Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons

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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#21 » by kuclas » Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:43 pm

Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
Why would PHI want Love, Garland or the picks? Garland and the picks are a few years in the future and Love is a few years in the past. CJ makes PHI better right now. He would be an All-Star on that team.


Portland also needs to win now to keep Dame happy, I don't think they're going to take a bunch of futures.

For the Sixers, I'd rather have Garland right now than CJ. The picks are the assets needed for the next player who comes available. Love is the necessary evil to get a deal done.

CJ and 2nds is not close to an acceptable deal for Simmons even if you think his value is in the toilet (and it's not).

Well, a CJ trade is a precursor to a Dame trade, so Dame's happiness isn't a concern. And the reality is that the two 2nds would just be helping PHI save face. Simmons is worth less than CJ and gets paid more. Or to keep it general, knock down shooters and shot creators are much more valuable than defensive specialists that can't/won't shoot. I'd be willing to bet that PHI doesn't get a player as good as CJ in a Simmons trade from anyone. CJ is essentially Bradley Beal if Beal had a real #1 on his team. Beal is overrated because he's been a one-man-show on a bad team for a while. CJ has been the second best player on a Blazers squad that hasn't missed the playoffs in the 8 years since CJ has been in the league... and he's done it in the West.

The issue isn't if CJ makes PHI better... he does, hands down. The issue is that Simmons makes POR worse. That would be the last move Olshey made as the Blazers GM. If you think PHI would rather have Love and Garland they can have at it, just as long as Simmons doesn't end up in POR I am fine.


It really shows you don't know Simmons value. Simmons is not just a defensive specialist. He's primary ball handler. And you mention "kncok down shooters and shot creators" are much valuable. Guess what? Simmons generats a lot of shot for his teammates. He leads the league in assited 3 pointers.

So let's just clarify this defensive specialist. Matisse Thybulle is a defensive specialist. Andre Roberson is/Was a defensive specialist. Simmons is much more. Primary ball handler, makes assists, runs the offense plus rebounds in addition to playing defense and just his sheer size 6 foot 10 allows him so many mismatches. He had a brain fart in playoffs refusing to shoot.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#22 » by Pickled Prunes » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:05 pm

kuclas wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
Portland also needs to win now to keep Dame happy, I don't think they're going to take a bunch of futures.

For the Sixers, I'd rather have Garland right now than CJ. The picks are the assets needed for the next player who comes available. Love is the necessary evil to get a deal done.

CJ and 2nds is not close to an acceptable deal for Simmons even if you think his value is in the toilet (and it's not).

Well, a CJ trade is a precursor to a Dame trade, so Dame's happiness isn't a concern. And the reality is that the two 2nds would just be helping PHI save face. Simmons is worth less than CJ and gets paid more. Or to keep it general, knock down shooters and shot creators are much more valuable than defensive specialists that can't/won't shoot. I'd be willing to bet that PHI doesn't get a player as good as CJ in a Simmons trade from anyone. CJ is essentially Bradley Beal if Beal had a real #1 on his team. Beal is overrated because he's been a one-man-show on a bad team for a while. CJ has been the second best player on a Blazers squad that hasn't missed the playoffs in the 8 years since CJ has been in the league... and he's done it in the West.

The issue isn't if CJ makes PHI better... he does, hands down. The issue is that Simmons makes POR worse. That would be the last move Olshey made as the Blazers GM. If you think PHI would rather have Love and Garland they can have at it, just as long as Simmons doesn't end up in POR I am fine.


It really shows you don't know Simmons value. Simmons is not just a defensive specialist. He's primary ball handler. And you mention "kncok down shooters and shot creators" are much valuable. Guess what? Simmons generats a lot of shot for his teammates. He leads the league in assited 3 pointers.

So let's just clarify this defensive specialist. Matisse Thybulle is a defensive specialist. Andre Roberson is/Was a defensive specialist. Simmons is much more. Primary ball handler, makes assists, runs the offense plus rebounds in addition to playing defense and just his sheer size 6 foot 10 allows him so many mismatches. He had a brain fart in playoffs refusing to shoot.

Well, it seems that the only people talking about how valuable Simmons is are PHI and their fans... the exact same people that are desperately trying to get rid of him. It's pretty ridiculous!

