The Tale Of Two Philosophies

Post #1 » by **BigSlam** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 6:37 pm

MJ said in the Observer a year ago that a team should be made up of a super star who has a supporting cast to be successful.

He even went as far as using that reasoning when he soaked up all of our cap room on Swish comparing Swish and Crash to him and Pipen.

LB is totally different wanting a team that is made up of several options and no true star. That is what he has effectively done by trading away our "star" for role players.

We are about to come a pretty boring, methodical team that will probably rarely score over 100 points in a game with any one player pouring in the points but rather we'll be a team that scores more like 80-90 points on average with several players scoring between 10-15 points each and hope to shut the other team down to get our wins.

So I guess time will tell which philosophy will win out and is the better bath to the promised land - the star method or the shared method - but one things for sure, us unexciting as we were to watch before, we have just become almost unbearable (IMO).

NashtyNas · Post #2 » by **NashtyNas** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 6:45 pm

The Pistons under Larry Brown. The Spurs under Popovich. Boring to watch, but won games. You're wrong that No one will score 20-22PPG. I can see Crash going easily for 22PPG now, and EO50 for atleast 16-12-2blocks.

Elwren · Post #3 » by **Elwren** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 6:57 pm

I'm really not sure what you are talking about. J-Rich was good but he was far from making our team really exciting to watch. Now we can start using Ammo/Carrol more and I believe they can fill J-Rich's shoes (albeit not completely). I'm not saying the trade was a God-send but it was obvious that a change was needed...

Also, I actually enjoy watching every game of the Bobcats and I think the recent changes with our players will only add to the excitement.

StutterStep · Post #4 » by **StutterStep** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 7:11 pm

sd1306 wrote:The Pistons under Larry Brown. The Spurs under Popovich. Boring to watch, but won games. You're wrong that No one will score 20-22PPG. I can see Crash going easily for 22PPG now, and EO50 for atleast 16-12-2blocks.

Spurs? See Tim Duncan.

Pistons players were at their peak (because of Carlisle) and totally under-rated: Billups, Hamilton, Prince, Sheed were all players with major college hype and experience... To this day many wonder how Prince slipped so low in the draft. Watching him nail 3's in the SEC, I thought he would go Top 10.

Not saying you always need a superstar but I liked the combo of JRich/GWallace to go with Okafor/DJ or Felton... all you really needed was another dedicated big... and to take the kid gloves off the offense. You'd been close in many recent games, compared to how the season started.

Post #5 » by **BigSlam** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 8:38 pm

Elwren wrote:Now we can start using Ammo/Carrol more and I believe they can fill J-Rich's shoes (albeit not completely).

It's going to be very hard for them to do that from the bench and in spot mins.

Post #6 » by **BigSlam** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 8:41 pm

sd1306 wrote:The Pistons under Larry Brown. The Spurs under Popovich. Boring to watch, but won games. You're wrong that No one will score 20-22PPG. I can see Crash going easily for 22PPG now, and EO50 for atleast 16-12-2blocks.

I hope you are right - on both counts (the winning games and the evolution of Crash and EO50 in this new system), of course if we are looking to trade Crash as hard as we are rumored to be doing then he wont be here to score 20-22 a game - and if we trade him it really puts a full point on any exciting style of play we had or at least had the potential of having.

667Club · Post #7 » by **667Club** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 9:01 pm

Yes BigSlam. Actually I think you generally need a Superstar (or more) to win a title but it's way easier to put together a good team when you have a great defensive coach with players who know their roles. Bad teams are usually run like a one man show.

Post #8 » by **Paydro70** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 9:29 pm

There's really no question you need a superstar... nobody outside of the Pistons has won a title without a 24 PER player in almost 20 years (if you allow for the Isaiah Thomas Pistons, it's actually more like 30 years).

It's certainly possible to compete, and a few teams have made the finals without a superstar type (The 99-00 Pacers, the 98-99 Knicks, Kidd's Nets were at least not a conventional superstar team), but you need to have like 4 guys at the 17 PER level or so who fit together really well, plus some good depth.

I agree that Crash probably tops 20ppg, but I think this might be the third straight year in which his FG% drops, as his usage climbs for the fourth straight year. It's pretty clear he can't shoulder as much of the offensive load as he's being given and stay efficient, but JRich's shots have to go somewhere.

In theory, at least, this team could be built upon the framework of the clockwork non-superstar squad, but it depends on a couple things: 1) Okafor must become good for at least 16ppg. 2) Wallace has to stay efficient while scoring 20ppg. 3) DJ has to keep up his scoring while cutting his turnovers. 4) Diaw has to return to 05-06 Diaw. 5) The team's defense has to really gel into an elite unit, because even with all those things, we're probably at best the 10th or so offense.

I would say #3 is the most likely thing to happen, but five is the most critical by far, and depends on the guys gotten in trade working out. If all of these DO occur, that would position us with probably one 18-19 PER player in Okafor, another three 17 PER players in Diaw/Wallace/Augustin, and with sufficient defense. If we solidify the bench, that's a contending squad.

But that's a lot of things to do, and I'm not sure the odds on any of them besides DJ being over 50%.