We Are Stuck With Him - The Lance Stephenson Thread II

[BeesWax]

Lance has been trash but I don't blame his signing as a bad thing. It was a last ditch effort to make something out of our free agency after the mediocre signings of Marv and Roberts. That's why I won't quip on Lance as much as I do Marv and Roberts. Signing Lance was a desperate measure worth trying.

I'm not sure but I do think that we signed Lance before we acquired Marv and Roberts.

We agreed to terms with Marv on 7/12, Roberts on 7/13, and then Lance on 7/16. We offered Hayward the max contract sheet on 7/9.

So it was not a reactionary signing as they all happened about the same time. Like I said everything was within a weeks time. They were most likely talking to Lance before either the other two came to terms.

[BlackOutBuzz]

They had tied up all their money into Hayward, so once Utah matched it was a domino effect.

[catch20two]

I'm not sure but I do think that we signed Lance before we acquired Marv and Roberts.

We agreed to terms with Marv on 7/12, Roberts on 7/13, and then Lance on 7/16. We offered Hayward the max contract sheet on 7/9.

So it was not a reactionary signing as they all happened about the same time. Like I said everything was within a weeks time. They were most likely talking to Lance before either the other two came to terms.

A lot change in a single day once free agency start. It's not typical timing. Players are signing with teams faster than flies are dropping. We only ended up with Lance because Bosh turned down Houston and Dallas jumped on Chandler Parsons. The dominoes fell so that we had no choice but to sign Stephenson or go into the season with a more lackluster free agency than we already had.

Everyone that was at least serviceable was signed within a week. After that it was just the 15th man types like Maxiell and the RFAs that nobody wanted to touch to waste their time like Monroe and Reggie.

[Diop]

to me its Cliff saying that they really shouldn't have signed Lance for the role they expected, which was a 2 guard who could come in an be an immediate upgrade at 2 guard. Someone who could really take a load on offence. Lance isn't good enough to deliver what they hoped for their "star signing"

Lance is a poor mans MKG. I'm sure 99% of Indiana fans would prefer having MKG over Lance.

I would like to ask what 2 guard for the role was still available by the time we decided to go after Lance? Cho obviously didn't want Lance but he exhausted all of his options wasting time on Hayward which I thought was a bad move unless he had another trick up his sleeve because everyone knew Utah would match so Cho don't get off the hook for going after a restricted player. They're called restricted free agents for a reason.

i dont know why you're getting salty with me. i agree there were no obvious big name upgrades available.
i was just adding a different interpretation to Cliffords quotes compared to MI's version of "Lance is ok, its not his or my fault the rest of the team is crap"

[catch20two]

to me its Cliff saying that they really shouldn't have signed Lance for the role they expected, which was a 2 guard who could come in an be an immediate upgrade at 2 guard. Someone who could really take a load on offence. Lance isn't good enough to deliver what they hoped for their "star signing"

Lance is a poor mans MKG. I'm sure 99% of Indiana fans would prefer having MKG over Lance.

I would like to ask what 2 guard for the role was still available by the time we decided to go after Lance? Cho obviously didn't want Lance but he exhausted all of his options wasting time on Hayward which I thought was a bad move unless he had another trick up his sleeve because everyone knew Utah would match so Cho don't get off the hook for going after a restricted player. They're called restricted free agents for a reason.

i dont know why you're getting salty with me. i agree they're were no obvious big name upgrades available.
i was just adding a different interpretation to Cliffords quotes compared to MI's version of "Lance is ok, its not his or my fault the rest of the team is crap"

I wasn't getting salty with you. It was more of a continuation on what you were saying with my added frustrations.

[LamarMatic7]

Lance has been trash but I don't blame his signing as a bad thing. It was a last ditch effort to make something out of our free agency after the mediocre signings of Marv and Roberts. That's why I won't quip on Lance as much as I do Marv and Roberts. Signing Lance was a desperate measure worth trying.

I'm not sure but I do think that we signed Lance before we acquired Marv and Roberts.

We agreed to terms with Marv on 7/12, Roberts on 7/13, and then Lance on 7/16. We offered Hayward the max contract sheet on 7/9.

Cool. Wasn't sure about how it went down.

[Diop]

ah k, got it.

I think Lance was as much a result of public pressure than anything else.
it did create a lot of buzz at first as people thought he was going to be great here

[catch20two]

Even Anthony Morrow had signed with OKC by July 12th. There wasn't really any options after wasting time on Gordon Hayward and then if I'm not mistaken tryna get in on the Chandler Parsons action before just settling for Lance. I'm not mad at the Lance signing tho. I'm disappointed in everything that happened before it.

[Braggins]

I feel like it's obvious that Lance and Al cancel out each other's strengths. Lance is the opposite of a floor spacer and is most successful in PNR and drive and dish situations where he has an empty lane. Is it just totally insane to want to move Lance into the starting lineup for Hendo when Biz comes back?

I would honestly probably try this. Hendo isn't giving us what we need regardless and Lance has been playing good enough D lately imo. He's also been moving the ball. I'm all for trying to do something to get Lance playing well. We need Lance to play well for this team to have a shot of making any noise.

