ImageImage

2020 Pre-Draft Discussion

Moderators: yosemiteben, BigSlam, JDR720, Diop, fatlever

User avatar
James Gatz
Veteran
Posts: 2,727
And1: 693
Joined: Mar 12, 2012

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1301 » by James Gatz » Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:48 pm

DY_nasty wrote:
But oh LaMelo Ball? That's different.



Disagree on some points above, but appreciate you laying out your argument!

Off-ball is definitely a concern if you don't think he's capable of being a primary initiator. For me, I don't see his value unless he constantly has the ball in his hands.

We're in a pretty large disagreement about his handle in traffic. For me, it's easily the best in this class. This is evidenced by his incredibly low ast:to rate. There's one play where he gets doubled after beating his initial man and has an amazing beyond the back pass in a crowded paint for an easy lay in. I'm pretty sure it's in the Schmitz vid.

I'm also in some disagreement about his "ugly floater." His floater is sort of wild with the range he's able to shoot it from and the touch he's able to put on it. Considering his form will prevent him from ever having a true midrange shot, he'll have to develop it more. Definitely a swing skill for him.

Lack of sample size is a fair criticism. 12 games is not a ton. It's clearly more than Wiseman, but I won't go there.

For me his negatives include:
- Lack of strength when it comes to finishing
- Shot Selection, especially when he takes some of those awful deep off the dribble 3s.
- Lack of interest in on ball defense/how often he gambles


At this point it'll be a "we'll see" scenario. I don't think there will be much convincing the other about Lamelo takes at this point!

Part of the bummer of the draft being pushed back again is how kinda boring it is to obsess over the same prospects.
LofJ
RealGM
Posts: 12,297
And1: 10,474
Joined: Mar 29, 2014
   

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1302 » by LofJ » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:14 pm

I still think someone is going to trade up with the Warriors to select LaMelo, and that Edwards is likely going number 1. So Mitch is going to choose among Wiseman, Avdija, and Hayes if we stay at 3 (which I'm confident we will).
User avatar
MasterIchiro
RealGM
Posts: 18,147
And1: 5,301
Joined: Jan 18, 2013
Location: The Dirty Water
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1303 » by MasterIchiro » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:34 pm

LofJ wrote:I still think someone is going to trade up with the Warriors to select LaMelo, and that Edwards is likely going number 1. So Mitch is going to choose among Wiseman, Avdija, and Hayes if we stay at 3 (which I'm confident we will).


And by someone, you mean the Knickerbockers.
It has been written...
User avatar
James Gatz
Veteran
Posts: 2,727
And1: 693
Joined: Mar 12, 2012

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1304 » by James Gatz » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:50 pm

If Ball falls to 3 I'd happily trade down to 8 and try to get Okongwu/Hayes if we think they would fall.
UNCNYC
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,356
And1: 868
Joined: Jun 09, 2014
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1305 » by UNCNYC » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:00 pm

I HOPE we trade to 8. If so I would take either

Tyrell Terry, Killian Hayes or Devin Vassell.

Knicks are such a bad run franchise. They are in a great spot at 8 and one of those guys should be available. I think they should pick Malichi Flynn. He has the game and personality for New York. Their draft should be pick 1 Devin Vassell and if they have a 2nd rounder choose Flynn
UPDATED 2-18-2024



These are my top five for who I want with pick #1 in order



BuB Carrington
Ryan Dunn
Dalton Knect
Kevin McCullar
Bobi Klintman
spankymoore7
Rookie
Posts: 1,152
And1: 324
Joined: Apr 23, 2010

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1306 » by spankymoore7 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:23 pm

LofJ wrote:I still think someone is going to trade up with the Warriors to select LaMelo, and that Edwards is likely going number 1. So Mitch is going to choose among Wiseman, Avdija, and Hayes if we stay at 3 (which I'm confident we will).


