The Bismack Biyombo Thread

[Liver_Pooty]

Nooo, he was a project with defensive potential. He wasn't supposed to be Mutumbo or Ben Wallace in 2-3 years, he just has the potential to be which is why we drafted him instead of drafting a low-ceiling college guy which we've done our entire draft history to amazingly terrible results. They swung for a high-risk/high-reward guy b/c the franchise is desperate for a high-reward kind of guy. What's the point of drafting guys like Felton/May/Okafor and missing when you can just as easily miss on a project like Biz?

I'm not going to say that Biz is going to be awesome, nor am I going to say that he's always going to be bad. It's silly to speculate on what kind of butterfly Biz is going to become while he's in his cocoon. That's why I'm tired of this from Bobcat's fans:

10 games pass... OMG, Biz isn't Ben Wallace yet!?!?!
another 10 games... WTF!?! Biz is a bust! He should be DPOY by now!! etc.

Maybe the Bucks should have given up on Larry Sanders after he had his horrible two seasons?

Or better yet Biyombo goes thru a 7-8 game stretch where he averages 10 rebounds and 2 blocks per game and people get back on his bandwagon. Charlotte in general has to be the worst bandwagon sports city in the nation, the Panthers prove this, and the Bobcats are beginning to prove it as well when it comes to individual players.

[James Gatz]

I still love Biz but it's been hard watching him of late. Tonight's game showed that he's not a top 10 Center. I'm not ready to give up but we shouldn't assume he'll live up to that Ben Wallace potential.

[Nanogeek]

Re: Larry Sanders, I'd be thrilled if Biyombo was producing in his second year what Sanders did in his second year. 10.4 pp36m, 9.0 rp36m, 4.3 bp36m, 0.72 WS/48m. But Biyombo is a notch below that - 6.2 pp36m, 9.8 rp36m, 2.4 bp36m, 0.23 WS/48m.

If Biyombo this year was pumping out Sander's numbers last year I'd be as big a fanboy as some others are in this thread for Biyombo. But he's not. And so I'm not. I'm just being realistic. Biyombo is treading water on defense and regressing on offense. Sanders showed real improvement from his first year to his second year and obviously is showing even more improvement this year.

Can anyone produce an example of a player that has produced the numbers Biyombo is producing and has turned out to be a defensive superstar or even a starter level defensive player? Wallace is the closest thing which is why I keep mentioning him as a saving grace. Not because I think Biyombo must either be as good as Wallace or be a failure but because Wallace is the only analogue I can identify AND if Biyombo is going to suck this bad on offensive then he WILL need to be as dominant as Wallace was on defense to justify starter minutes.

[Eoghan]

Biyombo is treading water on defense and regressing on offense.

If you had any eye for basketball you would know that this is irrefutably false. Stop worshiping box scores.

[Elden Payton]

Re: Larry Sanders, I'd be thrilled if Biyombo was producing in his second year what Sanders did in his second year. 10.4 pp36m, 9.0 rp36m, 4.3 bp36m, 0.72 WS/48m. But Biyombo is a notch below that - 6.2 pp36m, 9.8 rp36m, 2.4 bp36m, 0.23 WS/48m.

If Biyombo this year was pumping out Sander's numbers last year I'd be as big a fanboy as some others are in this thread for Biyombo. But he's not. And so I'm not. I'm just being realistic. Biyombo is treading water on defense and regressing on offense. Sanders showed real improvement from his first year to his second year and obviously is showing even more improvement this year.

Can anyone produce an example of a player that has produced the numbers Biyombo is producing and has turned out to be a defensive superstar or even a starter level defensive player? Wallace is the closest thing which is why I keep mentioning him as a saving grace. Not because I think Biyombo must either be as good as Wallace or be a failure but because Wallace is the only analogue I can identify AND if Biyombo is going to suck this bad on offensive then he WILL need to be as dominant as Wallace was on defense to justify starter minutes.

Ignorance is bliss hey, Biyombo in his sophomore season is two years younger than Sanders when he was drafted.

Also for the record this is Sanders THIRD season, his sophomore averages of 3/3 sure are awesome.

[SWedd523]

I'm not one who's willing to assume 12.4 minutes a night is enough of a sample size to extrapolate to per36 production.

[Liver_Pooty]

I'm not one who's willing to assume 12.4 minutes a night is enough of a sample size to extrapolate to per36 production.

Per 36 numbers are stupid unless you're playing 23+ minutes per game in my opinion

[Nanogeek]

Ignorance is bliss hey, Biyombo in his sophomore season is two years younger than Sanders when he was drafted.

Also for the record this is Sanders THIRD season, his sophomore averages of 3/3 sure are awesome.

I know its Sanders' third season. My point was I'd be thrilled if Biyombo was putting up this season (his second) what Sanders was putting up last year (his second).

I don't care about age. I care about production on the court.

[Nanogeek]

I'm not one who's willing to assume 12.4 minutes a night is enough of a sample size to extrapolate to per36 production.

Seems like they were pretty good extrapolations given what Sanders is doing this year.

[Elden Payton]

Ignorance is bliss hey, Biyombo in his sophomore season is two years younger than Sanders when he was drafted.

Also for the record this is Sanders THIRD season, his sophomore averages of 3/3 sure are awesome.

I know its Sanders' third season. My point was I'd be thrilled if Biyombo was putting up this season (his second) what Sanders was putting up last year (his second).

