Michael Jordan To Sell Part of Hornets To Investors, Retains Majority Control

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Re: Michael Jordan To Sell Part of Hornets To Investors, Retains Majority Control 

Post#21 » by arasu » Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:26 am

WaltFrazier wrote:
arasu wrote:
ItsDanger wrote:SInce 1984, 8 franchises have won the championship 33 out of 36 times (Boston, Los Angeles, Detroit, Chicago, Houston, San Antonio, Miami and Golden State). Statistically speaking, you're a fool to chase a championship in these small market cities.

Info right. Conclusion dead wrong. The Spurs and Knicks kill all big/small market arguments. The end.


The Spurs are an outlier because of great coaching, drafting, and the luck of getting Duncan. The Knicks are also an aberration because of constant management bungling. The original point still holds here.

Wrong. The tiny market Bucks had the best regular season record last year. Half of last year's division winners were small market teams. The entire Northwest Division is small market and 4 of them finished with a top 9 record. Nearly half of the last 17 champions were bottom half of market size. Only one team of the last 8 champions ranks top 10. Two of the worst teams of the past two decades rank top 10. While the Jazz haven't been winning titles, they have been consistently one of the top teams in the NBA for most of the last 4 decades, while ranking near the bottom in market size. They managed two Finals appearances and had just 6 losing seasons in the past 36 years, only two of which won less than 46% of their games. Another small market example, the Pacers, have managed only 8 losing seasons in the last 30 years, winning at least 42% of their games in all but one of those 30 years, and making a Finals appearance as well. The Trail Blazers are yet another consistent winner from a small market, with a championship and multiple Finals appearances. The Pistons are merely middle of the pack in market size, yet they've had two long runs in the past 3 1/2 decades as perennial contenders, including three championships. How many times are you gonna give the excuse that team X is run well and team Y poorly so they are exceptions? Just an appearance in the Finals, a division/conference leading season, or deep playoff run, is strong evidence that a team has had a chance, and many small market teams go that route regularly.
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Re: Michael Jordan To Sell Part of Hornets To Investors, Retains Majority Control 

Post#22 » by WaltFrazier » Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:19 pm

arasu wrote:
WaltFrazier wrote:
arasu wrote:Info right. Conclusion dead wrong. The Spurs and Knicks kill all big/small market arguments. The end.


The Spurs are an outlier because of great coaching, drafting, and the luck of getting Duncan. The Knicks are also an aberration because of constant management bungling. The original point still holds here.

Wrong. The tiny market Bucks had the best regular season record last year. Half of last year's division winners were small market teams. The entire Northwest Division is small market and 4 of them finished with a top 9 record. Nearly half of the last 17 champions were bottom half of market size. Only one team of the last 8 champions ranks top 10. Two of the worst teams of the past two decades rank top 10. While the Jazz haven't been winning titles, they have been consistently one of the top teams in the NBA for most of the last 4 decades, while ranking near the bottom in market size. They managed two Finals appearances and had just 6 losing seasons in the past 36 years, only two of which won less than 46% of their games. Another small market example, the Pacers, have managed only 8 losing seasons in the last 30 years, winning at least 42% of their games in all but one of those 30 years, and making a Finals appearance as well. The Trail Blazers are yet another consistent winner from a small market, with a championship and multiple Finals appearances. The Pistons are merely middle of the pack in market size, yet they've had two long runs in the past 3 1/2 decades as perennial contenders, including three championships. How many times are you gonna give the excuse that team X is run well and team Y poorly so they are exceptions? Just an appearance in the Finals, a division/conference leading season, or deep playoff run, is strong evidence that a team has had a chance, and many small market teams go that route regularly.


You are talking about regular season success, the OP was about winning the Championship. Which the league and the refs have a lot to do with. When San Antonio and Detroit met in the Finals a decade ago, it was a ratings disaster. There are multi millions of dollars involved, the league and the networks would simply not allow that kind of matchup every year.

Having said all that, I am a Raptors fan, and our team is not a small, medium or large market, in American terms. Toronto is big city market size, but to the US networks it is a non-market. So I am still amazed how we managed to win.
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Re: Michael Jordan To Sell Part of Hornets To Investors, Retains Majority Control 

Post#23 » by arasu » Fri Sep 20, 2019 3:51 am

WaltFrazier wrote:
arasu wrote:
WaltFrazier wrote:
The Spurs are an outlier because of great coaching, drafting, and the luck of getting Duncan. The Knicks are also an aberration because of constant management bungling. The original point still holds here.

Wrong. The tiny market Bucks had the best regular season record last year. Half of last year's division winners were small market teams. The entire Northwest Division is small market and 4 of them finished with a top 9 record. Nearly half of the last 17 champions were bottom half of market size. Only one team of the last 8 champions ranks top 10. Two of the worst teams of the past two decades rank top 10. While the Jazz haven't been winning titles, they have been consistently one of the top teams in the NBA for most of the last 4 decades, while ranking near the bottom in market size. They managed two Finals appearances and had just 6 losing seasons in the past 36 years, only two of which won less than 46% of their games. Another small market example, the Pacers, have managed only 8 losing seasons in the last 30 years, winning at least 42% of their games in all but one of those 30 years, and making a Finals appearance as well. The Trail Blazers are yet another consistent winner from a small market, with a championship and multiple Finals appearances. The Pistons are merely middle of the pack in market size, yet they've had two long runs in the past 3 1/2 decades as perennial contenders, including three championships. How many times are you gonna give the excuse that team X is run well and team Y poorly so they are exceptions? Just an appearance in the Finals, a division/conference leading season, or deep playoff run, is strong evidence that a team has had a chance, and many small market teams go that route regularly.