[Braggins]

Even Anthony Morrow had signed with OKC by July 12th. There wasn't really any options after wasting time on Gordon Hayward and then if I'm not mistaken tryna get in on the Chandler Parsons action before just settling for Lance. I'm not mad at the Lance signing tho. I'm disappointed in everything that happened before it.

I think we should have resigned Tolliver and pushed hard to sign Morrow and Mo Williams. Tolliver is way better than Marv as a backup stretch 4 for like 1/7 the price. Morrow and Williams are perfect fits and both have a connection to our franchise with Mo being best friends with Al and Morrow is from Charlotte. If our team this season was Kemba, Lance, MKG, Zeller, Biz with Al, Morrow, Tolliver, Hendo, Vonleh, coming off the bench, we would be better and have more cap space. Who knows, maybe Lance doesn't mentally implode if the season doesn't start out so poorly.

[Diop]

I still doubt Morrow was leaving OKC.
I guess Marv was seen as a definite starter seeing he had started pretty much for all of his career before coming here.

I agree, after missing out on Hayward (who I still think was our best option at the time) we should have just signed small pieces like Tolliver (there are a few mediocre shooting forwards around eg villanueva), a decent shooter (maybe CDR) and gone after Mo.

But I swear the uproar what have been huge if some other team signed Lance for that contract and we didn't even make an attempt.
Especially if he went somewhere that fits him and he was performing. The Cho hate would be insane.

[catch20two]

Even Anthony Morrow had signed with OKC by July 12th. There wasn't really any options after wasting time on Gordon Hayward and then if I'm not mistaken tryna get in on the Chandler Parsons action before just settling for Lance. I'm not mad at the Lance signing tho. I'm disappointed in everything that happened before it.

I think we should have resigned Tolliver and pushed hard to sign Morrow and Mo Williams. Tolliver is way better than Marv as a backup stretch 4 for like 1/7 the price. Morrow and Williams are perfect fits and both have a connection to our franchise with Mo being best friends with Al and Morrow is from Charlotte. If our team this season was Kemba, Lance, MKG, Zeller, Biz with Al, Morrow, Tolliver, Hendo, Vonleh, coming off the bench, we would be better and have more cap space. Who knows, maybe Lance doesn't mentally implode if the season doesn't start out so poorly.

I can agree with that. I was on record for not liking the 2014 free agency options much where I woulda been cool with just upgrading the backup PG position with Vasquez/Livingston/MoWill and just returning CDR and Tolliver to 1 year guaranteed contracts.

[catch20two]

I still doubt Morrow was leaving OKC.

Morrow was on the Pelicans.

But I swear the uproar what have been huge if some other team signed Lance for that contract and we didn't even make an attempt.
Especially if he went somewhere that fits him and he was performing. The Cho hate would be insane.

Yes it woulda been. We had to do something. Still don't regret the Lance signing. It was a necessary evil after Cho blundered.

[Diop]

I still doubt Morrow was leaving OKC.

Morrow was on the Pelicans.

still think he would have preferred there than here.

[Liver_Pooty]

I for one was entirely thrilled with the Lance signing for one main reason, and thats the defensive pairing he could have been alongside MKG. His defense has picked up lately, but the first half of the season he looked completely out of shape and couldn't guard a dead carcass. Thats what has really disappointed me.

[catch20two]

I still doubt Morrow was leaving OKC.

Morrow was on the Pelicans.

still think he would have preferred there than here.

I think the hometown thing woulda intrigued him. Prolly woulda started too over Hendo. I didn't even see anywhere where we were interested that I can remember or I might have missed it.

[Braggins]

Even Anthony Morrow had signed with OKC by July 12th. There wasn't really any options after wasting time on Gordon Hayward and then if I'm not mistaken tryna get in on the Chandler Parsons action before just settling for Lance. I'm not mad at the Lance signing tho. I'm disappointed in everything that happened before it.

I think we should have resigned Tolliver and pushed hard to sign Morrow and Mo Williams. Tolliver is way better than Marv as a backup stretch 4 for like 1/7 the price. Morrow and Williams are perfect fits and both have a connection to our franchise with Mo being best friends with Al and Morrow is from Charlotte. If our team this season was Kemba, Lance, MKG, Zeller, Biz with Al, Morrow, Tolliver, Hendo, Vonleh, coming off the bench, we would be better and have more cap space. Who knows, maybe Lance doesn't mentally implode if the season doesn't start out so poorly.

I can agree with that. I was on record for not liking the 2014 free agency options much where I woulda been cool with just upgrading the backup PG position with Vasquez/Livingston/MoWill and just returning CDR and Tolliver to 1 year guaranteed contracts.

Forgot about CDR. I would have liked to resign him as well and literally cut Gary Neal.

I'm also pretty sure we never showed any interest in Morrow. I have no idea why we wouldn't have, but we didn't.

[TheKingofSting]

I bet Cliff cried when Neal got traded.

[Diop]

actually Neal's probably the reason we didn't chase Morrow

Neal did start the season well before crumbling into a dung heap

[yosemiteben]

Neal shot 40% from three post all star last season, which was right at his career average. It's some serious revisionist history to act like we should have that about waiving him.