Secret Sauce: The Terry Rozier Thread

[LofJ]

I wanted to sleep on this one before commenting.

After digesting everything, I'm good with the team getting Terry. As noted by others here in the thread
1. He's a young guy who had done well when starting
2. He's better than most of the other available options had the team not traded for him.
3. His assist percentage, which I was worried about, is much better in splits as a starter over the last 2 years.
4. He's a good defender so can play with guys who are weaker on that end.
5. The contract pretty much is what it had to be given the complex sign & trade. (Great convo in this thread about it)
6. I like that the team is not trying to be as terrible as possible and do a full tank.

Things I worry about
1. The Brad Stevens effect - many players seem to regress stat wise when leaving Boston
2. BBIQ and how his PG play will affect development of other young guys
3. How team chemistry will be post Kemba with Rozier

I disagree with almost everything that you posted. I just screams irrelevant mediocrity, in other words: Same Old Hornets

'

At best I think this team can finish with the 7th worst record, that's not mediocre it's this team finally starting to bottom out. Rozier isn't going to move the needle enough to keep the team out of the bottom half of the lottery. And thanks to the flatter lottery odds you don't have to go all the way and try as hard as you can to be the worst team.

[BlackOutBuzz]

Admittedly I forgot about this, there was no way to acquire Rozier for 2 years (though I guess the final year could have been unguaranteed/an option).

Read on Twitter

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[_tijo_]

I don't have a problem with Rozier the player, I kinda like his "I'm better than you, get out of my f'n way" attitude. It's the 3 years $58m. It's that we locked up any chance at flexibility. If MJ's argument that signing Kemba locks us into the same team that missed the playoffs the past two years, then I can squint and see that argument. But this does the same thing, locking us into this roster. With a worse player. No offense Terry, but Kemba is better than you right now. And we have to give up and asset in order to make this happen? This team is going backwards. Guess it's not surprising when you hire a dinosaur of a GM instead of progressive thinkers and movers.

Look, I know we aren't a free agent destination. But cap room helps us take on contracts and some draft picks that come with them. It allows us flexibility to make deals. Wanna know why we haven't made ANY deals when EVERY SINGLE TEAM has made deals in this off-season? Because we have no flexibility. Mitch talks about not wanting to give away our future, that's why he doesn't want to make any trades. But this effectively does the same thing. It hampers our ability to better our future. It takes away any hope of being better than what we are.

It also takes away from our development. For example, Monk's only here for 2 more years. If we don't let him play and develop, we are going to let him go, just like we did Frank. He's super young still, and we only have 2 more years to evaluate him. We have to give him the time to develop into the NBA player we thought he was when we drafted him. Or else, we won't extend him, he will go somewhere else, and flourish there. You have to give your draft picks the room to succeed. We haven't done that with our picks, and thereby hampering our future.

I'm actually kinda surprised agents haven't started steering players away from us. We are toxic for young players. You're telling me that Marvin Williams and MKG and Bismack are better NBA players and deserve more minutes than our young guys? They all should not see the floor, or take on the mentoring, "8 minute a game spell the starters" role. The young guys have to grow and develop into the players they are supposed to become. If not, we will never have a future.

More than Kemba leaving, this move saddens me. It just shows that it's MJ, it was never Cho, and it's not Mitch. And you can't fire owners.

[TGW]

Oof. Terrible signing.

[BigSlam]

Why the contract is 3 years instead of 2

Read on Twitter

Interesting. Did not know this - thanks Vandy.

So based on BoB's input on Rozier's contract HAVING to be around $17mil per year in order to match the Walker contract salary wise and based on your input that S&T's HAVING to be a min of 3 years, we really, really, really tied our hands and bent us over a barrel.

We absolutely painted ourselves into a corner.

As I understand it:
Because of the S&T rules the only contract we could sign Rozier to was pretty much the one we did (3/$58mil) - which was a massive overpay caused by the Walker contract.

Our only other option was to use our MLE on Roizer, which would have allowed teams with cap space to potentially out bid us.
Or
Use the MLE on a different PG.

[SWedd523]

Third year team option would've been a much better deal.

[cornchip]

I guess what I'm trying to figure out why did we have to do the S&T for Rozier in the first place.

We could've let Kemba walk and used our MLE on a cheaper option, no?

Obviously the best situation was to work out a S&T for MKG's expiring if we really wanted a PG on a longer deal.

[BigSlam]

I guess what I'm trying to figure out why did we have to do the S&T for Rozier in the first place.

Because we didn't have the cap space to outright sign him - unless he was willing to take the MLE (around $9.5mil per year).

We could've let Kemba walk and used our MLE on a cheaper option, no?

Yup.

Obviously the best situation was to work out a S&T for MKG's expiring if we really wanted a PG on a longer deal

You'd have to find a dance partner for that though - a team who has a PG who was a free agent who they were looking to move who had the cap space to absorb the extra money and who was also willing to take on MKG's $13mil.

[JMAC3]

It was basically either

Kemba leaving for nothing and have the MLE to spend (9.7)

Or

Kemba leaving, Getting Rozier, and having the MLE still.




Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[badladd22]

I think rozier will be our victor Oladipo...thats what im hoping for anyways

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[Lwcasu]

I think rozier will be our victor Oladipo...thats what im hoping for anyways

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

Rozier fits with the rebuild. At best he comes out balling, but even that isn’t gonna get us out of the top 5. I’m more pissed with how we wasted Kemba as an asset. Probably could have got at least a lottery 1st if we trade him a year ago and improved our own pick. From that perspective, it’s terrible. Rozier is now overpaid but could easily work his way into that contract.

[badladd22]

I agree 100 percent...we dropped the ball on trading kemba. Our current roster screams bottom 3 in the league if not the worst. Rozier is a gamble, but i like atleast giving him a chance..no one else was coming without a trade..i hope we didnt trade a good asset to boston in the sign and trade

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[Rich4114]

I can't get behind this move. If we were losing Kemba, no expensive free agent acquisition this summer does anything for us now or long term. The plan should have been to find a bargain option at PG day 2 or 3 of free agency. Alternatively, work out a S&T with BKN to get Russell because I could get behind maxing him out given the fact he is the next Kemba and much younger. I realize a Russell deal was never likely because he would have to want to come here and we'd have to make the numbers work. But I would've been perfectly happy with a Lin or someone to just be a PG during this early rebuild phase to help provide veteran leadership at the guard spot.

I envy what the Hawks and Grizzlies are doing. They've got a 3 year plan and are focused on young players, acquiring picks to help teams with short term cap related needs without hurting themselves in 2-3 years when they will really need that space. Kudos to them for doing it right and giving themselves multiple cracks at stars.

What is our plan with Rozier? What is the front office expecting? Trying to compete for a playoff spot still? Do they see something in Rozier that says he's a great PG prospect that could blossom in his 5th season the way Kemba did? That Kemba jump doesn't happen very often. Nobody ever saw Kemba going from where he was after season 3 or 4 to multiple all stars, all star starter, all nba PG.

[cornchip]

I think rozier will be our victor Oladipo...thats what im hoping for anyways

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

I think he's Reggie Jackson but I hope you're right.

[Robot Rock]

I think rozier will be our victor Oladipo...thats what im hoping for anyways

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

I think he's Reggie Jackson but I hope you're right.

He's neither. He's in between.

[jbk1234]

I think rozier will be our victor Oladipo...thats what im hoping for anyways

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

I think he's Reggie Jackson but I hope you're right.

Rozier is a much, much better defender than either Jackson or Schroeder. It's a bad contract, but some of these comps are unfair IMO. Also, he's the type of guy who might actually play better in non-contract years as he's less likely to force the issue.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

This is more of the Clippers rebuild model ... though trading Kemba and Lamb earlier on would have helped.

Basically focus on getting young talent while putting vets that play hard around them. Win every game you can to teach the young guys how to win in the NBA.

I honestly have no idea if Terry will work out, but why not give it a shot? He's worth a swing even if it misses ... which is more than I can say for Elf and some of the other PG prospects that were out there.

I also don't really expect Terry to replace Kemba even though they share a few similarities. Rozier isn't nearly the offensive guy Kemba was, though he might still be improving. The thing is that he's much better defensively. If the team moves Nic to the 2nd unit then pretty much all the starters should be plus defenders.

[LofJ]

The Mavericks completely struck out and didn't get a point guard. If Rozier plays well I wouldn't be surprised if we could flip him to the Mavericks for their 2020 1st, depending on how the rest of the offseason shakes out.

[predators]

I can't get behind this move. If we were losing Kemba, no expensive free agent acquisition this summer does anything for us now or long term. The plan should have been to find a bargain option at PG day 2 or 3 of free agency. Alternatively, work out a S&T with BKN to get Russell because I could get behind maxing him out given the fact he is the next Kemba and much younger. I realize a Russell deal was never likely because he would have to want to come here and we'd have to make the numbers work. But I would've been perfectly happy with a Lin or someone to just be a PG during this early rebuild phase to help provide veteran leadership at the guard spot.

I envy what the Hawks and Grizzlies are doing. They've got a 3 year plan and are focused on young players, acquiring picks to help teams with short term cap related needs without hurting themselves in 2-3 years when they will really need that space. Kudos to them for doing it right and giving themselves multiple cracks at stars.

What is our plan with Rozier? What is the front office expecting? Trying to compete for a playoff spot still? Do they see something in Rozier that says he's a great PG prospect that could blossom in his 5th season the way Kemba did? That Kemba jump doesn't happen very often. Nobody ever saw Kemba going from where he was after season 3 or 4 to multiple all stars, all star starter, all nba PG.

I think it's pretty obvious we are tanking without trying to look like we are tanking. Rozier is just taking a flier on a guy that we could potentially flip for more assets later if he pans out. He's only signed through year 1 AB (After Batum), so even if he doesn't I don't really have an issue with it. MKG/Biyombo/Marv fall off the books after next year, and Batum/Zeller fall off the year after.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

The Mavericks completely struck out and didn't get a point guard. If Rozier plays well I wouldn't be surprised if we could flip him to the Mavericks for their 2020 1st, depending on how the rest of the offseason shakes out.

The Mavs just got Seth Curry. He's a great option for a team with Luca.