Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth?

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Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#1 » by DJ_3_Ball » Sat Dec 14, 2019 8:02 am

This is coming from somebody who has only really been conscious of the Euroleague for the past 3 years, and only really looked at the Euroleague (semi-closely) since I heard the name Luka Doncic (about this time last year).

I know some of the basic differences. 40 minutes, instead of 48 minutes. Shorter court, wider lanes, harder to receive credit for an assist, minutes overall spread-out throughout the team more, etc.

One thing I've noticed is, with the exception of Luka Doncic, they don't seem to give young prospects minutes, and when they do, they don't look for them on offense. It doesn't seem like they're encouraged to take shots.

Two of the top draft prospects in next year's lottery are Deni Advija and Theo Maledon.

Deni Advija was expected to see a few more minutes this round, with Nate Wolters sidelined, his stat line on Thursday: 8 min 0 pts 0/1 FG 1 reb 1 asst.

Theo Maledon this round. His stat line: 6 min 0 pts 0/0 FG 1 reb 1 asst 1 TO.

For Advija, some of those Wolters' minutes went to Tyler Dorsey (who played 16 minutes). I watched Tyler Dorsey with ATL. Dorsey isn't some cagey veteran. In fact, the only thing Tyler Dorsey can teach young Deni is what NOT to do in the NBA. If Deni Advija isn't better than Tyler Dorsey, RIGHT NOW... TODAY... then he doesn't have any business being discussed in the lottery or in the 1st round or probably drafted at all.

BUT, this wouldn't be the first time the Euroleague put the shackles on a young talent & then he blossomed in the NBA...

So, What's the deal with that?
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Re: Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#2 » by THE J0KER » Sun Dec 15, 2019 11:17 pm

There are no reasons for anyone to be disappointed too much in anyone's EuroLeague numbers when we talking about Euro youngsters.

It is Luka Doncic alone who is the only big exception from the rule in the past 25 years who made his big EL name (even MVP award) already before 19th birthday. Even players of HoF level like Nowitzki, Giannis, Jokic, Gobert... didn't have time to do something notable. More back in the past, players like Drazen Petrovic, Sabonis, Divac, Kukoc... have some great achievements as under-20, but not as under-18 youngsters, and in that era, European clubs basketball was far less physical than in XXI century.
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Re: Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#3 » by Mirotic12 » Tue Dec 17, 2019 12:59 am

No the EuroLeague is not at all biased against young players. That's a complete myth that US sports media started. The EuroLeague is actually way friendlier to young players than NBA is. If a guy is 15 and good enough to play, then he will get to play in EuroLeague. No you have to be 18-19 just to get drafted stuff.

The reason NBA draft picks or guys listed high on NBA mocks usually don't play much in EuroLeague is simply because they are not good enough to get more playing time. You can look up all the old draft threads on realgm about guys like Mario Hezonja and Dragan Bender and see tons of NBA fans claiming they were not playing because their teams were punishing them for going into the draft, and many people who follow EuroLeague saying the reason they did not play was because they were just bad players and not good enough to get minutes.

Obviously, now we know what the truth was. They were never good players, so they didn't play. Doncic was a very good player, so he played. You mention Theo Maledon.....he's seriously the worst defender I have ever seen at the guard positions in EuroLeague. I am serious, the worst defender in the back court I have ever seen in EuroLeague. He's actually very lucky his coach plays him at all. Most teams wouldn't.

Every year at the NBA draft, the US sports media makes it seem like all these draft picks in Europe are "dominating over there". The reality is, most of them are actually scrubs "over there". This distortion of reality by US sports media on the issue created this whole myth among NBA fans in US about how young players are treated unfairly in Europe. It's complete nonsense.

If guys are not playing much in Europe or not being featured, it's because they are not good enough. You also mentioned Dani Avdija......he's not good enough to be anything but an 11th man or so on his team. If his coach featured him, the team would be a disaster, he would get fired, and the owners of the club would be on very thin ice with the fans.

EuroLeague is not a development league and also there is no tanking ever. It's actually for the most part, basically a nearly 100% merit based league, unlike the NBA that has a lot of politics, contract issues and tanking making it not that. In a nearly 100% merit based league, guys like Maledon and Avdija are not good enough for EuroLeague, while Doncic easily was. For players at that age, Doncic is simply a one in history player. It's just that simple.