And Simmons was 8th in USG% on PHI last season, 174th in the NBA, so... define "primary ball handler." He actually moved down to 9th in the playoffs, behind Dwight. You don't even know what you're selling!

I think what you mean to say is he could be a primary ball handler. I disagree, and so does the PHI coaching staff. His USG% has actually declined each year. What Simmons is truly gifted at is seeing the floor and making quick passes. The NBA is loaded with quality catch-and-shoot guys on mid-level contracts. Simmons is a catch-and-pass player. He typically doesn't set up the offense as much as he makes a quick second pass. You want to pay a guy $36M because he passed it to a guy that made a shot? Other than Harris, the 5 guys that made the bulk of those shots make less than Simmons combined. Curry, Korkmaz and Milton all handled the ball more than Simmons in the playoffs as well.

Seth Curry $8M
Green $10M
Korkmaz $5M
Milton $2M
Scott $5M

The reality is that Simmons is great at many things, but he is vastly overpaid. You want to get rid of him but you want a return for him that reflects what you hoped he would be rather than what he is. He's amazing, but we don't want him anymore... Send us Lillard and two 1sts. :crazy:
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#23 » by kuclas » Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:20 pm

Pickled Prunes wrote:
kuclas wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:Well, a CJ trade is a precursor to a Dame trade, so Dame's happiness isn't a concern. And the reality is that the two 2nds would just be helping PHI save face. Simmons is worth less than CJ and gets paid more. Or to keep it general, knock down shooters and shot creators are much more valuable than defensive specialists that can't/won't shoot. I'd be willing to bet that PHI doesn't get a player as good as CJ in a Simmons trade from anyone. CJ is essentially Bradley Beal if Beal had a real #1 on his team. Beal is overrated because he's been a one-man-show on a bad team for a while. CJ has been the second best player on a Blazers squad that hasn't missed the playoffs in the 8 years since CJ has been in the league... and he's done it in the West.

The issue isn't if CJ makes PHI better... he does, hands down. The issue is that Simmons makes POR worse. That would be the last move Olshey made as the Blazers GM. If you think PHI would rather have Love and Garland they can have at it, just as long as Simmons doesn't end up in POR I am fine.


It really shows you don't know Simmons value. Simmons is not just a defensive specialist. He's primary ball handler. And you mention "kncok down shooters and shot creators" are much valuable. Guess what? Simmons generats a lot of shot for his teammates. He leads the league in assited 3 pointers.

So let's just clarify this defensive specialist. Matisse Thybulle is a defensive specialist. Andre Roberson is/Was a defensive specialist. Simmons is much more. Primary ball handler, makes assists, runs the offense plus rebounds in addition to playing defense and just his sheer size 6 foot 10 allows him so many mismatches. He had a brain fart in playoffs refusing to shoot.

Well, it seems that the only people talking about how valuable Simmons is are PHI and their fans... the exact same people that are desperately trying to get rid of him. It's pretty ridiculous!

And Simmons was 8th in USG% on PHI last season, 174th in the NBA, so... define "primary ball handler." He actually moved down to 9th in the playoffs, behind Dwight. You don't even know what you're selling!

I think what you mean to say is he could be a primary ball handler. I disagree, and so does the PHI coaching staff. His USG% has actually declined each year. What Simmons is truly gifted at is seeing the floor and making quick passes. The NBA is loaded with quality catch-and-shoot guys on mid-level contracts. Simmons is a catch-and-pass player. He typically doesn't set up the offense as much as he makes a quick second pass. You want to pay a guy $36M because he passed it to a guy that made a shot? Other than Harris, the 5 guys that made the bulk of those shots make less than Simmons combined. Curry, Korkmaz and Milton all handled the ball more than Simmons in the playoffs as well.

Seth Curry $8M
Green $10M
Korkmaz $5M
Milton $2M
Scott $5M

The reality is that Simmons is great at many things, but he is vastly overpaid. You want to get rid of him but you want a return for him that reflects what you hoped he would be rather than what he is. He's amazing, but we don't want him anymore... Send us Lillard and two 1sts. :crazy:


Sixers aren’t going to move him for pieces that don’t make them any better.

The proposed Timberwolves/kings trades are horrible. Many of those guys unplayable in Sixers rotations or duplications of what Sixers already have.

