Super Lintendo: The Jeremy Lin Thread

Vae Victus · Post #1761 » by **Vae Victus** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 5:42 pm

The thing is it looks like he HASNT fixed his flaws at all. Wasnt aggressive looking for his shot when he shoulda been, driving into OBVIOUS traffic, loose handles, and stupid passes. His outside shooting seems to have improved this year, SO TAKE THE GODDAMN OUTSIDE SHOT if the other team is gonna swarm u on penetration. Getting blocked or missing shots suck, but at least there's a CHANCE it goes in, making stupid ass TOs leading to fast breaks otoh are killer.

On the 2nd unit without other ball handlers/facilitators he needs to take charge. Sure ideally it'd be great if he had another ball handler out there to lighten the load or to help with traps, but once he gets a screen he needs to go hard to the rack or make a decisive quick pass even if it doesnt lead to a shot, not this slow ass probing bull that only works on **** teams like the Lakers or something.

kastuul · Post #1762 » by **kastuul** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 5:56 pm

Lin mentioned him and Harden are both ball-dominating PnR players.

When he leads the 2nd unit, he should do some Harden things and takes more shots.

ChokeFasncists · Post #1763 » by **ChokeFasncists** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:03 pm

kastuul wrote:

Sounds like he chose the right team.

tonman · Post #1764 » by **tonman** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:07 pm

Vae Victus wrote:The thing is it looks like he HASNT fixed his flaws at all. Wasnt aggressive looking for his shot when he shoulda been, driving into OBVIOUS traffic, loose handles, and stupid passes. His outside shooting seems to have improved this year, SO TAKE THE GODDAMN OUTSIDE SHOT if the other team is gonna swarm u on penetration. Getting blocked or missing shots suck, but at least there's a CHANCE it goes in, making stupid ass TOs leading to fast breaks otoh are killer.

On the 2nd unit without other ball handlers/facilitators he needs to take charge. Sure ideally it'd be great if he had another ball handler out there to lighten the load or to help with traps, but once he gets a screen he needs to go hard to the rack or make a decisive quick pass even if it doesnt lead to a shot, not this slow ass probing bull that only works on **** teams like the Lakers or something.

You forget his time.with the Lakers was the only time his team.didn't make the playoffs.

So how.many points did you think he would average for the season? I remember a lot of folks believing he would only score 11 to 12 points a game on average. How many did he score yesterday? So now he needs to be the big scorer and shooter? Okay revise average. What do you think his scoring average will be?

And he only committed 3 of the teams 18 turnovers. I guess everyone else gets a pass?

Raydiation · Post #1765 » by **Raydiation** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:17 pm

kastuul wrote:

Good if it is true. I guess his problem in this game was so obvious to see. I am a fan of him and when I was watching his play in 3rd and early 4th, I was thinking I would be mad and sit him if I am the coach. it was very ugly and it is worse than being invisible.

As a lot of people mentioned it is so obvious that he passed up shots those he should've taken. Forced to drive in, pick up the ball and got trapped repeatedly. In preseason he was so confidence that he would have taken those shots even with head in his face. Don't really know what it is last night.

My guess might be that in preseason he played a lot of SG. He would take the shots when he is the SG. When he plays PG he get into the mindset that he has to break down D and setup for teammate. He fake the shot that he should have taken, drive in, got trapped, can't find anybody open and don't know who to pass to. That was really hard to watch. I think during preseason they have a lot more cutting. Yesterday didn't see so much. maybe Hawks D stopped them from doing it.

I agree the other post said. Maybe he should go into Kemba mode when he is with the 2nd unit

Vae Victus · Post #1766 » by **Vae Victus** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:38 pm

When i say works on the Lakers, i meant works against current Laker's level defenses, being complete **** ****, that even indecisive probing play can still work great since the Lakers cant defend crap. So i guess i wasn't clear in that regard. Shoulda switched the word on for against.

Honestly? On this squad (the loss of MKG really increases his mins and role), being primary backup PG when Kemba sits and getting a ton of wing mins as part of a small fast attack lineup, he should be scoring 18 a game no problem playing around 30-34 mins at a 45% FG 38% 3pt 85% FT 6 AST 4 RBs 2 STL 1 BLK clip. Totally doable numbers if he gets his head on right.

