FIBA World Olympic Qualifying Tournament 2008

[Walt Cronkite]

6 minutes to go, 4 point game!!

[Walt Cronkite]

Barea to seal the deal

[Walt Cronkite]

Good comeback by Cameroon. PR made a lot of FTs in the 2nd half. They ended with 13 made 3s, 10 made 2s(only 28%!).

[Walt Cronkite]

L_4_L, you don't know when to quit... my entire post was supporting your argument--something you would've realized had you taken the time to THINK BEFORE POSTING PLEASE! But no, you had to go cherry-picking data and got called out by Alyosha12.

The NBA is, by literal definition, more lenient in regard to assists than FIBA. I don't think anyone informed in the matter would argue against that. However, doing something as crude as tripling or quadrupling assist totals for NBA translations because of Jose Calderon shows a misunderstanding of statistical relevance. Hollinger's Assist Ratio is relevant because it takes pace into account. He figures out the stats of EUROLEAGUE players and multiplies it by 31% to get the projected NBA translation.

There is no metric for establishing FIBA stats to the NBA. If you watched the game and counted, by NBA definition, 14 assists, then kudos to you and Papaloukas. If you looked at the box score though and saw 7 assists and decided to double it (what I believe you did), then you're doing it wrong.

[Walt Cronkite]

I mean, really, why stop at 14 and 16 NBA assists? Calderon, if we're multiplying by his 08 production, means that NBA assists = FIBA x 3.19 or if we're going by his career production we're looking at FIBA x 2.35.

Therefore, we can "logically" assume that Spanoulis actually recorded 25.52-18.8 NBA assists and 22.33-16.45 for Popaloukas! So, is it too early or too late for me to get on the Vassillis 4 MVP bandwagon?

[Lakers_4_Life]

Euroleague and FIBA assists are the same exact thing. They are scored the same exact way.

And anyone believing it is really just a mere 31% difference doesn't know anything about the stats. Hollinger is full of crap completely if he really believes that.

Jose Calderon NBA

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/jose_cald ... stats.html

NBA career 25.0 MPG 6.1 APG

last season NBA 30.3 MPG 8.3 APG

Jose Calderon FIBA 2007

2007 European Championship FIBA international competition with Spanish national team

http://www.eurobasket2007.org/en/cid_Bq ... D_362.html

24.9 MPG 2.6 APG

Jose Calderon's last season of Euroleague 2005

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/p ... code=E2004

26.9 MPG 2.6 APG

Forgive me for thinking (obviously VERY wrongly) that on realgm.com posters might actually have the most basic of basketball knowledge. I won't make that mistake again as I now realize very few here know even the most common of things about the game.

Udrih 25mins per game in Euroleague 3 assists, 32mins per game in Sactown 4 assists.
Ginobili 28mins per game in euroleague 3 assists 30mins per game in the NBA 4.5assists
Delfino 30mins in the Euroleague 2 assists 23mins in the NBA almost 2 assists.
Navarro 28mins in the Euroleague 3 assists 25mins in the NBA 2 assists.

Should i go on?

Can someone PLEASE bring some basketball knowledge? How little do you guys know about the game? Udrih shooting point guard in a point guard body, Manu SG. Delfino SG, Navrro SG.

You do NOT look at assists from FIBA and Euroleague and then the NBA the same way you do for a point guard THINK. PLEASE someone anyone here if you know the game feel free to help anytime.

I advise strongly someone here actually reads the FIBA rule for scoring an assist because you are all really making yourselves look bad. FIBA assists difference would not be that great for non-point guards because of how the rule is written. BUT for point guards it is a HUGE difference. Steve Nash for example, 70% of his NBA assists would NOT be an assist in FIBA.

Udrih? Most of his assists are NOT completely creating away from the basket, creating back away from the goal or in the pick and roll spoon feeding a player. In FIBA those types of assists get taken away almost entirely. 90% of Stockton to Malone is NOT an assist in FIBA.

Does anyone here even have the sense to look at how the rule is written and actually use your brain and apply that to how that would affect a POINT GUARD'S assist stats?

Chris Paul FIBA 23.4 MPG 4.9 APG

NBA 37.6 MPG 11.6 APG


Always great to use NON-point guards to argue how assists are counted. You guys are BRILLIANT and to then laugh about how others don't know what is correct...........

[Lakers_4_Life]

I mean, really, why stop at 14 and 16 NBA assists? Calderon, if we're multiplying by his 08 production, means that NBA assists = FIBA x 3.19 or if we're going by his career production we're looking at FIBA x 2.35.

Therefore, we can "logically" assume that Spanoulis actually recorded 25.52-18.8 NBA assists and 22.33-16.45 for Popaloukas! So, is it too early or too late for me to get on the Vassillis 4 MVP bandwagon?

