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GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST

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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#501 » by TheKingofSting » Thu Nov 27, 2014 11:39 pm

I think it is time to trade Big Al, see if anyone will take Henderson and move on from there.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#502 » by Braggins » Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:12 am

Flip Murray wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:I refuse to side with Lance against Clifford until I see him playing solid defense. I'll gladly take Henderson over Lance on defense right now.

His crappy defense is totally on him.


Yeah I've been a lance defender but you're totally right in this respect. This dude has stop taking plays off on defense.

I'm not disagreeing or defending his defense being lazy at time but our supposed best player takes more plays off on defense than anyone on the team and is never held accountable. I think it might be hard for Cliff to get through to Lance on this issue when our main player who should be leading by example can't give a good effort for more than 3 quarters. It sets a bad example and precedent for everyone else and kind of invalidates Clifford's punishment. I fear that if Al doesn't get his stuff together and there continues to be this double standard that Cliff could lose this team.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#503 » by TheKingofSting » Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:17 am

Lance also takes some bad shots.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#504 » by yosemiteben » Fri Nov 28, 2014 1:01 am

When Lance can hit 50% of his shots then he can complain about not getting PT like Al.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#505 » by KembaWalker » Fri Nov 28, 2014 1:11 am

yosemiteben wrote:When Lance can hit 50% of his shots then he can complain about not getting PT like Al.


Clifford doesn't care about FG% and he sure as hell doesn't value good attitude or intensity, we've all seen that plain and obvious with MKG getting benched his whole time here. I don't really understand what he values. He has his favorites that get to play even when they are trash like Gary Neal last year, Maxiell this year.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#506 » by yosemiteben » Fri Nov 28, 2014 2:20 am

KembaWalker wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:When Lance can hit 50% of his shots then he can complain about not getting PT like Al.


Clifford doesn't care about FG% and he sure as hell doesn't value good attitude or intensity, we've all seen that plain and obvious with MKG getting benched his whole time here. I don't really understand what he values. He has his favorites that get to play even when they are trash like Gary Neal last year, Maxiell this year.

My point is Lance is not contributing more than the occasional PNR on either side of the floor.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#507 » by Liver_Pooty » Fri Nov 28, 2014 2:26 am

yosemiteben wrote:
KembaWalker wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:When Lance can hit 50% of his shots then he can complain about not getting PT like Al.


Clifford doesn't care about FG% and he sure as hell doesn't value good attitude or intensity, we've all seen that plain and obvious with MKG getting benched his whole time here. I don't really understand what he values. He has his favorites that get to play even when they are trash like Gary Neal last year, Maxiell this year.

My point is Lance is not contributing more than the occasional PNR on either side of the floor.


As I think you have said plenty of times its his defense that is bothersome. I can live with his shooting as long as he was to play elite defense, and right now its not even close. Its been pathetic. Instead of playing in those pro am games non stop which is basically nothing more than a glorified YMCA game he should have been working on his game this past off season
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#508 » by Braggins » Fri Nov 28, 2014 3:38 am

Liver_Pooty wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:
KembaWalker wrote:
Clifford doesn't care about FG% and he sure as hell doesn't value good attitude or intensity, we've all seen that plain and obvious with MKG getting benched his whole time here. I don't really understand what he values. He has his favorites that get to play even when they are trash like Gary Neal last year, Maxiell this year.

My point is Lance is not contributing more than the occasional PNR on either side of the floor.


As I think you have said plenty of times its his defense that is bothersome. I can live with his shooting as long as he was to play elite defense, and right now its not even close. Its been pathetic. Instead of playing in those pro am games non stop which is basically nothing more than a glorified YMCA game he should have been working on his game this past off season

You can live with Al's defense but not Lance's?
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#509 » by Braggins » Fri Nov 28, 2014 3:44 am

yosemiteben wrote:When Lance can hit 50% of his shots then he can complain about not getting PT like Al.