He should be launching 4-5 3pters a game and aggressively attacking the rack off of PnR or fast swing passes when a seam opens up (he does that BEAUTIFULLY when the option presents itself). He usually avgs 4 FTs a game so with increased aggression i can see it go up to 6 with increased PnR action. When he plays with Kemba he should aggressively shoot 3s (hence 4-5) to help open up the floor and especially since he's gotten so much better at it that he should shoot it at volume. Also by being more aggressive in shooting outside it'll only open up his inside game as defenders will have to jump out hard on him respecting his shot. When he's the PG he needs to look for the open shot, which alot of times will be him, as defenders will likely stick tight to their man to prevent easy passes, thus if Lin can get a step on his defender he needs to take that shot. When he got his own shot rolling defenders will likely adjust trying to stop him and THATs when the easy dump off passes come into play. Too often he tries to get his passing to open up his own shot when it should be the other way around.

Obviously his handles and decision making are a HUGE issue, but playing with the small fast attack lineup can alleviate those issues and bring out his strengths in outside shooting to the fore.

JohnStockton · Post #1767 » by **JohnStockton** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 8:57 pm

Some of you guys are simplifying Lin's game a bit too much by saying he just needs to shoot more. If it was that easy, he would just do it...

The issue on offense where it concerns Lin is this: Lin is on the 2nd Unit to be a shot creator. His strongest suit is running the PnR. HOWEVER, the rest of the 2nd Unit has ZERO playmakers. This means the defense can (and has been) trapping Lin aggressively on the screen, since nobody else is a threat to create offensively. This forces Lin to pass out of the trap. But once the ball is out of his hands, the rest of the 2nd Unit cannot create any offense on their own, so the play has been broken. Some people complain about, "Lin needs to stop picking up his dribble," but duh, he got trapped. He has to pass out.

The above wasn't as much of an issue in pre-season because teams in pre-season didn't trap this hard... It was pre-season. They didn't care. They care now that games matter.

So shoot more for Lin...? He literally can't if he calls a pick, because he's assured to get trapped. Then if Lin passes, the 2nd Unit doesn't have a great spot up shooter to take advantage of swinging the ball around after an initial trap either, so the Hornets can't make the D pay. They also don't have another offensive playmaker to take advantage of the defensive initial collapse on the perimeter. Therefore, what's left for Lin to be successful, is that he can either bypass calling for the PnR (so he doesn't get trapped), and isolate off of straight dribble drive - or he needs to put with another unit that has at least another playmaker (Ie: Kemba/Lin/Batum lineup).

qiantom · Post #1768 » by **qiantom** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 10:19 pm

Good points. This is why any good lineup in the league now has at least two capable playmakers.

Lin in isolation is below average I would say. Kemba is much better in iso for example. Hornets have to figure out a way to make the 2nd unit successful, maybe by staggering their minutes and making sure that at least two of Kemba/Lin/Batum are almost always on the court.

TinmanZBoy · Post #1769 » by **TinmanZBoy** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 10:31 pm

Lin been playing well at 2, meh at 1

Braggins · Post #1770 » by **Braggins** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 3:42 am

I told you guys being a guard on this team was dreadful. Don't be surprised if Lin has his first sub 40% shooting year.

lin is ok · Post #1771 » by **lin is ok** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 3:42 am

if lin is such a good 2 it's time to bring him into the starters, kemba can extend his minutes and go hero ball with the 2nd unit!

tonman · Post #1772 » by **tonman** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 3:56 am

TinmanZBoy wrote:Lin been playing well at 2, meh at 1

Lin hasn't played much 1 since mkg keep and Lamb got hurt.

tonman · Post #1773 » by **tonman** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 4:05 am

It's just funny now everyone wants Lin to go insanity on everyone. I think Lin can get off more shots but unless it's transition or part of offensive system, it's not the best approach. I am not concerned about shooting percentage. The 6 free throws offset those. It's like the bench is why we are losing and let's ignore everyone else. Yes Lin needs to step it up not because he isn't playing well (bad stretches are normal). But because it is needed for this team to win. This goes for everyone including kemba. We are not Good enough to play average.

Vae Victus · Post #1774 » by **Vae Victus** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 5:44 am

Well naturally as a Lin fan i want him to go all insanity on the league, but i'll settle for him playing well and helping this squad make it to the playoffs. Just watching his usual tentative play is just pissing me off since THIS is the situation he chose to be in. The coach seems to be on his side, his teammates seem to like him and wont freeze him out, so he doesnt have any excuses for weak ass play.

YES he should be hoisting up more shots !!! The whole pump fake drive thing WAS NOT WORKING and he shoulda just sent it up instead of driving into the belly of the beast to get swallowed time and time again. Alot of his stupider TOs can be prevented if he was more looking for his own shot when the opportunity presents itself. Not to mention against an elite swarming quick defense like Atlanta he's not gonna get his usual passing lanes for kicks outs and dumps off and it shoulda been evident before he even CHECKED INTO THE GAME.

