Around the NBA 11

[JDR720]

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[Braggins]

Borrego is interviewing for the Rockets job.

[JMAC3]

Congrats to Monk, but he definitely needed a change of scenery...he had growing up to do during his rookie contract which was unfortunately with us. Same I fear with Kai Jones, who needs 4 more years of seasoning (which won't be with us) to be effective. So why draft that guy.

Because for every 2 guys that need seasoning like this, 5 of them are ready to go day 1.

[LofJ]

Monk to MJ and Clifford:

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[SWedd523]

Monk to MJ and Clifford:

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But why?

He was an immature, bad attitude, do nothing who spent about as much time doing drugs as he did playing good basketball.

[Braggins]

But why?

He was an immature, bad attitude, do nothing who spent about as much time doing drugs as he did playing good basketball.

Specifically, how much time did he spend doing drugs?

[SWedd523]

But why?

He was an immature, bad attitude, do nothing who spent about as much time doing drugs as he did playing good basketball.

Specifically, how much time did he spend doing drugs?

No clue but he sucked when he played in Charlotte and had off the court issues to boot. I don't think it's very difficult to see why he didn't warrant re-signing and I don't think it's difficult to see why people didn't want him around. His finding success after leaving can probably be attributed to a few different things like opportunity, fit, growing up, etc. but that doesn't change the fact that he didn't really show any reason to retain him.

One great game doesn't really change the fact that he's still a roughly league average-ish player. The 10 games before that random 32 point outburst, he averaged 13/4/3 on 46/40/93. Over the entire year he was 14/4/3 on 45/36/89 with significantly more single digit scoring games (27) than 20+ point games (12). It was the first year in his career posting a PER over 15 and a VORP of at least 1.0 (Terry was a 0.8 this year, for comparison, and people are trying to chase him out of town).

So I mean good for him, I guess, but it was absolutely the right call to move on and I don't think they're going to regret it in the short nor long term. The dude they replaced him with is an even bigger bum and folks clown on him even harder. Are you saying they should keep him around too on the off chance he grows out of it and becomes a solid 7th/8th man?

[Braggins]

But why?

He was an immature, bad attitude, do nothing who spent about as much time doing drugs as he did playing good basketball.

Specifically, how much time did he spend doing drugs?

No clue

lol

[Braggins]

Monk was obviously trending in this direction his last season here. Borregos development plan was working and JB and Triano knew how to utilize him.

He doesn't need to be some kind of superstar to be useful. He has a three year sample of averaging 13/3/3 on 59% ts% and 38% from 3pt. This season he was the third offensive creator on one of the best offenses in history and ranked 3rd on the team in assists and 5th in points with a 59% ts%. He was one of the best 6th men in the league.

The front office letting him walk was 100% incorrect. Ya'll were wrong then and are wrong now. Sorry.

[LofJ]

Monk didn't want to be here. I don't blame him, our reputation as being one of the worst run franchises in the league is well earned at this point.

MJ indicating he wants to sell is the best thing to happen to this franchise since the rebrand. I bet Jordan has no clue how beloved Eric Collins and Dell Curry are by the fans that have stuck with the team through everything. If he actually sells I hope the new owner will be notified and take action to keep them together in Charlotte.

[Braggins]

He had a good relationship with Triano and Borrego gave him a fair shot. He said in his postseason interview he was willing to stay, but wanted to play for a team that wanted him. They could have offered him a few million more than the minimum contract he took from LA and gave him the role they inexplicably gifted Oubre, who is a MUCH worse player, and they very likely make the playoffs that season. It still could have worked.

Most peoples opinion at the time was that they shouldn't retain him because he sucks and is a scumbag loser who would never be successful in the league. Lets all get hyped for that big Miles Bridges extension!!

[LofJ]

Monk had a crappy attitude his first several years. It didn't turn around until his last season under JB and Triano. Bouknight has had a similar bad attitude since we drafted him. Just like Monk it's obvious in hindsight that he was expecting to be drafted by another team and was disappointed to be playing in Charlotte.

A kid with their head on straight would pull their heads out of their rears, get over their disappointment, and get to work to prove that they belong on the court. Monk and Bouknight both weren't ready to do that at the start of their careers. I think MJ is a bad owner, but no matter how good your organization is sometimes guys just don't get it and there's nothing you can do.

Monk to his credit has grown up and as a result he will make a lot more money in the coming years. I hope the same thing happens with Bouknight, who is lucky he didn't hurt or kill someone driving intoxicated. That should have been a major wakeup call for him to get his crap together, but who knows some people never do.

[Braggins]

Monk had a crappy attitude his first several years. It didn't turn around until his last season under JB and Triano. Bouknight has had a similar bad attitude since we drafted him. Just like Monk it's obvious in hindsight that he was expecting to be drafted by another team and was disappointed to be playing in Charlotte.

A kid with their head on straight would pull their heads out of their rears, get over their disappointment, and get to work to prove that they belong on the court. Monk and Bouknight both weren't ready to do that at the start of their careers. I think MJ is a bad owner, but no matter how good your organization is sometimes guys just don't get it and there's nothing you can do.

Monk to his credit has grown up and as a result he will make a lot more money in the coming years. I hope the same thing happens with Bouknight, who is lucky he didn't hurt or kill someone driving intoxicated. That should have been a major wakeup call for him to get his crap together, but who knows some people never do.