Hitting 50% of your shots by itself makes a player valuable? Statistically, our offense is considerably worse when he is in the game and our defense is wayyy worse. Our offense is slightly better when Lance is on the court and our defense is considerably better. I don't know how anyone can make any argument for Al having a positive effect on our team. It is obvious that isn't the case just from watching the games and the statistics back it up. It has been night and day the last couple games. Al leaves the game and we go on a run and get a lead and Al comes back in the game and we look horrible and lose. I don't really understand how anyone could defend Al's play at this point. His effort has been completely unacceptable as well. He has been one of our absolute worst players thus far.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#510 » by Liver_Pooty » Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:24 am

Braggins wrote:
Liver_Pooty wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:My point is Lance is not contributing more than the occasional PNR on either side of the floor.


As I think you have said plenty of times its his defense that is bothersome. I can live with his shooting as long as he was to play elite defense, and right now its not even close. Its been pathetic. Instead of playing in those pro am games non stop which is basically nothing more than a glorified YMCA game he should have been working on his game this past off season

You can live with Al's defense but not Lance's?


Al can hit shots. Lance cant.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#511 » by Braggins » Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:27 am

Liver_Pooty wrote:
Braggins wrote:
Liver_Pooty wrote:
As I think you have said plenty of times its his defense that is bothersome. I can live with his shooting as long as he was to play elite defense, and right now its not even close. Its been pathetic. Instead of playing in those pro am games non stop which is basically nothing more than a glorified YMCA game he should have been working on his game this past off season

You can live with Al's defense but not Lance's?


Al can hit shots. Lance cant.

Our offense is worse when Al is on the court. It is better with Lance.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#512 » by yosemiteben » Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:44 am

Braggins wrote:
Liver_Pooty wrote:
Braggins wrote:You can live with Al's defense but not Lance's?


Al can hit shots. Lance cant.

Our offense is worse when Al is on the court. It is better with Lance.

If you're using 82games than per 100 possessions our offense is 0.3 points better with Lance on the court. The flip side is that taking him out has virtually no impact on our offense.

And comparing Al to Lance head to head ignores the fact that Lance gets more time with Cody, who is killing it in the net ratings department. So Al pretty much has to generate all his offense, while Lance when he's running with the second unit gets the benefit of Neal and Cody, both of whom have proven to be better offensively than any option on our first line.

I am about ready to concede defeat on my defense of Marvin. I think the potential is there for him to be a more impactful player given his shooting percentages, but good lord his net ratings are terrible.

Honestly, if we are going for our most logical starting lineup, I think we should go with running Kemba - Gary - Lance - Cody - Al for long stretches. Our bench would be BAD, but that team can at least be an excellent offensive team while helping Al along on defense.
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Re: GT: Blazers @ Hornets Wed Nov 26th 7PM EST 

Post#513 » by Braggins » Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:00 am

yosemiteben wrote:
Braggins wrote:
Liver_Pooty wrote:
Al can hit shots. Lance cant.

Our offense is worse when Al is on the court. It is better with Lance.

If you're using 82games than per 100 possessions our offense is 0.3 points better with Lance on the court. The flip side is that taking him out has virtually no impact on our offense.

And comparing Al to Lance head to head ignores the fact that Lance gets more time with Cody, who is killing it in the net ratings department. So Al pretty much has to generate all his offense, while Lance when he's running with the second unit gets the benefit of Neal and Cody, both of whom have proven to be better offensively than any option on our first line.

I am about ready to concede defeat on my defense of Marvin. I think the potential is there for him to be a more impactful player given his shooting percentages, but good lord his net ratings are terrible.

Yeah, it was a stretch to say it is "better" but I was mainly meaning to point out that he has been better for our offense than Al. Al plays most of his minutes with our best play-makers in Lance and Kemba and sees plenty of time with Neal. His offense is almost all isolation anyways so I don't think the lineup has much effect on him which is why I think his scoring and efficiency are basically exactly what you would expect. I think a good offense is possible with Al just not if we play like we did for the first 3/4 of the season. Lance's oncourt/offcourt defensive statistics do benefit from playing with the second unit a lot but that is specifically because Al isn't in the game.

Marvin does some nice things but he just seems like clearly a backup SF/PF and not a starting anything. Although, I have actually started to wonder why we don't start him at SF with MKG out and start Cody at PF. This would give us better defense to help Al without losing Marvin's shooting. I wonder how well Marv can defend the perimeter at this point compared to Hendo.

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