You watch the game and you count the assists yourself. Is this really that hard? Don't tell me none of you knows how to score a basketball game using NBA rules?

[Alyosha12]

L_4_L, you don't know when to quit... my entire post was supporting your argument--something you would've realized had you taken the time to THINK BEFORE POSTING PLEASE! But no, you had to go cherry-picking data and got called out by Alyosha12.

The NBA is, by literal definition, more lenient in regard to assists than FIBA. I don't think anyone informed in the matter would argue against that. However, doing something as crude as tripling or quadrupling assist totals for NBA translations because of Jose Calderon shows a misunderstanding of statistical relevance. Hollinger's Assist Ratio is relevant because it takes pace into account. He figures out the stats of EUROLEAGUE players and multiplies it by 31% to get the projected NBA translation.

There is no metric for establishing FIBA stats to the NBA. If you watched the game and counted, by NBA definition, 14 assists, then kudos to you and Papaloukas. If you looked at the box score though and saw 7 assists and decided to double it (what I believe you did), then you're doing it wrong.

exactly! L4L read this part again.

[Lakers_4_Life]

L_4_L, you don't know when to quit... my entire post was supporting your argument--something you would've realized had you taken the time to THINK BEFORE POSTING PLEASE! But no, you had to go cherry-picking data and got called out by Alyosha12.

The NBA is, by literal definition, more lenient in regard to assists than FIBA. I don't think anyone informed in the matter would argue against that. However, doing something as crude as tripling or quadrupling assist totals for NBA translations because of Jose Calderon shows a misunderstanding of statistical relevance. Hollinger's Assist Ratio is relevant because it takes pace into account. He figures out the stats of EUROLEAGUE players and multiplies it by 31% to get the projected NBA translation.

There is no metric for establishing FIBA stats to the NBA. If you watched the game and counted, by NBA definition, 14 assists, then kudos to you and Papaloukas. If you looked at the box score though and saw 7 assists and decided to double it (what I believe you did), then you're doing it wrong.

I watched the game and counted. No one can be serious if they believe this 31% crap from Hollinger and he's a joke if he believes that himself.

This is not logical, you have to count each assist as the NBA would not just say "31% difference" that's just plain wrong. So yes I counted the assists.

Let me give an example, I went back and looked at Greece vs. USA in 2006. They counted 12 assists for Papaloukas and I counted 16 NBA assists. So there would be the same percentage Hollinger asserts in THAT case.

HOWEVER Spanoulis was recorded with 1 assist in the game and he completed 6 NBA assists in the game. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Hollinger is absolutely full of it.

[Alyosha12]

Euroleague and FIBA assists are the same exact thing. They are scored the same exact way.

And anyone believing it is really just a mere 31% difference doesn't know anything about the stats. Hollinger is full of crap completely if he really believes that.

Jose Calderon NBA

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/jose_cald ... stats.html

NBA career 25.0 MPG 6.1 APG

last season NBA 30.3 MPG 8.3 APG

Jose Calderon FIBA 2007

2007 European Championship FIBA international competition with Spanish national team

http://www.eurobasket2007.org/en/cid_Bq ... D_362.html

24.9 MPG 2.6 APG

Jose Calderon's last season of Euroleague 2005

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/p ... code=E2004

26.9 MPG 2.6 APG

Forgive me for thinking (obviously VERY wrongly) that on realgm.com posters might actually have the most basic of basketball knowledge. I won't make that mistake again as I now realize very few here know even the most common of things about the game.

Udrih 25mins per game in Euroleague 3 assists, 32mins per game in Sactown 4 assists.
Ginobili 28mins per game in euroleague 3 assists 30mins per game in the NBA 4.5assists
Delfino 30mins in the Euroleague 2 assists 23mins in the NBA almost 2 assists.
Navarro 28mins in the Euroleague 3 assists 25mins in the NBA 2 assists.

Should i go on?

Can someone PLEASE bring some basketball knowledge? How little do you guys know about the game? Udrih shooting point guard in a point guard body, Manu SG. Delfino SG, Navrro SG.

You do NOT look at assists from FIBA and Euroleague and then the NBA the same way you do for a point guard THINK. PLEASE someone anyone here if you know the game feel free to help anytime.

I advise strongly someone here actually reads the FIBA rule for scoring an assist because you are all really making yourselves look bad. FIBA assists difference would not be that great for non-point guards because of how the rule is written. BUT for point guards it is a HUGE difference. Steve Nash for example, 70% of his NBA assists would NOT be an assist in FIBA.

Udrih? Most of his assists are NOT completely creating away from the basket, creating back away from the goal or in the pick and roll spoon feeding a player. In FIBA those types of assists get taken away almost entirely. 90% of Stockton to Malone is NOT an assist in FIBA.

