Paris 2024 - Women's Olympic Basketball

[LewisnotMiller]

Whilst not the real stuff, quick shout out to the Aussie Women's 3x3 team (the Gangarrus) who qualified for the Olympics last night, following a tough win over the Canadians.
https://www.espn.com/nbl/story/_/id/40091655/aussie-women-sink-only-shot-qualify-paris-3x3

What's the meaning behind that name?

It is an Aboriginal word from one of the indigenous languages that means 'grey kangaroo'

[MrDollarBills]

Whilst not the real stuff, quick shout out to the Aussie Women's 3x3 team (the Gangarrus) who qualified for the Olympics last night, following a tough win over the Canadians.
https://www.espn.com/nbl/story/_/id/40091655/aussie-women-sink-only-shot-qualify-paris-3x3

What's the meaning behind that name?

It is an Aboriginal word from one of the indigenous languages that means 'grey kangaroo'

I like that!

[Wingy]

Team USA announced

Breanna Stewart
A'ja Wilson
Napheesa Collier
Jewell Loyd
Chelsea Gray
Kelsey Plum
Jackie Young
Alyssa Thomas
Sabrina Ionescu
Kahleah Copper
Diana Taurasi
Brittney Griner

We know who every headline point out, but who are the real snubs?

[shrink]

Coach Norman Dale: I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not

Nope. Every player on that team knows that America and the World would much rather see Clark play than any one of them. Sports is best when you are cheering for people you actually like. They claim they want to make the WNBA popular? By excluding the most popular player in the WNBA from a world stage?

This has been Clark’s dream, to represent Team USA in the Olympics. She has done nothing to any of these women. Every story about Team USA is going to mention Clark, regardless of how this team does, and their decision is detrimental to the WNBA going forward.

[MrDollarBills]

Team USA announced

Breanna Stewart
A'ja Wilson
Napheesa Collier
Jewell Loyd
Chelsea Gray
Kelsey Plum
Jackie Young
Alyssa Thomas
Sabrina Ionescu
Kahleah Copper
Diana Taurasi
Brittney Griner

We know who every headline point out, but who are the real snubs?

That roster is unstoppable. My God I cannot wait

[MrDollarBills]

Coach Norman Dale: I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not

Nope. Every player on that team knows that America and the World would much rather see Clark play than any one of them. Sports is best when you are cheering for people you actually like. They claim they want to make the WNBA popular? By excluding the most popular player in the WNBA from a world stage?

This has been Clark’s dream, to represent Team USA in the Olympics. She has done nothing to any of these women. Every story about Team USA is going to mention Clark, regardless of how this team does, and their decision is detrimental to the WNBA going forward.

You are really reaching here. None of the players selected have issues with Caitlin.

Newsflash: Rookies being left off Olympic rosters is nothing new. CC needs to pay her dues just like everyone else on this roster had too.

Thank God CC doesn't act as entitled as her insane fans do.

[shrink]

Coach Norman Dale: I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not

Nope. Every player on that team knows that America and the World would much rather see Clark play than any one of them. Sports is best when you are cheering for people you actually like. They claim they want to make the WNBA popular? By excluding the most popular player in the WNBA from a world stage?

This has been Clark’s dream, to represent Team USA in the Olympics. She has done nothing to any of these women. Every story about Team USA is going to mention Clark, regardless of how this team does, and their decision is detrimental to the WNBA going forward.

You are really reaching here. None of the players selected have issues with Caitlin.

Newsflash: Rookies being left off Olympic rosters is nothing new. CC needs to pay her dues just like everyone else on this roster had too.

Thank God CC doesn't act as entitled as her insane fans do.

The Olympics before last, team USA had a 21 year old rookie. Both the Men’s and Women’s teams have a long history of rookies, and even college players, to tie them to the program for future Olympics and give them experience.

But don’t let that stop you from expressing your feelings.

[MrDollarBills]

Nope. Every player on that team knows that America and the World would much rather see Clark play than any one of them. Sports is best when you are cheering for people you actually like. They claim they want to make the WNBA popular? By excluding the most popular player in the WNBA from a world stage?

This has been Clark’s dream, to represent Team USA in the Olympics. She has done nothing to any of these women. Every story about Team USA is going to mention Clark, regardless of how this team does, and their decision is detrimental to the WNBA going forward.

You are really reaching here. None of the players selected have issues with Caitlin.

Newsflash: Rookies being left off Olympic rosters is nothing new. CC needs to pay her dues just like everyone else on this roster had too.