I'd be very happy with Avdija or Hayes. Wiseman would be bad
UNCNYC
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,356
And1: 868
Joined: Jun 09, 2014
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1307 » by UNCNYC » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:00 pm

I can't put into words how happy I would be on draft day if we got any of these players and Isaiah Joe with pick 32 and best available pick 56

Killian Hayes
Tyrell Terry
LaMelo Ball

Especially if we draft Hayes and Joe man

New lineup

Hayes / Martin
Joe / Monk / and maybe get to invite Ty'shon alexander or Karim Mane if they go undrafted to camp
Miles / Martin
PJ / McDaneils
Zeller / Rashaun Hammonds, Reggie Perry etc... from the draft

Then trade Graham and Rozier before we have to resign them
UPDATED 2-18-2024



These are my top five for who I want with pick #1 in order



BuB Carrington
Ryan Dunn
Dalton Knect
Kevin McCullar
Bobi Klintman
User avatar
MasterIchiro
RealGM
Posts: 18,147
And1: 5,301
Joined: Jan 18, 2013
Location: The Dirty Water
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1308 » by MasterIchiro » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:28 pm

spankymoore7 wrote:
LofJ wrote:I still think someone is going to trade up with the Warriors to select LaMelo, and that Edwards is likely going number 1. So Mitch is going to choose among Wiseman, Avdija, and Hayes if we stay at 3 (which I'm confident we will).


I'd be very happy with Avdija or Hayes. Wiseman would be bad


I believe we're either getting Avdija or dealing Ball to the Knicks if Warriors take Avdija.

But if I can't get the Knicks 2021 1st on top of pick 8, I'm taking Toppin and letting Ball fall to the Bulls. I really consider pick 8 third tier and pick 3 first tier. Knicks get a chance at a (granted boom-or-bust) star but we don't? I don't think so.

Yes I like Toppin more than Ball. Ball is a 3 year project, minimum. Toppin will win ROY if not Avdija.

Hopefully the Warriors work out a deal with the Knicks for Ball so we can just take Avdija. But if the Knicks won't give up a 2021 1st to the Warriors, GS should take Avdija.
It has been written...
spankymoore7
Rookie
Posts: 1,152
And1: 324
Joined: Apr 23, 2010

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1309 » by spankymoore7 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:57 pm

MasterIchiro wrote:
spankymoore7 wrote:
LofJ wrote:I still think someone is going to trade up with the Warriors to select LaMelo, and that Edwards is likely going number 1. So Mitch is going to choose among Wiseman, Avdija, and Hayes if we stay at 3 (which I'm confident we will).


I'd be very happy with Avdija or Hayes. Wiseman would be bad


I believe we're either getting Avdija or dealing Ball to the Knicks if Warriors take Avdija.

But if I can't get the Knicks 2021 1st on top of pick 8, I'm taking Toppin and letting Ball fall to the Bulls. I really consider pick 8 third tier and pick 3 first tier. Knicks get a chance at a (granted boom-or-bust) star but we don't? I don't think so.

Yes I like Toppin more than Ball. Ball is a 3 year project, minimum. Toppin will win ROY if not Avdija.

Hopefully the Warriors work out a deal with the Knicks for Ball so we can just take Avdija. But if the Knicks won't give up a 2021 1st to the Warriors, GS should take Avdija.


I'm not big on Toppin because the track record for 22 year old lottery picks isn't good. Also, I get BPA, but taking a power forward in the lottery for the third year seems like a mistake
User avatar
MasterIchiro
RealGM
Posts: 18,147
And1: 5,301
Joined: Jan 18, 2013
Location: The Dirty Water
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1310 » by MasterIchiro » Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:08 pm

spankymoore7 wrote:
MasterIchiro wrote:
spankymoore7 wrote:
I'd be very happy with Avdija or Hayes. Wiseman would be bad


I believe we're either getting Avdija or dealing Ball to the Knicks if Warriors take Avdija.

But if I can't get the Knicks 2021 1st on top of pick 8, I'm taking Toppin and letting Ball fall to the Bulls. I really consider pick 8 third tier and pick 3 first tier. Knicks get a chance at a (granted boom-or-bust) star but we don't? I don't think so.

Yes I like Toppin more than Ball. Ball is a 3 year project, minimum. Toppin will win ROY if not Avdija.

Hopefully the Warriors work out a deal with the Knicks for Ball so we can just take Avdija. But if the Knicks won't give up a 2021 1st to the Warriors, GS should take Avdija.


I'm not big on Toppin because the track record for 22 year old lottery picks isn't good. Also, I get BPA, but taking a power forward in the lottery for the third year seems like a mistake


Forget I imagined a scenario with the Knicks and Warriors unable to forge a deal. I just saw a proposal in the trade forum that sparked an idea where Knicks and Warriors find common ground and it gave me hope Avdija will be there.

Knicks in
Pick 2 (Lamelo Ball)
Andrew Wiggins absorb into cap

Knicks leverage cap to keep their 2021 pick. Knicks get a potential star but so can GS potentially with the space.

