Signed By Indiana - The Jeremy Lamb Thread

[Diop]

Bonnell is a (Please Use More Appropriate Word)

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

Trading Lamb would be a mistake. He's one of three guys on the team that I'm really bullish about. But I also sense that Cliff never really was a Lamb fan and if the team commits to Cliff then yeah - sacrificial lamb indeed.

[catch20two]

Trading Lamb would be a mistake. He's one of three guys on the team that I'm really bullish about. But I also sense that Cliff never really was a Lamb fan and if the team commits to Cliff then yeah - sacrificial lamb indeed.

Huge mistake. The odds are unlikely to find a player 25 and under with Lamb’s scoring production and bargain contract. The Wizards are paying max dollars to Otto Porter for similar production, and ditto us to Batum.

[Rich4114]

If Lamb can be used to move Batum/MKG/Frank/Zeller then so be it. But to just send him off to save cap room would be a mistake. Have to gain something more than just cap space for a guy who clearly has value and likely more value than his current salary compared to other players.

[Diop]

Surely frank and Zeller wouldn’t be difficult to move, Batum is the only contract I see as really unmoveable.

Which is why I was contemplating trading him for Noah for his smaller contract

[Liver_Pooty]

I am completely whole heartedly against moving Zeller.

[Diop]

I am completely whole heartedly against moving Zeller.

I agree, Zellar is great for this team and fits the current nba as a glue guy, supporting centre.

He would look brilliant on one of the champion contesting squads. Imagine him creating room for curry and co?

[yosemiteben]

Let's assume we keep Lamb, which I think is highly likely.

Let's hear some thoughts on how you would use him next season. If he starts, talk about what the second unit rotation is. If he is coming off the bench, what is the preferred starting group?

[catch20two]

Starting or not Lamb needs to be playing 30 minutes per game. We have that luxury and flexibility with Batum in the lineup being able to play 4 positions from PG to PF but we don’t have the right coach to use our versatility to our advantage. I could beat a dead horse into a purée that smell like manure going on and on about Clifford but I’ll stay on topic.

Although unlikely I think honesty the very best way to utilize this roster would be to make Batum the starting PF as a stretch 4 that can play the “McBob role” and I’ve said that earlier in the season before he returned from injury. Batum isn’t a SG in the modern NBA because of a few reasons, (1) he’s pass-first (2) he’s too slow and lazy to defend most of these quicker wings (3) he’s not much of a playmaker off the dribble whether penetrating to dish or slashing to the rim to score (4) he’s below average in PnR as a ball handler (5) he never really was a SG to begin with.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

Doesn't really matter to me in the abstract if Lamb starts, but the numbers are clear ... when he and Kemba play together the team as a whole does better. So the sensible thing to do is to maximize their minutes on the floor with each other.

Should mention that the same post as Kemba - Lamb - MKG as the most effective 3 man unit. Surprised me a bit. I've been wanting to bench or trade MKG for a while now.

[yosemiteben]

That surprises me too VG.

Not sure what I am more concerned about, how are we going to make our bench not suck or how are we going to figure out how to close out games. Both are major, major issues that need to be resolved if we want to improve next season.

I still don't think Batum is the issue, I think MKG is. I mean Batum was an issue pre-ASB given his post-injury performance, but it's time we had a perimeter scoring threat on the wing.

[catch20two]

Doesn't really matter to me in the abstract if Lamb starts, but the numbers are clear ... when he and Kemba play together the team as a whole does better. So the sensible thing to do is to maximize their minutes on the floor with each other.

Should mention that the same post as Kemba - Lamb - MKG as the most effective 3 man unit. Surprised me a bit. I've been wanting to bench or trade MKG for a while now.

Lamb-MKG together has by a wide margin been our most successful 2-man unit that has played together at least 200 minutes followed by Lamb-Kemba and Lamb-Dwight.

[catch20two]

That surprises me too VG.

Not sure what I am more concerned about, how are we going to make our bench not suck or how are we going to figure out how to close out games. Both are major, major issues that need to be resolved if we want to improve next season.

