NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA

Moderators: bwgood77, BombsquadSammy, Domejandro

RealGM Wiretap
RealGM
Posts: 64,977
And1: 177
Joined: Mar 19, 2013

NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#1 » by RealGM Wiretap » Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:07 pm

The NBA has formally submitted a proposal to the NBPA to lower the draft-eligible age to 18 from 19.


The NBPA and its executive director, Michele Roberts, planned to review the proposal Monday at a post-All-Star weekend meeting in the Bahamas.


Adam Silver is on record saying the current 19-year-old age limit is not working for the league or college basketball.


The rule change will likely take effect by the 2022 NBA Draft, which would give most teams ample time to prepare for the effects of the change.

Via Jeff Zillgitt/USA Today

Gavin_TDThree
Ballboy
Posts: 7
And1: 2
Joined: Feb 18, 2019
         

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#2 » by Gavin_TDThree » Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:30 am

I think this makes a ton of sense. Especially for high end talents that know they will be in the NBA the following year providing no catastrophic injury. I think this also eliminates players going overseas for a year then coming back for the NBA draft. It's not a common thing but I could see it happening more if the draft age stayed at 19.
User avatar
Clyde Frazier
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 14,714
And1: 14,537
Joined: Sep 07, 2010

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#3 » by Clyde Frazier » Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:46 am

:clap:

Finally!
User avatar
Laimbeer
RealGM
Posts: 31,023
And1: 8,619
Joined: Aug 12, 2009
Location: Cabin Creek

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#4 » by Laimbeer » Fri Feb 22, 2019 1:40 am

This hurts more kids than it helps. So few are truly ready. That one college season can be a real eye opener. Is someone like Zion having to wait one season that awful?

As a fan, the draft is more interesting when you've seen the top prospects for at least a year.
dice
RealGM
Posts: 33,632
And1: 8,170
Joined: Jun 30, 2003
Location: chicago

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#5 » by dice » Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:38 am

bad for the nba, bad for college hoops, bad for the fan, fair to players
harden '17-18: 30p 62%ts
MJ chi: 32p 58%ts

me: "JH almost the scorer MJ is"
notorious MJ water carrier/sack shaver: "dur, MJ have much more bigger career playoff PPG"

wasn't a career comparison, clown. you dishonor MJ's legacy
User avatar
dougthonus
Senior Mod - Bulls
Senior Mod - Bulls
Posts: 44,668
And1: 4,975
Joined: Dec 22, 2004
Contact:

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#6 » by dougthonus » Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:04 am

dice wrote:bad for the nba, bad for college hoops, bad for the fan, fair to players


The irony of this, and I agree with you completely, is that the players don't really even have a voice in the negotiation but are the only ones benefiting. As a fan, I despise this change. I hate the idea that the really bad teams now have to gamble so much.
Mwd1981
Pro Prospect
Posts: 932
And1: 118
Joined: Mar 01, 2017

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#7 » by Mwd1981 » Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:09 am

Awesome. A bunch of unskilled players on every bench. That’ll be great to watch.

I really hope NBA make a big investment in player development too.
User avatar
Killboard
Veteran
Posts: 2,871
And1: 706
Joined: Jul 16, 2010

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#8 » by Killboard » Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:35 am

They should jump into the D-league from high school, be payed by the legue for similar contract than now for that year, and then end up in team by draft like always. That way the kid can be pros and still teams can watch them against real competition before to pick them.
dan-man
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,370
And1: 225
Joined: Mar 15, 2017
     

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#9 » by dan-man » Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:37 am

Mwd1981 wrote:Awesome. A bunch of unskilled players on every bench. That’ll be great to watch.

I really hope NBA make a big investment in player development too.


Actually with the later CBA framework it won't be too bad. Players will have 2 years to show some promise or they are gone...
User avatar
Blue Ninja
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,444
And1: 753
Joined: Jul 17, 2011
       

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#10 » by Blue Ninja » Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:44 am

I love this move for the game. Rosters have grown with two way players and may grow even more in size in the near future. The G League is becoming more and more a real developmental system and a resource for teams. Only four teams don't have a G League affiliate associated solely with their teams. By 2022, every team can potentially get their own affiliate.