Thank God CC doesn't act as entitled as her insane fans do.

The Olympics before last, team USA had a 21 year old rookie. Both the Men’s and Women’s teams have a long history of rookies, and even college players, to tie them to the program for future Olympics and give them experience.

But don’t let that stop you from expressing your feelings.

The youngest players on the 2020 Olympics team were A'ja Wilson, Napheesa Collier, and Ariel Atkins...who were all 24 at the time. No one was crying when Sabrina was left off the squad.

Caitlin has to earn it. That's life. She'll be alright, and Team USA will take gold easily.

[shrink]

You are really reaching here. None of the players selected have issues with Caitlin.

Newsflash: Rookies being left off Olympic rosters is nothing new. CC needs to pay her dues just like everyone else on this roster had too.

Thank God CC doesn't act as entitled as her insane fans do.

The Olympics before last, team USA had a 21 year old rookie. Both the Men’s and Women’s teams have a long history of rookies, and even college players, to tie them to the program for future Olympics and give them experience.

But don’t let that stop you from expressing your feelings.

The youngest players on the 2020 Olympics team were A'ja Wilson, Napheesa Collier, and Ariel Atkins...who were all 24 at the time. No one was crying when Sabrina was left off the squad.

Caitlin has to earn it. That's life. She'll be alright, and Team USA will take gold easily.

Isn’t 2016 “the Olympics before last?”

Since last Olympics had 24 year old players, and the one before had 21, now we’re setting 24 is the minimum age requirement? And Brianna Stewart didn’t “earn it?”

[MrDollarBills]

The Olympics before last, team USA had a 21 year old rookie. Both the Men’s and Women’s teams have a long history of rookies, and even college players, to tie them to the program for future Olympics and give them experience.

But don’t let that stop you from expressing your feelings.

The youngest players on the 2020 Olympics team were A'ja Wilson, Napheesa Collier, and Ariel Atkins...who were all 24 at the time. No one was crying when Sabrina was left off the squad.

Caitlin has to earn it. That's life. She'll be alright, and Team USA will take gold easily.

Isn’t 2016 “the Olympics before last?”

Since last Olympics had 24 year old players, and the one before had 21, now we’re setting 24 is the minimum age requirement? And Brianna Stewart didn’t “earn it?”

No, no age requirement.

Stewie is a first ballot hall of famer. Are you putting CC on the same level?

I hate to break it to you, but there are other players in the W right now who are better and more experienced than CC. She's not getting gifted a spot over literal hall of fame level players just because she cooked Division 1 players.

[Wingy]

Coach Norman Dale: I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not

Nope. Every player on that team knows that America and the World would much rather see Clark play than any one of them. Sports is best when you are cheering for people you actually like. They claim they want to make the WNBA popular? By excluding the most popular player in the WNBA from a world stage?

This has been Clark’s dream, to represent Team USA in the Olympics. She has done nothing to any of these women. Every story about Team USA is going to mention Clark, regardless of how this team does, and their decision is detrimental to the WNBA going forward.

You are really reaching here. None of the players selected have issues with Caitlin.

Newsflash: Rookies being left off Olympic rosters is nothing new. CC needs to pay her dues just like everyone else on this roster had too.

Thank God CC doesn't act as entitled as her insane fans do.

It’s not about paying dues. It’s about being good enough, and right now Caitlin simply isn’t good enough.

Next Olympics, I think she’ll earn and be worthy of a spot.

The world has made huge strides when it comes to closing the gap with our men. It’s inevitable for the women too (look at USWNT soccer/futbol), but not yet…this crew is obviously going to dominate.

[MrDollarBills]

Nope. Every player on that team knows that America and the World would much rather see Clark play than any one of them. Sports is best when you are cheering for people you actually like. They claim they want to make the WNBA popular? By excluding the most popular player in the WNBA from a world stage?

This has been Clark’s dream, to represent Team USA in the Olympics. She has done nothing to any of these women. Every story about Team USA is going to mention Clark, regardless of how this team does, and their decision is detrimental to the WNBA going forward.

You are really reaching here. None of the players selected have issues with Caitlin.

Newsflash: Rookies being left off Olympic rosters is nothing new. CC needs to pay her dues just like everyone else on this roster had too.

Thank God CC doesn't act as entitled as her insane fans do.

It’s not about paying dues. It’s about being good enough, and right now Caitlin simply isn’t good enough.

Next Olympics, I think she’ll earn and be worthy of a spot.

