The Trade Thread

[lmcguir5]

^^Agreed. Bargnani is one of the Raps best scorers, and Colangelo is already under a lot of fire, he would be committing career suicide if he traded Bargnani for TT. I wouldn't even entertain that idea because it's so unlikely.

[penquin11]

If Colangelo could get rid of Bargnani and free up Ed Davis + Amir Johnson from the bench it would work miracles for that team. Ed Davis has consistently been a beast this year, but he never gets PT, not to mention that Bargs has been cold lately. Even if Colangelo is a terrible GM, he is't terrible enough to pick up TT for Bargs, or for anyone really.

Now that stated I think that TT is a great match for the Wizards who are clearly in need of another imature idiot to restore order to their franchise.

[Kembastockton]

There is no reason to think that Tyrus is an immature idiot or any like that. He just isn't a very good basketball player. That doesn't make him the ideal canidate for a Hot boyz video.

[SWedd523]

There is no reason to think that Tyrus is an immature idiot or any like that. He just isn't a very good basketball player. That doesn't make him the ideal canidate for a Hot boyz video.

Getting in a physical altercation with his coach and threatening people in the stands gives me plenty of reason to think he's an immature idiot. I'm sure there are other stupid things he's done but I honestly try to forget about him as much as possible

[lmcguir5]

Even if Colangelo were to hypothetically trade Bargnani for TT, does Bargnani really fit our team that well? Does Bargnani fit any team that well for that matter? He is a big who does no rebounding and can score, but if he goes cold, the game goes to all hell. I am in no way saying that I prefer TT to Bargnani, I'm simply saying I don't like either for our team.

[HornetJail]

How do you guys feel about this:

Hendo, Reggie, 2014 2nd round pick
for
Derrick Williams and one of Josh Howard/Lou Amundson/Malcolm Lee

[doc.end]

I would pass. There can be a solid argument that cap space is more valueable than Derrcik Williams under contract.

[Kembastockton]

I would pass. There can be a solid argument that cap space is more valueable than Derrcik Williams under contract.

Especially since there are likely at least two players in the lottery this summer with a similar skillset. With the way the two have played so far Derrick would be a down grade in talent, so why would we trade our most versitile player, and expiring contract, and a pick for D and filler. Cha_77_Bobcats, I understand that you really like Derrick, but that is not a good trade.

[HornetJail]

We shouldn't be drafting a SF/PF in the draft. We should be drafting a center. There are a lot of lotto-caliber centers in this draft. I will be shocked if we don't pick up one of them.

The point about cap space is invalid unless you think we're just going to let Henderson expire and not re-sign him (we don't need to lose more talent this way, for real). Otherwise, he's probably going to make more than D-Will over the following two years.

There's a reason he was picked 2nd overall, which is because he is really, really good. He hasn't been getting minutes in Minnesota because he plays the same position as Kevin Love. He needs a change of scenery. Players with potential who are in his situation should be a our top targets. He's not a small forward (which is a big reason why he sucked last year, because they were playing him out of position), and he fills a huge need for us.

[Kembastockton]

We shouldn't be drafting a SF/PF in the draft. We should be drafting a center. There are a lot of lotto-caliber centers in this draft. I will be shocked if we don't pick up one of them.

Cho's MOO is to pick the best player available, and trade for need. He has said so already. That is why he picked JT at 31 after already taking MKG. Also ask yourself if we don't need to pick a 3/4 in the draft why do we need to trade our most versatile player for one?

The point about cap space is invalid unless you think we're just going to let Henderson expire and not re-sign him (we don't need to lose more talent this way, for real). Otherwise, he's probably going to make more than D-Will over the following two years.

Hendo is not going to walk. He will resign reasonably. He should make more than DWill. He's a better player.

There's a reason he was picked 2nd overall, which is because he is really, really good. He hasn't been getting minutes in Minnesota because he plays the same position as Kevin Love. He needs a change of scenery. Players with potential who are in his situation should be a our top targets. He's not a small forward (which is a big reason why he sucked last year, because they were playing him out of position), and he fills a huge need for us.

