Not In The Face - The Jeremy Lin Thread 3

[gafun]

If you compare Lin's stats between as starter and bench, he performed (as well as the team) in two completely two different levels in most of games through his career, even in Lakers. The simple explanation is he needs the ball in his hands so he can create shots for any open teammate (first) and himself. The coach knows it and mentioned it right after Cavs game. Kemba has proved he had his best year so far, Lin has proved his has his best year so far based the status and records (7-3 ) as starter and the defense skills which not showed in the stats. If Lin would be happy with his role and minutes, good for him. Remember , he likes to compete and winning, although money is never in his first priority, not even 2rd one.

[bws94]

Lin signed up to be a versatile combo guard and mostly he's used as an off-ball facilitator when either Kemba or Roberts is on with him. When Batum is on with him he's the main ball handler for the most part and they both facilitate and they both may bring the ball up the court. When he starts, he steps up. He's done that for a long time and that's a great asset for any team to have.

Kemba is the starting PG for the Hornets. He has had wonderful games of high stats as such and contributed to a lot of wins playing his brand of PG which is a lot of scoring. Lin has had one very nice game as starting PG, but only one. So I don't think you can go by the one time Lin started as PG to crown him the starting PG.

Are you literally ignoring all the stats people post here of Lin? Go look at Lin's game log and get back to me regarding "only one" game in which he started and did well.

How many games did he start at PG for the Hornets this season? That's what I'm talking about. Not started in general, but as a PG.

[TTNN]

Lin signed up to be a versatile combo guard and mostly he's used as an off-ball facilitator when either Kemba or Roberts is on with him. When Batum is on with him he's the main ball handler for the most part and they both facilitate and they both may bring the ball up the court. When he starts, he steps up. He's done that for a long time and that's a great asset for any team to have.

Kemba is the starting PG for the Hornets. He has had wonderful games of high stats as such and contributed to a lot of wins playing his brand of PG which is a lot of scoring. Lin has had one very nice game as starting PG, but only one. So I don't think you can go by the one time Lin started as PG to crown him the starting PG.

No, Lin signed up to help the team in playmaking, that was said by Lin and said by coach Clifford before the season. He was anticipated to play with Kemba, to help in playmaking. He end up with playing as a combo guard.

And what even is "off-ball facilitator" means? how you facilitate off-ball? As a playmaker, he need on-ball time, and on-ball opportunity, does not matter what position he is playing. Now you are trying to sell that he signed up as an off-ball player, and you still ask him to facilitate, come on......

[bws94]

Lin signed up to be a versatile combo guard and mostly he's used as an off-ball facilitator when either Kemba or Roberts is on with him. When Batum is on with him he's the main ball handler for the most part and they both facilitate and they both may bring the ball up the court. When he starts, he steps up. He's done that for a long time and that's a great asset for any team to have.

Kemba is the starting PG for the Hornets. He has had wonderful games of high stats as such and contributed to a lot of wins playing his brand of PG which is a lot of scoring. Lin has had one very nice game as starting PG, but only one. So I don't think you can go by the one time Lin started as PG to crown him the starting PG.

No, Lin signed up to help the team in playmaking, that was said by Lin and said by coach Clifford before the season. He was anticipated to play with Kemba, to help in playmaking. He end up with playing as a combo guard.

And what even is "off-ball facilitator" means? how you facilitate off-ball? As a playmaker, he need on-ball time, and on-ball opportunity, does not matter what position he is playing. Now you are trying to sell that he signed up as an off-ball player, and you still ask him to facilitate, come on......

I don't know where you are getting this. I'm not selling anything. He facilitates from whatever position he plays and with the first unit guys, he's mostly off ball. Batum does the same. Nothing that complicated.

He signed to do what he does. He can play from two positions and he's versatile. I think there is a disconnect to the way many coaches/organizations in the league see him, as a versatile combo guard with a PG mindset, to how some fans of his see him which is as a PnR PG who should have the ball in his hands most of the time. Working with Charlotte is helping him facilitate not having the ball in his hands as much and being effective with ball-dominant players. And that's good for Lin's applicability in the league and opens things up for him.

I think Kemba and Lin haven't developed proper chemistry. There are little hints of it now and then but overall, it's not there.

My personal opinion is Lin should be much more in the flow of just about every possession when he's on the court. Because, good things happen usually when he does. And when he does, expect a sloppy period where he tries to do to much. It passes usually. I also think most games he should be late in the 4th and closing games drawing fouls and making clutch plays. But sometimes matchups will have him not be able to.