Let the players who aren't looking to be in college for the full degree develop in the G League and the NBA. With more focus on the G League, players will be getting proper development, getting paid, and gaining service time towards their retirement and larger salary groups. Screw the crooked NCAA and shoe companies.
dice
RealGM
Posts: 33,632
And1: 8,170
Joined: Jun 30, 2003
Location: chicago

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#11 » by dice » Fri Feb 22, 2019 4:31 am

dougthonus wrote:
dice wrote:bad for the nba, bad for college hoops, bad for the fan, fair to players


The irony of this, and I agree with you completely, is that the players don't really even have a voice in the negotiation but are the only ones benefiting. As a fan, I despise this change. I hate the idea that the really bad teams now have to gamble so much.

yeah, i don't know why the players association wants this other than it's fair to prospective future members. and i doubt that anyone in the one and done era has entered the league holding a grudge with the players association

i haven't watched any college ball other than the ncaa tourney since the influx of teenagers into the nba. the marquee regular season matchups are glorified AAU games. but this is still a minor bad news event for me
harden '17-18: 30p 62%ts
MJ chi: 32p 58%ts

me: "JH almost the scorer MJ is"
notorious MJ water carrier/sack shaver: "dur, MJ have much more bigger career playoff PPG"

wasn't a career comparison, clown. you dishonor MJ's legacy
DarkoNeedsAfro
Veteran
Posts: 2,505
And1: 956
Joined: Jun 30, 2003

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#12 » by DarkoNeedsAfro » Fri Feb 22, 2019 4:34 am

I think the nba is underestimating how much college basketball helps their product. They are getting players who have already made a name for themselves and bring fans and interest with them into the league. Sure, guys like Zion Williamson have been known since high school, but the majority of the players coming in are unknown and pretty unskilled due to the joke that is aau Ball.

This move only helps a few. The very top guy or 2 that can get picked top 5 earlier and the guys that are lucky enough to get picked on potential before their flaws are exposed. It hurts the nba, hurts college basketball, and hurts every player in the nba over 25. There is so much focus on potential that actual ability has been marginalized. It’s much worse than when high school kids were eligible before. The veteran journeymen will be gone. Replaced by young kids with “potential” and no skills. Half the rosters will be a year away from being a year away.
ryanball
Sophomore
Posts: 222
And1: 207
Joined: Jul 06, 2013

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#13 » by ryanball » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:39 am

DarkoNeedsAfro wrote:This move only helps a few. The very top guy or 2 that can get picked top 5 earlier and the guys that are lucky enough to get picked on potential before their flaws are exposed. It hurts the nba, hurts college basketball, and hurts every player in the nba over 25.


College basketball is a den of corruption, waste and graft and should be hurt.

The people getting hurt now are legitimate students who must accumulate lifelong debt to go to public university. Meanwhile these clown ball players are given a free ride and don't even have to attend any real classes if they don't want to. Even most of those kids are getting screwed in the end because almost none of them go to the NBA.

The NBA needs to manage its own amateur talent development, and pay for it. Taxpayers should not be paying to help the NBA make a better product. Private unis can of course do what they want, at least their donors understand what they are paying for.
Am2626
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,412
And1: 353
Joined: Jul 13, 2013

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#14 » by Am2626 » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:59 am

Laimbeer wrote:This hurts more kids than it helps. So few are truly ready. That one college season can be a real eye opener. Is someone like Zion having to wait one season that awful?

As a fan, the draft is more interesting when you've seen the top prospects for at least a year.


Yeah this is a bad move. The one and done rule was put in for a reason. These kids are not old enough and mature enough to make the right decision. Too many of them will come out too early and will ruin their chances. This is also going to water down the NBA. What I would have liked seen happen is to raise the age limit to 20 and let these kids market their names. There’s no reason why they shouldn’t be able to make money off their likeness.
Tussin33
Sophomore
Posts: 214
And1: 36
Joined: Jul 01, 2010
Location: Los Angeles
   

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#15 » by Tussin33 » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:22 am

Am2626 wrote:
Laimbeer wrote:This hurts more kids than it helps. So few are truly ready. That one college season can be a real eye opener. Is someone like Zion having to wait one season that awful?

As a fan, the draft is more interesting when you've seen the top prospects for at least a year.