I do think Simmons will get traded sometime in the season. Teams will see how the season goes and see.

That’s why Morey isn’t desperate to unload Simmons for poor fits.

Depending on Embiid health. Sixers will be a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons. Even with Embiid our extended time. They are looking at 6 seed. You are still looking at a 2nd round exit or possible first round exit even with CJ. That’s why no trade has been made.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#24 » by Pickled Prunes » Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:48 pm

kuclas wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
kuclas wrote:
It really shows you don't know Simmons value. Simmons is not just a defensive specialist. He's primary ball handler. And you mention "kncok down shooters and shot creators" are much valuable. Guess what? Simmons generats a lot of shot for his teammates. He leads the league in assited 3 pointers.

So let's just clarify this defensive specialist. Matisse Thybulle is a defensive specialist. Andre Roberson is/Was a defensive specialist. Simmons is much more. Primary ball handler, makes assists, runs the offense plus rebounds in addition to playing defense and just his sheer size 6 foot 10 allows him so many mismatches. He had a brain fart in playoffs refusing to shoot.

Well, it seems that the only people talking about how valuable Simmons is are PHI and their fans... the exact same people that are desperately trying to get rid of him. It's pretty ridiculous!

And Simmons was 8th in USG% on PHI last season, 174th in the NBA, so... define "primary ball handler." He actually moved down to 9th in the playoffs, behind Dwight. You don't even know what you're selling!

I think what you mean to say is he could be a primary ball handler. I disagree, and so does the PHI coaching staff. His USG% has actually declined each year. What Simmons is truly gifted at is seeing the floor and making quick passes. The NBA is loaded with quality catch-and-shoot guys on mid-level contracts. Simmons is a catch-and-pass player. He typically doesn't set up the offense as much as he makes a quick second pass. You want to pay a guy $36M because he passed it to a guy that made a shot? Other than Harris, the 5 guys that made the bulk of those shots make less than Simmons combined. Curry, Korkmaz and Milton all handled the ball more than Simmons in the playoffs as well.

Seth Curry $8M
Green $10M
Korkmaz $5M
Milton $2M
Scott $5M

The reality is that Simmons is great at many things, but he is vastly overpaid. You want to get rid of him but you want a return for him that reflects what you hoped he would be rather than what he is. He's amazing, but we don't want him anymore... Send us Lillard and two 1sts. :crazy:


Sixers aren’t going to move him for pieces that don’t make them any better.

The proposed Timberwolves/kings trades are horrible. Many of those guys unplayable in Sixers rotations or duplications of what Sixers already have.

I do think Simmons will get traded sometime in the season. Teams will see how the season goes and see.

That’s why Morey isn’t desperate to unload Simmons for poor fits.

Depending on Embiid health. Sixers will be a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons. Even with Embiid our extended time. They are looking at 6 seed. You are still looking at a 2nd round exit or possible first round exit even with CJ. That’s why no trade has been made.

If PHI is a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons, then what is his value? I agree with you, but you are kind of making my case for me. A straight up trade for CJ makes PHI better and POR worse, but Morey reportedly wants more. A trade for Dame makes PHI a legit contender and puts POR in the lottery. That really doesn't make sense for POR. If Dame wants out, POR will want youth and picks. It won't happen. It is the same for every potential trade partner. Go down the list of NBA teams and come up with any trades that work monetarily and that you think make sense. Nothing that makes PHI better is favorable to the other team.

The reality is that PHI screwed the pooch. They may hope to get better from the situation but the more realistic hope would be to get out of Simmons' contract without falling off too much. You are looking at this like PHI has to win the trade and I just don't see that happening. PHI has to get this done and the 29 other teams have zero pressure to participate. At $36M, I think most teams will be expecting PHI to take back a bad contract, at least as part of the deal. I'm not saying Simmons is a bad player, just that he isn't on a value contract. If he was on the contract that Aaron Gordon just signed things would be different. But I bet DEN wouldn't even consider trading Gordon for Simmons straight up.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#25 » by the_process » Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:28 pm

Pickled Prunes wrote:
kuclas wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:Well, it seems that the only people talking about how valuable Simmons is are PHI and their fans... the exact same people that are desperately trying to get rid of him. It's pretty ridiculous!

