Big Nick Energy: The Nick Richards Thread

[amcoolio]

I mean is it possible that they passed on Jonas Valanciunas because they didn't want to hurt Mark's feelings?
Just makes no sense to keep adding guards and be like "deuces" to the C position

[fatlever]

Yeah I don't get the narrative that the front office passed on drafting a center or adding a free agent center because they we're concerned about how Mark would interpret that after they had praised him and said he was one of the core building pieces. I think Mark is mature and adult enough to understand that when you miss a year with a pretty scary back injury that a billion dollar franchise has to protect the interests of the team. you can both protect Mark's feelings and continue to believe he is part of the core of the team moving forward while also bringing in some competition for the position.

[yosemiteben]

Just makes no sense to keep adding guards and be like "deuces" to the C position

Can you name any team that has 5 centers on the roster? Because we have 4. I get people might not like our depth, but carrying 5 centers is extreme.

[Diop]

And you know Biz will be fit.

[SWedd523]

Just makes no sense to keep adding guards and be like "deuces" to the C position

Can you name any team that has 5 centers on the roster? Because we have 4. I get people might not like our depth, but carrying 5 centers is extreme.

The quantity is irrelevant. It was a failure to bring in a serious addition at Center this off-season and id wager that you're in a very small minority who hand waves that sentiment

[JustBuzzin]

Shout out to the guy who was saying we should have drafted Edey before the draft.

He got a lot of heat, but he looks like he was right about Edey being good in the NBA.

[yosemiteben]

Just makes no sense to keep adding guards and be like "deuces" to the C position

Can you name any team that has 5 centers on the roster? Because we have 4. I get people might not like our depth, but carrying 5 centers is extreme.

The quantity is irrelevant. It was a failure to bring in a serious addition at Center this off-season and id wager that you're in a very small minority who hand waves that sentiment

Yeah, seems like I'm in the minority but I'm happy with a center depth chart of Mark - Nick - Moussa - Gibson, especially with Tidjane and Grant in the rotation that can play spot 5 minutes. I'm very happy with Moussa's play and I'm apparently much happier with Nick than most on here.

I just don't see a glaring error in how we compiled our center rotation, unless you think our FO should have assumed Mark wouldn't be healthy. I don't feel like that would have been a smart decision.

[Liver_Pooty]

Can you name any team that has 5 centers on the roster? Because we have 4. I get people might not like our depth, but carrying 5 centers is extreme.

The quantity is irrelevant. It was a failure to bring in a serious addition at Center this off-season and id wager that you're in a very small minority who hand waves that sentiment

Yeah, seems like I'm in the minority but I'm happy with a center depth chart of Mark - Nick - Moussa - Gibson, especially with Tidjane and Grant in the rotation that can play spot 5 minutes. I'm very happy with Moussa's play and I'm apparently much happier with Nick than most on here.

I just don't see a glaring error in how we compiled our center rotation, unless you think our FO should have assumed Mark wouldn't be healthy. I don't feel like that would have been a smart decision.

Depends on match ups. Duren got hurt unfortunately or we lose tonight. Gibson plays hard. Diabete plays hard, but man we can't match up with 90 percent of the league at the position without Nick or Mark.

[SWedd523]

unless you think our FO should have assumed Mark wouldn't be healthy.

Yes, that is absolutely how they should have approached the situation.

1. Mark hasn't played organized ball in almost a full calendar year
2. His injury went from a back strain to no updates, no surgery, no activity for that full year
3. apparently did not participate in any team activities leading up to the season
4. he's 7 foot, 250lb coming off an injured back


Any one of those would be cause for an intelligent organization to play risk management and add some help.

They settled on a 39yo mascot who looks visibly gassed after two trips down the floor and had played 40 total games in the past 3 years

I don't feel like that would have been a smart decision.

I think every single box score this season minus the one Nick heater would very clearly say otherwise

[JDR720]

Can you name any team that has 5 centers on the roster? Because we have 4. I get people might not like our depth, but carrying 5 centers is extreme.

The quantity is irrelevant. It was a failure to bring in a serious addition at Center this off-season and id wager that you're in a very small minority who hand waves that sentiment

Yeah, seems like I'm in the minority but I'm happy with a center depth chart of Mark - Nick - Moussa - Gibson, especially with Tidjane and Grant in the rotation that can play spot 5 minutes. I'm very happy with Moussa's play and I'm apparently much happier with Nick than most on here.

I just don't see a glaring error in how we compiled our center rotation, unless you think our FO should have assumed Mark wouldn't be healthy. I don't feel like that would have been a smart decision.