Yeah this is a bad move. The one and done rule was put in for a reason. These kids are not old enough and mature enough to make the right decision. Too many of them will come out too early and will ruin their chances. This is also going to water down the NBA. What I would have liked seen happen is to raise the age limit to 20 and let these kids market their names. There’s no reason why they shouldn’t be able to make money off their likeness.


These kids do the same thing now.

For every Kwame Brown u have an Anthony Bennett. For every Eddie Curry there's a Sheldon Williams. The current system stops absolutely nothing but forcing kids to be in a classroom they have no interest in. Those are seats being taken up by someone who can actually utilize that knowledge for a career.

There are so many great players that came out of high school how is this even a discussion?

Lou Williams & Monta Ellis were late 2nd rounders... those are 2 absolute gems.
Andrew Bynum .... (Greg Oden)
Josh Smith
Al JEfferson
Dwight Howard
LeBron
Amare Stoudemire
Tyson Chandler
Rashard Lewis (2nd round)
Al Harrington
Tracy Mcgrady
Jermain O'neal
Kobe
KG

That's with only 10 years of eligibility. Multiple Hall of Famers that never needed college ball. Some players do need it yes, and those guys will stay in College until their stock rises to a level they're comfortable with... Think Buddy Hield & Justin Jackson (UNC)
So once again, why is this a discussion?
TheExpat
Pro Prospect
Posts: 934
And1: 117
Joined: Aug 16, 2002
Location: S. Korea

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#16 » by TheExpat » Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:22 pm

Mwd1981 wrote:Awesome. A bunch of unskilled players on every bench. That’ll be great to watch.

I really hope NBA make a big investment in player development too.


You mean, like, a developmental league, or something of that nature?
- Man is something that must be surpassed. Nietzsche
User avatar
dougthonus
Senior Mod - Bulls
Senior Mod - Bulls
Posts: 44,668
And1: 4,975
Joined: Dec 22, 2004
Contact:

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#17 » by dougthonus » Fri Feb 22, 2019 1:10 pm

ryanball wrote:College basketball is a den of corruption, waste and graft and should be hurt.


Agree completely.

The people getting hurt now are legitimate students who must accumulate lifelong debt to go to public university. Meanwhile these clown ball players are given a free ride and don't even have to attend any real classes if they don't want to. Even most of those kids are getting screwed in the end because almost none of them go to the NBA.


Not really sure that's true, the colleges are getting a ton of money from basketball and football which props up their university. I don't think the money here is a net negative to the schools. It probably lowers tuition for typical students or supports lots of other programs that could not otherwise pay for themselves.

The NBA needs to manage its own amateur talent development, and pay for it. Taxpayers should not be paying to help the NBA make a better product. Private unis can of course do what they want, at least their donors understand what they are paying for.


The NBA has this already and is certainly willing to do it.
User avatar
dougthonus
Senior Mod - Bulls
Senior Mod - Bulls
Posts: 44,668
And1: 4,975
Joined: Dec 22, 2004
Contact:

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#18 » by dougthonus » Fri Feb 22, 2019 1:20 pm

Tussin33 wrote:These kids do the same thing now.

For every Kwame Brown u have an Anthony Bennett. For every Eddie Curry there's a Sheldon Williams. The current system stops absolutely nothing but forcing kids to be in a classroom they have no interest in. Those are seats being taken up by someone who can actually utilize that knowledge for a career.

There are so many great players that came out of high school how is this even a discussion?

Lou Williams & Monta Ellis were late 2nd rounders... those are 2 absolute gems.
Andrew Bynum .... (Greg Oden)
Josh Smith
Al JEfferson
Dwight Howard
LeBron
Amare Stoudemire
Tyson Chandler
Rashard Lewis (2nd round)
Al Harrington
Tracy Mcgrady
Jermain O'neal
Kobe
KG

That's with only 10 years of eligibility. Multiple Hall of Famers that never needed college ball. Some players do need it yes, and those guys will stay in College until their stock rises to a level they're comfortable with... Think Buddy Hield & Justin Jackson (UNC)
So once again, why is this a discussion?


IMO, it isn't a discussion over whether it is better for the kids. It absolutely is. Get your money right away.

The question is whether it is better for the league. I don't think it is. The NBA, IMO, doesn't lose out on any value by having those guys play one year in college. Their names become bigger, they become stars, they get big fans who want to follow them. They enter the league pre-marketed.