The world has made huge strides when it comes to closing the gap with our men. It’s inevitable for the women too (look at USWNT soccer/futbol), but not yet…this crew is obviously going to dominate.

That's what I mean though. She's not there yet. She has to work her way up and earn it.

"Paying dues" = being left off the team because she needs to get better.

[shrink]

The youngest players on the 2020 Olympics team were A'ja Wilson, Napheesa Collier, and Ariel Atkins...who were all 24 at the time. No one was crying when Sabrina was left off the squad.

Caitlin has to earn it. That's life. She'll be alright, and Team USA will take gold easily.

Isn’t 2016 “the Olympics before last?”

Since last Olympics had 24 year old players, and the one before had 21, now we’re setting 24 is the minimum age requirement? And Brianna Stewart didn’t “earn it?”

No, no age requirement.

Stewie is a first ballot hall of famer. Are you putting CC on the same level?

Do you even read your own quotes? You specifically made this an case about being 24 years old. If you want to use the age of the player on Olympics rosters as evidence, then 2020 and 2016 both should count, not just the one that agrees with your opinion.

As for 2016, you understand Stewart was not yet a “first ballot Hall of Famer” when she was selected at 21? Had Stewart “earned it” with one month of WNBA under her belt? If not, why are you arguing that Clark (22) has to?

Dude, pick one lane, and try to stay in it.

[DOT]

Geno was the coach in 2016

Stewie got in cause of nepotism. She deserved it to be fair, but it was nepotism

So the one case in the last 8 years is an obvious outlier due to having played for the head coach in college

Again, there is an argument to be made she should be on the roster, but it's not this huge scandal people are making it out to be.

[shrink]

So the one case in the last 8 years is an obvious outlier due to having played for the head coach in college

To be fair, that’s only two rosters. So I took a look to get a larger sample

The US has been sending a women’s basketball team since 1976, but those first ones were almost all college players that were mostly Clark’s age of younger, but those restrictions shouldn’t count either way on whether 2020 Olympics selection of 24+ was the standard selection or an aberration. The Olympics started allowing professional players in 1992, so I was curious who the youngest player was on each of these rosters was, each year.

1992 Carolyn Jones (22), Christian Laettner (22)
1996 Rebecca Lobo (22), Grant Hill (23)
2000 Kara Wolters (25), Vince Carter (23)
2004 Diana Taurasi! (22), LeBron James (19)
2008 Sylvia Fowles (22), Dwight Howard (22)
2012 Tina Charles (23), Anthony Davis (19)
2016 Briana Stewart (21), Kyrie Irving (24)
2020 Napheesa Collier (24), Keldon Johnson (21)

Clark is 22, and the fact that the last team’s youngest player was 24 is not the standard. Players Clark’s age are not outliers.

[MrDollarBills]

Isn’t 2016 “the Olympics before last?”

Since last Olympics had 24 year old players, and the one before had 21, now we’re setting 24 is the minimum age requirement? And Brianna Stewart didn’t “earn it?”

No, no age requirement.

Stewie is a first ballot hall of famer. Are you putting CC on the same level?

Do you even read your own quotes? You specifically made this an case about being 24 years old. If you want to use the age of the player on Olympics rosters as evidence, then 2020 and 2016 both should count, not just the one that agrees with your opinion.

As for 2016, you understand Stewart was not yet a “first ballot Hall of Famer” when she was selected at 21? Had Stewart “earned it” with one month of WNBA under her belt? If not, why are you arguing that Clark (22) has to?

Dude, pick one lane, and try to stay in it.

No, you're the one focusing on the 24 years old thing in an attempt to create a strawman argument because you're having a hard time trying to justify why Clark should be picked over players that are flat out better than her right now.

Yep i understand she wasn't a first ballot HOFer in 2016, but she is now and she was a better player at age 21 than Clark is now at 22.

Also, Stewie making it doesn't mean Caitlin is entitled to make it.

What guards should have been left off on CC's behalf? Sabrina? Gray? Jackie Young? Kelsey? Jewel? DT? You really can't make a case for CC being picked over any of them.

[DOT]

So the one case in the last 8 years is an obvious outlier due to having played for the head coach in college

To be fair, that’s only two rosters. So I took a look to get a larger sample

The US has been sending a women’s basketball team since 1976, but those first ones were almost all college players that were mostly Clark’s age of younger, but those restrictions shouldn’t count either way on whether 2020 Olympics selection of 24+ was the standard selection or an aberration. The Olympics started allowing professional players in 1992, so I was curious who the youngest player was on each of these rosters was, each year.