You can make excuses for DWill all you like, but you said it your self he is a 3/4 not just a 4. Even with Beasley's departure he hasn't earned consistent minutes. He should be making the most of the minutes he receives like James Harden did in Oklahoma. DWill is an okay player, but he is a tweener. He may develop one day, or he may be the next Ed Obannon. Nothing is guarunteed. Okafor was a number two pick as well. As were Darko Milic, Hasheem Thabeet, and Marvin Williams. We need a consistent low post presence. Derrick is not one. Understand I am not saying that I would not trade for Derrick. I would, but not Hendo and a pick, let alone an expiring contract too. That is to much to pay for potential. You trade for sure things. You draft potential.

[chrbal]

I'm thinking that we won't draft a Center unless its an absolute can't miss. I'm thinking that they'll make due with a Center by committee approach. Biyombo is still young, Haywood is putting up pretty good numbers, and Mullens just needs a shooting coach. I can think of many teams that would be happy with that group.

[HornetJail]

Would you trade a jumpshot-less shooting guard who's about to get paid for Williams? That's essentially what's we're giving up here. I added the future 2nd round pick (should be around 40-45, right?) as a small sweetener and I added the rest to balance out the salaries.

If we had signed Hendo to an extension before the season, I wouldn't be trying to trade him, but there are some stupid ass GMs in the league and you can't blame Hendo, who's been stuck here on a rock-bottom team the last couple years, if he signs for as much money as he can with another team. Let's let another team worry about what happens Henderson becomes the next player to sign a Derozan-like deal to a team with a (Please Use More Appropriate Word) GM.

That being said, this shouldn't lower his value, and we shouldn't trade him for anything less than we would otherwise, but I really think we should pursue this option.

[doc.end]

We shouldn't be drafting a SF/PF in the draft. We should be drafting a center. There are a lot of lotto-caliber centers in this draft. I will be shocked if we don't pick up one of them.

The point about cap space is invalid unless you think we're just going to let Henderson expire and not re-sign him (we don't need to lose more talent this way, for real). Otherwise, he's probably going to make more than D-Will over the following two years.

There's a reason he was picked 2nd overall, which is because he is really, really good. He hasn't been getting minutes in Minnesota because he plays the same position as Kevin Love. He needs a change of scenery. Players with potential who are in his situation should be a our top targets. He's not a small forward (which is a big reason why he sucked last year, because they were playing him out of position), and he fills a huge need for us.

I had typed a note about how draft positon is overrated in NBA (more among fans, most among hype bandwagons) but backspaced it from my previous post.

I am for trading Henderson and Reggie as we have to decide what to do with them - whether we should keep them, for how much, how is that realistic on open market, will they get any offers and for how much and whether they could be more valueable as trading chips, considering their expiring contracts and whether they could bring us value more advantageous for long term futurre.

It is better to get some value rather just to let them expire and walk free. But if we couldn't do that (like with DJ) it is just a missed oportunity. Better no deal than bad deal.

What would be a good deal? As we are under the cap team with probable lottery picks in upcoming years, we have ways to get players thru draft and thru free agency not being dependable on other ways like (nearú luxury tax teams like OKC or Brooklyn. If we were, getting someone like Williams as a better fit for expiring contracts (of valueable players) would be great move (assuming he can play). But as we are not dependable on it, we have a choice who to have signed by that 4-5M. And I value sttaying flexible and have that choice in the offseason more. Reaching for someone in a deal like that would make sense if such a player would be underpaid and couldn't be get on open market or with potential to break out (very subjective) on rookie deal not up to extension - buy low. I can't see how second pick overall, hyped before the draft (so no Thabeet), in his sophomore season would match that description. On theory, yes, he would be good gamble but his value around the league is probably still high and his rookie scale contract is not that low either.

Some could argue that us not having a decent backup PF is a good thing and with D.Williams we would score a few more meaningless wins. I put it here for thought,

I don't agree with drafting for need (and PF it is rather than C) and no we don't need C, now, we need to have a good C when competing. And ho we get there is not that that important in fact being flexinble and keeping options open should be beneficial in that. It is better than be invested in something with a qustionable chance of success. Draft BPA rather than a need for sure.

Speaking of the trade, it is like this:
- having players re-signed
- having D.Will instead
- sign BPA with that space
- save money/save money till a trade rewuiring us having a cap space emerges
Which option is better?

Sending a pick away on top of that is not what we should aim for (it could be worth another Mullens or Taylor).

[thesneakysneak]

So I just saw that both Mullens and Henderson have Arn Tellem as their agent. Looks like the odds for them both getting paid above market value is pretty high. Interestingly it looks like the last player Tellem struck out on for a good deal was our very own D.J Augustin. In saying that, I'd be happy to see both Hendo and Mullens go for the right pieces. There is still such a dire need for efficient perimeter scoring and a low post player.