The teams doing the drafting have way more data points to make a decision as they see everyone against much better competition and one more year of additional development and avoid lots of busts. Just go look at the RSCI rankings of any HS class and think if you drafted in that order how much more random the draft would be compared to where is now.

From a quality of play perspective, the guys who haven't grown into their bodies just yet have another year to mature as well and will be far more likely to be in a real strength program at a university for a year prior to entering the NBA as well.

If you mark up what the NBA loses and gains I'd say this:
Pros:
Guys come in with way more marketing hype than they would otherwise
More consistent analysis of players giving worse teams better odds of improving and more consistent draft results
Guys come in at a higher skill level with more development
Guys come in with more mature bodies after being in a far more professional strength program for a year

Cons:
League loses one year of a star player playing in the NBA (I'd argue this is only valuable in the most rare of cases though, given your list, only LeBron really was moving the needle in terms of generating profits his rookie season).

This isn't about whether its better for the players or not. Absolutely it is better for the players to come in out of HS, get that guaranteed money, get your 2nd contract faster, etc... It's not the league's responsibility to make it better for the players though. As players, they can go play in any league they want at any time. They can go to Europe and play, straight to the G-League and play, etc.

Players vastly over-estimate their value here. They can only generate large revenue numbers because of the league. The actual value of playing basketball well is near zero without a league to support it. It isn't intrinsically valuable, it is the machine which makes it valuable. They are free to market their basketball skills anyway they want and aren't owed a space in the value machine that can make them wealthy. That's up to the value machine to decide what its best interest is to remain a value machine.
Monky15
Rookie
Posts: 1,228
And1: 262
Joined: Mar 13, 2012

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#19 » by Monky15 » Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:06 pm

I'm hoping they expand roster sizes.

Would love it if kids were able to get into a college program from age 16. I'd say G-League but the teams are owned by NBA teams who won't want to invest in guys that will be drafted by someone else. Get them some better coaching and can play against guys in their early 20's, still get an education that can be more tailored to their needs.
Am2626
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,412
And1: 353
Joined: Jul 13, 2013

Re: NBA Formally Submits Plan To Lower Age Limit To NBPA 

Post#20 » by Am2626 » Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:15 pm

Tussin33 wrote:
Am2626 wrote:
Laimbeer wrote:This hurts more kids than it helps. So few are truly ready. That one college season can be a real eye opener. Is someone like Zion having to wait one season that awful?

As a fan, the draft is more interesting when you've seen the top prospects for at least a year.


Yeah this is a bad move. The one and done rule was put in for a reason. These kids are not old enough and mature enough to make the right decision. Too many of them will come out too early and will ruin their chances. This is also going to water down the NBA. What I would have liked seen happen is to raise the age limit to 20 and let these kids market their names. There’s no reason why they shouldn’t be able to make money off their likeness.


These kids do the same thing now.

For every Kwame Brown u have an Anthony Bennett. For every Eddie Curry there's a Sheldon Williams. The current system stops absolutely nothing but forcing kids to be in a classroom they have no interest in. Those are seats being taken up by someone who can actually utilize that knowledge for a career.

There are so many great players that came out of high school how is this even a discussion?

Lou Williams & Monta Ellis were late 2nd rounders... those are 2 absolute gems.
Andrew Bynum .... (Greg Oden)
Josh Smith
Al JEfferson
Dwight Howard
LeBron
Amare Stoudemire
Tyson Chandler
Rashard Lewis (2nd round)
Al Harrington
Tracy Mcgrady
Jermain O'neal
Kobe
KG

That's with only 10 years of eligibility. Multiple Hall of Famers that never needed college ball. Some players do need it yes, and those guys will stay in College until their stock rises to a level they're comfortable with... Think Buddy Hield & Justin Jackson (UNC)
So once again, why is this a discussion?
[/b]

John Calipari said that his one and done players have 3.5 GPA so I don’t buy your argument on that they don’t want to be in the classroom. Karl Anthony Towns and Jabari Parker are both working towards their degree now. Brandon Knight had enough credits after his senior year in high school that he started college as a sophomore academically. He has a 4.0 GPA.

It’s a discussion because there will be a lot of guys that will think they are ready when they are not and are going to ruin their chances. Think Leon Smith, Korleone Young, Robert Swift, Ndudi Ebi. What about them? Where are they now?

Return to Wiretap Discussion