You are talking about regular season success, the OP was about winning the Championship. Which the league and the refs have a lot to do with. When San Antonio and Detroit met in the Finals a decade ago, it was a ratings disaster. There are multi millions of dollars involved, the league and the networks would simply not allow that kind of matchup every year.

Having said all that, I am a Raptors fan, and our team is not a small, medium or large market, in American terms. Toronto is big city market size, but to the US networks it is a non-market. So I am still amazed how we managed to win.

Wrong. I'm talking about being in position to win a championship, including regular season success, which leads to playoff seeding, which leads to Finals appearances. Once the playoffs begin, anything can happen, and the Raptor's championship only proves that. The NBA is less controlled by refs than ever before, since the scandal exposed them. And the current CBA provides the best chance for league-wide parody that it has ever had. Again, last year's (non-market) Raptors and the Cavs' (bottom third market) extended run of contention are proof.
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Re: Michael Jordan To Sell Part of Hornets To Investors, Retains Majority Control 

Post#24 » by WaltFrazier » Fri Sep 27, 2019 3:22 am

arasu wrote:
WaltFrazier wrote:
arasu wrote:Wrong. The tiny market Bucks had the best regular season record last year. Half of last year's division winners were small market teams. The entire Northwest Division is small market and 4 of them finished with a top 9 record. Nearly half of the last 17 champions were bottom half of market size. Only one team of the last 8 champions ranks top 10. Two of the worst teams of the past two decades rank top 10. While the Jazz haven't been winning titles, they have been consistently one of the top teams in the NBA for most of the last 4 decades, while ranking near the bottom in market size. They managed two Finals appearances and had just 6 losing seasons in the past 36 years, only two of which won less than 46% of their games. Another small market example, the Pacers, have managed only 8 losing seasons in the last 30 years, winning at least 42% of their games in all but one of those 30 years, and making a Finals appearance as well. The Trail Blazers are yet another consistent winner from a small market, with a championship and multiple Finals appearances. The Pistons are merely middle of the pack in market size, yet they've had two long runs in the past 3 1/2 decades as perennial contenders, including three championships. How many times are you gonna give the excuse that team X is run well and team Y poorly so they are exceptions? Just an appearance in the Finals, a division/conference leading season, or deep playoff run, is strong evidence that a team has had a chance, and many small market teams go that route regularly.


You are talking about regular season success, the OP was about winning the Championship. Which the league and the refs have a lot to do with. When San Antonio and Detroit met in the Finals a decade ago, it was a ratings disaster. There are multi millions of dollars involved, the league and the networks would simply not allow that kind of matchup every year.

Having said all that, I am a Raptors fan, and our team is not a small, medium or large market, in American terms. Toronto is big city market size, but to the US networks it is a non-market. So I am still amazed how we managed to win.

Wrong. I'm talking about being in position to win a championship, including regular season success, which leads to playoff seeding, which leads to Finals appearances. Once the playoffs begin, anything can happen, and the Raptor's championship only proves that. The NBA is less controlled by refs than ever before, since the scandal exposed them. And the current CBA provides the best chance for league-wide parody that it has ever had. Again, last year's (non-market) Raptors and the Cavs' (bottom third market) extended run of contention are proof.


Maybe it is changing as of late, but the facts of the post which we originally responded to, remain:

SInce 1984, 8 franchises have won the championship 33 out of 36 times (Boston, Los Angeles, Detroit, Chicago, Houston, San Antonio, Miami and Golden State).


I am not so sure the "NBA is less controlled by refs than ever before, since the scandal exposed them." The refs never acted on their own, they influenced results at the behest of the league. Has that really changed? Maybe, if only because Silver is less controlling than David Stern.

As an aside, you should look up the difference between parity and parody. :D
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Re: Michael Jordan To Sell Part of Hornets To Investors, Retains Majority Control 

Post#25 » by arasu » Fri Sep 27, 2019 4:29 am

WaltFrazier wrote:
arasu wrote:
WaltFrazier wrote:
You are talking about regular season success, the OP was about winning the Championship. Which the league and the refs have a lot to do with. When San Antonio and Detroit met in the Finals a decade ago, it was a ratings disaster. There are multi millions of dollars involved, the league and the networks would simply not allow that kind of matchup every year.

Having said all that, I am a Raptors fan, and our team is not a small, medium or large market, in American terms. Toronto is big city market size, but to the US networks it is a non-market. So I am still amazed how we managed to win.

Wrong. I'm talking about being in position to win a championship, including regular season success, which leads to playoff seeding, which leads to Finals appearances. Once the playoffs begin, anything can happen, and the Raptor's championship only proves that. The NBA is less controlled by refs than ever before, since the scandal exposed them. And the current CBA provides the best chance for league-wide parody that it has ever had. Again, last year's (non-market) Raptors and the Cavs' (bottom third market) extended run of contention are proof.


Maybe it is changing as of late, but the facts of the post which we originally responded to, remain:

SInce 1984, 8 franchises have won the championship 33 out of 36 times (Boston, Los Angeles, Detroit, Chicago, Houston, San Antonio, Miami and Golden State).


I am not so sure the "NBA is less controlled by refs than ever before, since the scandal exposed them." The refs never acted on their own, they influenced results at the behest of the league. Has that really changed? Maybe, if only because Silver is less controlling than David Stern.

As an aside, you should look up the difference between parity and parody. :D

Apologies for the misspelling.

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