Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness

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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#21 » by cpower » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:04 pm

does he always play passive? He doesn't look like Lebron to me at all, more like a taller version of Gordon Hayward.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#22 » by ReasonablySober » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:05 pm

olive_triangurl wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
laploutocratie wrote::roll:

To me, this "lack of competitiveness" is such a cop out when describing basketball players. Same was said about Wiggins too.

The guys writing these, many of whom have never played a minute of competitive basketball in their lives, are going to say that a guy that has gotten this good up to the collegiate level didn't have the drive to compete? Please.


That's not the best comparison to drop here. Wiggins has looked like a waste of ability on many nights this season when he offers nothing but scoring.


Wiggins isn't in a position to dominate the playmaking and rack up assists. Rubio is his teammate....


It's not just playmaking (although it's strange that you think only one player is allowed to be a playmaker on any given team), I'm saying Wiggins also isn't offering anything with regards to rebounding, defense, steals, or blocks either.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#23 » by The Penguin » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:06 pm

I really don't understand the choice to go to LSU. I get they likely paid him the most, but in theory anything short of him carrying a severely undermanned team to the Sweet 16 was going to be looked at as a disappointment. The blue bloods of college basketball have proven time and time again the ability to get guys through the 1 year and minimize the questions regarding "competitiveness" or other fake red flags. It's a pit stop, kids shouldn't try to pull a Melo and carry an undermanned team to prominence, just spend your year at Kentucky - Duke - Kansas, get embraced by their NBA alumni, win some games and move on. If he had a guy like Coach K in his corner a lot of these stories wouldn't be written as writers would want to maintain the relationship with Coach K.

I'd be more concerned about his shooting ability, but he's a 19 year old kid who found himself in a bad situation with a coach who lost control of the team.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#24 » by The Moose » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:18 pm

WarriorsEFC wrote:As soon as I read the part in the article about Simmons Australian teammates I knew it was a sham article. I know 1 person involved in the Australian coaching setup.... and just about everything about that was an outright lie. The only thing that was right was that they called him "The Yank".... but the writer of this article has twisted it to make it sound like a derogatory statement which it is not. The nickname is because when he came to the Australian training camp last year he had a weird mixture of American and Australian accent.

As for the rest of it.... Simmons does have an outward laidback nature that most Australians do... and this has been misinterpreted as laziness and a "lack of competitiveness"which couldn't be further from the truth. If he looks sometimes like he is not engaged on the court it is because LSU and their coach Johnny Jones completely misused him.

Everyone knew coming out of highschool his best position was point forward with the ball in his hands. A 6ft 10 guy with dribbling skills and athleticism that can layup with either hand. Why would you not play him at the 1 spot? Because they had a more senior point guard called Tim Quarterman who basically could only play the 1 and nothing else. Quarterman can't shoot... can't pass... in fact he can't do much.

Simmons actually admitted only a few weeks ago that he would prefer to have played the 1 but sacrificed for Coach Jones and the sake of the team and played at the 4 and 5... because Quarterman wasn't a shooter and couldn't play anywhere outside of the 1. The truth is Quarterman should have been on the bench and not starting at all.

If you watched every LSU game as I did... the pattern was the same. They played Simmons in the post 90% of the time... and nobody on the team could make entry passes and when they did he would be double or triple teamed and have to kick it right out. He had players around him jacking up shots that couldn't shoot. He would spend pockets of 3-5 minutes of game time where the ball may never even pass through his hands in offensive sets because they couldn't get it to him!! The #1 player in the country.... and this is how Coach Jones misused him.

The only time Simmons ever got the ball and dribbled with it against opposition was when he got his own rebound and didn't give the ball up.... and probably had am 80% success rate of scoring or drawing the foul in those occassions. Apart from that he never got the ball in half court offense at the 1 spot.... unless they needed him to shave 25 seconds off the clock.

There was also a period there in the season where LSU were going down by 10 point margins with 4 mins to go in games... and then and only then would Simmons get the ball up the court and take it to the rim and got to be aggressive. There are games where he scored 10 or 15 of the last points in games trying to will his team back out of a hole that guys like Quarterman had put them into.... and just come up short.

I don't blame Simmons for that. Who gets to take the ball up the court... is the coaches call. Right up until the last minute of the last game of the season... Jones continued to misuse Simmons.... and it was all about keeping other senior players onside that he wanted to come back next year to LSU. He knew Simmons was one and done but to keep his job he needed others to be happy.

