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NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2025 4:21 pm
by RealGM Wiretap

When Nikola Jokic was 19 years old and just two months removed from being a second round pick by the Denver Nuggets, he was measured as having a 17-inch vertical jump. According to P3 founder Marcus Elliott, it was the worst vertical jump they had ever recorded. 


But as Jokic was evaluated in other ways such as how he moved laterally, a list of what Elliott calls “granular biomechanics” — hundreds of variables that rate things like force production, loads and joint extension, he scored exceptionally well. Jokic was right on the fringe of a group of guards that Elliot called “Swiss Army Knives” because of their ability to do anything on the court.


“They’re just like a B-minus to B-level in everything,” Elliott said. “And that’s Jokic. He may look herky-jerky to you. But looking at the data, we think it looks really beautiful.”


P3 calls these types of athletes "The Kinematic Movers", which grades out above average in almost everything, possessing a portfolio of some of the most useful physical tools and movements in basketball. As a group, Kinematic Movers in the NBA have longer careers, on average, and accumulate more of the statistic Win Shares.


“I love the idea that if you can do everything pretty well, there’s a place for you at the highest level of sport,” Elliott said.


Luka Doncic and James Harden are also Kinematic Movers. Elliott believes Patrick Mahomes is another example. 


“When you start actually measuring these things, it’s almost like having a microscope,” Elliott said. “You start being able to see this hidden world that’s not accessible to us with our eyes open.”

Via Rustin Dodd/The Athletic


Re: NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 2:16 am
by WaltFrazier
List more of the group then

Re: NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 2:57 am
by Reeko
Is Steph Curry also a kinematic mover? What about Kyle Lowry? SGA?

Who are the top Kinematic movers in this upcoming draft?

Re: NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 3:28 am
by NBA4Lyfe
john stockton another one

Re: NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 5:55 am
by hyberx
If you jump less and lower, you get hurt less. What an earth-breaking concept.

Re: NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 12:31 pm
by elmdawgg69
Kobe, Kidd, Malone, Pippen, Barkley, Shaq, and Duncan were.

Re: NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 1:01 pm
by ecuhus1981
Reeko wrote:Is Steph Curry also a kinematic mover? What about Kyle Lowry? SGA?

Who are the top Kinematic movers in this upcoming draft?

This is the million dollar question.

Meaning, teams will pay this guy a million dollars to keep this knowledge in-house before the draft.

Re: NBA's 'Kinematic Movers' Have Longer Careers, Produce More Win Shares

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 2:22 pm
by Lockdown504090
ecuhus1981 wrote:
Reeko wrote:Is Steph Curry also a kinematic mover? What about Kyle Lowry? SGA?

Who are the top Kinematic movers in this upcoming draft?

This is the million dollar question.

Meaning, teams will pay this guy a million dollars to keep this knowledge in-house before the draft.

P3 isnt public information, but all the teams have it. P3 wasnt widely used in 2009 when curry was drafted, and he was an upperclassman so teams were naturally less interested in him also as a prospect his numbers were probably so terrible they are buried. Curry's trainer works adjacent to P3 so im sure somebody knows where he is compared to his peers.