Cap related question

[The_Hater]

I know that teams can't use their cap space to sign free-agents and then start using their MLE/LLE once they run out of cap room.

My question is with the Grizzlies being $14 million under the cap, could they trade for a big contract right now (say if they previously took Marcus Camby and his $10 million salary off the Nuggets) and at that point announce that they're going to use their exceptions to sign free-agents? Or have they already lost their exceptions?

[Three34]

If they don't renounce their exceptions, then they can't make that trade in the first place. It's either/or.

[Dunkenstein]

In the Grizzlies case I don't think it's a matter of renouncing exceptions. They are so far under the cap that they no longer have exceptions to use this year.

[Three34]

I thought every team got an MLE, and those with cap room merely renounced it.

[Dekko1]

I thought every team got an MLE, and those with cap room merely renounced it.

If a team is so far under the cap that all the available exceptions will not put them over the cap, then they do not get the exceptions. If they are under but the totaled exceptions put them over the cap, then they get the exceptions and they are added to team salary.

If they are over the cap they get the exceptions but the exceptions are not added to team salary since it is to plug the loophole for signing free agents with cap space and then using the exceptions.

If they are given the exceptions and lose their FAs and drop to the point where team salary and exceptions combined are under the cap then their exceptions are taken away.

[Wizenheimer]

I thought every team got an MLE, and those with cap room merely renounced it.

If a team is so far under the cap that all the available exceptions will not put them over the cap, then they do not get the exceptions. If they are under but the totaled exceptions put them over the cap, then they get the exceptions and they are added to team salary.

If they are over the cap they get the exceptions but the exceptions are not added to team salary since it is to plug the loophole for signing free agents with cap space and then using the exceptions.

If they are given the exceptions and lose their FAs and drop to the point where team salary and exceptions combined are under the cap then their exceptions are taken away.

most of that I got and understood it as being corect before your post.

The one thing that isn't clear is whether or not a team substantially under the cap...say for instance portland next year is 20 million under...has the exceptions count against their team salary unless they renounce. In the case of portland, I somehow thought they'd have to renounce the exceptions for the 09/10 season to actually build the 20 million in space. Or maybe there's a specific rule that says portland couldn't sign 2 players bringing them right to the cap, and then use their MLE to sign a 3rd player.

[Dekko1]

Wizenheimer wrote I thought every team got an MLE, and those with cap room merely renounced it.

If a team is so far under the cap that all the available exceptions will not put them over the cap, then they do not get the exceptions.

If they are over the cap they get the exceptions but the exceptions are not added to team salary since it is to plug the loophole for signing free agents with cap space and then using the exceptions.

If they are given the exceptions and lose their FAs and drop to the point where team salary and exceptions combined are under the cap then their exceptions are taken away.

most of that I got and understood it as being correct before your post.

The one thing that isn't clear is whether or not a team substantially under the cap...say for instance portland next year is 20 million under...has the exceptions count against their team salary unless they renounce.

The part I was answering was the assumption that every team get the exceptions. They do not.
If they are farther under the cap than their signed salary plus any cap holds plus the exceptions, they do not receive the exceptions and I think also lose any trade exception they hold. They do not have to renounce what they do not have.
"Exception" to the cap is just that.


Here is the rule:
http://nbpa.com/cba_articles/article-VII_6.php
(k) Other Rules.
(1) A Team shall be entitled to the Disabled Player, Bi-annual, Mid-Level Salary, and Assigned Player Exceptions set forth in Section 6(c), (d), (e) and (h) above, respectively, except as set forth in Section 6(h)(2) and (3) above, only if, at the time any such Exception would arise and at all times until it is used, the Team’s Team Salary, excluding the amount(s) of such Exception and any other Exception that would be included in Team Salary pursuant to Section 6(k)(2) below, is (i) at or above the Salary Cap, or (ii) below the Salary Cap by less than the amount(s) of the Team’s Exception(s).

(2) In the event that when a Disabled Player Exception, Bi-annual Exception, Mid-Level Salary Exception and/or Assigned Player Exception arises, the Team’s Team Salary is below the Salary Cap (or in the event that, prior to the expiration of any such Exceptions, the Team’s Team Salary falls below the Salary Cap) by less than the amount of such Exceptions, then (i) the Team’s Team Salary shall include, until the Exceptions are actually used or until the Team no longer is entitled to use the Exceptions, the amount of the Exceptions (or any unused portion of the Exceptions), and (ii) the amount by which the Team’s Team Salary is less than the Salary Cap shall thereby be extinguished.


Had to hunt but it is better explained at the end of Larry's FAQ #20
===

In the case of portland, I somehow thought they'd have to renounce the exceptions for the 09/10 season to actually build the 20 million in space. Or maybe there's a specific rule that says portland couldn't sign 2 players bringing them right to the cap, and then use their MLE to sign a 3rd player.

In the Portland sample...with the cap holds on 4 FAs at well over 25 million they would be over the cap and get the exceptions. After they sign or renounce the FAs... and if still over cap with the exceptions... they would then need to renounce the exceptions to make much cap room.
If taking care of the FA cap holds put them under the cap to where the exceptions no longer put them over then the exceptions are gone automatically.

[LarryCoon]

Just to add an additional perspective to Dekko1's already-thorough reply -- the rules are set up so teams have either cap room or exceptions, but never both.

[Dekko1]

So an additional question.
If a team is say 9 mil under the cap and holds 10 million in exceptions and wants to sign a FA for 7 million...can they just waive part of the exceptions like the MLE and for the sample a 2 mil disabled but keep their bi-annual? Or does the time line run so that immediately when they waive the 2 exceptions they are under the cap and lose all their exceptions before they can sign the FA player?

I am assuming it is set up as all or nothing?

[bgwizarfan]

it's exactly the last thing you said...once you renounce 1 exception and fall even a dollar under the cap, you lose the rest of them anyway.

and if you renounce an exception but don't fall under the cap, then it would have been pretty pointless and stupid to have renounced the exception in the 1st place