Warriors in
Pick 8
Mitchell Robinson
Cap space

Warriors get an NBA-proven center for matchups plus a rotation player with 8. Or they could package their TPE with pick 8 for a win-now player or play the 2021 free agent market. Let's say TPE + 8 for Oubre + 10.

Warriors could roll out Curry - Thompson - Oubre - Draymond - M. Robinson

+ Paschall on the bench with pick 10.
It has been written...
spankymoore7
Rookie
Posts: 1,152
And1: 324
Joined: Apr 23, 2010

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1311 » by spankymoore7 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:20 pm

MasterIchiro wrote:
spankymoore7 wrote:
MasterIchiro wrote:
I believe we're either getting Avdija or dealing Ball to the Knicks if Warriors take Avdija.

But if I can't get the Knicks 2021 1st on top of pick 8, I'm taking Toppin and letting Ball fall to the Bulls. I really consider pick 8 third tier and pick 3 first tier. Knicks get a chance at a (granted boom-or-bust) star but we don't? I don't think so.

Yes I like Toppin more than Ball. Ball is a 3 year project, minimum. Toppin will win ROY if not Avdija.

Hopefully the Warriors work out a deal with the Knicks for Ball so we can just take Avdija. But if the Knicks won't give up a 2021 1st to the Warriors, GS should take Avdija.


I'm not big on Toppin because the track record for 22 year old lottery picks isn't good. Also, I get BPA, but taking a power forward in the lottery for the third year seems like a mistake


Forget I imagined a scenario with the Knicks and Warriors unable to forge a deal. I just saw a proposal in the trade forum that sparked an idea where Knicks and Warriors find common ground and it gave me hope Avdija will be there.

Knicks in
Pick 2 (Lamelo Ball)
Andrew Wiggins absorb into cap

Knicks leverage cap to keep their 2021 pick. Knicks get a potential star but so can GS potentially with the space.

Warriors in
Pick 8
Mitchell Robinson
Cap space

Warriors get an NBA-proven center for matchups plus a rotation player with 8. Or they could package their TPE with pick 8 for a win-now player or play the 2021 free agent market. Let's say TPE + 8 for Oubre + 10.

Warriors could roll out Curry - Thompson - Oubre - Draymond - M. Robinson

+ Paschall on the bench with pick 10.


Would be great for GS
User avatar
MasterIchiro
RealGM
Posts: 18,147
And1: 5,301
Joined: Jan 18, 2013
Location: The Dirty Water
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1312 » by MasterIchiro » Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:33 pm

spankymoore7 wrote:
MasterIchiro wrote:
spankymoore7 wrote:
I'm not big on Toppin because the track record for 22 year old lottery picks isn't good. Also, I get BPA, but taking a power forward in the lottery for the third year seems like a mistake


Forget I imagined a scenario with the Knicks and Warriors unable to forge a deal. I just saw a proposal in the trade forum that sparked an idea where Knicks and Warriors find common ground and it gave me hope Avdija will be there.

Knicks in
Pick 2 (Lamelo Ball)
Andrew Wiggins absorb into cap

Knicks leverage cap to keep their 2021 pick. Knicks get a potential star but so can GS potentially with the space.

Warriors in
Pick 8
Mitchell Robinson
Cap space

Warriors get an NBA-proven center for matchups plus a rotation player with 8. Or they could package their TPE with pick 8 for a win-now player or play the 2021 free agent market. Let's say TPE + 8 for Oubre + 10.

Warriors could roll out Curry - Thompson - Oubre - Draymond - M. Robinson

+ Paschall on the bench with pick 10.


Would be great for GS


True, but they hold the top asset in the deal. Knicks get to keep 2021 1st + Mavs 2021 + Mavs 2023 + Clippers 2020. That's 4 prospects to add while they develop Ball + Barrett and shed Wiggins over the next 3 years. Ball really needs 3 years. Thibs coached vets Wiggins and Gibson with the Wolves. So they know the drill.
It has been written...
User avatar
PerkinsFor3
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,833
And1: 1,973
Joined: Nov 10, 2004
Contact:

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1313 » by PerkinsFor3 » Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:42 am

Knicks arent giving up Mitchell Robinson that easy. Especially not with Thibs in town.
User avatar
Snidely FC
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,903
And1: 3,121
Joined: Jan 19, 2011
Location: Asheville, NC

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1314 » by Snidely FC » Fri Sep 25, 2020 1:58 pm

BigSlam wrote:I guess our big board will eventually show out, but...

