think the Wizards need is to do just what you said--pair him with a Boozer, Stoudemire, or Landry. Add Zach Randolph to that list. I would pray for Bosh ...

Washington needs to have a very good defensive rebounder who on offense can also score on the low post next to Haywood.

[DaRealHibachi]

So even Wood is catching flak now...

Get over it, Wood is what he is... This year he hasn't been inconsistent; I'd call it overachieving if he scores more than 8 points, since he only gets about 7 attempts per game and isn't a good finisher...

Blaming him for anything else but his defense or rebounding is uncalled for... (and oh, him going up against 2 of the best rebounders in the league most def. didn't help him last night) This guy gets no plays called for him, he gets his off easy dunks and offensive rebounds, which is enough shots I would say... If we needed a scorer down low, it should be AJ with that flipshot, but since he loves him some shotjacking, Wood is being exposed...

Wood can be an amazing role playing starter on a championship team... Just pair him with any kind of post scorer and Wood will not be exposed... Simple as that...

[nate33]

Offensively challenged? Sure. Tell us something we don't know.

Inconsistent? That's the most ridiculous accusation I've ever heard. Haywood is easily the most consistent player on the team. He consistently leads the team in rebounding. He consistently anchors the defense. He consistently shuts down opposing big men. Heck, only one low post player all season has had a good game against Haywood: Kaman. Haywood has pwn3d everyone else.

[Halcyon]

Naturally on a sucky-asstastic team nobody should be free from criticism, but he's probably the last guy I would look at as a negative influence on this team. He's one of the best offensive rebounders in the game today (5th in the league) and is a physical post defender who plays smart defense most of the time (4th in blocked shots on 2.8 fouls a game).

He may hurt this team on offense, but you would think on a team with 3 former all-star players on offense this would not be an issue. He does plenty on the defensive end on this team to give him a pass on being mediocre on offense.

[mohammed10]

Offensively challenged? Sure. Tell us something we don't know.

Inconsistent? That's the most ridiculous accusation I've ever heard. Haywood is easily the most consistent player on the team. He consistently leads the team in rebounding. He consistently anchors the defense. He consistently shuts down opposing big men. Heck, only one low post player all season has had a good game against Haywood: Kaman. Haywood has pwn3d everyone else.

nate- BTH is like a VERY poor man's Robert Parrish...but it's not the 20th century anymore.

Today's big men are more nimble, athletic and fluid..3 characteristics Brendan will never be accused of being.

[mohammed10]

Blaming him for anything else but his defense or rebounding is uncalled for... (and oh, him going up against 2 of the best rebounders in the league most def. didn't help him last night) This guy gets no plays called for him, he gets his off easy dunks and offensive rebounds, which is enough shots I would say... If we needed a scorer down low, it should be AJ with that flipshot, but since he loves him some shotjacking, Wood is being exposed...

Wood can be an amazing role playing starter on a championship team... Just pair him with any kind of post scorer and Wood will not be exposed... Simple as that...

And he still can't average 10 points a game in over 30 minutes? Sometimes with Haywood, it's just pointless.

How many times has he grabbed an offensive board, gone up weak and missed the easy layin but gotten fouled. Then he splits a pair at the line. Classic ared effries disease.

Is this BS worth 7 million a year when there's potentially a young stud on the bench ready to cut his teeth?

[verbal8]

While Haywood helps the Wizards in a lot of areas, he does have terrible hands which makes him an offensive liability. When he sticks to his role(very limited on offense) he helps the team and is pretty consistent. In the past he would try to force things too much offensively and that would have very inconsistent results.

[LyricalRico]

Naturally on a sucky-asstastic team nobody should be free from criticism, but he's probably the last guy I would look at as a negative influence on this team. He's one of the best offensive rebounders in the game today (5th in the league) and is a physical post defender who plays smart defense most of the time (4th in blocked shots on 2.8 fouls a game).

He may hurt this team on offense, but you would think on a team with 3 former all-star players on offense this would not be an issue. He does plenty on the defensive end on this team to give him a pass on being mediocre on offense.

Nobody would be questioning Haywood's value if they weren't so infatuated with McGee's athleticism. Everybody's drooling over the guy's measurables when it's clear he's not even close to being an NBA player mentally. Yes, he can make some good plays by accident just because of his physical gifts. But that's not enough. Stop focusing on what McGee might someday eventually be if we're lucky and instead appreciate Haywood for what he actually is in the here and now.