1992 Carolyn Jones (22), Christian Laettner (22)
1996 Rebecca Lobo (22), Grant Hill (23)
2000 Kara Wolters (25), Vince Carter (23)
2004 Diana Taurasi! (22), LeBron James (19)
2008 Sylvia Fowles (22), Dwight Howard (22)
2012 Tina Charles (23), Anthony Davis (19)
2016 Briana Stewart (21), Kyrie Irving (24)
2020 Napheesa Collier (24), Keldon Johnson (21)

Clark is 22, and the fact that the last team’s youngest player was 24 is not the standard. Players Clark’s age are not outliers.

WNBA started in 1997, so there's no reference for how Jones and Lobo would have played, but I will point out that Lobo was 2nd team All-WNBA in 1997

Diana Taruasi was All-WNBA 1st team and 3rd in MVP voting in 2004

Sylvia Fowles was 2nd team All-Defense in 2008 as well as being a 6'6 C, something that would be difficult to match up with

Tina Charles won MVP in 2012, had 2 1st team All-WNBA selections and 1 2nd team All-WNBA, along with 2 2nd team All-Defense selections in 3 seasons

Stewie was 2nd team All-WNBA, 2nd team All-Defense, and 2nd in DPOY voting in 2016

Napheesa Collier was 2nd team All-Defense and 2nd team All-WNBA in 2020

So out of 6 players, 4 were at least 2nd team All-WNBA the year they were selected, one was 2nd team All-Defense, and the other was Kara Wolters, who was probably only on the team due to being a 6'7 C. Meaning the 6 players who we have reference for were either at least 2nd team All-WNBA the year they went, or were just really tall

There's still time for Clark to improve her efficiency and make an All-WNBA team, but that's not guaranteed to happen. She's not even guaranteed to get ROY, so her making it at that age despite no major accomplishments would be an outlier, yes.

[MrDollarBills]

I know people are pissed because DT is old, but Clark isn't a better player than she is right now.

Olympic play isn't charity. It's serious hoops. If CC was the best player in the league getting snubbed, that's one thing, but she isn't and the margin between her and the league's best player, A'ja, is WIDE.

[shrink]

So the one case in the last 8 years is an obvious outlier due to having played for the head coach in college

To be fair, that’s only two rosters. So I took a look to get a larger sample

The US has been sending a women’s basketball team since 1976, but those first ones were almost all college players that were mostly Clark’s age of younger, but those restrictions shouldn’t count either way on whether 2020 Olympics selection of 24+ was the standard selection or an aberration. The Olympics started allowing professional players in 1992, so I was curious who the youngest player was on each of these rosters was, each year.

1992 Carolyn Jones (22), Christian Laettner (22)
1996 Rebecca Lobo (22), Grant Hill (23)
2000 Kara Wolters (25), Vince Carter (23)
2004 Diana Taurasi! (22), LeBron James (19)
2008 Sylvia Fowles (22), Dwight Howard (22)
2012 Tina Charles (23), Anthony Davis (19)
2016 Briana Stewart (21), Kyrie Irving (24)
2020 Napheesa Collier (24), Keldon Johnson (21)

Clark is 22, and the fact that the last team’s youngest player was 24 is not the standard. Players Clark’s age are not outliers.

WNBA started in 1997, so there's no reference for how Jones and Lobo would have played, but I will point out that Lobo was 2nd team All-WNBA in 1997

Diana Taruasi was All-WNBA 1st team and 3rd in MVP voting in 2004

Sylvia Fowles was 2nd team All-Defense in 2008 as well as being a 6'6 C, something that would be difficult to match up with

Tina Charles won MVP in 2012, had 2 1st team All-WNBA selections and 1 2nd team All-WNBA, along with 2 2nd team All-Defense selections in 3 seasons

Stewie was 2nd team All-WNBA, 2nd team All-Defense, and 2nd in DPOY voting in 2016

Napheesa Collier was 2nd team All-Defense and 2nd team All-WNBA in 2020

So out of 6 players, 4 were at least 2nd team All-WNBA the year they were selected, one was 2nd team All-Defense, and the other was Kara Wolters, who was probably only on the team due to being a 6'7 C. Meaning the 6 players who we have reference for were either at least 2nd team All-WNBA the year they went, or were just really tall

There's still time for Clark to improve her efficiency and make an All-WNBA team, but that's not guaranteed to happen. She's not even guaranteed to get ROY, so her making it at that age despite no major accomplishments would be an outlier, yes.