The best way to help your bench is for the starters to build enough of a cushion for them not to put your team in a hole. This is the reason why starters start and in most normal circumstances are the best players on the team. Virtually every team has drop-off when their bench comes into the game. What successful head coaches nowadays have learned to do is stagger a couple starters into the second unit to minimize the damage.

Clifford is too old-fashioned and incompetent to understand this concept. From game to game we watch teams use this strategy against us. Just last night we had a 5-man bench in the game while Anthony Davis wreaked havoc on us. The Pelicans took AD out at the 5-minute mark of the 1st quarter and brought him right back in at the 1-minute mark. Before you know it we were down by 10 points. Sad day in basketball as a fan when you’re coach get outcoached by Gentry.

Only a select few teams have a bench that’s functional enough to maintain and build on leads and that is the Warriors, Rockets, and Raptors among a couple others.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

That surprises me too VG.

Not sure what I am more concerned about, how are we going to make our bench not suck or how are we going to figure out how to close out games. Both are major, major issues that need to be resolved if we want to improve next season.

I still don't think Batum is the issue, I think MKG is. I mean Batum was an issue pre-ASB given his post-injury performance, but it's time we had a perimeter scoring threat on the wing.

There are a lot of ways this could be approached. As a seasonal metric this may indicate how badly Batum played when hurt. Or this may simply indicate who Kemba has the best chemistry with.

There are some possible negative spins on this as well. This may indicate guys that Kemba doesn't trust to make shots or move the ball such that he gets it back if they aren't open (and could be related to the team's lack of passing). This latter is why I posted in the Kemba thread to start with. As the team's best player Kemba is going to have a huge impact on any kind of 2/3/5 man lineup rating.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

I'll also add that on the subject of Batum, I still think that he's an OK player, but his role on the team is to make the other guys better, not Kemba. He was specifically brought in to help guys like Cody or later Dwight in ways that someone (either Cliff or Cho or both) didn't think Kemba could.

[yosemiteben]

I don't really buy the idea that having a **** bench is fine and we should just focus on building a bigger lead with the starters.

I think MKG has to play with a spacing center. I also honestly don't feel great about starting Cody just because at this point I assume he's going to miss a big chunk of games, so I'm not sure how MKG fits in the rotation moving forward.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

I don't really buy the idea that having a **** bench is fine and we should just focus on building a bigger lead with the starters.

Detroit agrees with you.

[catch20two]

But it would mean that someone made an argument other than criticizing Lamb and just saying *insert scrub here* is a better fit though, which was my point.

I would have loved to start Lamb over MKG, but the bench + MKG would have been even worse than it already was offensively. I don't think moving Batum to the bench would have been a good solution either.

It wasn't "Lamb sucks", it was "our bench sucks and taking Lamb out of it is not a good idea."

My “*insert scrub*” argument is based on the reasoning we gave for Hairston starting over Lamb, Belinelli playing over Lamb, and the sporadic Graham being a better fit than Lamb because he’s a better 3&D player comments I’ve been reading.

I too don’t think moving Batum to the bench is the best solution and that’s why my initial idea earlier in the season was to entertain using him as a stretch 4. But it’s better than what we’ve been doing because the starters function better with Lamb vs Batum because Kemba be needing somebody to help him with the scoring load.

[catch20two]

I don't really buy the idea that having a **** bench is fine and we should just focus on building a bigger lead with the starters.

I think MKG has to play with a spacing center. I also honestly don't feel great about starting Cody just because at this point I assume he's going to miss a big chunk of games, so I'm not sure how MKG fits in the rotation moving forward.

I mean it’s ideal to want to have a good starting unit and a good bench unit but the reality of the matter is to reiterate/repeat myself is that not many teams are reliant on their bench and usually stagger starters into the 2nd unit to minimize the drop-off of having to play their lesser players when their best players need a breather.

MKG does not have to play with a spacing C. That’s how many of you overthink. Cody isn’t a spacing C and we’ve been successful with him in the lineup. But like you said he’s injury-prone and I don’t think age or more wear and tear will help his durability moving forward.

[yosemiteben]

Cody is absolutely a spacing C, his mobility shifts defenses and opens the lane. Didn't mean spacing as in shooting, I meant spacing as in creates space.