I don't care about age. I care about production on the court.

So 3/3 is what you want Biyombo to get in 12 minutes a game? so his per 36 looks awesome?

Seriously?

Hilarious.

Do you watch basketball or just look at box scores? For someone who sure loves numbers you don't care about age.

[Elden Payton]

I'm not one who's willing to assume 12.4 minutes a night is enough of a sample size to extrapolate to per36 production.

Seems like they were pretty good extrapolations given what Sanders is doing this year.

It's called breaking out and the Bucks fans will be the first to tell you they had no faith in him after his first two seasons.

[Nanogeek]

So 3/3 is what you want Biyombo to get in 12 minutes a game? so his per 36 looks awesome?

Seriously?

Hilarious.

Do you watch basketball or just look at box scores? For someone who sure loves numbers you don't care about age.

You seem confused or you are just trolling and baiting. I will try to describe it in more detail for you. If we could get Sanders production per minute from his second year from Biyombo in his second year I'd be thrilled. And Sanders' production per minute last year is scaling quite well with this year where he's playing as many minutes as Biyombo.

[Elden Payton]

So 3/3 is what you want Biyombo to get in 12 minutes a game? so his per 36 looks awesome?

Seriously?

Hilarious.

Do you watch basketball or just look at box scores? For someone who sure loves numbers you don't care about age.

You seem confused or you are just trolling and baiting. I will try to describe it in more detail for you. If we could get Sanders production per minute from his second year from Biyombo in his second year I'd be thrilled. And Sanders' production per minute last year is scaling quite well with this year where he's playing as many minutes as Biyombo.

You're definitely confused, Biyombo will be in the league for seven seasons before he is Sanders age right now (in his third)

Biyombo has plenty of time to break out and considering his age is much more impressive than Sanders first two seasons in the league, when Sanders was Biyombo's age he was a sophomore in college.

Biyombo right now is better than Sanders was last season, no joke.

[SWedd523]

I'm not one who's willing to assume 12.4 minutes a night is enough of a sample size to extrapolate to per36 production.

Seems like they were pretty good extrapolations given what Sanders is doing this year.

confirmation bias

[Nanogeek]

You're definitely confused, Biyombo will be in the league for seven seasons before he is Sanders age right now (in his third)

Biyombo has plenty of time to break out and considering his age is much more impressive than Sanders first two seasons in the league, when Sanders was Biyombo's age he was a sophomore in college.

Biyombo right now is better than Sanders was last season, no joke.

How is Biyombo "much more impressive" than Sanders was during his first two seasons in the league?

[raleigh]

Biyombo is 2 years away from being what alot of us think he can be. Were going to be God awful during that time span anyway, may as well stick with him.

"Sticking with him" is one thing. Assuming he ever fulfills his potential is quite another thing.

[Nanogeek]

I've said it before and will say it again. I'd be as thrilled as anyone if Biyombo pans out. I'm hopeful but I am also a realist. I don't see much progress. Others do. I hope I'm wrong in my skepticism.

[JMAC3]

You seem confused or you are just trolling and baiting. I will try to describe it in more detail for you. If we could get Sanders production per minute from his second year from Biyombo in his second year I'd be thrilled. And Sanders' production per minute last year is scaling quite well with this year where he's playing as many minutes as Biyombo.

I think you are confused Nanogeek.

Forget about age right now (which matters).

Sanders averaged 4.3 points and 3 rebounds and 1.2 blocks in 14.5 minutes his rookie year.

Sanders averaged 3.6 points and 3.1 rebounds and 1.5 blocks in 12.4 minutes in his second year.

Sanders is averaging 8.9 points and 9.1 rebounds and 3.2 blocks in 26.4 minutes this season.

Biz averaged 5.2 points and 5.8 rebounds and 1.8 blocks in 23.1 minutes in his rookie year.

Biz is averaging 4.4 points and 7.1 rebounds and 1.7 blocks in 25.9 minutes this year.

Biz has better rebounding numbers per 36 then Sanders when you compare their sophomore years. Of course Sanders is averaging more points this year, he plays on a better team, so they score more points then us. Also, his guards are much better play makers then ours and that leads to easy points for Sanders. I do not think Sanders is even that much better then Biyombo now using the eye test.

By the time Biz is 24 he will be miles better then Sanders is now. Sanders wasn't even good enough to see minutes until this season and nobody saw him making the statistical jump he has this season, so I think when you take into account Biz experience and age his jump is more likely.

[catch20two]

If I was a Cho I wouldn't hesitate to draft, trade for, or sign a big to fulfill Biyombo's spot until when and if he ever emerge into a above average quality starting C. This is the NBA. You can't just waste away years hoping a player pan out. That's what the ability to assign players to the D-League is for.

[Eoghan]

If I was a Cho I wouldn't hesitate to draft, trade for, or sign a big to fulfill Biyombo's spot until when and if he ever emerge into a above average quality starting C. This is the NBA. You can't just waste away years hoping a player pan out. That's what the ability to assign players to the D-League is for.

Yeah, that's more than reasonable. We've only got 2 bigs "of the future" in Biz and Mully and it would be foolish to put all our eggs in either's baskets. I don't know why Cho stated last year that he was hesitant of having two developing bigs on the roster in reference to Drummond, we basically start 2 of them and I don't see the harm of bringing another one off the bench.