And Simmons was 8th in USG% on PHI last season, 174th in the NBA, so... define "primary ball handler." He actually moved down to 9th in the playoffs, behind Dwight. You don't even know what you're selling!

I think what you mean to say is he could be a primary ball handler. I disagree, and so does the PHI coaching staff. His USG% has actually declined each year. What Simmons is truly gifted at is seeing the floor and making quick passes. The NBA is loaded with quality catch-and-shoot guys on mid-level contracts. Simmons is a catch-and-pass player. He typically doesn't set up the offense as much as he makes a quick second pass. You want to pay a guy $36M because he passed it to a guy that made a shot? Other than Harris, the 5 guys that made the bulk of those shots make less than Simmons combined. Curry, Korkmaz and Milton all handled the ball more than Simmons in the playoffs as well.

Seth Curry $8M
Green $10M
Korkmaz $5M
Milton $2M
Scott $5M

The reality is that Simmons is great at many things, but he is vastly overpaid. You want to get rid of him but you want a return for him that reflects what you hoped he would be rather than what he is. He's amazing, but we don't want him anymore... Send us Lillard and two 1sts. :crazy:


Sixers aren’t going to move him for pieces that don’t make them any better.

The proposed Timberwolves/kings trades are horrible. Many of those guys unplayable in Sixers rotations or duplications of what Sixers already have.

I do think Simmons will get traded sometime in the season. Teams will see how the season goes and see.

That’s why Morey isn’t desperate to unload Simmons for poor fits.

Depending on Embiid health. Sixers will be a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons. Even with Embiid our extended time. They are looking at 6 seed. You are still looking at a 2nd round exit or possible first round exit even with CJ. That’s why no trade has been made.

If PHI is a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons, then what is his value? I agree with you, but you are kind of making my case for me. A straight up trade for CJ makes PHI better and POR worse, but Morey reportedly wants more. A trade for Dame makes PHI a legit contender and puts POR in the lottery. That really doesn't make sense for POR. If Dame wants out, POR will want youth and picks. It won't happen. It is the same for every potential trade partner. Go down the list of NBA teams and come up with any trades that work monetarily and that you think make sense. Nothing that makes PHI better is favorable to the other team.

The reality is that PHI screwed the pooch. They may hope to get better from the situation but the more realistic hope would be to get out of Simmons' contract without falling off too much. You are looking at this like PHI has to win the trade and I just don't see that happening. PHI has to get this done and the 29 other teams have zero pressure to participate. At $36M, I think most teams will be expecting PHI to take back a bad contract, at least as part of the deal. I'm not saying Simmons is a bad player, just that he isn't on a value contract. If he was on the contract that Aaron Gordon just signed things would be different. But I bet DEN wouldn't even consider trading Gordon for Simmons straight up.


Ben has 4 years left and he has the chance now to come back and pump up his own value if he wants out.

I do agree that Morey has shown surprisingly poor asset management this summer. There were a few proposed Ben trades that would've helped both sides. But they didn't involve stars, so Morey wasn't interested.
It is highly unlikely that the Sixers will agree with your Ben Simmons evaluation for the purposes of a trade.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#26 » by Pickled Prunes » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:49 am

the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
kuclas wrote:
Sixers aren’t going to move him for pieces that don’t make them any better.

The proposed Timberwolves/kings trades are horrible. Many of those guys unplayable in Sixers rotations or duplications of what Sixers already have.

I do think Simmons will get traded sometime in the season. Teams will see how the season goes and see.

That’s why Morey isn’t desperate to unload Simmons for poor fits.

Depending on Embiid health. Sixers will be a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons. Even with Embiid our extended time. They are looking at 6 seed. You are still looking at a 2nd round exit or possible first round exit even with CJ. That’s why no trade has been made.

If PHI is a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons, then what is his value? I agree with you, but you are kind of making my case for me. A straight up trade for CJ makes PHI better and POR worse, but Morey reportedly wants more. A trade for Dame makes PHI a legit contender and puts POR in the lottery. That really doesn't make sense for POR. If Dame wants out, POR will want youth and picks. It won't happen. It is the same for every potential trade partner. Go down the list of NBA teams and come up with any trades that work monetarily and that you think make sense. Nothing that makes PHI better is favorable to the other team.