Ok, you didn’t like extending past your two Olympic sample, so let’s compare apples to apples.

How many of these players you excluded had already won those accolades before they were selected for Team USA? Yes, Clark hasn’t won DPOY or All-WNBA or Rookie of the Year. She’s only won Rookie of the Month, because that’s the only award she could have received at this point in her career.

Will she will DPOY or ALL WNBA at the end of the season? I agree, we don’t know. But neither did the selection committee when they chose women and men at her same age, who also hadn’t yet been eligible for these awards. Young athletes for years have been chosen because they are projected to contribute to the national team, this year and in the future. It seems unfair to dismiss her because she hasn’t acquired WNBA awards in her first month of play, while she has certainly had a greater basketball career than any of them at 22 with her many record-breaking college accolades.

Watch on YouTube

Making Team USA is not a WNBA award, though it really seems like the WNBA board can’t see that, and WNBA accomplishments seem to be the metric you are using to justify Clark’s exclusion.

[DOT]

To be fair, that’s only two rosters. So I took a look to get a larger sample

The US has been sending a women’s basketball team since 1976, but those first ones were almost all college players that were mostly Clark’s age of younger, but those restrictions shouldn’t count either way on whether 2020 Olympics selection of 24+ was the standard selection or an aberration. The Olympics started allowing professional players in 1992, so I was curious who the youngest player was on each of these rosters was, each year.

1992 Carolyn Jones (22), Christian Laettner (22)
1996 Rebecca Lobo (22), Grant Hill (23)
2000 Kara Wolters (25), Vince Carter (23)
2004 Diana Taurasi! (22), LeBron James (19)
2008 Sylvia Fowles (22), Dwight Howard (22)
2012 Tina Charles (23), Anthony Davis (19)
2016 Briana Stewart (21), Kyrie Irving (24)
2020 Napheesa Collier (24), Keldon Johnson (21)

Clark is 22, and the fact that the last team’s youngest player was 24 is not the standard. Players Clark’s age are not outliers.

WNBA started in 1997, so there's no reference for how Jones and Lobo would have played, but I will point out that Lobo was 2nd team All-WNBA in 1997

Diana Taruasi was All-WNBA 1st team and 3rd in MVP voting in 2004

Sylvia Fowles was 2nd team All-Defense in 2008 as well as being a 6'6 C, something that would be difficult to match up with

Tina Charles won MVP in 2012, had 2 1st team All-WNBA selections and 1 2nd team All-WNBA, along with 2 2nd team All-Defense selections in 3 seasons

Stewie was 2nd team All-WNBA, 2nd team All-Defense, and 2nd in DPOY voting in 2016

Napheesa Collier was 2nd team All-Defense and 2nd team All-WNBA in 2020

So out of 6 players, 4 were at least 2nd team All-WNBA the year they were selected, one was 2nd team All-Defense, and the other was Kara Wolters, who was probably only on the team due to being a 6'7 C. Meaning the 6 players who we have reference for were either at least 2nd team All-WNBA the year they went, or were just really tall

There's still time for Clark to improve her efficiency and make an All-WNBA team, but that's not guaranteed to happen. She's not even guaranteed to get ROY, so her making it at that age despite no major accomplishments would be an outlier, yes.

Let’s compare apples to apples.

How many of these players you excluded had already won those accolades before they were selected for Team USA? Yes, Clark hasn’t won DPOY or All-WNBA or Rookie of the Year. She’s only won Rookie of the Month, because that’s the only award she could have received at this point in her career.

Will she will DPOY or ALL WNBA at the end of the season? I agree, we don’t know. But neither did the selection committee when they chose women and men at her same age, who also hadn’t yet been eligible for these awards. Young athletes for years have been chosen because they are projected to contribute to the national team, this year and in the future. It seems unfair to dismiss her because she hasn’t acquired WNBA awards in her first month of play, while she has certainly had a greater basketball career than any of them at 22 with her record-breaking college accolades.

lol you can't bring up the Men's team, who for years has been notorious for not sending their best or the most popular players, and then start whining about "we need to compare apples to apples"

Let's talk apples to apples, Clark is not better than the guards on that list, she would not get any playing time. Of course, you don't know that because you don't actually watch or care about the WNBA, you just want to whine about it. If she were on the team, you'd be in that thread talking about how bad it looks for the WNBA that they're putting her on it just for popularity and not taking just the best basketball players