[Tracymcgoaty]

Lin signed up to be a versatile combo guard and mostly he's used as an off-ball facilitator when either Kemba or Roberts is on with him. When Batum is on with him he's the main ball handler for the most part and they both facilitate and they both may bring the ball up the court. When he starts, he steps up. He's done that for a long time and that's a great asset for any team to have.

Kemba is the starting PG for the Hornets. He has had wonderful games of high stats as such and contributed to a lot of wins playing his brand of PG which is a lot of scoring. Lin has had one very nice game as starting PG, but only one. So I don't think you can go by the one time Lin started as PG to crown him the starting PG.

No, Lin signed up to help the team in playmaking, that was said by Lin and said by coach Clifford before the season. He was anticipated to play with Kemba, to help in playmaking. He end up with playing as a combo guard.

And what even is "off-ball facilitator" means? how you facilitate off-ball? As a playmaker, he need on-ball time, and on-ball opportunity, does not matter what position he is playing. Now you are trying to sell that he signed up as an off-ball player, and you still ask him to facilitate, come on......

I don't know where you are getting this. I'm not selling anything. He facilitates from whatever position he plays and with the first unit guys, he's mostly off ball. Batum does the same. Nothing that complicated.

He signed to do what he does. He can play from two positions and he's versatile. I think there is a disconnect to the way many coaches/organizations in the league see him, as a versatile combo guard with a PG mindset, to how some fans of his see him which is as a PnR PG who should have the ball in his hands most of the time. Working with Charlotte is helping him facilitate not having the ball in his hands as much and being effective with ball-dominant players. And that's good for Lin's applicability in the league and opens things up for him.

True Lin has become better off ball and defensivly. But him not being involved in plays is teammates looking him off a lot of times to be honest. i have watched every came and i legit get mad when they dont give him the ball at times to create. especially in the second unit.
I think Kemba and Lin haven't developed proper chemistry. There are little hints of it now and then but overall, it's not there.

My personal opinion is Lin should be much more in the flow of just about every possession when he's on the court. Because, good things happen usually when he does. And when he does, expect a sloppy period where he tries to do to much. It passes usually. I also think most games he should be late in the 4th and closing games drawing fouls and making clutch plays. But sometimes matchups will have him not be able to.

[PG13]

Harvard degree and all, kept taking the ball to the rim to get blocked

[lin is ok]

obvious that he needs to be the pg. whats mind numbing is that he is playing sg at the bench.

[platinumnyc]

Some of you need to watch basketball cherish life and just relax and start to love Kemba just as much... Everyone needs love. Try and stop being mind masters eh? And I'm gonna say with some degree of confidence that Lin is smarter than me and knows exactly what he's doing, after all he is millions of dollars richer and a Harvard degree brighter. Chill. Out. O.k.? Yeah ok.

[ChokeFasncists]

If you compare Lin's stats between as starter and bench, he performed (as well as the team) in two completely two different levels in most of games through his career, even in Lakers. The simple explanation is he needs the ball in his hands so he can create shots for any open teammate (first) and himself. The coach knows it and mentioned it right after Cavs game.

Another thing is that there are more capable scorers he could pass to.

Some of you need to watch basketball cherish life and just relax and start to love Kemba just as much... Everyone needs love.

Lin fans aren't saints and angels (or Bodhisattvas). Most at least. I think most Lin fans like team game and team wins.

[KM6]

Lin signed up to be a versatile combo guard and mostly he's used as an off-ball facilitator when either Kemba or Roberts is on with him. When Batum is on with him he's the main ball handler for the most part and they both facilitate and they both may bring the ball up the court. When he starts, he steps up. He's done that for a long time and that's a great asset for any team to have.

Kemba is the starting PG for the Hornets. He has had wonderful games of high stats as such and contributed to a lot of wins playing his brand of PG which is a lot of scoring. Lin has had one very nice game as starting PG, but only one. So I don't think you can go by the one time Lin started as PG to crown him the starting PG.

No, Lin signed up to help the team in playmaking, that was said by Lin and said by coach Clifford before the season. He was anticipated to play with Kemba, to help in playmaking. He end up with playing as a combo guard.

And what even is "off-ball facilitator" means? how you facilitate off-ball? As a playmaker, he need on-ball time, and on-ball opportunity, does not matter what position he is playing. Now you are trying to sell that he signed up as an off-ball player, and you still ask him to facilitate, come on......

I don't know where you are getting this. I'm not selling anything. He facilitates from whatever position he plays and with the first unit guys, he's mostly off ball. Batum does the same. Nothing that complicated.