The reality is that PHI screwed the pooch. They may hope to get better from the situation but the more realistic hope would be to get out of Simmons' contract without falling off too much. You are looking at this like PHI has to win the trade and I just don't see that happening. PHI has to get this done and the 29 other teams have zero pressure to participate. At $36M, I think most teams will be expecting PHI to take back a bad contract, at least as part of the deal. I'm not saying Simmons is a bad player, just that he isn't on a value contract. If he was on the contract that Aaron Gordon just signed things would be different. But I bet DEN wouldn't even consider trading Gordon for Simmons straight up.


Ben has 4 years left and he has the chance now to come back and pump up his own value if he wants out.

I do agree that Morey has shown surprisingly poor asset management this summer. There were a few proposed Ben trades that would've helped both sides. But they didn't involve stars, so Morey wasn't interested.

I understand. So, in what way is Simmons worth a star player. Morey isn't getting a star back. He might get a former star or a potential future star, but he will not get a current star. It's not going to happen.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#27 » by kuclas » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:07 am

Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:If PHI is a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons, then what is his value? I agree with you, but you are kind of making my case for me. A straight up trade for CJ makes PHI better and POR worse, but Morey reportedly wants more. A trade for Dame makes PHI a legit contender and puts POR in the lottery. That really doesn't make sense for POR. If Dame wants out, POR will want youth and picks. It won't happen. It is the same for every potential trade partner. Go down the list of NBA teams and come up with any trades that work monetarily and that you think make sense. Nothing that makes PHI better is favorable to the other team.

The reality is that PHI screwed the pooch. They may hope to get better from the situation but the more realistic hope would be to get out of Simmons' contract without falling off too much. You are looking at this like PHI has to win the trade and I just don't see that happening. PHI has to get this done and the 29 other teams have zero pressure to participate. At $36M, I think most teams will be expecting PHI to take back a bad contract, at least as part of the deal. I'm not saying Simmons is a bad player, just that he isn't on a value contract. If he was on the contract that Aaron Gordon just signed things would be different. But I bet DEN wouldn't even consider trading Gordon for Simmons straight up.


Ben has 4 years left and he has the chance now to come back and pump up his own value if he wants out.

I do agree that Morey has shown surprisingly poor asset management this summer. There were a few proposed Ben trades that would've helped both sides. But they didn't involve stars, so Morey wasn't interested.

I understand. So, in what way is Simmons worth a star player. Morey isn't getting a star back. He might get a former star or a potential future star, but he will not get a current star. It's not going to happen.

Considering the offers of Barnes hield Bagley
Minnesota meh offers of Beasley/McDaniels etc
Spurs offer of white/Murray picks (Spurs probably offered 1 maybe 2 picks. And morey wanted 4
Golden state of Wiggins plus couple of players/picks

They are no potential future star player. No win now pieces Sixers don’t already have on their roster
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#28 » by the_process » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:49 pm

Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:If PHI is a 3-4 seed with or without Simmons, then what is his value? I agree with you, but you are kind of making my case for me. A straight up trade for CJ makes PHI better and POR worse, but Morey reportedly wants more. A trade for Dame makes PHI a legit contender and puts POR in the lottery. That really doesn't make sense for POR. If Dame wants out, POR will want youth and picks. It won't happen. It is the same for every potential trade partner. Go down the list of NBA teams and come up with any trades that work monetarily and that you think make sense. Nothing that makes PHI better is favorable to the other team.

The reality is that PHI screwed the pooch. They may hope to get better from the situation but the more realistic hope would be to get out of Simmons' contract without falling off too much. You are looking at this like PHI has to win the trade and I just don't see that happening. PHI has to get this done and the 29 other teams have zero pressure to participate. At $36M, I think most teams will be expecting PHI to take back a bad contract, at least as part of the deal. I'm not saying Simmons is a bad player, just that he isn't on a value contract. If he was on the contract that Aaron Gordon just signed things would be different. But I bet DEN wouldn't even consider trading Gordon for Simmons straight up.


Ben has 4 years left and he has the chance now to come back and pump up his own value if he wants out.