That's a good group... if Mark is healthy. But he isn't and may not be for who knows how long. They should've assumed Mark wouldn't be healthy because he hasn't been healthy. Expecting Mark to be healthy when he's had a bad back for a year is like expecting Melo's ankles to not be sore.


We, effectively, went into the season with one 20+mpg quality center on the roster. And now he's hurt too. Diabate isn't very good and Taj isn't either at his age.

At the very least, when Mark hurt his foot, they should've tried to find another option for extra insurance.

[GoBobs]

I like both Mark and Nick. Injuries are part of the game and that is why I have always felt you need three rotation centers if you can get your hands on them. This will allow you to stagger some of the heavy minutes of the NBA season and get to the playoffs with at least 2 healthy guys most years.

[KembaWalker]

I never got the point of Gibson. We got a "Haslem" when we put Kemba on the bench. we need dudes that are ready to play

granted, I will say that Taj has been playing better than I would have expected in the minutes he can handle

[Snidely FC]

With a little imagination there are guys on G League rosters who could fill the gap during these latest injuries

Moses Brown a name some of you know is on G League contract in Westchester for example

Malik Williams, another example. 6'11, 26, former five star recruit at Louisville, had a cup of coffee with the Raptors, in the Heat's orbit in Sioux Falls. Better positional size than Diabete.

replace Jeffries or Rhoden for example who are surplus to requirements

I'm not talking about any of these guys as the future of the position, but this in-season injury to Richards requires a short term fix why not take a swing at G League rosters

[Bassman]

With a little imagination there are guys on G League rosters who could fill the gap during these latest injuries

Moses Brown a name some of you know is on G League contract in Westchester for example

Malik Williams, another example. 6'11, 26, former five star recruit at Louisville, had a cup of coffee with the Raptors, in the Heat's orbit in Sioux Falls. Better positional size than Diabete.

replace Jeffries or Rhoden for example who are surplus to requirements

I'm not talking about any of these guys as the future of the position, but this in-season injury to Richards requires a short term fix why not take a swing at G League rosters

Good ideas, since any trade option is likely not a good one or would require too many assets going out. At minimum get Giles back in here to take minutes. Diabete was a good get for us but he doesn’t have the size to compete with big 5’s.

[SWedd523]

If nothing else, they should've brought in a real vet to help ease Mark back into action after such a long layoff as opposed to going 0-100 so fast.

They botched it. Nick getting hurt just highlighted the hell out of it.

[yosemiteben]

unless you think our FO should have assumed Mark wouldn't be healthy.

Yes, that is absolutely how they should have approached the situation.

1. Mark hasn't played organized ball in almost a full calendar year
2. His injury went from a back strain to no updates, no surgery, no activity for that full year
3. apparently did not participate in any team activities leading up to the season
4. he's 7 foot, 250lb coming off an injured back


Any one of those would be cause for an intelligent organization to play risk management and add some help.

Obviously the lack of updates was not internal, they clearly knew his medical status and are not similarly situated as the public.

I believe he hurt his foot participating in team activities before training camp, so not sure what you mean by him not participating in team activities.

They settled on a 39yo mascot who looks visibly gassed after two trips down the floor and had played 40 total games in the past 3 years

They also acquired Moussa Diabate, who has looked very competent. Again, name me other teams that carry 5 or even 4 dedicated centers on the roster.

I think every single box score this season minus the one Nick heater would very clearly say otherwise

I guess I just have an outlier position on Nick, I think he has played very well. I would be very interested in seeing someone make a statistical argument as to why he has been an issue.

[SWedd523]

unless you think our FO should have assumed Mark wouldn't be healthy.

Yes, that is absolutely how they should have approached the situation.

1. Mark hasn't played organized ball in almost a full calendar year
2. His injury went from a back strain to no updates, no surgery, no activity for that full year
3. apparently did not participate in any team activities leading up to the season
4. he's 7 foot, 250lb coming off an injured back


Any one of those would be cause for an intelligent organization to play risk management and add some help.

Obviously the lack of updates was not internal, they clearly knew his medical status and are not similarly situated as the public.

I believe he hurt his foot participating in team activities before training camp, so not sure what you mean by him not participating in team activities.

They settled on a 39yo mascot who looks visibly gassed after two trips down the floor and had played 40 total games in the past 3 years

They also acquired Moussa Diabate, who has looked very competent. Again, name me other teams that carry 5 or even 4 dedicated centers on the roster.

I think every single box score this season minus the one Nick heater would very clearly say otherwise

I guess I just have an outlier position on Nick, I think he has played very well. I would be very interested in seeing someone make a statistical argument as to why he has been an issue.