[JMAC3]

I am so Tired of being abused at the four position every single night. (cough cough Mullens)

here are two trades

Charlotte gets Markeiff Morris and Kendall Marshall
Phoenix gets Gerald Henderson and Byron Mullens

why: we get a decent post player in Morris who is young with a solid midrange shot. Marshall gives us a big third point guard who has decent potential and makes Sessions expendable if right deal came up. Also, Hendo gone keeps JT development moving and we pawn Mullens off. Also, we avoid having to pay these guys in the offseason.


Charlotte gets Carlos Boozer, our first rounder back and second rounder.
Chicago gets Tyrus Thomas, Gerald Henderson and Mullens

why: We get Boozer to be our big man until we draft a decent potential guy. We dump TT, and avoid paying Henderson and Mully. Added bonus dont have to worry about losing our pick. Chicago gets out of Boozer contract with a half as bad contract in TT. Also, get two expiring guys with chance to sign them later.

[Diop]

Boozer's defence is Mullenesque.

Are we ready to give up on Mullens yet???

[JMAC3]

I am so Tired of being abused at the four position every single night. (cough cough Mullens)

here are two trades

Charlotte gets Markeiff Morris and Kendall Marshall
Phoenix gets Gerald Henderson and Byron Mullens

why: we get a decent post player in Morris who is young with a solid midrange shot. Marshall gives us a big third point guard who has decent potential and makes Sessions expendable if right deal came up. Also, Hendo gone keeps JT development moving and we pawn Mullens off. Also, we avoid having to pay these guys in the offseason.


Charlotte gets Carlos Boozer, our first rounder back and second rounder.
Chicago gets Tyrus Thomas, Gerald Henderson and Mullens

why: We get Boozer to be our big man until we draft a decent potential guy. We dump TT, and avoid paying Henderson and Mully. Added bonus dont have to worry about losing our pick. Chicago gets out of Boozer contract with a half as bad contract in TT. Also, get two expiring guys with chance to sign them later.

Obviously I like the Phoenix trade better for us, but I dont think Chicago trade is horrible either. Boozer would be a much better player on our roster then Mullens. If Boozer was given minutes here I think his offense would be 18 and 8. He has to be better defensively then Mullens.

Are you forgetting we have to pay both Mully and Henderson. I would expect Henderson to get at least 6-8 million per year. Mully will be vastly overpayed by somebody and I would rather it not be us.

[mrknowitall215]

Boozer's defence is Mullenesque.

Are we ready to give up on Mullens yet???

Boozer's defense is even worst than Mullens, and a whole lot more frustrating to watch. Even though Boozer is the better overall player right now, Mullens has the upside that this young developing 'Cats team is looking for. Boozer is on his last leg, might retire within 3 years, and has one of the worst contracts left in the new CBA

[shrink]

As a MIN fan, I would have my doubts that Kahn would make a deal around Williams for Henderson, and they are loaded with second round picks right now, so that wouldn't tip the deal into the "yes" column.

I understand that some could argue that Williams is not worth the cap space, but I think it comes down to how quickly someone would give up on him. In a rookie season, we look for players to show some flashes of ability, and Williams does that with his athleticism - amidst a sea of mediocrity. However, this is Year Two for Williams. Do we write him off now, or cling to the idea that last year's strike, no training camp, and the more complicated Adelman offense makes this year his rookie season? I see it both ways.

The other issue that needs to be considered is personal prestige. Kahn did try to trade the #2 pick many times before the draft, but when it came down to it - he picked that guy. If he takes pennies on the dollar (which Henerson - who you might not even re-sign, certainly is), it makes him look worse than saying, "let's just wait and see." Now, he's gotten burned doing that last year with Wes Johnson, but Williams doesn't even have 82 games under his belt yet.

I think if you see Williams traded, it would be combined with Roy's now-expiring, or Ridnour/Barea, and bring back a good vet that's probably overpaid. At RealGM, where we watch players value, we may realize Kahn is still losing out - but it'd be a fan-friendly move that helps him get his contract extended when it's up at the end of the season.

[HornetJail]

Would Ben Grdon paired with something else (possibly the future 1st we have from Portland) interest you at all for D-Will? We can take back Roy's contract or something as well.