Source: Wiggins Could Be 'Compromise' Pick For Cavaliers

[RealGM Wiretap]

Andrew Wiggins may become the compromise pick for the Cleveland Cavaliers with the No. 1 overall pick, according to sources.

Jabari Parker had been atop their board all season due to his perceived ability to make an instant impact, while they believe Joel Embiid has the highest upside and fits a long-term need. Wiggins is seen as a player with more upside than Parker and can play impactful minutes immediately unlike Embiid.

Dan Gilbert is known as being anxious to make the Cavaliers a playoff team.

Via Chad Ford/ESPN

[Bubstubbler]

Surely this is a smokescreen or outright BS, because Embiid is going to be much more impactful out of the gate than Wiggins will be.

Wiggins doesn't have good enough handles or a good enough shot to have much of an offensive impact in year 1. NBA defenders will shut him down off the dribble and often strip him. Early in his career, he'll get most of his points off of offensive rebounds and inefficient jumpers.

Embiid, on the other hand, already has an arsenal of moves that will allow him to be more offensively impactful than Anthony Davis was as a rookie. Embiid is already capable of putting up 20 ppg on pretty good efficiency if his team wants to give him the shots (which Kyrie may inefficiently hog to himself), and he's already a good defender who will continue to rapidly improve throughout the year.

Embiid not only has a higher floor and a higher ceiling than Wiggins, he's also going to be much more impactful in year 1.

[Donnyxc]

I don't think compromise is the right word, if they think he has higher upside than Parker.

[anatomicbomb]

Embiid not only has a higher floor and a higher ceiling than Wiggins, he's also going to be much more impactful in year 1.

I don't know that I agree about a higher ceiling, but I think that everything else you've said makes perfect sense. Really, there are only two ways to lose at all by taking Embiid: his body falls apart and he never gets on the floor, or Wiggins becomes the next GOAT-contender. Even in the second case, it could be like '84, where the Rockets still got Dream, even though they missed on MJ; and a solid silver medal would be huge for the franchise.

[anatomicbomb]

I don't think compromise is the right word, if they think he has higher upside than Parker.

The compromise for the Cavs, with Wiggins having a higher upside than Parker, is the reduction in immediate, meaningful on-court time. Additionally, if Wiggins' game never fully matures, then that compromise gets greater the longer his potential goes unrealized.

[Bubstubbler]

IMO Embiid has a much, much higher reasonably attainable ceiling than Wiggins.

I think it's highly likely that Embiid becomes a HOF-caliber elite 2-way center capable of putting up 26/12/3/3 with a TS% over 60%, and I think it's literally on the order of a thousand times less likely that Wiggins attains those heights.

I had the opposite opinion last summer, but watching every KU game last year totally changed my mind. It was clear early on that Embiid was the alpha prospect. Highlights and boxscores don't do Embiid any justice: you've got to watch the games to see how he really shines. He's similar to Marc Gasol in that he's way more valuable than you'd ever know just by watching highlights or checking out boxscores. He's the opposite of a 'hollow stats' guy.

Embiid just has to continue on his trajectory to attain those heights. If you watch a lot of his games, it's easy to invision how he could put up those numbers and dominate an NBA game.

Wiggins, however, will have to radically change his trajectory of skill development. It's very troubling how unskilled he is. Embiid has comparable handles right now.


Embiid is already in the rare class of mega prospects of centers that had dominant minds (gifted/genius IQ), dominant physical traits, and a strong will to dominate/win. The only center/center-ish prospects over the last 25 years who have met those criteria are Shaq, Yao, Duncan, Oden, Anthony Davis, and now Embiid. Mourning and DHoward would be close. Looking back a little further, the other prospects of that caliber are Ewing, David Robinson, and Hakeem. Maybe Bowie, too? Then back to guys like Ralph Sampson, Walton, Kareem, Russell, Parrish, and Wilt. When the biggest guy out on the court also happens to be the smartest and most competitive, dominance ensues. Always has, always will.

Notice the incredibly high odds of success for center prospects of Embiid's caliber? Literally 80-90% of them go on to become dominant HOF-caliber players. Busts are unheard of; the only guys who didn't reach those heights were Oden and Bowie. Injuries eventually got to Sampson, but he was a HOF-caliber player early on.

IMO, if the Cavs' medical staff clears Embiid, he's gotta be the pick.

[bwgood77]

It would be ridiculous if they didn't take Embiid. Which means they won't.

[HSOB SIRHC]

Surely this is a smokescreen or outright BS, because Embiid is going to be much more impactful out of the gate than Wiggins will be.

Wiggins doesn't have good enough handles or a good enough shot to have much of an offensive impact in year 1. NBA defenders will shut him down off the dribble and often strip him. Early in his career, he'll get most of his points off of offensive rebounds and inefficient jumpers.