I thought you said they wouldn't lie to the public and had no reason to obfuscate his medical status? Now they have info they aren't sharing?

Regardless of his true health situation, nobody showed or saw any footage of him doing any real basketball activity and he hasn't played NBA games in almost a year. That's fairly indisputable. Don't see how anyone could possibly argue against having some, at least short term, insurance in place.

And again, you keep quoting a quantity as if that matters. They could stock the entire team with clones of Diabetes and it wouldn't make a difference. QUALITY is the operative term here Ben. It's malpractice to consider Taj Gibson and a two way summer tryout as your insurance. They should have signed a real backup.

I've never considered Nick as a backup to be an issue. Nick as a starter being backed up by two victory cigars is an issue. Nick getting hurt and the team running rookie Tiddy at Center is a huge issue.


Even if you take away all reality and pretend we live in a perfect world full of teal and purple rainbows, they are now down both of their NBA level centers. If they didn't start making phone calls immediately when Nick hit the injury list then they are signalling either ineptitude or a tank.

[JMAC3]

Hindsight is 20/20.. of course now it looks terrible that we didn't sign a center.

However, if we paid Jonas Valanciunas 3/30 and Mark and Nick were healthy and Valanciunas was sitting on the bench getting DNPs meanwhile because we did that we didn't sign Josh Green... the complaints would be that we needed more perimeter defense...

Or if we gave Hartenstein 3/90 million instead of paying Miles then the complaint would be we signed another injured guy... at least Miles is healthy and playing for team X...

I think if we want to be optimistic it would be that we have top 10 Draft Capital for trades in the NBA. If we want to be aggressive we can be, it is not like because we didn't draft Clingan or sign JVal there are no other options. We have plenty of bullets to in the chamber and we can fire multiple at center if we really want to win games this year.

[yosemiteben]

I thought you said they wouldn't lie to the public and had no reason to obfuscate his medical status? Now they have info they aren't sharing?

I'm not sure if you're serious, but I have a hard time believing that you expect that the FO and training staff have no more information than the public does. I think it's safe to assume that, given this new medical staff they have dumped money into, they have used that staff to define his treatment protocol, established specific benchmarks for advancing through the protocol, and analyzed his progress in advancing towards those benchmarks. We obviously do not have access to his medical reports, do not know the specific protocols he's operating under, and do not know the benchmarks that are being used and how he is tracking in terms of hitting those benchmarks.

So yeah, there's a ton of information we (correctly) are not privvy to. That's as it should be. We are not being lied to and his medical status is not being hidden. We just don't know the exact protocol being used, because it's not really our business.

Regardless of his true health situation, nobody showed or saw any footage of him doing any real basketball activity and he hasn't played NBA games in almost a year. That's fairly indisputable. Don't see how anyone could possibly argue against having some, at least short term, insurance in place.

I don't understand why the existence or lack of existence of video footage that the team itself produces is relevant to this discussion.

I viewed signing both Moussa and Taj, and having guys like Grant and Miles that can spot fill C minutes in a pinch, as appropriate insurance barring long term injury. I still view that to be the case.

And again, you keep quoting a quantity as if that matters. They could stock the entire team with clones of Diabetes and it wouldn't make a difference. QUALITY is the operative term here Ben. It's malpractice to consider Taj Gibson and a two way summer tryout as your insurance. They should have signed a real backup.

My point is that we have in fact filled 4 roster spots with guys who only play C, and I've emphasized that because folks have seemed to suggest that we should just go sign or trade for another C. Carrying 5 guys on the roster that only are able to play C is some inherently questionable roster management.

As to your quality point, I just fundamentally disagree that our C depth chart is inherently an issue that requires giving up assets to address. Just my view. Again, I'd encourage those that point to this as a major issue with our team to build the statistical argument for why that is a major paint point for this team, because I just don't see it.

ETA: Just to be clear here, I'm not saying people shouldn't be concerned or criticizing any one else's views. I'm just saying I'm not upset / concerned like some other folks are.

[fatlever]

Hindsight is 20/20.. of course now it looks terrible that we didn't sign a center.

However, if we paid Jonas Valanciunas 3/30 and Mark and Nick were healthy and Valanciunas was sitting on the bench getting DNPs meanwhile because we did that we didn't sign Josh Green... the complaints would be that we needed more perimeter defense...

i would assume in that scenario its nick as 3rd string, not jval.
if mark looks healthy, nick is a good asset to flip. if not our rotation is jval/nick/diabate