Who are posters lower on: Ball or Edwards?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm gonna go lower on Edwards here. His upside is clear he could be a physically powerful explosive star guard and I could be way off base but what I worry about with Edwards is as an alpha dog even if he puts up numbers individually he may hurt the rest of what is a young team by playing hero ball and indifferent defense. LaMelo is a playmaking and ballhandling savant, I know the shooting is a concern, but at least I know LaMelo is going to make everyone around him better with his passing and playmaking.
Vanderbilt_Grad
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,018
And1: 1,771
Joined: Sep 22, 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1315 » by Vanderbilt_Grad » Fri Sep 25, 2020 2:37 pm

If you want to talk about hurting his team, LaMelo's shooting has got to be discussed. It's not just his form, but he tries to be Steph or Trae and toss up 3s off the dribble way early in the shot clock. That would be fine if he could shoot like them, but he can't. Snidely, you mentioned guys "who can just play" in another post. I'm not convinced that Edwards or Ball are that.
My picks:
2020 Draft (3rd pick) - Tyrese Haliburton, Devin Vassell, or Onyeka Okongwu
2021 Draft (11th pick) - Moses Moody
Rays Pompadour
Senior
Posts: 570
And1: 418
Joined: Jul 08, 2018
     

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1316 » by Rays Pompadour » Fri Sep 25, 2020 2:42 pm

PerkinsFor3 wrote:Knicks arent giving up Mitchell Robinson that easy. Especially not with Thibs in town.


I'm not sure NY will continue so blatantly into incompetence. I hear the chatter they're jonesing after Ball, with the thought of teams in the top 3 ready to take advantage of NY's desire for the player. Ball is a nice talent, but he's not worth the capital needed to move from 8 to, say, 2.
UNCNYC
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,356
And1: 868
Joined: Jun 09, 2014
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1317 » by UNCNYC » Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:18 pm

As of late I have been taking more interest in Jay Scrubb. I have made up my mind on who I want us to take with pick 3 and 32. The last player I go back and forth with is who is there at 56. As of now it's scrubb. I now have insurance if Joe isn't there at 32 because I would take Scrubb. Unless someone major falls.

PICK 3 - Tyrell Terry, Killian Hayes

PICK 32 - Isaiah Joe, Jay Scrubb

PICKL 56 - LaMar Stevens, CJ Elleby, Ty'shon Alexander, Karim Mane

I doubt Scrubb Falls there but if so I prolly would take him.

UPDATED 2-18-2024



These are my top five for who I want with pick #1 in order



BuB Carrington
Ryan Dunn
Dalton Knect
Kevin McCullar
Bobi Klintman
LofJ
RealGM
Posts: 12,297
And1: 10,474
Joined: Mar 29, 2014
   

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1318 » by LofJ » Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:21 pm

If your last name is Scrubb and you make it to the NBA you have won at life.
UNCNYC
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,356
And1: 868
Joined: Jun 09, 2014
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1319 » by UNCNYC » Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:41 pm

LofJ wrote:If your last name is Scrubb and you make it to the NBA you have won at life.


Lmao, I always think of that when I see his name. He is a big risk pick along with Karim Mane but I am a super risky drafter lol.

It could end up being

PICK 3 - Tyrell Terry

PICK 32 - Jay Scrubb (if isaiah Joe is gone)

PICK 56 - Karim Mane

bout as risky as it gets lol
UPDATED 2-18-2024



These are my top five for who I want with pick #1 in order



BuB Carrington
Ryan Dunn
Dalton Knect
Kevin McCullar
Bobi Klintman
UNCNYC
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,356
And1: 868
Joined: Jun 09, 2014
       

Re: 2020 Draft Discussion 

Post#1320 » by UNCNYC » Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:48 pm

LofJ wrote:If your last name is Scrubb and you make it to the NBA you have won at life.


Actually you are right on that because I am sure he's heared

He shoots the *Jay*, and he *Misses*, what a *Scrubb* at some point. I want to draft him just for that lol. I LOVE an underdog. I wish him luck. I think he has a bright future if given a chance
UPDATED 2-18-2024



These are my top five for who I want with pick #1 in order



BuB Carrington
Ryan Dunn
Dalton Knect
Kevin McCullar
Bobi Klintman

Return to Charlotte Hornets