[WizarDynasty]

I would rather develop blatche with Haywood's minutes and have haywood come off the bench. At least blatche still has upside which is slowly disappearing while Haywood has no upside at all. Decreasing Haywood's minutes has no effect on Haywood's development.
Blatche doesn't have the shotblocking and offensive rebounding but he is a better over all player than haywood. Haywood is a bench player in the mold of Erick Dampier. Blatche upsides is alot closer to Dirk Nowitski.

[MJG]

Blaming him for anything else but his defense or rebounding is uncalled for... (and oh, him going up against 2 of the best rebounders in the league most def. didn't help him last night) This guy gets no plays called for him, he gets his off easy dunks and offensive rebounds, which is enough shots I would say... If we needed a scorer down low, it should be AJ with that flipshot, but since he loves him some shotjacking, Wood is being exposed...

Wood can be an amazing role playing starter on a championship team... Just pair him with any kind of post scorer and Wood will not be exposed... Simple as that...

And he still can't average 10 points a game in over 30 minutes? Sometimes with Haywood, it's just pointless.

How many times has he grabbed an offensive board, gone up weak and missed the easy layin but gotten fouled. Then he splits a pair at the line. Classic ared effries disease.

Is this BS worth 7 million a year when there's potentially a young stud on the bench ready to cut his teeth?

I went ahead and greened up your post for you. I know it may seem unnecessary with sarcasm that obvious, but there's always going to be one or two people who misinterpret uncolored text as serious.

[closg00]

While Haywood helps the Wizards in a lot of areas, he does have terrible hands which makes him an offensive liability. When he sticks to his role(very limited on offense) he helps the team and is pretty consistent. In the past he would try to force things too much offensively and that would have very inconsistent results.

+1 My feelings on BTH also, as others have mentioned, we just need to have a better PF to pair with him. Anway, this is going to be a mute point. Wood is gone after this season fo-sure.

[WizarDynasty]

Haywood is not that good people. Part of defense is securing a defensive rebound and Haywood ranks as one of the worst starting centers in the league at defensive rebounding. He routinely gives up an entire possession for the wizard on offense because he doesn't have the mobility, agility, and hand coordination to secure a defensive rebound.
In other words, each time he gives up an offensive rebound, its equivalent to the wizards running down teh court and missing a shot.
Not securing a defensive rebounding is POOR post defense.
Haywood kills you on offense with his lack of defensive rebounding in traffic and his poor post play. Get it straight people.
Javale needs a weight vest

http://www.weightvest.com/Pages/40basketball.html

Haywood has 180 rebounds for the entire season. that ranks him at 22. Pretty far from being ranked number 4. finally out of all the players who have 180 rebounds, brenda ranks dead last in points scored, he has only 13 assists for the entire season. That means out of 28 games, he has only created an easy shot for another player only 13 times. That ranks dead last. He has only scored 104 fgm..that ranks close to the bottom with players with 180 defensive rebounds or more. He has only 53 FT's for the entire season so he isn't getting the other bigman in foul trouble at all.
Homers, Haywood is not that good. statistically, he only excels at blocks and offensive rebounds. He is one of the worst defensive rebounders, he can't create easy shots for others, and he can't get to the free throw line for easy shots.
Even pathetic kendrick perkins has scored 138 fgms to haywoods 104 fgm. Haywood is not that good homers. The problem with Wizards fans is that the wizards have sucked for so long at the center and p/f positions that we don't what a good is so we over rate. We compare haywood to Muresan or Popeye Jones, Kwame and Etan Thomas. Wizards have had nothing but bums for center, haywood is just slightly better than them but you compare haywood to the top defensive rebounders in the league and you see a clearer picture. what makes this so bad is that haywood is suppose to be a stand out defensive center yet gerald wallace has more defensive rebounds that him. we are giving the nod to haywoods defensive ability and over look how horrible his offensive statistical production is. if you are that horrible on offense...aka ..ben wallace, you better be outstanding on defense. folks, haywood is as complete player..is a bum. Compare him to the top 30 defensive rebounders in the league..and you see he has only 13 assists, he ranks at the bottom at defensive rebounds, and he has ranks at the bottom and Free throws made, and he ranks at the bottom at total fgm made.
Open your eyes homers. we need at top defensive rebounder at the center position if that same center absoluted sucks and ranks at the bottom in points scored and free throws made. Kendrick Perkins 138 fgms compared to haywood 104 fgm after nearly 30 games and kendrick perkins is allstar compared to haywood.

you look at the 07-08 season when haywood was healthy, he averaged 28 minutes a game and played 80 of 82 games. guess how many defensive rebounds he had. 303.