Embiid, on the other hand, already has an arsenal of moves that will allow him to be more offensively impactful than Anthony Davis was as a rookie. Embiid is already capable of putting up 20 ppg on pretty good efficiency if his team wants to give him the shots (which Kyrie may inefficiently hog to himself), and he's already a good defender who will continue to rapidly improve throughout the year.

Embiid not only has a higher floor and a higher ceiling than Wiggins, he's also going to be much more impactful in year 1.

You're out of your mind if you think Embiid can already average 20ppg on good efficiency right away. He's not strong enough and from what I've see, he doesn't have a lot of post moves. He's going to get pushed around a lot. He'll be lucky to average 10pts 7rebs in his first year.

[spudwebb]

You're out of your mind if you think Embiid can already average 20ppg on good efficiency right away. He's not strong enough and from what I've see, he doesn't have a lot of post moves. He's going to get pushed around a lot. He'll be lucky to average 10pts 7rebs in his first year.

Anthony Davis is a twig and did 13.5, 8 his first year. And 20, 10 this year. This isn't your daddy's NBA - Bosh and KG parade around as a centers.

[ChuckBros4Life]

Surely this is a smokescreen or outright BS, because Embiid is going to be much more impactful out of the gate than Wiggins will be.

Wiggins doesn't have good enough handles or a good enough shot to have much of an offensive impact in year 1. NBA defenders will shut him down off the dribble and often strip him. Early in his career, he'll get most of his points off of offensive rebounds and inefficient jumpers.

Embiid, on the other hand, already has an arsenal of moves that will allow him to be more offensively impactful than Anthony Davis was as a rookie. Embiid is already capable of putting up 20 ppg on pretty good efficiency if his team wants to give him the shots (which Kyrie may inefficiently hog to himself), and he's already a good defender who will continue to rapidly improve throughout the year.

Embiid not only has a higher floor and a higher ceiling than Wiggins, he's also going to be much more impactful in year 1.

You're out of your mind if you think Embiid can already average 20ppg on good efficiency right away. He's not strong enough and from what I've see, he doesn't have a lot of post moves. He's going to get pushed around a lot. He'll be lucky to average 10pts 7rebs in his first year.

Saying Embiid "doesn't have a lot of post moves" instantly makes your argument invalid. He's got terrific post moves and footwork. You should watch some clips of him before the draft.

[brownbobcat]

INotice the incredibly high odds of success for center prospects of Embiid's caliber? Literally 80-90% of them go on to become dominant HOF-caliber players. Busts are unheard of; the only guys who didn't reach those heights were Oden and Bowie. Injuries eventually got to Sampson, but he was a HOF-caliber player early on.

Notice there's a problem called selection bias where you pre-select HOF'ers to make the case that they will become HOf'ers? There are many, many highly drafted and highly touted big men that busted.

[miltk]

yeah, cleve, make the stupid move and go for compromise.

noun
1.
an agreement or a settlement of a dispute that is reached by each side making concessions.

make concessions, cleve! go for the middle of the road!

[HSOB SIRHC]

Saying Embiid "doesn't have a lot of post moves" instantly makes your argument invalid. He's got terrific post moves and footwork. You should watch some clips of him before the draft.

I disagree. I've watched Kansas play more than a few times and he just seems very raw. Sure he has those hook shots, but other than that, he gets pushed out of the post too often. You can't honestly believe this guy can average 20pts as a rookie. He will struggle a lot in his first year.

[MaxRider]

Cleveland should trade with Philly
draft Wiggins and trade him to Philly for Parker and Young
get two quality players in return
Wiggins has good upside but Cleveland needs to win now to convince Irving to stay
Embiid is long term project
if Milwaukee picks Parker to screw them up then they need to deal with Milwaukee instead

[MaxRider]

You're out of your mind if you think Embiid can already average 20ppg on good efficiency right away. He's not strong enough and from what I've see, he doesn't have a lot of post moves. He's going to get pushed around a lot. He'll be lucky to average 10pts 7rebs in his first year.

Anthony Davis is a twig and did 13.5, 8 his first year. And 20, 10 this year. This isn't your daddy's NBA - Bosh and KG parade around as a centers.

Davis is PF not C and most of his points are from jumper and put back and dunk

[bisme37]

So the Cavs are going to take a guy they don't like because they can't decide between two guys they do like?? Just another illustration of what a joke this franchise has become. If there was any justice they'd be banned from the lottery for the next five years. Get three number ones in four years and you still suck... that's your own problem.

[williamsonfox]

Embiid 20 ppg as a rookie? CMON MAN!

