Does using midlevel exception in 2009 hurt cap in 2010

[clydewally]

Recently Jason Kidd indicated he might be interested in signing with the Knicks next year for the mid level exception. My question is whether the salary of a mid level exception player signed when a team is over the cap counts against that team when they drop below the cap.

Currently, if nothing changes, in 2010 the Knicks will have only the salaries of Curry, Chandler, Gallinari and, depending on the answer to this question, Jefferies on their cap (aggregating $18 million) and should be able to sign two max free agents. I base that on a payment of 60% of $50-60 million being between $30 and $36 million (depending on what the cap is then) and leaving between $20 and $26 million.

So if they signed Kidd for $5 million a year, that $5 million would, if it counted against them and the salary cap was at the low end of the scale, stop them from making the max offer to two free agents in 2010. If it doesn't count against the cap, then presumably Jefferies $6 million would not either as he is also a midlevel exception player.

As a separate question (and assuming the answer is that the Kidd signing would have a negative impact in 2010), even if they do not sign someone in 2009, might they have to renounce the midlevel exception in 2010. I saw something that indicated that unused exceptions count against a team's cap.

[FGump]

1. All your contracts will count.
2. If you have cap space to spend, you don't get any exceptions that year.
3. "Recently Jason Kidd indicated he might be interested in signing with the Knicks next year for the mid level exception." Well no, not really. The Kidd "quote" has been greatly misconstrued and reinterpreted by Knick fans. Be warned.

Here's the original article that started it all, written on the eve of Dallas-NY. Notice the interview wasn't even about 2009 but rather about the big free agent class of 2010, and when pressed all he said was he would consider NY. And why not, their money is as green as everyone else's.
http://www.star-telegram.com/287/story/1132871.html

When Kidd was asked if he would consider signing with the Knicks in 2010, he said: "I’m the ’09 class."

When pressed, Kidd smiled and said: "Yeah, why not? I’m going to look and see. Coach [D’Antoni] is great. I got to know him a little this summer [with the Olympic team]. D’Antoni has a great philosophy. I think people enjoy watching that."

It was a very noncommittal answer, and he certainly doesn't mention settling for the MLE from anyone. All he did was give the cursory, Yeah it'd be a great place to play - the same answer all free-agents-to-be give to reporters - when asked about NY. They never close doors, but that doesn't mean he really has them on his radar (much less sign a bargain deal to do so).

[clydewally]

Thanks. I wasn't asking just about Kidd though. In making the "I can Dream Team" there have also been Nash rumors.

I wasn't sure whether you answered the question concerning renouncing the exception, but as a follow up question, if they are able to add two max free agents in 2010 and still stay more than $5million under the cap at the time they sign the free agents (so they don't have to renounce the exception in order to sign the free agents), can they later in 2010, after they have reached the cap through other transactions, still use the mid-level exception.

[loserX]

Until it is renounced, the MLE counts against the salary cap.

after they have reached the cap through other transactions, still use the mid-level exception.

No, because they cannot "reach the cap" through other transactions. Keeping the MLE would put them over the cap as they made those transactions, which would not be allowable.

The closest the team would be allowed to get through "other transactions" would be to the-MLE-below-the-cap...in which case it doesn't make a difference whether they keep it or renounce it*.

*EDIT-- it actually does kind of make a difference, since the MLE can only be used in free agency while capspace can also be used in trade. That's why teams more than the-MLE-below-the-cap renounce the exception.

[FGump]

if they are able to add two max free agents in 2010 and still stay more than $5million under the cap at the time they sign the free agents (so they don't have to renounce the exception in order to sign the free agents), can they later in 2010, after they have reached the cap through other transactions, still use the mid-level exception.

No.

Because, they won't have an MLE under that circumstance. You only get an MLE if you are operating as an "over the cap" team. (By definition, it is an "EXCEPTION" to the cap rules, to benefit teams already over the cap. If you are UNDER the cap, you don't need an exception.)

Any team that has cap space which it spends on major free agents (bigger than the MLE) does not have the MLE or BAE that season.

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm see #20

[clydewally]

Thanks