If he didn't have the year he had in his final season while showing obvious signs of maturing and/or someone else would have offered him a big contract, then I think it would have been much more justified to let him walk. There was still some risk even though he was playing well and trending in the right direction at the time. They invested the development time to help him get his career turned around and ended up getting no benefit out of it for no good reason.

Giving the way things were going and the fact that the only offers he had from other teams were minimum deals, it was inexcusable for them to let one of their more talented players walk at that cost. If they offered Monk a one or two year deal at 3-5 million per season or whatever and he turned it down to go to LA for the minimum, then so be it, but they didn't do that and instead threw more than double the money at Oubre and extended Rozier.

[LofJ]

Monk had a crappy attitude his first several years. It didn't turn around until his last season under JB and Triano. Bouknight has had a similar bad attitude since we drafted him. Just like Monk it's obvious in hindsight that he was expecting to be drafted by another team and was disappointed to be playing in Charlotte.

A kid with their head on straight would pull their heads out of their rears, get over their disappointment, and get to work to prove that they belong on the court. Monk and Bouknight both weren't ready to do that at the start of their careers. I think MJ is a bad owner, but no matter how good your organization is sometimes guys just don't get it and there's nothing you can do.

Monk to his credit has grown up and as a result he will make a lot more money in the coming years. I hope the same thing happens with Bouknight, who is lucky he didn't hurt or kill someone driving intoxicated. That should have been a major wakeup call for him to get his crap together, but who knows some people never do.

If he didn't have the year he had in his final season while showing obvious signs of maturing and/or someone else would have offered him a big contract, then I think it would have been much more justified to let him walk. There was still some risk even though he was playing well and trending in the right direction at the time. They invested the development time to help him get his career turned around and ended up getting no benefit out of it for no good reason.

Giving the way things were going and the fact that the only offers he had from other teams were minimum deals, it was inexcusable for them to let one of their more talented players walk at that cost. It was exacerbated by them signing Oubre and extending Rozier.

They chose Rozier over both Monk and Graham. That was a bad decision considering their relative contracts and production. I don't think Oubre had anything to do with that decision though. I don't even think he was the main target in free agency - Lauri Markkanen was, but he was playing hard ball with the Bulls and they weren't able to work out a sign and trade.

[yosemiteben]

If he didn't have the year he had in his final season while showing obvious signs of maturing and/or someone else would have offered him a big contract, then I think it would have been much more justified to let him walk.

Seems like we could take something from the fact that it appears that no one was willing to offer him more than a small dollar one year contract, and even after his LAL season he was only able to sign for less than MLE money.

[Braggins]

If he didn't have the year he had in his final season while showing obvious signs of maturing and/or someone else would have offered him a big contract, then I think it would have been much more justified to let him walk.

Seems like we could take something from the fact that it appears that no one was willing to offer him more than a small dollar one year contract, and even after his LAL season he was only able to sign for less than MLE money.

He ended his last season here on a bit of down note after injuring his ankle and it was clear that the Hornets were prioritizing Rozier and Graham before him, which I'm sure had an effect on his perception around the league. There was also legitimate reasons to be worried about if he would keep it together and other teams without as much inside information could justify being more risk averse with him.

Even still, its clear that he was undervalued by the league then and it was a good opportunity for the Hornets front office to arbitrage the market if they were savvy. There was virtually no risk and plenty of upside with the way his market turned out. He would be one of the better players on the current team, which is clearly lacking talent.

His current deal is maybe slightly below market, but is in the ball park of what he should have been paid for his role and production based on his play to that point (Ive never said he was some kind of star player). Hes improved some more this season and he is still young enough that if he continues to avoid significant injury he could make up some of the lost development time he wasted his first couple years. If he keeps it up he has a good chance of getting a better deal on his next contract.

[Chapelchilla]

He finished the shooting 6 for 15. 40%. That is who he is, a streaky and undersized volume shooting two guard. We don't need him.

[yosemiteben]

There was also legitimate reasons to be worried about if he would keep it together and other teams without as much inside information could justify being more risk averse with him.

Seems like teams with more inside information also wondered this, which also seems like the reason the choice was made.

I hope Monk does great and like the guy, but I also don't think it was a big error to move on from him.

[Braggins]

He finished the shooting 6 for 15. 40%. That is who he is, a streaky and undersized volume shooting two guard. We don't need him.

In the two play-in games, LaMelo is averaging 17.5 pts ~ 3 reb ~ 6 ast on 28%/30%/75% shooting splits and lost both games. We don't need him.

You could also say Monk had 18 points on 15 shots with 6 rebounds and 3 assists with a +5 plus/minus in an impressive playoff win against Steph Curry (who he actually guarded quite a bit) and the defending NBA champs.

In his two playoffs games + the play-in for the Hornets, Monk is averaging 21 pts ~ 3.3 reb ~ 2.3 ast on 56%/47%/94% shooting splits. Over the last three regular seasons hes averaged 13 ppg on 46/38/85 shooting splits. Hes not any more streaky than other similar scorers and if anything he is actually pretty consistent. Virtually every player in the league not named Nikola Jokic has plenty of inefficient shooting games.

For quite some time now its been the people insisting hes super streaky or inconsistent that have been cherry picking specific games and small sample sizes.

[Chapelchilla]

You are putting Monk on the same level with Ball?
Ball is 6’7” with otherworldly passing skills. He was also a teenager in those play in games.

Monk is 25. In his prime. But still not reliable and still only 6’3”.