He signed to do what he does. He can play from two positions and he's versatile. I think there is a disconnect to the way many coaches/organizations in the league see him, as a versatile combo guard with a PG mindset, to how some fans of his see him which is as a PnR PG who should have the ball in his hands most of the time. Working with Charlotte is helping him facilitate not having the ball in his hands as much and being effective with ball-dominant players. And that's good for Lin's applicability in the league and opens things up for him.

I think Kemba and Lin haven't developed proper chemistry. There are little hints of it now and then but overall, it's not there.

My personal opinion is Lin should be much more in the flow of just about every possession when he's on the court. Because, good things happen usually when he does. And when he does, expect a sloppy period where he tries to do to much. It passes usually. I also think most games he should be late in the 4th and closing games drawing fouls and making clutch plays. But sometimes matchups will have him not be able to.

I think Lin signed up with the Hornets knowing full well what his role is going to be this year:

1. Backing up Kemba as the backup PG;
2. playing along side Kemba and starting unit as off-ball combo guard;
3. Lead the 2nd unit as facilitator and main scoring option;
4. play tough defense and provide energy and be the glue guy;
5. start at PG or SG when deemed necessary due to possible injuries;
6. chance to improve his defense with one of the best defensive team and show case his defensive prowess as his strength not his weakess as that's one of the main misconception about his game;
7. showcase his true ability as an excellent combo guard who can succeed both at the 1 and 2 position, guard any PG and most SG effectively;
8. Prove his ability to be a capable starting PG for a winning team when given the chance, even though he had been starting for many teams in the past and people keep saying he is a career backup scrub.

The way I see it, he did very well so far in terms of achieving his objectives. Lin is a winning player, he doesn't care what his stats looks like as long as his team can win the ball game, but he did sign a 1 year rental contract because he is not certain whether Hornets is going to be his long term stay.

He is not here trying to get Kemba's starting gig. Even though us Lin fans might go overboard sometimes demanding Clifford to start Lin over Kemba (not me personally even once if I remember correctly), Lin is just trying to help the team win in anyway possible, and improve his game along the way.

He stated many times in the past his goal for his NBA career is first to get stable minutes in the rotation of a team, then getting into the starting lineup. Once that's done, he would like to be able to fight for a NBA championship, not as a bench but as a starter.

So even though he really likes his teammates here, and that might change his career goal, I don't see him willing to give up a chance to start somewhere else if they give him enough respect by paying him adequately and offering him a chance to be the starting PG who gets to playmake and attack.

[TinmanZBoy]

Some of you need to watch basketball cherish life and just relax and start to love Kemba just as much... Everyone needs love. Try and stop being mind masters eh? And I'm gonna say with some degree of confidence that Lin is smarter than me and knows exactly what he's doing, after all he is millions of dollars richer and a Harvard degree brighter. Chill. Out. O.k.? Yeah ok.

this.

[ChokeFasncists]

Lin is a winning player, he doesn't care what his stats looks like as long as his team can win the ball game,

Lin is just trying to help the team win in anyway possible

Well, if the Cavs game is any indication.......

[ChokeFasncists]

Seems like Lin still has problem with elite shot blockers. Love and Thompson vs Whiteside. Maybe that was a difference. Gortat isn't bad but definitely no Whiteside. Pau after that.

[bws94]

Seems like Lin still has problem with elite shot blockers. Love and Thompson vs Whiteside. Maybe that was a difference. Gortat isn't bad but definitely no Whiteside. Pau after that.

He went up against Porzingis great who has been blocking shots. He floated shots over Drummond. And it's not like Whiteside blocked just Lin. He blocked Kemba, MKG, Lin, Marv and others. He had 10 blocks. He was in the block zone.

[Guitardude]

How many games did he start at PG for the Hornets this season? That's what I'm talking about. Not started in general, but as a PG.

You and I both know the term "PG" is loosely used these days in the NBA. Even when Lin was starting "as PG", he wasn't brining the ball up the court every time. What you probably meant was primary option on offense, which he was at least "1a" before, esp in the game he scored 35.

Knowing that, it's asinine to even mention he only had "one good game" as a starting PG, when as you mentioned, how many of those did he have?

What he needs is a consistent role with a supportive coach and teammates. I always come back to this question: do you think the hornets will do 1) better, 2) the same, or 3) worse with Lin as starting guard and Walker/Batum coming off the bench? The answer is absolutely at least the same but likely significantly better with Lin as the primary facilitator. Can you imagine the havoc Walker or Batum can cause off the bench?