Edit: I say start Lin and sit him first for Lamb and have Kemba play with the 2nd unit more and see what happens.

kastuul · Post #1775 » by **kastuul** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 6:24 am

The NBA officials announced their review decision on the foul call at 15sec remaining in the last game, was incorrect.

It could be a steal by Lin. :banghead:

http://official.nba.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/2015/10/L2M-CHA-ATL-10-30-15.pdf

http://official.nba.com/last-two-minute-report/?gameNo=0021500026&eventNum=528

anthoang · Post #1776 » by **anthoang** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 6:26 am

I didn't think Lin had a good game against the Hawks... yet his +/- ratio was a PLUS 3. So when he was in the game, he had a positive effect for the Hornets. as were most of the Hornets players. However, Cody Zeller was a MINUS 27. by far the worse of any Hornet. not sure why this is.

lin is ok · Post #1777 » by **lin is ok** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 12:42 pm

ahhhhh yoooooo..... dang

kastuul wrote:The NBA officials announced their review decision on the foul call at 15sec remaining in the last game, was incorrect.

It could be a steal by Lin.

http://official.nba.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/2015/10/L2M-CHA-ATL-10-30-15.pdf

http://official.nba.com/last-two-minute-report/?gameNo=0021500026&eventNum=528

Roy Tarpley · Post #1778 » by **Roy Tarpley** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 2:50 pm

Lin needs to take what's given to him. If he's open for 20 shots, take 20 shots. If he's trapped, then pass out. Steph Curry just scored 53 points and no one is calling him a ball hog because it's within the flow of the game. There's days where Klay will score 50. If Lin is respected as a scorer, then it'll open up space for other players. I feel like Lin tries to force feed his teammates and then turns it up in the 4th quarter. I understand this mentality but it's counterproductive if it's predictable.

TinmanZBoy · Post #1779 » by **TinmanZBoy** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 5:05 pm

Roy Tarpley wrote:Lin needs to take what's given to him. If he's open for 20 shots, take 20 shots. If he's trapped, then pass out. Steph Curry just scored 53 points and no one is calling him a ball hog because it's within the flow of the game. There's days where Klay will score 50. If Lin is respected as a scorer, then it'll open up space for other players. I feel like Lin tries to force feed his teammates and then turns it up in the 4th quarter. I understand this mentality but it's counterproductive if it's predictable.

if anyone else took the shots Curry took, the guy would be called a chucker with low efficiency...

there is only one Stephen Curry...

Lorenzomax7 · Post #1780 » by **Lorenzomax7** » Sun Nov 1, 2015 6:41 pm

JohnStockton wrote:Some of you guys are simplifying Lin's game a bit too much by saying he just needs to shoot more. If it was that easy, he would just do it...

The issue on offense where it concerns Lin is this: Lin is on the 2nd Unit to be a shot creator. His strongest suit is running the PnR. HOWEVER, the rest of the 2nd Unit has ZERO playmakers. This means the defense can (and has been) trapping Lin aggressively on the screen, since nobody else is a threat to create offensively. This forces Lin to pass out of the trap. But once the ball is out of his hands, the rest of the 2nd Unit cannot create any offense on their own, so the play has been broken. Some people complain about, "Lin needs to stop picking up his dribble," but duh, he got trapped. He has to pass out.

The above wasn't as much of an issue in pre-season because teams in pre-season didn't trap this hard... It was pre-season. They didn't care. They care now that games matter.

So shoot more for Lin...? He literally can't if he calls a pick, because he's assured to get trapped. Then if Lin passes, the 2nd Unit doesn't have a great spot up shooter to take advantage of swinging the ball around after an initial trap either, so the Hornets can't make the D pay. They also don't have another offensive playmaker to take advantage of the defensive initial collapse on the perimeter. Therefore, what's left for Lin to be successful, is that he can either bypass calling for the PnR (so he doesn't get trapped), and isolate off of straight dribble drive - or he needs to put with another unit that has at least another playmaker (Ie: Kemba/Lin/Batum lineup).

CANT AGREE MORE

U want Lin to shoot more? Then bring back that Tyson Chandler for him. Or at least it's Ed Davis or Asik.

Hawks couldn't even set a legal screen w/out fouling and he was too slow moving his ass. Cody was ok but he is not that great as a finisher aka ED or Tyson.