Also, I don't think that the EuroLeague has wider lanes, but I might be wrong on that.
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Re: Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#4 » by Perseus1966 » Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:17 am

Euroleague is a joke, a berttomeu fraud its a trick to make money not a place to develop players .
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Re: Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#5 » by giberish » Wed Dec 18, 2019 5:15 am

EuroLeague teams are trying to win, right now.

Look at the NBA. Most 1 and done rookies are bad, often below replacement-level by +/- impact stats. Even the guys who eventually become top players are usually not helping their teams win at 19. Step back a year to 18 year olds and they're going to be really bad (most players are improving rapidly that young). Those guys are going to be below the guys even a tier below min salary NBA players.

Luka being as good as he was at 18 is completely nuts. That he wasn't seen as the obvious #1 pick (and one of the stronger #1 picks) was surprising.
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Re: Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#6 » by THE J0KER » Wed Dec 18, 2019 11:05 am

Actually, I can understand USA NBA fans frustrations over Euro 18y prospects lack of chances to play on a high-level competition with notable playing time, but EuroLeague is too serious competition and result-based (much more than NCAA). Also, why would some EL team would development any young player which going to USA already next year anyway?

And lack of minutes in serious competition prevents NBA scouts army to do their job properly when it goes to European prospects. If we look at non-College European lottery picks in this decade and non-lottery players chosen from Europe, you will see clearly the issue, and reasons for frustrations.

3 Luka Doncic
4 Kristaps Porzingis
4 Dragan Bender
5 Jonas Valanciunas
5 Mario Hezonja
6 Jan Vesely
7 Bismack Biyombo (from Africa, but played in Spain before Draft)
8 Frank Ntilikina
12 Dario Saric

Giannis Antetokounmpo
Nikola Jokic
Rudy Gobert
Clint Capela
Jusuf Nurkic
Bojan Bogdanovic
Bogdan Bogdanovic
Evan Fournier
Dennis Schröder

(EURO players which come to Draft from NCAA like Vucevic, Sabonis, Markkanen... doesn't counts)

Chances to take from Europe "fools gold" or to miss "real gold" on draft is obviously much higher than for players from the rest of the planet.
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Re: Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#7 » by UcanUwill » Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:24 pm

Euroleague being biased towards youth is a myth, and Luka Doncic proved it. The reason why young players do not play there, is because they are just not good enough. NBA teams keep trying to draft EUro bench warmers thinking they are hidden gems, but time shows why these guys were bench warmers as they fall on their face in the league Dragan Bender style. Thats not Euroleague problem.
This year we had Goga Bitadze who actually played in EUroleague very well, and I think he will be good NBA player. He is not Sekou Doumbaya or Dragan Bender.
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Re: Is the EuroLeague Biased Towards Youth? 

Post#8 » by Maccabi95 » Wed Jul 1, 2020 12:26 am

This is a pretty ridiculous question and the point that can be effectively summarized as "if there's anything that Tyler Dorsey can do better than Deni Avdija right now then Deni Avdija will never be an NBA player" is especially absurd.

Deni Avdija is the age of a college sophomore on a roster full of guys who were standouts in college and fringe NBA players, and that organization is trying to win now. Maccabi Tel Aviv are the Lakers/Duke/Yankees of the Israeli basketball league -- if they lose, there's hell to pay. They're not in the business of losing games to develop young players like a bunch of NBA teams are.

I don't think there's any doubt that Deni Avdija will eventually be a better basketball player than Tyler Dorsey, but you shouldn't expect Deni Avdija to be better than Dorsey at everything just because one has been deemed an NBA player and the other hasn't. Dorsey is a very good 3-point shooter, and European teams need players who can hit 3-point shots, too.

Would Maccabi Tel Aviv have been better off this year had they taken the ball out of Scottie Wilbekin's hands more often and put the ball in Avdija's more? Absolutely not. Does that mean that Avdija doesn't possess all the qualities to be a 3&D wing with secondary playmaking abilities in the future? No. But Wilbekin is mostly a finished product, and Avdija is nowhere close.

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