I do agree that Morey has shown surprisingly poor asset management this summer. There were a few proposed Ben trades that would've helped both sides. But they didn't involve stars, so Morey wasn't interested.

I understand. So, in what way is Simmons worth a star player. Morey isn't getting a star back. He might get a former star or a potential future star, but he will not get a current star. It's not going to happen.


They're not getting a star, but they should be able to get a bushel of picks they can try and turn into a star at a later date.
It is highly unlikely that the Sixers will agree with your Ben Simmons evaluation for the purposes of a trade.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#29 » by Pickled Prunes » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:05 pm

the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
Ben has 4 years left and he has the chance now to come back and pump up his own value if he wants out.

I do agree that Morey has shown surprisingly poor asset management this summer. There were a few proposed Ben trades that would've helped both sides. But they didn't involve stars, so Morey wasn't interested.

I understand. So, in what way is Simmons worth a star player. Morey isn't getting a star back. He might get a former star or a potential future star, but he will not get a current star. It's not going to happen.


They're not getting a star, but they should be able to get a bushel of picks they can try and turn into a star at a later date.

But the money has to match, so if they aren't getting a star back (which they won't) then they need to accept multiple non-stars, or at least a couple of overpaid players to go along with a pick or two. I am assuming said picks would be lottery protected in which case they would not be strong enough assets to trade for a star but might help Morey save face. That's the stage we are at right now... the "try and save face" stage. Morey doesn't want to be the guy that traded Simmons away for pocket lint. He might have to, but it isn't his fault. That's on Embiid and Doc.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#30 » by the_process » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:20 pm

Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:I understand. So, in what way is Simmons worth a star player. Morey isn't getting a star back. He might get a former star or a potential future star, but he will not get a current star. It's not going to happen.


They're not getting a star, but they should be able to get a bushel of picks they can try and turn into a star at a later date.

But the money has to match, so if they aren't getting a star back (which they won't) then they need to accept multiple non-stars, or at least a couple of overpaid players to go along with a pick or two. I am assuming said picks would be lottery protected in which case they would not be strong enough assets to trade for a star but might help Morey save face. That's the stage we are at right now... the "try and save face" stage. Morey doesn't want to be the guy that traded Simmons away for pocket lint. He might have to, but it isn't his fault. That's on Embiid and Doc.


The Embiid and Doc fault is way overblown because the NBA is like a men's soap opera.

Yes they will have to take back some bad money. Should be some good money, too. And of course the picks.
It is highly unlikely that the Sixers will agree with your Ben Simmons evaluation for the purposes of a trade.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#31 » by Pickled Prunes » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:31 pm

kuclas wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
Ben has 4 years left and he has the chance now to come back and pump up his own value if he wants out.

I do agree that Morey has shown surprisingly poor asset management this summer. There were a few proposed Ben trades that would've helped both sides. But they didn't involve stars, so Morey wasn't interested.

I understand. So, in what way is Simmons worth a star player. Morey isn't getting a star back. He might get a former star or a potential future star, but he will not get a current star. It's not going to happen.

Considering the offers of Barnes hield Bagley
Minnesota meh offers of Beasley/McDaniels etc
Spurs offer of white/Murray picks (Spurs probably offered 1 maybe 2 picks. And morey wanted 4
Golden state of Wiggins plus couple of players/picks

They are no potential future star player. No win now pieces Sixers don’t already have on their roster

Well, I doubt SAC offered Barnes, Hield and Bagley. That would be foolish. But consider a starting lineup of Embiid/Harris/Barnes/Green/Curry with Hield and Bagley as options off the bench. That's a better PHI than the one you're looking at now with some much needed depth. It would be a good idea for PHI to do this for Barnes and either one of Hield or Bagley. Barnes is solid and capable of being a #3 on a championship team. And if SAC throws in a 1st, all the better. That will certainly still be a lottery team.

The MIN and SAS offers don't move me.

GSW... I don't see the fit. I think they look at this as a potential way to dump Wiggins. I think Simmons would eventually be traded again, probably for depth, which is what PHI should be looking for in the first place. If GSW had Simmons they would absolutely trade him for Barnes, Hield and Bagley.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#32 » by the_process » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:40 pm

Pickled Prunes wrote:
kuclas wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:I understand. So, in what way is Simmons worth a star player. Morey isn't getting a star back. He might get a former star or a potential future star, but he will not get a current star. It's not going to happen.