Code: Select all

                FGM   DEFREB   ASST
1   Dwight H   167   288   45!!
2   Gerald W   156   261   52
3   Carlos B   235   260   105
4   Chris Bo   258   256   59
5   David Le  226   252   80
6   Marcus C   98   247   94
7   Joakim N   115   231   66
8   Dirk Now   277   214   79
9   Luis Sco   198   213   58
10   Al Horfo   170   207   61
11   Marc Gas   162   202   65
12   Lamar Od   99   200   102
13   Chris Ka   250   197   55!
14   Nene Hil   157   194   73
15   Al Jeffe   207   192   58!
16   Amar'e S   235   191   33!!!
17   LeBron J   322   190   250
18   Tim Dunc   207   188   83
19   Zach Ran   234   185   57
20   Brook Lo   207   184   63
21   Emeka Ok   120   182   16!!!
22   Brenda     104   180   13!!!
23   LaMarcus   207   180   56
24   Troy Mur   121   179   48
25   Kevin Ga   173   173   71
26   Kendrick   138   168   32!!!
27   Andre Ig   195   168   158
28   Ben Wall   50   167   54
29   Joel Prz   45   166   8!!!!
30   Josh Smi   175   164   102
31   Kevin Du   270   162   88
32   Anderson   97   161   29!!!
33   Jason Th   171   161   59
34   Kenyon M   120   160   49
35   Samuel D   73   159   38!!!!
36   Jason Ki   88   159   284
37   Luol Den   202   157   59
38   Erick Da   79   157   9!!!

Brenda lously 13 assists shows that he is one of the least intelligent bigman in the league !!!!. 104 FGM shows that he is also a extremely poor offensive executor. His defensive rebounding ranks him at 22 in the league. not close to being ranked 4th. You also see that Jamison has a low offensive IQ as well with very low assists numbers. Ranking a players assists relative to his position displays his basketball IQ especially offensively. Brenda 180 defensive rebounds is only 13 more than point guard jason kid, Gerald Wallace a small forward destroy haywood. tim duncan, who is on the decline, still has score 100 more fgm than haywood has in the same number of games. If you are below average defensive rebounding, i expect for you to make up for by scoring more fgm like tim duncan did. Haywood sucks people. the quicker you let this sink in, the better you guys can come up with solution to making my team into a dynasty. Kendrick Perkins is tier above haywood. He has scored 30 more fg than haywood and has twice as many assist and even Kendrick ranks pretty low in terms of offensive basketball Iq. that shows just how horrible haywood's offensive Iq is. Haywood is another major reason this team sucks people. His offensive rebouding is not boosting his fgms...field goal made based on the stats people. and he has league low 13 assists which is path

[nate33]

Oh dear God! Not this argument again!

[daSwami]

couldn't agree more. dude's a total stiff.

[nate33]

daSwami,

I hate you.

[closg00]

Great stuff WizDynasty. The reason Wood has such poor assist-numbers is because he has such poor hands and poor mobility so he usually freezes (just like Orberto) when he gets the ball. If he has to put that ball on the floor, look-out cause a slow-motion and akward move to the basket is coming-up. Is indeed to horrible rebounder. I don't give him credit for pulling-down uncontested rebounds which tends to pad numbers. Around the basket, Wood is a wasteland unless he can dunk uncontested.

Brendan does have a good defensive IQ, he knows how to set screens and he knows where his teammates should be on the floor and he will often shout directions to them. Brendan also plays good man D on most of his counterparts in the NBA, effectively reducing their numbers or taking some of them out nearly entirely.

Brendan is a good guy to have on your team, but he has to be used in the right way. Brendan is decent back-up Center IMO.

[fishercob]

Great stuff WizDynasty. The reason Wood has such poor assist-numbers is because he has such poor hands and poor mobility so he usually freezes (just like Orberto) when he gets the ball. If he has to put that ball on the floor, look-out cause a slow-motion and akward move to the basket is coming-up. Is indeed to horrible rebounder. I don't give him credit for pulling-down uncontested rebounds which tends to pad numbers. Around the basket, Wood is a wasteland unless he can dunk uncontested.

Brendan does have a good defensive IQ, he knows how to set screens and he knows where his teammates should be on the floor and he will often shout directions to them. Brendan also plays good man D on most of his counterparts in the NBA, effectively reducing their numbers or taking some of them out nearly entirely.

Brendan is a good guy to have on your team, but he has to be used in the right way. Brendan is decent back-up Center IMO.

You, my friend, are the consummate hater. .