Does anyone here even have the sense to look at how the rule is written and actually use your brain and apply that to how that would affect a POINT GUARD'S assist stats?

Chris Paul FIBA 23.4 MPG 4.9 APG

NBA 37.6 MPG 11.6 APG


Always great to use NON-point guards to argue how assists are counted. You guys are BRILLIANT and to then laugh about how others don't know what is correct...........

LOL oh so now we are only talking about assists generated by PGs funny how you change the rules mid debate lol.

Oh and i am done talking to you after the line about Udrih being a shoot first PG and really a SG in a PG body haha. Really a PG is 6-3?

I only hope that some Sacramento fan comes in and sets you str8 because i really don't feel like it anymore lol.

[Lakers_4_Life]

Alyosha you love to regale the forum with your European "expertise" basketball knowledge. So far from all your posts I've read though you are a fan boy and don't even give opinions objectively. It's a shame that Europeans post that way on realgm because it really distorts how Americans view European basketball.

[Rasho Brezec]

Alyosha you love to regale the forum with your European "expertise" basketball knowledge. So far from all your posts I've read though you are a fan boy and don't even give opinions objectively. It's a shame that Europeans post that way on realgm because it really distorts how Americans view European basketball.

Pot, meet keetle.

[Lakers_4_Life]

http://www.athens2008.fiba.com/pages/en ... oundID=ALL

Spanoulis leads the tournament in assists with 8 and Papaloukas is second with 7. Like I said, the main difference for the stats is for point guards.

Don't make me compare stat leaders for assists over the years between the NBA (NBA type assists) and the Euroleague (FIBA type assists). Because the credibility of Europeans in this forum is dropping by the post here. And you guys don't even seem to care that like I said what you say is how Americans view European basketball.

[Alyosha12]

Alyosha you love to regale the forum with your European "expertise" basketball knowledge. So far from all your posts I've read though you are a fan boy and don't even give opinions objectively. It's a shame that Europeans post that way on realgm because it really distorts how Americans view European basketball.

Pot, meet keetle.

Oh thats not fair am i really a fanboy ?

I mean ok i hype slo players up a bit thats true but we are a small country someone has to do it

[Walt Cronkite]

I think the only method that really makes sense is to use assists/minute and create a rate between the difference for guys that are in the NBA that have also participated in the most recent FIBA tournaments.

We already have Paul, Calderon, and Nash--how many more do we need? It would still be a crude method of establishing any sort of FIBA:NBA assist translation, but it'd be better than any of the other proposed methods.

[planaria]

I hope Brazil qualify and refuse to allow Nene, Barbosa and Varejao join their Olympic squad. Arrogant, coat-tail-riding mofos. They ought to be playing. What's their excuse?

I want Germany to make it; I love the Nowitzki-Kaman frontline. I hope Canada make it, and I would expect Greece to qualify, though, I'd like to see the Slovenians progress, since they were more than mildly entertaining at Eurobasket '07.

Nenê had cancer this season. I dont have nothing against him for choose to rest this offseason. But the others...

[Ern III]

Nenê had cancer this season. I dont have nothing against him for choose to rest this offseason. But the others...

I apologise as that had inexplicably slipped my mind. However, Nenê did come back and play for the Nuggets toward the end of the regular season and playoffs. Plus, he's made noise about not wanting to represent his country in the past. Though, as you rightly say, he gets a pass to fully recover his health.

Varejao conceivably lost millions of fans with his ridiculous hold-out at the beginning of last NBA season, so you'd think he'd try to atone in some way. If there was any lingering doubt about his selfishness, it's gone now. I guess Nash and the Suns' management had Barbosa's ear when it came to this offseason.


By the way, Coach Monsalve looked 'elegant' last night...

[Ern III]

Looks like Slammin' Sam hasn't taken too well to criticism for bad play. Who would expect that from an NBA player? After his 1-8 performance in Canada's first game, he was nowhere to be seen and without explanation during tonight's must-win game against Korea.

One of the photos from their first game on the Athens tourney's website showed Sam lining up a 20-plus foot jumpshot. That would've been a good place to start the discussion that evidently got out of hand, if I was Coach Rautins.

[asdfgh]

Greece has the strongest team we've had in years.
Getting rid of a couple of slow and unathletic veterans like Hatzivretas, Kakiouzis and to a lesser extent Papadopoulos has been a blessing in disguise. Run and gun baby!

[Apollo64]

Can't wait to see the Splitter/Kaman matchup come Friday. I don't think Brazil has much of a chance against Germany, because they don't seem to me capable of stopping Nowitzki, but it should be an interesting game.

Btw Splitter seems to me more than ready to play in the NBA, he had a terrific game against Greece today, too bad his contract won't allow that to happen during the next few years.