So LSU never got the best out of Simmons. Simmons never got to play in the position he was most suited to. And now he is about to go to the NBA.. more than likely a top 2 pick. He will be a gun... in a system where others around him can shoot and play basketball. Nobody at LSU could do that... and he can't be held responsible for not getting them to the NCAA when the guy is literally frozen out on the court by the ineptness of his own coach and teammates.

The only person that managed to shut down Ben Simmons all year was his own coach.... Johnny Jones.


The Australian coaches might have one opinion, but some of the junior national teams players have very different opinions of Ben Simmons
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#25 » by Crooked-I » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:20 pm

It's pretty obvious that he's hurting his stock on purpose so he falls to the Lakers. Smart man. :wink:
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#26 » by Yoshun » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:23 pm

This is was people always say about stars who can't "will" their teams to victory. This is all because LSU blows. Some how, if Simmons were really that great, he would have driven the team deep into the tournament or something. It's ridiculous.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#27 » by jmnvcavs » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:30 pm

Yoshun wrote:This is was people always say about stars who can't "will" their teams to victory. This is all because LSU blows. Some how, if Simmons were really that great, he would have driven the team deep into the tournament or something. It's ridiculous.


LSU lost two players to the draft last year and Hornsby was injured nearly the whole year... This team could of potentially made the tournament, but no way they were making a run.

People always use Melo as an example, but his team had Hakim Warrick and Gerry Mcnamara who were both very good college players.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#28 » by WarriorsEFC » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:39 pm

The Penguin wrote:I really don't understand the choice to go to LSU. I get they likely paid him the most, but in theory anything short of him carrying a severely undermanned team to the Sweet 16 was going to be looked at as a disappointment.


His godfather who grew up with Simmons was the assistant coach at LSU. Had nothing to do with money... that is the only reason he went there. Otherwise Simmons said he was going to join Duke.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#29 » by The Penguin » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:41 pm

WarriorsEFC wrote:
The Penguin wrote:I really don't understand the choice to go to LSU. I get they likely paid him the most, but in theory anything short of him carrying a severely undermanned team to the Sweet 16 was going to be looked at as a disappointment.


His godfather who grew up with Simmons was the assistant coach at LSU. Had nothing to do with money... that is the only reason he went there. Otherwise Simmons said he was going to join Duke.



It always has something to do with money.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#30 » by WarriorsEFC » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:48 pm

cpower wrote:does he always play passive? He doesn't look like Lebron to me at all, more like a taller version of Gordon Hayward.


No.. the whole "he plays passive" thing is being hypercritical. They say he doesn't demand the ball... but when you play in the post and nobody can get you the ball I am not sure how you can be aggressive.

Here is an example of him in a game where there is no coincidence that Tim Quarterman was dropped from the starting lineup and benched... and Josh Gray who is a more pass first guard was in with Simmons also getting some of the ballhandling duties. The benching for Quarterman was a lesson for him... which Quarterman seemed to get in this game giving the ball up more... instead of shooting... but that wasn't to last.

You can see Simmons is a completely different player when he is allowed to get the ball and create with it. I wouldn't say he is passive at all.

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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#31 » by rockmanslim » Tue Apr 5, 2016 5:57 am

I think the comparisons with how Wiggins was criticized are way, way off. People who said Wiggins "lacked competitiveness" weren't actually watching him in college. He didn't lack competitiveness. He lacked ball skills. He was terrified of dribbling the ball, or showing any kind of ball manipulation skill, dexterity, etc., or any creativity with the ball in his hands, because he knew he couldn't. The "lacks competitiveness" excuse was just that, an excuse.

For Simmons, I think the criticism might actually have merit, because Simmons actually does have skill with the ball. He does have the ability to attack and create for his team. He should have been more assertive. He did look terrified at times, at times looking like a deer in the headlights, yet at the same time trying to play it too cool, trying to appear non-chalant, which only made him look more scared, especially on nationally televised games. So that may be an issue to monitor with him. But he has the skills. Yes, he lacks a jumper, but you're far more likely to improve your jumper once you enter the NBA than you are your ball handling/dexterity/creativity.
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#32 » by GimmeDat » Wed Apr 6, 2016 10:20 am

The Moose wrote:The Australian coaches might have one opinion, but some of the junior national teams players have very different opinions of Ben Simmons



What opinions would they be?
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Re: Ben Simmons: Lack of Competitiveness 

Post#33 » by anubis0713 » Wed Jun 1, 2016 3:15 am

The Moose wrote:
The Australian coaches might have one opinion, but some of the junior national teams players have very different opinions of Ben Simmons


You mean the junior national team he played for when he was 15?

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