Considering the offers of Barnes hield Bagley
Minnesota meh offers of Beasley/McDaniels etc
Spurs offer of white/Murray picks (Spurs probably offered 1 maybe 2 picks. And morey wanted 4
Golden state of Wiggins plus couple of players/picks

They are no potential future star player. No win now pieces Sixers don’t already have on their roster

Well, I doubt SAC offered Barnes, Hield and Bagley. That would be foolish. But consider a starting lineup of Embiid/Harris/Barnes/Green/Curry with Hield and Bagley as options off the bench. That's a better PHI than the one you're looking at now with some much needed depth. It would be a good idea for PHI to do this for Barnes and either one of Hield or Bagley. Barnes is solid and capable of being a #3 on a championship team. And if SAC throws in a 1st, all the better. That will certainly still be a lottery team.

The MIN and SAS offers don't move me.

GSW... I don't see the fit. I think they look at this as a potential way to dump Wiggins. I think Simmons would eventually be traded again, probably for depth, which is what PHI should be looking for in the first place. If GSW had Simmons they would absolutely trade him for Barnes, Hield and Bagley.


Salary dumping him would be foolish, regardless of what your opinion on Simmons is. Stop with that.
It is highly unlikely that the Sixers will agree with your Ben Simmons evaluation for the purposes of a trade.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#33 » by Pickled Prunes » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:42 pm

the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
the_process wrote:
They're not getting a star, but they should be able to get a bushel of picks they can try and turn into a star at a later date.

But the money has to match, so if they aren't getting a star back (which they won't) then they need to accept multiple non-stars, or at least a couple of overpaid players to go along with a pick or two. I am assuming said picks would be lottery protected in which case they would not be strong enough assets to trade for a star but might help Morey save face. That's the stage we are at right now... the "try and save face" stage. Morey doesn't want to be the guy that traded Simmons away for pocket lint. He might have to, but it isn't his fault. That's on Embiid and Doc.


The Embiid and Doc fault is way overblown because the NBA is like a men's soap opera.

Yes they will have to take back some bad money. Should be some good money, too. And of course the picks.

I agree, but Doc and Embiid were in a position to understand the fragility of Simmons' ego. My point was that Morey was put in a no win situation. If he had a choice, Morey would have waited until mid-season to trade Simmons. Let him recoup some value. He still might, but if he does perceptibly lose in a Simmons trade it won't be his blunder. This is not on Morey. I honestly thought he should have been traded before the extension was offered. He was always going to have a hard time living up to this one, I just didn't expect PHI to regret it so soon.
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Re: Cavaliers Continue To Seek Trade For Ben Simmons 

Post#34 » by Pickled Prunes » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:44 pm

the_process wrote:
Pickled Prunes wrote:
kuclas wrote:Considering the offers of Barnes hield Bagley
Minnesota meh offers of Beasley/McDaniels etc
Spurs offer of white/Murray picks (Spurs probably offered 1 maybe 2 picks. And morey wanted 4
Golden state of Wiggins plus couple of players/picks

They are no potential future star player. No win now pieces Sixers don’t already have on their roster

Well, I doubt SAC offered Barnes, Hield and Bagley. That would be foolish. But consider a starting lineup of Embiid/Harris/Barnes/Green/Curry with Hield and Bagley as options off the bench. That's a better PHI than the one you're looking at now with some much needed depth. It would be a good idea for PHI to do this for Barnes and either one of Hield or Bagley. Barnes is solid and capable of being a #3 on a championship team. And if SAC throws in a 1st, all the better. That will certainly still be a lottery team.

The MIN and SAS offers don't move me.

GSW... I don't see the fit. I think they look at this as a potential way to dump Wiggins. I think Simmons would eventually be traded again, probably for depth, which is what PHI should be looking for in the first place. If GSW had Simmons they would absolutely trade him for Barnes, Hield and Bagley.


Salary dumping him would be foolish, regardless of what your opinion on Simmons is. Stop with that.

Salary dumping who? I was talking about salary dumping Wiggins. Or not even salary dumping as much as trading one overpaid player for one slightly less so.
Or maybe you don't believe in Barnes?

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