I understand the potential that Embiid has as a centre in this league. A lot of talent...with his agility and knack for the game (post moves) but he is still a project - a 3-5 year project - like most young centres in the NBA. Rarely do guys come in and play effectively. Embiid is your medium risk HIGH reward type of player. People are saying Hakeem 2.0. I can see the similarities but that is LOFTY. In the NBA these days its ran by speed. You need guys to get to the basket. If you do not have a big man that can run the floor in transition to finish or defend they are useless.

Wiggins will come in and defend quite effectively right away just due to his unreal athleticism. He can hit open jumpers (great form but still needs to improve his catch and shoot footwork). He'll run the floor like a gazelle and finish like a beast in transition. He will definitely take advantage of slower defenders of the dribble. I know he lacks a left hand right now but in a one strong dribble to his right - he'll catch guys off guard a lot due to his speed.

Parker is the most ready with his NBA sized body. Great instincts on offense (posting up, off the dribble and spot up shooting). Has a lower ceiling because he isn't as athletic as Wiggins.

I think they need to go with Parker or Wiggins...

Choose Parker. Trade one of Thompson or Bennett for a 3 & D shooting guard (such Arron Afflalo). Trade Waiters or bring him off the bench (clashes with Irving as a ball-handling guard). You have Hawes and Varejao at 5 (great tandem). Varejao-Bennett-Parker-SG-Irving - That can be a playoff team with adding some depth in free agency.

Choose Wiggins. More of the same. He may not be as polished and ready to take over in the NBA but will fill the need the Cavs want without trading for a big superstar. However they definitely run the risk of Wiggins leaving after his qualifying deal is done because he is a homer and will go to Toronto because he loves the Raptors - not just the city, he loves the team and wants them to do well and to fulfil his childhood dream. Just makes sense.

Go Parker, Cavs.

[slicedbread2]

Embiid 20 ppg as a rookie? CMON MAN!

I understand the potential that Embiid has as a centre in this league. A lot of talent...with his agility and knack for the game (post moves) but he is still a project - a 3-5 year project - like most young centres in the NBA. Rarely do guys come in and play effectively. Embiid is your medium risk HIGH reward type of player. People are saying Hakeem 2.0. I can see the similarities but that is LOFTY. In the NBA these days its ran by speed. You need guys to get to the basket. If you do not have a big man that can run the floor in transition to finish or defend they are useless.

Wiggins will come in and defend quite effectively right away just due to his unreal athleticism. He can hit open jumpers (great form but still needs to improve his catch and shoot footwork). He'll run the floor like a gazelle and finish like a beast in transition. He will definitely take advantage of slower defenders of the dribble. I know he lacks a left hand right now but in a one strong dribble to his right - he'll catch guys off guard a lot due to his speed.

Parker is the most ready with his NBA sized body. Great instincts on offense (posting up, off the dribble and spot up shooting). Has a lower ceiling because he isn't as athletic as Wiggins.

I think they need to go with Parker or Wiggins...

Choose Parker. Trade one of Thompson or Bennett for a 3 & D shooting guard (such Arron Afflalo). Trade Waiters or bring him off the bench (clashes with Irving as a ball-handling guard). You have Hawes and Varejao at 5 (great tandem). Varejao-Bennett-Parker-SG-Irving - That can be a playoff team with adding some depth in free agency.

Choose Wiggins. More of the same. He may not be as polished and ready to take over in the NBA but will fill the need the Cavs want without trading for a big superstar. However they definitely run the risk of Wiggins leaving after his qualifying deal is done because he is a homer and will go to Toronto because he loves the Raptors - not just the city, he loves the team and wants them to do well and to fulfil his childhood dream. Just makes sense.

Go Parker, Cavs.

Wiggins won't be able to do that. The CBA has been modified where teams have the leverage on players coming out of their entry level deal so unless Wiggins wants to risk injury, he wouldn't pass a potential 5 year deal for 80-90 million especially if he takes off. Plus the Cavaliers would have at least 8-9 years to put a solid roster around him with or without Irving and I'd be willing to move Irving for a top 5 pick in this draft if possible since I'm not so sure he'd be willing to stay.

Parker's not a bad choice neither although his position as a 3 or 4 is unknown and the Cavs already have a bunch of 4's in Bennett and Thompson and Parker may be a defensive liability.

Overall, I'd reach for the player with the highest ceiling and maybe gun for Embiid or I'd even trade down to Philadelphia and swoop 3 and 10 up.

[Marty McFly]

draft him and trade him before the season starts if you want someone else.

[Blame Rasho]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... rder_by=ws

Yeah... I think it is unwise to that he can be a 26/12/3/3... I know that perhaps you are getting stats out of thin air... but try to be realistic over a guy who maybe had 15 meaningful games in college...