[ChokeFasncists]

Seems like Lin still has problem with elite shot blockers. Love and Thompson vs Whiteside. Maybe that was a difference. Gortat isn't bad but definitely no Whiteside. Pau after that.

He went up against Porzingis great who has been blocking shots. He floated shots over Drummond. And it's not like Whiteside blocked just Lin. He blocked Kemba, MKG, Lin, Marv and others. He had 10 blocks. He was in the block zone.

KP's still young. Drummond only averages less than 1.5 bpg.

It was true Whiteside was blocking others and in a blocking zone but that doesn't mean Lin doesn't have a problem against elite shot blockers and that he plays better when the opponent doesn't have one.

[bws94]

How many games did he start at PG for the Hornets this season? That's what I'm talking about. Not started in general, but as a PG.

You and I both know the term "PG" is loosely used these days in the NBA. Even when Lin was starting "as PG", he wasn't brining the ball up the court every time. What you probably meant was primary option on offense, which he was at least "1a" before, esp in the game he scored 35.

Knowing that, it's asinine to even mention he only had "one good game" as a starting PG, when as you mentioned, how many of those did he have?

What he needs is a consistent role with a supportive coach and teammates. I always come back to this question: do you think the hornets will do 1) better, 2) the same, or 3) worse with Lin as starting guard and Walker/Batum coming off the bench? The answer is absolutely at least the same but likely significantly better with Lin as the primary facilitator. Can you imagine the havoc Walker or Batum can cause off the bench?

Ask me what I meant, I'll tell you. He is either PG or SG on the lineup sheet. If playing for Batum, he's called SG. IF playing for Kemba, he's called PG. As a starter, Lin steps up often and sometimes in a huge way and that's something I know well as anyone else who has watched him over the years. And it's something Charlotte fans have seen this season.

Lin is used as a tough, gritty guard that is called on to get in the paint, play tough D, facilitate when called on, get a fair amount of rebounds, get to the line and knock down foul shots, hustle for 50/50 balls, get out and run in transition when the opportunities present themselves. He's not seen the way many Lin fans want to see him as the PG and primary facilitator orchestrating the offense mostly. Not even on the 2nd unit when Roberts is in or Batum.

Cliff seems to use guys specifically. Lin's role is specific but varied. Kemba is the main ball handler, does some facilitation, is a big scorer and go-to guy in the clutch to handle the ball. Batum is the main facilitator from the 2 spot, on the wing, entrusted to have the best BB IQ of all of his "guards", 3 ball shooter and scorer, defensive player. Lin is as above. Their roles are quite specific. Lin is often used to close games and may still be used in that capacity. He is usually in the OT lineup as well.

That's how it is and those are the roles set. Lin gets to be primary PG or facilitator or at least facilitate a lot of the game when Kemba isn't playing. And he handles the ball more when Kemba is off the court. That's the way coach designed it.

[bws94]

Seems like Lin still has problem with elite shot blockers. Love and Thompson vs Whiteside. Maybe that was a difference. Gortat isn't bad but definitely no Whiteside. Pau after that.

He went up against Porzingis great who has been blocking shots. He floated shots over Drummond. And it's not like Whiteside blocked just Lin. He blocked Kemba, MKG, Lin, Marv and others. He had 10 blocks. He was in the block zone.

KP's still young. Drummond only averages less than 1.5 bpg.

It was true Whiteside was blocking others and in a blocking zone but that doesn't mean Lin doesn't have a problem against elite shot blockers and that he plays better when the opponent doesn't have one.

I think that's the case for most penetrating guards. It was to Lin's advantage that the Cavs didn't have one in Wednesday's game.

[LostInACrowd]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-JEkpMmRIo[/youtube]

I think this guy is pretty good.

[ChokeFasncists]

He went up against Porzingis great who has been blocking shots. He floated shots over Drummond. And it's not like Whiteside blocked just Lin. He blocked Kemba, MKG, Lin, Marv and others. He had 10 blocks. He was in the block zone.

KP's still young. Drummond only averages less than 1.5 bpg.

It was true Whiteside was blocking others and in a blocking zone but that doesn't mean Lin doesn't have a problem against elite shot blockers and that he plays better when the opponent doesn't have one.

I think that's the case for most penetrating guards. It was to Lin's advantage that the Cavs didn't have one in Wednesday's game.

That is true. But Lin can do more other things like kick it back out. With Frank and Hawes as bigs, there's no reason they can't figure something out.